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Congress: Iraq Pullout Vote Tonight

26 X World Champs said:
Are you saying that we've killed more than 40,000 insurgents? That is a lie. Total exaggeration. The real number is between 26K and 30K. Why can't you tell the truth?

Source: http://www.iraqbodycount.org/

you rubber
that is civilians dead
the collateral damage of the war
the unfortunate side effect of military action
NOT INSURGENTS :rofl
 
DeeJayH said:
you rubber
that is civilians dead
the collateral damage of the war
the unfortunate side effect of military action
NOT INSURGENTS :rofl

Does that mean you are finally admitting that we are not killing insurgents but women and children instead? You said before that we were killing terrorists. Which is it? You cant have it both ways.
 
danarhea said:
Does that mean you are finally admitting that we are not killing insurgents but women and children instead? You said before that we were killing terrorists. Which is it? You cant have it both ways.

we are killing insurgents AND terrorists
the innocents, as in every war before, are caught up in it unfortunately
any women and children killed by us is accidental
the same can not be said for those we are fighting
they target mosques, they target weddings, they target civilians
alll the while dressed as civilians
 
DeeJayH said:
we are killing insurgents AND terrorists
the innocents, as in every war before, are caught up in it unfortunately
any women and children killed by us is accidental
the same can not be said for those we are fighting
they target mosques, they target weddings, they target civilians
alll the while dressed as civilians

Show me the numbers.
 
Navy Pride said:
I think there is a better way of telling who to believe.......Look at who the troops voted for in the 2004 elections.............That will answer the question.......

Last I checked, we all voted by secret ballot, so there's no telling who they voted for. You have about as much access to that information as I do.
 
JustMyPOV said:
Last I checked, we all voted by secret ballot, so there's no telling who they voted for. You have about as much access to that information as I do.

You lefties all like polls.....Well polls after the 2004 elections said that almost 70% of the military voted for President Bush.........

Why do you think Gore tried to disinfranchise military absenteee ballots in the 2000 elections...........
 
Well, in any case, the fact remains that nobody bought this pathetic attempt at a political grandstand put on by the Republican party. The Republicans introduced a bill to completely and immediately "bug out" of Iraq with no concern as to the troops safety, or the safety of Iraq's fledgeling democratic establishment, which is disturbing in and of itself. It wasn't even close to anything the Democrats have asked of this administration, and yet they'll try to spin it to look like it was the democrats' idea.

Rep. Murtha did not call for an immediate withdrawal or surrender as the Republicans would like for everyone to believe. This is the same old spin we've been hearing all along, and clearly, people aren't buying into it anymore. Not anywhere in his speech which is available for viewing at http://www.c-span.org was such an extreme proposal made by Murtha or any other Democrat for that matter. What he did was called for a prudent exit strategy to safely withdraw our troops as quickly as possible while continuing to aid and assist the Iraqi people in their fight for freedom. His plan is the most sensible of any I've heard come out of any politician. To summarize, we've plowed the field, we've planted the seed, it is now up to the IRAQIS to make it happen.

The "one-line", vague exit strategy that we've gotten from the Republican side is wearing thin, and their poll numbers are going to continue to decline until they come up with something more coherent than just stating that victory is the goal. What the hell is victory? That's the question we're looking to see answered.
 
JustMyPOV said:
Well, in any case, the fact remains that nobody bought this pathetic attempt at a political grandstand put on by the Republican party. The Republicans introduced a bill to completely and immediately "bug out" of Iraq with no concern as to the troops safety, or the safety of Iraq's fledgeling democratic establishment, which is disturbing in and of itself. It wasn't even close to anything the Democrats have asked of this administration, and yet they'll try to spin it to look like it was the democrats' idea.

Rep. Murtha did not call for an immediate withdrawal or surrender as the Republicans would like for everyone to believe. This is the same old spin we've been hearing all along, and clearly, people aren't buying into it anymore. Not anywhere in his speech which is available for viewing at http://www.c-span.org was such an extreme proposal made by Murtha or any other Democrat for that matter. What he did was called for a prudent exit strategy to safely withdraw our troops as quickly as possible while continuing to aid and assist the Iraqi people in their fight for freedom. His plan is the most sensible of any I've heard come out of any politician. To summarize, we've plowed the field, we've planted the seed, it is now up to the IRAQIS to make it happen.

The "one-line", vague exit strategy that we've gotten from the Republican side is wearing thin, and their poll numbers are going to continue to decline until they come up with something more coherent than just stating that victory is the goal. What the hell is victory? That's the question we're looking to see answered.

Where the hell is victory? You have to ask? Dont you know that Baghdad Bob's little brother, Baghdad George, declared "mission accomplished" years ago?
 
JustMyPOV said:
Well, in any case, the fact remains that nobody bought this pathetic attempt at a political grandstand put on by the Republican party. The Republicans introduced a bill to completely and immediately "bug out" of Iraq with no concern as to the troops safety, or the safety of Iraq's fledgeling democratic establishment, which is disturbing in and of itself. It wasn't even close to anything the Democrats have asked of this administration, and yet they'll try to spin it to look like it was the democrats' idea.

Rep. Murtha did not call for an immediate withdrawal or surrender as the Republicans would like for everyone to believe. This is the same old spin we've been hearing all along, and clearly, people aren't buying into it anymore. Not anywhere in his speech which is available for viewing at http://www.c-span.org was such an extreme proposal made by Murtha or any other Democrat for that matter. What he did was called for a prudent exit strategy to safely withdraw our troops as quickly as possible while continuing to aid and assist the Iraqi people in their fight for freedom. His plan is the most sensible of any I've heard come out of any politician. To summarize, we've plowed the field, we've planted the seed, it is now up to the IRAQIS to make it happen.

The "one-line", vague exit strategy that we've gotten from the Republican side is wearing thin, and their poll numbers are going to continue to decline until they come up with something more coherent than just stating that victory is the goal. What the hell is victory? That's the question we're looking to see answered.

are you sure about that
and just so you cant claim right wing propaganda, i am using CNN as source
bon apetit
http://www.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/11/17/murtha.iraq.ap/

WASHINGTON (AP) -- An influential House Democrat who voted for the Iraq war called Thursday for the immediate withdrawal of U.S. troops from Iraq, another sign of growing unease in Congress about the conflict.

"This is the immediate redeployment of American forces because they have become the target," said Rep. John Murtha, D-Pennsylvania, one of Congress' most hawkish Democrats. At times during his remarks to reporters, the decorated Vietnam War veteran and former Marine was choking back tears.

or is CNN the new right wing propaganda machine?
 
DeeJayH said:
are you sure about that
and just so you cant claim right wing propaganda, i am using CNN as source
bon apetit
http://www.cnn.com/2005/POLITICS/11/17/murtha.iraq.ap/



or is CNN the new right wing propaganda machine?

I actually watched the entire 32 minute speech/Q&A, rather than relying on a damned sound-bite from a cable network. I defy you to bring me back an authentic quote from Murtha suggesting that we pull out of Iraq immediately or surrender to the terrorists. Good luck.
 
JustMyPOV said:
I actually watched the entire 32 minute speech/Q&A, rather than relying on a damned sound-bite from a cable network. I defy you to bring me back an authentic quote from Murtha suggesting that we pull out of Iraq immediately or surrender to the terrorists. Good luck.

soooo...... you are saying that CNN manufactured this story?
 
This is what a news agency said:
CNN said:
An influential House Democrat who voted for the Iraq war called Thursday for the immediate withdrawal of U.S. troops from Iraq, another sign of growing unease in Congress about the conflict.

This is what Murtha said :
John Murtha said:
"This is the immediate redeployment of American forces because they have become the target," said Rep. John Murtha, D-Pennsylvania, one of Congress' most hawkish Democrats. At times during his remarks to reporters, the decorated Vietnam War veteran and former Marine was choking back tears.

If we can extrapolate from "immediate redeployment" to "immediate withdrawal" then it isn't that hard to go from "faulty intelligence" to "Bush lied". ;)
ted
 
DeeJayH said:
soooo...... you are saying that CNN manufactured this story?
Murthas proposal was to withdraw the military in stages and keep a rapid deployment force in the ME. Did you actually watch the whole thing on CSPAN?
 
scottyz said:
Murthas proposal was to withdraw the military in stages and keep a rapid deployment force in the ME. Did you actually watch the whole thing on CSPAN?

and yet withdrawing the military in stages as Iraq stabilizes
IS EXACTLY WHAT BUSH PLANS TO DO
so why did Murtha need to whip out the lines quoted above?
or did CNN twist, manipulate, and take out of context what Murtha said

I can not recall, nor would i admit to, the last time i watched CSPAN
got much better things to do in life.
I would rather watch The Daily Show
 
DeeJayH said:
and yet withdrawing the military in stages as Iraq stabilizes
IS EXACTLY WHAT BUSH PLANS TO DO
so why did Murtha need to whip out the lines quoted above?
or did CNN twist, manipulate, and take out of context what Murtha said

I can not recall, nor would i admit to, the last time i watched CSPAN
got much better things to do in life.
I would rather watch The Daily Show
Bush has no plan other than "stay the course".
CNN seems to confuse the Republican proposal for withdraw with Murthas even though it was made clear they weren't the same.
 
JustMyPOV said:
Ok, you still didn't answer my question as to the exit strategy. An exit strategy for the military ought to consist of more than a one liner in a political speech, don't you think? These are our people, our sons, brothers, sons and daughters over there dying for this cause, and you think that a one-liner in a political speech is an adequate exit strategy?

Yes I did. You just want an answer that agrees with you. The exit strategy is as it is. The extremists do not need to know our dates, times, coordinates, and whatever you seem to want. Releasing what you seem to want will only cause harm to your "sons, brothers, sons and daughters" and will only create a false peace for the Iraqis that are determined to succeed.
 
DeeJayH said:
...or did CNN twist, manipulate, and take out of context what Murtha said...

Probably. It seems that they have been doing it for the last 5 years. ;) :mrgreen:
ted
 
GySgt said:
Yes I did. You just want an answer that agrees with you. The exit strategy is as it is. The extremists do not need to know our dates, times, coordinates, and whatever you seem to want. Releasing what you seem to want will only cause harm to your "sons, brothers, sons and daughters" and will only create a false peace for the Iraqis that are determined to succeed.

IMO, there shouldnt be a total exit. There should be a semi exit. However, the iraqis themselves dont want us to leave. And they want us to build a base there for their protection. So to answer your question I dont think there will be a total exit strategy in a very long time.
 
SKILMATIC said:
IMO, there shouldnt be a total exit. There should be a semi exit. However, the iraqis themselves dont want us to leave. And they want us to build a base there for their protection. So to answer your question I dont think there will be a total exit strategy in a very long time.

There are, actually, bases being built on borders.
 
scottyz said:
Bush has no plan other than "stay the course".
CNN seems to confuse the Republican proposal for withdraw with Murthas even though it was made clear they weren't the same.

....and what is the course? Answer your own question. Put away the need to pretend to be stupid and answer your own question from your own intellect to the situation. What is the course?
 
90% of the democrats believe exactly like Murtha but they are to cowardly to admit it.....That is why the republicans called for that vote and the cowardly democrats all abandoned their principles and voted with the republicans.

Only 2 democrats voted to pull out one was probably Murtha and the other one was that little weasel from Ohio...........I don't agree with them but at least they are honest unlike the rest of the democrats in the house.........
 
GySgt said:
....and what is the course? Answer your own question. Put away the need to pretend to be stupid and answer your own question from your own intellect to the situation. What is the course?
I'll give a hint, scotty...Use the words "up" & "down"...

And I'm not referring to Monica...
 
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