Colorado police beat, hogtie septuagenarian with dementia and then deny her medical treatment

[Integrityrespec]

What kind of question is this? Old ladies should not get beaten by cops and end up in the hospital. Cops shouldn't esculate the situation. They should deescalate it. Beating this woman was not necessary. Don't use disproportionate force. Don't use violence and deadly force when it's not necessary.

I didn't see any beating taking place. The detained a woman who was trying to leave and she was accussed of shop lifting. What do yo think they should do to a person who tries to leave as they are trying to detain her? The biased opinion of police is making some peoples expectations unrealistic.

 

[SheWolf]

I didn't see any beating taking place. The detained a woman who was trying to leave and she was accussed of shop lifting. What do yo think they should do to a person who tries to leave as they are trying to detain her? The biased opinion of police is making some peoples expectations unrealistic.

If you don't see a problem, there is a problem.

 

[SenorXm/Sirius]

There's actually people in this thread defending the police in this case?

My God! They won't be, but they should be ashamed of themselves..

 

[Sweden]

I didn't see any beating taking place. The detained a woman who was trying to leave and she was accussed of shop lifting. What do yo think they should do to a person who tries to leave as they are trying to detain her? The biased opinion of police is making some peoples expectations unrealistic.

Right, I get it. Old people with dementia should be thrown to the ground by thugs, have their arm broken and their shoulder dislocated.

By the way - how goes your job as a care home assistant? Do you make sure that any of the old folks who try to escape gets what is coming to them?

 

[Excast]

There's actually people in this thread defending the police in this case?

My God! They won't be, but they should be ashamed of themselves..

There is no example too egregious to prevent the usual Neanderthals from coming out and acting as if the cop had no possible alternative or the true blame really lies elsewhere.

 

[Questerr]

"Change" is not a univocal term, and I'm quite confident I wouldn't like the "changes" your ilk would like to make.

Those changes wouldn’t turn America into a white supremacist fascist state where only white Christian males have protected rights, so yeah. You’d like it.

 

[dirtpoorchris]

If only should would comply with police orders.

If she did that then none of her injuries would have occurged

And if your mom didnt backtalk you so much you never would to have slapped her growing up. #AMIRIGHT?

 

[dirtpoorchris]

When someone doesn't immediately comply with an officer, perhaps the first instinct shouldn't be to injure or kill them?

There are plenty of reasons why someone wouldn't, whether it be a hearing disability, degrading mental condition, or that they are simply in a crisis situation. And yet as a society we just accept this one size fits all approach to things.

Most cops in Sweeden/Norway just laugh at police disrespect and find it hilarious like a baby tantrum.

 

[dirtpoorchris]

tor·ture
/ˈtôrCHər/

noun

• 1. the action or practice of inflicting severe pain or suffering on someone as a punishment or in order to force them to do or say something:

Maybe if you are talking about confessional torture prefected by the Christians. You dont have to draw a confession in order to torture, sickos torture animals all the time and they cant talk. YOU LOSE.

 

[dirtpoorchris]

I feel like this is another example of cops not having proper deescalation training. Cops should be trained enough to recognize potential signs of dementia. She was clearly older and didn't seem to understand what he was saying, and she wasn't aggressive until he tried to arrest her. He wasn't wrong to try to take her in, but hog-tying her seems unnecessary and she should have been medically examined promptly.

You think "Training" stops a person with qualified immunity from having hatred in their heart and beating/torturing/bullying someone? If anything the training just teaches them how to do it better and what methods and excuses they can hide behind. No amount of training will stop cops from illegally planting evidence on people and "lawfully" executing them and stuff like that. We need cops to have a body cam and a gun cam and a helmet/head cam. IF a cop gets caught turning the camera off he agrees that he is immediately guilty of whatever the suspect accused him of if the suspect ends up hurt. If the suspect dies while camera is off the cop immediately gets charged with negligence of life while being the legal guardian of a persons body and health and carries the same punishment as murder. THAT will stop a whole bunch of abuse but not all of it.

 

[dirtpoorchris]

What bear is getting at is that blaming the caregiver might be misplaced too. I know of a caregiver who went to the bathroom for 2 minutes and it lead to a 4.5 hour hunt for thier charge who had wandered into the alley out back and just kept walking.
Short of chaining them up, sometimes its a risk you run to do somethings.

Only thing you can do is make it really comfortable for them and provide lots of entertainment for them. Maybe a fake busstop real close to the facility so they might sit there thinking a bus will wisk them away. If you lock them up too much the old and crazy will become very nasty. If 1 person is non-violent but keeps sneaking out they obviously need an escort outing more and probably stuffed away in a room too much. I think its horrible how retirement homes and stuff will demonize and escape old person but never ever offer them escort out while charging them 7-10,000$ a month until their retirement soaks up.

for how much these facilities of these types of get paid the old and crazy should have tons and tons of ping pong tables and VR headsets. But all the staff is making minimum wage and all that money is disappearing to one person usually..... The boss.

 

[Sweden]

Most cops in Sweeden/Norway just laugh at police disrespect and find it hilarious like a baby tantrum.

Our Swedish police are like uniformed social workers. Not so good at detecting crime, maybe, but kind and understanding.

 

[eohrnberger]

That‘s completely beside the point. Yes people should comply but cops should actually use that lump of gray shit in their heads. Who in their right mind applies that level of force to a little old lady? No thinking person really cares whether the force was authorized or not. What matters is was it reasonable given the circumstances and anyone who suggests this level force in this circumstance is appropriate needs to live alone on an island far away from the rest of humanity.

I'm not going to second guess the cops with as little information has been released at present by the apparently cop-hating media.
Standard 48-72 hours waiting period instituted, at least on my part.

Some questions though, if she's as debilitated as she appears to be, how'd she get to that WalMart? How would she get back to where she came from?
I rather doubt that she'd be capable of driving herself, so someone drove her?

 

[Gaius46]

I'm not going to second guess the cops with as little information has been released at present by the apparently cop-hating media.
Standard 48-72 hours waiting period instituted, at least on my part.

Some questions though, if she's as debilitated as she appears to be, how'd she get to that WalMart? How would she get back to where she came from?
I rather doubt that she'd be capable of driving herself, so someone drove her?

Given that she was walking home and from what was posted earlier in the thread it seems she walked there.

 

[Phys251]

Quite simply, it is true.....the police have great positive impact on communities as a whole, end of story, no matter the agenda of race baiters.

THE greatest positive impact? More than families? Churches? Schools?

If you're going to make an extraordinary claim like that, you are expected to produce extraordinary evidence. So let's see that evidence.

 

[eohrnberger]

Given that she was walking home and from what was posted earlier in the thread it seems she walked there.

OK. I guess I missed that.
Still, it would seem that a higher level of supervision and care might be a prudent next step for the care of this individual.

 

[reflechissez]

That's a shame and we lack detail, but at face value someone with that diagnosis probably shouldn't be permitted to run around alone to avoid this exact type of scenario.

Maybe her condition worsened rapidly, but even so someone should have intervened a LONG time before the police got involved.

I'd bet her family's up in arms today. Where were they when granny was roaming the streets half out of her mind? Where should they have been?

I'm a caregiver myself to a disabled woman, and this lady was being neglected before police entered the picture.

They were quick to go to force, but the lady was resisting and evading throughout, and it does seem like they were treating her like any other person they were called out on.

If we want to make special rules for the elderly in police custody let's hear some ideas, but we can't apply them retroactively.

Let's blame the caregiver and not the police. Good plan.

 

[reflechissez]

No argument. I'd have preferred for them to offer her a ride home, a speak to a caregiver, and return to the store (with or without her) to pay and/or determine whether to press charges.

I'm not sure that would have been permitted by policy but it would have been a better solution. If adding resources will make that easier to do, I'm supportive.

That said she was trying to leave, and it is far from clear that she would have calmed down if they had tried that.

I ultimately point the finger at the absent caregiver. They might as well have shoved her off an overpass.

Anything that didn't actually happen is "far from clear."

 

[Gaius46]

OK. I guess I missed that.
Still, it would seem that a higher level of supervision and care might be a prudent next step for the care of this individual.

I don’t disagree but it’s no easy thing caring for an old person whose grasp of reality is questionable (i know from personal experience)

In any case that is a separate question from whether or not the use of force is justifable - either from a legal/policy standpoint or from a public relations perspective.

 

[craig]

Another shining example of American policing.

Karen Garner suffers from dementia and sensory aphasia. She had just left a Wal Mart with a grand total of $13.88 in items she had forgotten to pay for and was walking home. An officer approaches her and Garner, confused and unable to understand what he is saying, continues walking. Less than 10 seconds after their first encounter, Officer Austin Hoops had slammed the 73 year old to the ground and handcuffed her. She was later hog tied. Her injuries included a dislocated shoulder, broken arm, sprained wrist, and a bloody lip, but you wouldn't know that from the initial police report, which claimed she had no injuries.



After more than 6 hours in detention without any treatment, Garner was finally taken to a hospital. We still have to see if she will also be portrayed as a thug who deserved the treatment she received.

Police accused of injuring elderly woman with dementia during arrest

Video shows Karen Garner, 73, being slammed to the ground and hog-tied. She suffered a dislocated shoulder and other injuries, her attorney said.

www.nbcnews.com

Suggest a better practical treatment.

 

[Excast]

Suggest a better practical treatment.

Pretty much anything other than tossing her to the ground 10 seconds after you arrive because she doesn't immediately do what you say.

1. Walk in front of her and try to speak with her again.
2. Call for some medical assistance to perhaps ascertain if she has an issue.
3. Ask for her name so you can radio in and see if there is some information or if she has been reported missing.

Literally anything other than the cave man, Grognar routine that we see cops resorting to as first solution rather than the last.

 

[Gaius46]

Suggest a better practical treatment.

Hmmm an old woman who apparently isnt all there. Call social services and let her continue on her way if she insists while making sure she doesn’t run into traffic.

The only tool a cop has is force. Force often isn’t appropriate.

Not rocket science

 

[craig]

Pretty much anything other than tossing her to the ground 10 seconds after you arrive because she doesn't immediately do what you say.

1. Walk in front of her and try to speak with her again.
2. Call for some medical assistance to perhaps ascertain if she has an issue.
3. Ask for her name so you can radio in and see if there is some information or if she has been reported missing.

Literally anything other than the cave man, Grognar routine that we see cops resorting to as first solution rather than the last.

I said suggest something practical.

 

[Excast]

I said suggest something practical.

Why is giving a shit about someone considered less practical than immediate, overwhelming violence against a person who needs help?

 

[craig]

Why is giving a shit about someone considered less practical than immediate, overwhelming violence against a person who needs help?

You didn't.