Colonisation of West Bank to start again

[Iron Yank]

So why is Demon Light having the fact that he does not believe Hezbollah to be a terrorist group held up against him? It doesnt discredit him at all.
Living in the UK, i insist Hezbollah is NOT a terrorist group, only its paramilitary wing. I dont see why it should be branded as such just because of what two countries say; the one being attacked by Hezbollah, and the blinded ally of the one being attacked by Hezbollah.

Only its Paramilitary wing..... huh? Is that like saying the Nazi party was not responsible for the holoucost only its paramilitary wing (the SS) was ? What kind of logic is this?

Whether or not the west Bank eventually is a Palestian state or becomes part of Israel is besides the point. Why cant Jews live in there ancestral homeland in the west bank? The real answer lies with a relgion that is intolerant of anyone whom disagrees with it and its seventh century mindset.

 

[CaptainCourtesy]

Please quote where I said I don't think Hezbollah is terrorist group.

If you don't than what are you arguing with me about?

 

[Orion]

If you don't than what are you arguing with me about?

I was just remarking the original exchange about what the U.S. considers a terrorist group. You said, "Doesn't mean they aren't one." My point was that, if that's all the logic it takes, then the reverse could just as easily be true. Then I got a reply about national loyalties... and here we are.

 

[kaya'08]

For those who see Hezbollah as one, it does.

Well, it shouldn't. Unfortunately, the issue isn't as black and white as that.

Hezbollah leaders still call for the destruction of Israel and still list Israel and the US as enemies. If you are a member of that organization, you take their postions with you... paramilitary or not.

The West calls on for the destruction of Iran, just in much politer diplomatic terms. Only imagine if Iran had invaded our land and expanded settlements there, you would be saying the same. So what? Hezbollah didn't wake up one day and decide to hate on Israel. It takes two to tango.

 

[CaptainCourtesy]

Well, it shouldn't. Unfortunately, the issue isn't as black and white as that.

Well it does, and issues in the ME are NEVER black and white.

The West calls on for the destruction of Iran, just in much politer diplomatic terms.

Let me know if there is an official government sanctioned "manifesto" about this anywhere in the west.

Only imagine if Iran had invaded our land and expanded settlements there. So what?

Hmmm... well firstly, I happen to be against the settlements. Secondly, I disagree with the word "invasion". But to answer your question, if you had been attacking Iran for years, invading the soverign borders of their country, I would have no problem with Iran going into your country to put a stop to it.

 

[kaya'08]

Only its Paramilitary wing..... huh? Is that like saying the Nazi party was not responsible for the holoucost only its paramilitary wing (the SS) was ? What kind of logic is this?

Only Hezbollah isn't the SS and they haven't commited a holocaust.

Whether or not the west Bank eventually is a Palestian state or becomes part of Israel is besides the point. Why cant Jews live in there ancestral homeland in the west bank? The real answer lies with a relgion that is intolerant of anyone whom disagrees with it and its seventh century mindset.

Its not the Palestinians who have kicked the Jews out...

 

[CaptainCourtesy]

If you don't than what are you arguing with me about?

My comment was based on an explanation. Our beliefs are different and are based on our beliefs. Mine have some basis in national loyalty. Yours seem to not be.

 

[kaya'08]

Let me know if there is an official government sanctioned "manifesto" about this anywhere in the west.

Strikes on Iran and invasions have all been discussed on the agenda.

Hmmm... well firstly, I happen to be against the settlements. Secondly, I disagree with the word "invasion". But to answer your question, if you had been attacking Iran for years, invading the soverign borders of their country, I would have no problem with Iran going into your country to put a stop to it.

Was this before or after 1967?

 

[CaptainCourtesy]

Strikes on Iran and invasions have all been discussed on the agenda.

So there is no official policy or manifesto on the destruction of Iran. Thank you.

Was this before or after 1967?

What does 1967 have to do with it?

 

[kaya'08]

So there is no official policy or manifesto on the destruction of Iran. Thank you.

Economic and political destruction of Iran, yes. The policy of that are the embargo's. Yet it seems Israel has enacted more policies than Hezbollah has to destroy the opponent and create a humanitarian crises, like the blockade, for example.
Now, why does Demon Lights position discredit him?

 

[Apocalypse]

Are you aware only the US and Israel consider Hezbollah a terrorist group?

Actually Israel, the United States and Canada consider Hezbollah in its whole to be a terrorist movement.
The UK and Australia consider its military/"external-security" wing to be a terrorist movement.
The EU has noted that it believes there is no doubt that Hezbollah is involved in terrorist activities.

Now the political correctness aside, Hezbollah launches rockets deliberately on Israeli civilians, its officials, including its head Hassan Nasrallah, have not only made terrorist statements about its rockets reaching every Israeli citizen, but some have also made genocidal statements against Israelis and Jews in general.
Anyone who ignores this reality and says that Hezbollah, which is one of the biggest terrorist organizations in the world, is not a terrorist organization, is nothing but, in my own honest opinion, a terrorist-supporter.

 

[Apocalypse]

Economic and political destruction of Iran, yes. The policy of that are the embargo's. Yet it seems Israel has enacted more policies than Hezbollah has to destroy the opponent and create a humanitarian crises, like the blockade, for example.
Now, why does Demon Lights position discredit him?

The blockade has never created a humanitarian crisis, and certainly there is no humanitarian crisis now that the general blockade is no longer existing.

 

[Apocalypse]

Its not the Palestinians who have kicked the Jews out...

Doesn't work the other way too. Jews didn't kick the Palestinians out, 20% of Israel's population are Arabs.

Although one could say that the Palestinians were definitely trying to kick the Jews out in 48'.

 

[kaya'08]

Actually Israel, the United States and Canada consider Hezbollah in its whole to be a terrorist movement.
The UK and Australia consider its military/"external-security" wing to be a terrorist movement.
The EU has noted that it believes there is no doubt that Hezbollah is involved in terrorist activities.

I know all this already. The EU has not officially branded Hezbollah as anything. Living in the UK, i am inclined to believe Hezbollah's paramilitary wing is a terrorist movement, and i do.
However, considering the mixed opinions and disputed nature of Hezbollah, how does this discredit DL?

Now the political correctness aside,

Do you even know what this means?

Hezbollah launches rockets deliberately on Israeli civilians, its officials, including its head Hassan Nasrallah, have not only made terrorist statements about its rockets reaching every Israeli citizen, but some have also made genocidal statements against Israelis and Jews in general.

Its a war. As it goes, both sides have proven it can play it very, very dirty. :shrug:

Anyone who ignores this reality and says that Hezbollah, which is one of the biggest terrorist organizations in the world, is not a terrorist organization, is nothing but, in my own honest opinion, a terrorist-supporter.

So you believe the entire EU is a terrorist supporting organization?

 

[kaya'08]

The blockade has never created a humanitarian crisis, and certainly there is no humanitarian crisis now that the general blockade is no longer existing.

You live in fairy land. The cost of goods is so expensive, many Gazans cannot afford basic food supplies, aid is rationed, and unemployement stands at 40%.
Wake up.

 

[kaya'08]

Doesn't work the other way too. Jews didn't kick the Palestinians out, 20% of Israel's population are Arabs.

Although one could say that the Palestinians were definitely trying to kick the Jews out in 48'.

Although i support the establishment of Israel - ancestral land won in a fair contest of war - it has to be said that they lived peacefully together BEFORE zionism.

 

[Apocalypse]

My opinion is not formed by national loyalty. The Canadian government supports Israel. Canadian factories do some of the manufacturing for vehicles and weapons that end up in Israeli hands. I am not blind to this.

That does not mean I fall in line with my government's stance. I am against support of Israeli imperialism and terrorism, just as I am against Hamas terrorism.

Israel has never engaged in terrorism, so your statement that you see the support of Israel as bad as the support of Hamas is an immoral statement that softens up the repulsive agenda that is terrorism - the willing to murder innocents to promote political causes.

 

[justabubba]

The blockade has never created a humanitarian crisis, and certainly there is no humanitarian crisis now that the general blockade is no longer existing.

that part i bolded ... are you taking the position that the blockade has ended?

and if the blockade was not intended to create a crisis among the population of gaza, then why was it ever imposed?

 

[Apocalypse]

Although i support the establishment of Israel - ancestral land won in a fair contest of war - it has to be said that they lived peacefully together BEFORE zionism.

That is a very common historical mistake.
The land was filled with bloodshed well before the Jewish call for their right to self-determination to be acknowledged.

 

[Apocalypse]

that part i bolded ... are you taking the position that the blockade has ended?

No, I'm pointing at the fact that right now it's a military blockade, banning only military equipment and double-use items.

and if the blockade was not intended to create a crisis among the population of gaza, then why was it ever imposed?

To place pressure on Hamas, to cut its supplies.

 

[kaya'08]

That is a very common historical mistake.
The land was filled with bloodshed well before the Jewish call for their right to self-determination to be acknowledged.

Can you provide some links so i can see where your getting your info? Im just curious btw.

 

[Apocalypse]

I know all this already. The EU has not officially branded Hezbollah as anything. Living in the UK, i am inclined to believe Hezbollah's paramilitary wing is a terrorist movement, and i do.
However, considering the mixed opinions and disputed nature of Hezbollah, how does this discredit DL?

There is no dispute, an organization that deliberately attacks innocent civilians from a specific nationality and is trying to murder them is a terrorist organization. Claiming that such organization is not a terrorist organization is pure and clear support of terrorism.

Do you even know what this means?

Absolutely.

Its a war. As it goes, both sides have proven it can play it very, very dirty. :shrug:

The side that deliberately targets civilians is the side that engages in terrorism.
The US kills civilians, it doesn't target them but it's killing them, more civilians than al-Qaeda kills, but does that mean that the US is a terrorist state and al-Qaeda is not a terrorist organization?
Absolutely not, such claim is pure and simple terror supporting.

So you believe the entire EU is a terrorist supporting organization?

The EU has never stated that Hezbollah is not a terrorist organization.
Read my words before responding to them:
"Anyone who ignores this reality and says that Hezbollah, which is one of the biggest terrorist organizations in the world, is not a terrorist organization, is nothing but, in my own honest opinion, a terrorist-supporter. "

 

[justabubba]

No, I'm pointing at the fact that right now it's a military blockade, banning only military equipment and double-use items.

so, you were wrong in that prior statement. the general blockage, in fact, has not ended

To place pressure on Hamas, to cut its supplies.

yes, would not want them to terrorize with things like chocolate, toys, stationery, kitchen utensils, mattresses and towels

that those items were prohibited into gaza underscores the meanness of the israeli policies against the Palestinians. israel exploited its power but exposed its inhumanity

 

[Apocalypse]

Can you provide some links so i can see where your getting your info? Im just curious btw.

Ever heard about World War 2? World war 1? The crusades?
How far do you want me to go exactly?

 

[Apocalypse]

so, you were wrong in that prior statement. the general blockage, in fact, has not ended

No you are wrong with that statement, the general blockade has ended and what we have now is not a general blockade but a military blockade.

yes, would not want them to terrorize with things like chocolate, toys, stationery, kitchen utensils, mattresses and towels

None of those are necessities, so that's not something that would cause a humanitarian crisis.
Besides that now that those are no longer barred, I don't see a reason to argue about them anymore.