CNN finally admits the Sweden Strategy of Herd Immunity was right, but are still discouraging other countries from doing the same

[joluoto]

As I said before I do not think Sweden was really trying for herd immunity they were just trying to keep businesses open.

This article says that gatherings were limited to 50 people and that social distance was recommended by the Prime Minster and that the people followed that recommendation.

Sweden is taking a very different approach to Covid-19

Swedish policy is predicated on trust between citizens and government. Will it work?

qz.com

From what I have followed in Swedish media they really tried for herd immunity, their health experts actually believed in it. The economy had nothing to do with it at all.

And that yes, there were still some restrictions in Sweden, and most people did still follow social distancing. However not for example restricting visist in Service Homes for the elderly was a big mistake, and for a long time Sweden's restrictions on social gatherings were still 500, when their neighbors were restricting gatherings with more than 10 people.

 

[EMNofSeattle]

Sweden is well above the infection and death rate of the EU average as a whole. Cherry picking two other European countries who were worse does not prove their strategy was right. They were wrong.

Germany shut down quick and early and is one of the best performers in the world. All developed countries also had something the US didn't, a national strategy and a leader who didn't actively lie about the seriousness of the virus. The rest of the developed world has been back to work for MONTHS.

I see the Chinese bot has the talking points uploaded properly, Too bad every single sentence in your rent is a lie. Maybe except for Germany having the lowest infection rates. But that has nothing to do with lock down strategy. I should know by the way that the Democrats oppose every single thing Donald Trump tried to do as a national strategy. Literally every single thing. Trump wanted to stop New Yorkers from leaving the state, the governor threatened to sue. Donald Trump close down travel to China, the liberal media then ran a full court press campaign saying that was racist and that the coronavirus was nothing to worry about. Trumps administration asked for more money for the CDC before there was any United States cases, the Democrats took no action. They attempted to brief Congress, and Nancy Pelosi decided it was more important to ban adults from buying cigarettes then attend the briefing. You can point to exactly 0 objective evidence that the Democrats would’ve done any better if they had been in charge.

 

[joluoto]

I see the Chinese bot has the talking points uploaded properly, Too bad every single sentence in your rent is a lie. Maybe except for Germany having the lowest infection rates. But that has nothing to do with lock down strategy. I should know by the way that the Democrats oppose every single thing Donald Trump tried to do as a national strategy. Literally every single thing. Trump wanted to stop New Yorkers from leaving the state, the governor threatened to sue. Donald Trump close down travel to China, the liberal media then ran a full court press campaign saying that was racist and that the coronavirus was nothing to worry about. Trumps administration asked for more money for the CDC before there was any United States cases, the Democrats took no action. They attempted to brief Congress, and Nancy Pelosi decided it was more important to ban adults from buying cigarettes then attend the briefing. You can point to exactly 0 objective evidence that the Democrats would’ve done any better if they had been in charge.

Reminder:

Sweden: confirmed deaths 5880
Norway: 274
Denmark 649
Finland 345

One of these are not like the others....

If we compare in death per capita:
Sweden: 577.42
Norway 51.56
Denmark 111.95
Finland 62.52

Again one of these are over five times higher than the second largest....

When it comes to the lowest in Europe in deaths per capita it's Latvia and Slovakia, both had lock downs. The European countries with the highes death per capita rate are Belgium, Spain and the UK. Sweden is 12th in the World, and 5th in Europe. Sweden also has one of the best health care systems in Europe, comparable to their Nordic neighbors, which is one reason their death rate to Covid is so alarming.

 

[EMNofSeattle]

Reminder:

Sweden: confirmed deaths 5880
Norway: 274
Denmark 649
Finland 345

One of these are not like the others....

If we compare in death per capita:
Sweden: 577.42
Norway 51.56
Denmark 111.95
Finland 62.52

Again one of these are over five times higher than the second largest....

When it comes to the lowest in Europe in deaths per capita it's Latvia and Slovakia, both had lock downs. The European countries with the highes death per capita rate are Belgium, Spain and the UK. Sweden is 12th in the World, and 5th in Europe. Sweden also has one of the best health care systems in Europe, comparable to their Nordic neighbors, which is one reason their death rate to Covid is so alarming.

I don’t believe the numbers. And even so 5000 is a very low cost for normal life

 

[CaughtInThe]

i don't think i've every been around a group of people that are so bad at math.

~ 600 is now > ~ 5,000.


my middle schooler is smarter than a bunch of people here.

 

[EMNofSeattle]

i don't think i've every been around a group of people that are so bad at math.

~ 600 is now > ~ 5,000.


my middle schooler is smarter than a bunch of people here.

No one says 5000 is small then 500. However utilitarianism is an evil philosophy. Sweden is better because their citizens weren’t placed under house arrest

 

[CaughtInThe]

No one says 5000 is small then 500. However utilitarianism is an evil philosophy. Sweden is better because their citizens weren’t placed under house arrest

Holy Mother of God

There are 5,890 dead Swedes from COVID. Sweden's TWO neighbors (similar population) only have 619 dead. IT WOULD TAKE OVER FIVE YEARS FOR EVEN ONE OF THOSE COUNTRIES TO CATCH UP WITH SWEDEN.


You guys don't think that living and breathing human life is sacred and you just can't do the smart thing during a crises. Selfish and stupid. Not the way to go through life.

 

[EMNofSeattle]

Holy Mother of God

There are 5,890 dead Swedes from COVID. Sweden's TWO neighbors (similar population) only have 619 dead. IT WOULD TAKE OVER FIVE YEARS FOR EVEN ONE OF THOSE COUNTRIES TO CATCH UP WITH SWEDEN.


You guys don't think that living and breathing human life is sacred and you just can't do the smart thing during a crises. Selfish and stupid. Not the way to go through life.

Yes I do believe life is sacred. However the government has no affirmative duty to protect your life at infinite expense. If it is a moral command to destroy people’s livliehoods over 5000 deaths then we must lock down every winter for the flu. Because every Individual life is sacred. Now I do believe every individual life is sacred, but the lives of a group of people collectively are not. And that is the only logical mindset if you are going to govern any kind of a successful society. Life is not free of risk. Those 5000 people did not have a nonforfeitable right to survive at all costs.

 

[CaughtInThe]

Yes I do believe life is sacred. However the government has no affirmative duty to protect your life at infinite expense. If it is a moral command to destroy people’s livliehoods over 5000 deaths then we must lock down every winter for the flu. Because every Individual life is sacred. Now I do believe every individual life is sacred, but the lives of a group of people collectively are not. And that is the only logical mindset if you are going to govern any kind of a successful society. Life is not free of risk. Those 5000 people did not have a nonforfeitable right to survive at all costs.

Which means that your plan causes a whole shit load of extra Swedes to be rotting in their graves.

Hey man. Good plan.

 

[RabidAlpaca]

I see the Chinese bot has the talking points uploaded properly, Too bad every single sentence in your rent is a lie. Maybe except for Germany having the lowest infection rates. But that has nothing to do with lock down strategy. I should know by the way that the Democrats oppose every single thing Donald Trump tried to do as a national strategy. Literally every single thing. Trump wanted to stop New Yorkers from leaving the state, the governor threatened to sue. Donald Trump close down travel to China, the liberal media then ran a full court press campaign saying that was racist and that the coronavirus was nothing to worry about. Trumps administration asked for more money for the CDC before there was any United States cases, the Democrats took no action. They attempted to brief Congress, and Nancy Pelosi decided it was more important to ban adults from buying cigarettes then attend the briefing. You can point to exactly 0 objective evidence that the Democrats would’ve done any better if they had been in charge.

Except nothing I said was a lie. Sweden underperformed the EU average and the US had no national strategy of any kind. Trump spent MONTHS railing against wearing masks and accused people who wore them of making a statement against him.

Other countries who took this seriously from the beginning haven't had to suffer nearly as much as we have and they've been back to work for MONTHS.

You lie because you're dishonest and have an agenda.

No one says 5000 is small then 500. However utilitarianism is an evil philosophy. Sweden is better because their citizens weren’t placed under house arrest

That was literally the entire point of this thread. To claim 5,000 is less than 500. Sweden radically underperformed its neighbors.

 

[EMNofSeattle]

Which means that your plan causes a whole shit load of extra Swedes to be rotting in their graves.

Hey man. Good plan.

It is a good plan, Because it allows people to have the option of not despairing. Anyone who wants to be 100% safe from the virus can just stay at home and never come out and then they will be safe. Those who want to live a more fulfilling life and take risks on it will do so.I myself do not consent to being protected by a technocratic elite

 

[CaughtInThe]

It is a good plan, Because it allows people to have the option of not despairing. Anyone who wants to be 100% safe from the virus can just stay at home and never come out and then they will be safe. Those who want to live a more fulfilling life and take risks on it will do so.I myself do not consent to being protected by a technocratic elite

Your plan kills more people and effects > 5000 more families with (probably) multiple family members still living with the loss.

That's despicable, stupid and selfish.

 

[JMaximus]

Anyone being honest will admit that it's genuinely too early to know which strategies will prove to have been most effective in reducing the long-term impacts of covid.

It may well take decades to truly assess and even realize these effects.

 

[OlNate]

As usual you cherry pick your stats about the per capita deaths, completely ignoring what happened in Belgium because it ruins your false narrative. As predicted.



Huge difference between them and the state governors in the US who have mask mandates and lockdowns.

LMAO....said the biggest cherry picker in here. Do you know of any European countries other than Belgium?

But, hey, way to invalidate any opposition in the OP. You make the highest quality threads.

Don't really need to refute, given that your whole article refutes your position. Thanks for the chuckles, though...

 

[OlNate]

Some countries are eying Sweden's 'light-touch' Covid response. It's a gamble that could backfire | CNN

An expert on the spread of Covid-19 proclaimed the pandemic in Sweden was essentially over, as research suggests Swedes could be building immunity. Such comments have emboldened governments flirting with the idea of adopting Sweden's "light-touch" approach.

edition.cnn.com

Cue the usual covid lockdown doomsayers coming into this thread, and proclaiming Sweden had a high death toll (even though Belgium's was higher, and they practiced lockdowns) even though most of Sweden's deaths were from elderly patients in nursing homes.

And as for exactly why Belgium is a pretty amateurish place to base one's response analysis:

Coronavirus: Why so many people are dying in Belgium

Belgium believes its high Covid-19 mortality rate is down to more rigorous counting of cases.

www.bbc.com

In a nutshell, in case you don't want to read...they counted differently. Can't compare if two different counting methodologies are used. I know, I know, you'll make some predictably lame attempt to smack down the opposition, but it's ok, I understand, it's only because it destroys your false narrative.

 

[Phys251]

Whos making you go out and put your face near others?

You do not have the right to accelerationism. Your freedom ends where my face begins.

 

[Phys251]

Then keep your distance from me and you’re safe

^ Here we see the comment of a person who feels entitled to unlimited freedom. He obviously does not believe that 200,000 dead people matter. All that matters to that one is his self-entitled privilege to do anything he wants.

 

[EMNofSeattle]

^ Here we see the comment of a person who feels entitled to unlimited freedom. He obviously does not believe that 200,000 dead people matter. All that matters to that one is his self-entitled privilege to do anything he wants.

View attachment 67296970

Actually you have no responsibility whatsoever to prevent someone from receiving a contagious virus. Can you prove with 100% certainty you have never killed anyone by spreading the flu?

Did you generally wear a mask every flu season before COVID-19 came around? If not then why did you fail and your responsibility to keep people safe from your influenza?

 

[jpn]

As of July 21:

Regardless of whether herd immunity is a goal or a side effect of the Swedish strategy, how has it worked out? Not so well, according to the agency’s own test results. The proportion of Swedes carrying antibodies is estimated to be less than 10%, thus nowhere near herd immunity. Yet, the Swedish death rate is unnerving. Sweden has a death toll greater than the United States: 564 deaths per million inhabitants compared with 444, as of July 27.

Sweden also has a death toll nearly five times greater than that of the other four Nordic countries combined — more than twice per million inhabitants. For a number of weeks, Sweden has been among the top in the world when it comes to reported deaths per capita.​

Letter signed by several dozen Swedish health professionals ends with: "In the end, this too shall pass and life will eventually return to normal. New medical treatments will come and improve the prognosis. Hopefully, there will be a vaccine. Stick it out until then. And don’t do it the Swedish way."

 

[VySky]

^ Here we see the comment of a person who feels entitled to unlimited freedom. He obviously does not believe that 200,000 dead people matter. All that matters to that one is his self-entitled privilege to do anything he wants.

View attachment 67296970

Um, looks like an employee needs to empty the cart corral as it's full. People can't get their carts back.

 

[snakestretcher]

Yes I do believe life is sacred. However the government has no affirmative duty to protect your life at infinite expense. If it is a moral command to destroy people’s livliehoods over 5000 deaths then we must lock down every winter for the flu. Because every Individual life is sacred. Now I do believe every individual life is sacred, but the lives of a group of people collectively are not. And that is the only logical mindset if you are going to govern any kind of a successful society. Life is not free of risk. Those 5000 people did not have a nonforfeitable right to survive at all costs.

Economies recover. The 1918 Spanish flu pandemic killed between 80-100 million, worldwide. We survived that, we survived the Great Depression of the 1930s and business eventually returned to normal, so why the hyperbole about destroying people's livelihood? Businesses go under all the time and for many different reasons; savvy entrepreneurs are starting up new businesses even under the current conditions. Lives are always more valuable than a business. Always.

 

[AlphaOmega]

You do not have the right to accelerationism. Your freedom ends where my face begins.

Your freedom ends at getting your face near mine. You can stay home if you are afraid of germs.

 

[bluesmoke]

But they lack the definition of Americans freedom. For those listed a little is better than nothing.

The other countries are free of our murder and crime rates. And assorted deaths caused by guns.

 

[Mr Person]

Thread: CNN finally admits the Sweden Strategy of Herd Immunity was right, but are still discouraging other countries from doing the same

Some countries are eying Sweden's 'light-touch' Covid response. It's a gamble that could backfire | CNN

An expert on the spread of Covid-19 proclaimed the pandemic in Sweden was essentially over, as research suggests Swedes could be building immunity. Such comments have emboldened governments flirting with the idea of adopting Sweden's "light-touch" approach.

edition.cnn.com

Cue the usual covid lockdown doomsayers coming into this thread, and proclaiming Sweden had a high death toll (even though Belgium's was higher, and they practiced lockdowns) even though most of Sweden's deaths were from elderly patients in nursing homes.

OMG, man, I can't. I just can't come across any more posts from you today. That is too hilariously stupid.

The article says nothing like what you claim - that "CNN" is "admitting" that Sweden's approach worked - and actually says the opposite. They're nowhere near where they'd have to be for 'herd immunity' to work, cases are on the rise, that any number of factors are in play, etc. You call that an admission that there is herd immunity. As you love to say, herp derp.

Too funny.

Laughable. There is no such admission in the piece from either CNN or Sweden. Regarding Sweden's approach:

"Even Sweden's government now admits that this likely contributed to its high death toll of more than 5,800 people in the country of around 10 million". On top of that Sweden is now seeing an uptick in cases of infection, according to the article, and that adopting Sweden's approach to more densely populated countries could be dangerous.
Furthermore, the article continues, Sweden may be looking at introducing more stringent restrictions such as mandating mask wearing in public places.

You would do well to examine your sources more closely.

Right? It's epic fail after epic fail with him.

As usual you cherry pick your stats about the per capita deaths, completely ignoring what happened in Belgium because it ruins your false narrative. As predicted.

His false narrative?

You just fell flat on your face again. The article simply does not say what you thought it said. Another moronic fail by the guy who calls himself "PoS".

L.
O.
L.

 

[VySky]

The other countries are free of our murder and crime rates. And assorted deaths caused by guns.

Yes we have a failed diversity experiment in the US.