Cindy Sheehan Go Home!!!

[AlbqOwl]

Kidrocks asks "Where are you Michael Moore?"

(Hope this wasn't terribly offensive to somebody. But it was just too on target to leave it out.)

 

[MSgt]

"Where are you Michael Moore? Come to Crawford please! Join us!"

Competition is vital in a democracy. Without competition, every system falls apart. With honest competition, we all perform at a higher level. It’s a sad day for our country when the Left’s philosophy comes from Michael Moore’s innuendos, biases, lies, deceits, and the half-truths that captured the minds of the weak. By obsessing about Iraq—where the United States and its allies performed a great and noble deed, however imperfect the day-to-day details— and Nancy Sheehan, the Left has wordlessly agreed to let the rest of the world rot and for the troops to have died in vain.

Very reminiscent of Somalia. The liberals' constant whining about details and their insistent yearning for America to quit everything they vote to start, is the best support to the terrorists America has to offer.

There is a military maxim...."Don't let the Battalion get bogged down by a sniper." Maybe our liberal masses should do the same.

 

[MSgt]

"John Kerry wasn't very guilty of this, before he was
-Attempting to pass the buck from the two previous actions on their current commander in chief(as well as attacking him constantly during a two front war) and continuosly say that our brave men and women are dying for nothing.
-And finally, constantly playing the troop death card and claiming concern for them, all the while not letting the fact that both fronts have less casualties in four years than some singular battles in other wars."

Senator John Kerry was a champion of the hypocritical and morally decrepit left. Here is a man that broadcasted remarks that insisted — against all hard evidence — that the “terrorists are winning”. Above all, he could have seen the magnificent performance of our troops, their dedication and professionalism, their humanity, and their goodness. But the Lib-Dem’s spokesperson didn't want to see those things. He reverted to form. Just as he lied about our troops three decades ago, encouraging our enemies of the day and worsening the suffering of our POWs in North Vietnam, in today’s history he was pandering to a new enemy. Imagine the encouragement the terrorists, insurgents and global extremists drew from Kerry's declarations of defeat, from his insistence that our efforts in Iraq and in the War on Terror have failed. This is a man that did not care about the troops....unless they were a tool to be used for his and his political party's Presidency.

In many cases, the correct decision is not the popular one. Leaders, in any position, often make the mistake of making their position a popularity status. They appease instead of lead. Clinton also was an appeaser. I reference Somalia. Say what you will about President Bush, but he leads and travels in one direction, despite his "popularity" polls.

 

[LaMidRighter]

"John Kerry wasn't very guilty of this, before he was
-Attempting to pass the buck from the two previous actions on their current commander in chief(as well as attacking him constantly during a two front war) and continuosly say that our brave men and women are dying for nothing.
-And finally, constantly playing the troop death card and claiming concern for them, all the while not letting the fact that both fronts have less casualties in four years than some singular battles in other wars."

Senator John Kerry was a champion of the hypocritical and morally decrepit left. Here is a man that broadcasted remarks that insisted — against all hard evidence — that the “terrorists are winning”. Above all, he could have seen the magnificent performance of our troops, their dedication and professionalism, their humanity, and their goodness.
But the Lib-Dem’s spokesperson didn't want to see those things. He reverted to form. Just as he lied about our troops three decades ago, encouraging our enemies of the day and worsening the suffering of our POWs in North Vietnam, in today’s history he was pandering to a new enemy. Imagine the encouragement the terrorists, insurgents and global extremists drew from Kerry's declarations of defeat, from his insistence that our efforts in Iraq and in the War on Terror have failed.

In many cases, the correct decision is not the popular one. Leaders, in any position, often make the mistake of making their position a popularity status. They appease instead of lead.

Oh I know Gunny, I know. I think the Democrats of old were for the most part a darn good party, but unfortunately it seems the real American Dems are few and far between. I think that many of the hardliner liberals should take a look at the successes of guys like Miller and Lieberman, sure, I don't always agree with them but they are rock solid in their beliefs and mix up liberal and conservative pros pretty well, I respect that.

 

[Navy Pride]

I got to thinking further about a response I had to a liberal asking what we have done for the troops as Republicans and my answers, here's what I came up with:
Since Vietnam Liberals have done the following things To the military:
-some dodged the draft, thus ensuring that some other unfortunate soul took their place on the front line(including FRMR Pres Clinton)
-"Hanoi" Jane Fonda posing with opposing forces, thus thumbing nose at OUR brave men and women who defend HER right to do it.
-demanded a pullout against the fact that, like NavyPride pointed out, we were winning.
-Spit on and threw horrible things at returning soldiers, called them baby killers, and ultimately did their best to destroy whatever sense of dignity they had left.
-Did everything possible to discredit military service, thus demeaning and demonizing a noble profession, thinning recruitment, and demoralizing some of our best citizen's.
-Demanded a scale back in military spending in light of social programs meaning mil. pay no longer competitive and mil. infrastructure also not what it could be. (my personal opinion, the military is one of the few government expenditures that can never be compromised).
-Attempts to halt research and development on new military technologies because of cost regardless of the fact that these improvements could make lives better in combat and maybe even save a few.
-- John Kerry wasn't very guilty of this, before he was:smile:
-Attempting to pass the buck from the two previous actions on their current commander in chief(as well as attacking him constantly during a two front war) and continuosly say that our brave men and women are dying for nothing.
-And finally, constantly playing the troop death card and claiming concern for them, all the while not letting the fact that both fronts have less casualties in four years than some singular battles in other wars.

Excellent observations, I could not agree more...Liberals try and bring this country down.....We must never let that happen..........

 

[SKILMATIC]

Yeah I think the democtratic party in its roots are a great party. I wouldve been democrat back in the days of FDR or JFK. I respected both presidents very highly. It just seems the 2nd law of thermodynamics has hit liberalism very hard and its deteriorating rapidly like the Ebola plague. Its very sad to see cause we used to be able to find common grounds in things.

Very reminiscent of Somalia. The liberals' constant whining about details and their insistent yearning for America to quit everything they vote to start, is the best support to the terrorists America has to offer.

There is a military maxim...."Don't let the Battalion get bogged down by a sniper." Maybe our liberal masses should do the same.

Like I said before, people here will never understand this casue they have never served this nation at all. Its so sad. I really dont know what much more to say? I mean the facts are pretty straight forward, even a child can comprehend them. The very people who voted to go into iraq are now against it. Thats hypocrisy at its best. How can someone have any ounce of credibility after that?

Let me guess, I already know what you are going to say about this. "Well it was bushes fault for presenting false info, right?" When will you get this through your heads that it wasnt false? I mean the info that was presented was the same info 2 other administrations presented before him. If 30yrs of presented info is wrong then i guess we should start overthrowing the government cause theres no credibility in it whatsoever. Hmmm... mabe this is true?

 

[Navy Pride]

I was behind President Bush 100% in going to Iraq and still am......Bottom line we are there and have to finish the job..........Anybody that talks about cutting and running to me is a traitor.........I can't put it any plainer then that........The time to protest was before the war started..........

"God Bless our Commander in Chief, our brave troops in harms way, and the USA."

 

[SKILMATIC]

Anybody that talks about cutting and running to me is a traitor.........I can't put it any plainer then that........The time to protest was before the war started

Can I get a Amen? :2wave:

 

[gordontravels]

Ya sure, as if a serviceman is going to question his orders. Doesn't matter if they are illegal or not, you are taught to just follow orders first.

As for crackbrained idiots, the same can apply to Bush-worshippers who align with him blindly and follow him from flip to flop. Useful idiots apply here and most of them are r-wing facists at heart.

I've been trying to take you seriously but that is getting harder to accomplish. To think that neighbors, friends or just the people you may have gone to school with would follow orders and it "doesn't matter if they are illegal or not" flies in the face of all Americans that are in or have been in the military. You, in your educated wisdom on military matters pass right over the standard for our military and the orders that are given. That term is "LAWFUL ORDERS".

No soldier is required to follow orders that are not lawful. Article 90, Article 91 and Article 92 of the Uniform Code of Military Justice makes it plain:

These articles require the obedience of LAWFUL orders. An order which is unlawful not only does not need to be obeyed, but obeying such an order can result in criminal prosecution of the one who obeys it. Military courts have long held that military members are accountable for their actions even while following orders -- if the order was illegal.

"I was only following orders," has been unsuccessfully used as a legal defense in hundreds of cases (probably most notably by Nazi leaders at the Nuremberg tribunals following World War II). The defense didn't work for them, nor has it worked in hundreds of cases since.

Keep posting without study and you will finally become one of the posters that just writes but only writes. The Uniform Code of Military Justice. Read it and then maybe you will want to adjust your post. :duel

 

[Missouri Mule]

I've been trying to take you seriously but that is getting harder to accomplish. To think that neighbors, friends or just the people you may have gone to school with would follow orders and it "doesn't matter if they are illegal or not" flies in the face of all Americans that are in or have been in the military. You, in your educated wisdom on military matters pass right over the standard for our military and the orders that are given. That term is "LAWFUL ORDERS".

No soldier is required to follow orders that are not lawful. Article 90, Article 91 and Article 92 of the Uniform Code of Military Justice makes it plain:

These articles require the obedience of LAWFUL orders. An order which is unlawful not only does not need to be obeyed, but obeying such an order can result in criminal prosecution of the one who obeys it. Military courts have long held that military members are accountable for their actions even while following orders -- if the order was illegal.

"I was only following orders," has been unsuccessfully used as a legal defense in hundreds of cases (probably most notably by Nazi leaders at the Nuremberg tribunals following World War II). The defense didn't work for them, nor has it worked in hundreds of cases since.

Keep posting without study and you will finally become one of the posters that just writes but only writes. The Uniform Code of Military Justice. Read it and then maybe you will want to adjust your post. :duel

Good, accurate and insightful post. This bears repeating:


Article 90, Article 91 and Article 92 of the Uniform Code of Military Justice makes it plain:

"These articles require the obedience of LAWFUL orders. An order which is unlawful not only does not need to be obeyed, but obeying such an order can result in criminal prosecution of the one who obeys it. Military courts have long held that military members are accountable for their actions even while following orders -- if the order was illegal."

 

[alienken]

I did. I was just offering a reminder to you and everyone who reads it that this sort of emotional leakage isn't helpful or constructive to a debate nor to ones personal reputation. Even if you don't see it that way, I suspect that some folks think that snide asides help them score coolness points. If the shoe don't fit...

Point taken but I do want to make it clear that when I am speaking about the idiots that deliver the enemies propaganda I am refering to the media and gov. officials, not anyone here.You can say what you like without hurting our war efforts. That stuff gets back to them and the rests of the world. Bin Laden may be hiding in a cave somewhere in Syria but I guarentee you he watches CNN....I think you should also go after the real bitter and extreme snide comments from the other posters.

 

[alienken]

Can I get a Amen? :2wave:

Amen. Utopians will never get it because they are after a world that will not exist.

 

[edb19]

Can I get a Amen? :2wave:

AMEN and AMEN

 

[SKILMATIC]

Amen. Utopians will never get it because they are after a world that will not exist.

This is very true. Now of course we can strive all we can to attain utopia. However, as long as there is sin in this world this will never happen. And last time I checked we havent had very many perfect people in the world(actually none).

 

[ALiberalModerate]

I got to thinking further about a response I had to a liberal asking what we have done for the troops as Republicans and my answers, here's what I came up with:
Since Vietnam Liberals have done the following things To the military:
-some dodged the draft, thus ensuring that some other unfortunate soul took their place on the front line(including FRMR Pres Clinton)
-"Hanoi" Jane Fonda posing with opposing forces, thus thumbing nose at OUR brave men and women who defend HER right to do it.
-demanded a pullout against the fact that, like NavyPride pointed out, we were winning.
-Spit on and threw horrible things at returning soldiers, called them baby killers, and ultimately did their best to destroy whatever sense of dignity they had left.
-Did everything possible to discredit military service, thus demeaning and demonizing a noble profession, thinning recruitment, and demoralizing some of our best citizen's.
-Demanded a scale back in military spending in light of social programs meaning mil. pay no longer competitive and mil. infrastructure also not what it could be. (my personal opinion, the military is one of the few government expenditures that can never be compromised).
-Attempts to halt research and development on new military technologies because of cost regardless of the fact that these improvements could make lives better in combat and maybe even save a few.
-- John Kerry wasn't very guilty of this, before he was:smile:
-Attempting to pass the buck from the two previous actions on their current commander in chief(as well as attacking him constantly during a two front war) and continuosly say that our brave men and women are dying for nothing.
-And finally, constantly playing the troop death card and claiming concern for them, all the while not letting the fact that both fronts have less casualties in four years than some singular battles in other wars.

Thirty years later and you right wingers are still trying to re-fight the Vietnam war. Look, even if we would have won that war in the military sense, we still would have been stuck occupying it, and occupying that nation would make post war Iraq look like crossing guard duty. Unfortunately due to the obvious total lack of empathy on the far right, I don’t guess any of y’all will ever get that though. We lost some 50,000 Americans fighting in Vietnam for nothing. Even if we won that war, what would have gotten out of it? Absolutely nothing. The same goes for the war in Iraq, as a nation, what are we gaining from this? Absolutely nothing. This isn’t World War II, we are not at war with nations who attacked us. Iraq was not a threat, did not have any of those “WMDs”, and was way down on the Middle East list of supporters of terrorism. It is an elective war fought for ideological reasons. And you guys on the right now wonder why more than half of Americans now think that it was a mistake. People aren’t stupid, if they don’t have their head two feet up Limbaugh’s colon, then they have a concept of reality and see this war for what it is.

Furthermore, like a lot of other hard working taxpaying Americans, I don’t want my billions of my tax dollars pissed away lining pockets of big GOP contributing defense contractors on projects that have never worked and show little chance of ever working. The far right is not for defense or the military, but rather the far right is for defense contractors and those who get rich off of war. Your idea of supporting the troops is lining the pockets of the war profiteers, and that my friend is as ethically treasonous and as anti-American as it gets. Anyone who knows anything about the founding of our great nation knows that one of founding principles is that this nation would avoid war at all costs, stay out of foreign entanglements, and that anyone who increases his wealth during a time of war is an enemy to his nation.

Moreover, it is not only the right of every American to question his government’s actions, it is also our responsibility as Americans to question our governments actions and motives. This is not the Soviet Union. This is not a totalitarian state. We don’t serve the government and the military industrial complex in this nation, but rather the government works for us. I love my country. I work hard. I pay my taxes. If I and others like me want to question my government’s motives and question our involvement in this elective war fought purely for ideological reasons, then by God it’s my right and responsibility to do so. If you and those like you don’t like that, then you obviously hate this nation and everything it stands for.

 

[SKILMATIC]

even if we would have won that war in the military sense

We did win that war militarily. We lost the war politically here at home. Learn you history down there buddy. Cause all I read was that first 2 sentences and already your post became full of ignorance.

 

[ALiberalModerate]

We did win that war militarily. We lost the war politically here at home. Learn you history down there buddy. Cause all I read was that first 2 sentences and already your post became full of ignorance.

Where is the ignorance, did we occupy all of Vietnam? We lost the war because a vast majority of hard working tax paying Americans were sick of sending their sons off to fight in a war for nothing. You dont want to answer my post, because you know I am right.

 

[SKILMATIC]

Where is the ignorance, did we occupy all of Vietnam? We lost the war because a vast majority of hard working tax paying Americans were sick of sending their sons off to fight in a war for nothing. You dont want to answer my post, because you know I am right.

OMG look what you said before.

Look, even if we would have won that war in the military sense,

The thing is is we did win the war in a military sense. As I already exclaimed to you.

 

[SKILMATIC]

And yes although I do agree with your post about the vietnam war being for nothing that doesnt disclose the idea of that statement being wrong.

I beleive in that certain scenario, the way to beat communism is containment. We shouldnt have gone in there besides it was too political anyway. If you are going to send a soldier to war let him do his job and dont micromanage him.

 

[Missouri Mule]

Where is the ignorance, did we occupy all of Vietnam? We lost the war because a vast majority of hard working tax paying Americans were sick of sending their sons off to fight in a war for nothing. You dont want to answer my post, because you know I am right.

This is one of the great lies of the left. We won the war decisively. The Viet Cong were utterly destroyed. What happened was that the Democratic/Liberal/leftist cabal in Washington decided to cut the legs out from under the fledgling South Vietnam government. Thanks to Uncle Walt (Walter Cronkite) we "cut and run" and the result was that the North Vietnamese overran the south. This was entirely due to the lilly livered and gutless Democratic congress.

 

[ALiberalModerate]

OMG look what you said before.



The thing is is we did win the war in a military sense. As I already exclaimed to you.

You made the statement, but you didnt prove it. I could say we have been to Mars already. Does that make it true just because I said so? Did we have control of that entire country? You know generally, you win a war when the other side surrenders, or you completely occupy and control that nation. Moreover, you are only proving my point: Over thirty years later, and you right wingers are still trying to re-fight the Vietnam war.

 

[argexpat]

Unlike you I don't want to cut and run in Iraq and see millions of Iraqis murdered........

You mean any more Iraqis than have already been killed all in the name of liberating their oil, er, I mean them.

You Liberals don't care anything about our troops or the Iraqis.........All your worried about is where you will get your next fix..........You disgust me......

Hey, could you define a liberal for me, because you dittoheads have so abused that word that it's become meaningless. 'Preciate it!

Also, I'm jonesin' real bad, can you hook me up? This weekend I'm going to a pro-choice anti-war gay marriage ceremony/rally and bible burning with a bunch of my pinko terrorist sympathizer buddies, and I'd really like to score some primo smack.

 

[MSgt]

Vietnam was an American military victory. Fighting any war and winning is the easy part. Occupation is where things fall apart. This is where the enemy looks forward to our American civilian failure. One of America's missions is to support and defend Democracy everywhere. This has been especially true since the end of WWII. Isolationalism proved to be deadly to Americans. The Vietnamese people needed our help and we responded. The Korean people needed our help and we responded. These were battlefields in the war against the spread of Commmunism. In the end, defending democracies and freedoms around the globe is good for our country. We would be a weaker nation if the rest of the world succumbed to Naziism or Communism. Our lifestyle is only strong because we send our troops forward.

The liberals speak on equality and freedom, but the real truth is that they speak for equality and freedom for Americans only. By saying that we "send our sons" to fight for nothing, you are really saying that if you aren't American, your freedoms don't matter. This is why Conservatives are largely the main contributor to fighting for what is right and moral.

 

[MSgt]

"You mean any more Iraqis than have already been killed all in the name of liberating their oil"

I always love this one. Last I checked, my gas was $2.59 a gallon. I would love to actually go to war for oil.

"Also, I'm jonesin' real bad, can you hook me up? This weekend I'm going to a pro-choice anti-war gay marriage ceremony/rally and bible burning with a bunch of my pinko terrorist sympathizer buddies, and I'd really like to score some primo smack."

Liberal defined. Oh yeah, make sure you shed some tears for the fundamental Islamists while your there. After all, it's not there fault they murder civilians of all cultures. Also, while your protecting their rights to anger...make sure you condemn a few Christians and Jews for their religion.

 

[SKILMATIC]

Another quality gunny post to the records.

The point we are trying to make here southerndemocrat, is that your wrong.

Nothing more nothing less.

And we have been to mars you nutcase, :lol: Its called NASA's exploration program.

I never beleived it but you southerners really are away from it all arent you?

You cant tell me that with 50,000americans dead and app. a million Vietcong dead thats not a military victory? It sure sounds like it to me. Not to mention every major battle that went on in Vietnam we basically handed the vietnamese there asses. Remember the TET offensive? Have you seen We Were Soldiers? That was based on a true story as well. And we won that battle and we were undermaned, over-spread, we had the lower ground, and we still won. Do I need to go into detail?