Children, Coyotes & Over-supervision

[JBG]

Coyotes are increasingly widespread in the suburbs. See Are coyotes moving into your neighborhood? - Science News . Predators of the human variety are widely feared. Some people, in neighborhood discussions are saying, and I am paraphrasing, "the premise that they are not a threat to children or small pets is false" and "(i)t’s irresponsible to say that children are safe."

What do we do? Keep our children inside or in cars? Do we avoid unstructured play for children because of the "big, bad...coyote"? Same question with human child molesters.Kids need to run around, bicycle etc. Don't we need to teach our children, as we were taught when we were young, not to talk to strangers?

At most, I would support a "buddy system" leaning towards group activities, such as pick-up games.

 

[HIP56948]

When the populace allows the destruction of animal habitats,, my tears are not for the humans. Actions have consequences.

 

[JasperL]

Coyotes are increasingly widespread in the suburbs. See Are coyotes moving into your neighborhood? - Science News . Predators of the human variety are widely feared. Some people, in neighborhood discussions are saying, and I am paraphrasing, "the premise that they are not a threat to children or small pets is false" and "(i)t’s irresponsible to say that children are safe."

What do we do? Keep our children inside or in cars? Do we avoid unstructured play for children because of the "big, bad...coyote"? Same question with human child molesters.Kids need to run around, bicycle etc. Don't we need to teach our children, as we were taught when we were young, not to talk to strangers?

At most, I would support a "buddy system" leaning towards group activities, such as pick-up games.

We have coyotes that run through on occasion. We had an explosion of rabbits last year, and then the coyotes moved in over the fall and winter and I don't see any rabbits anymore.... They still go through, which I know because my beagle/pyr smells coyotes at their preferred crossing near our house, and it's the only smell that sends him over the edge.

They are definitely a threat to small animals and kill cats and little dogs every year in my area. The problem are the owners who leave those animals outside, especially at dusk and later when we see them hunting. If you have an 'outdoor' cat, you're feeding the coyotes, it's really that simple.

Are they a possible threat to little children? Yes, there are a handful or so of attacks in the U.S. every year, but I'm sure a car ride is many orders of magnitude more dangerous. I can't imagine properly supervised children are at any meaningful risk.

 

[reflechissez]

politics?

 

[Chillfolks]

Are Dingos taking your babies. Film at 11

 

[EdwinWillers]

Coyotes are one of those "unspoken problems" where I live. My wife and I live in a semi-urban environment, but we have three different packs of coyotes nearby. Small dogs, cats - family pets are frequently "lost" to these vermin. We live in a rather large community, adjacent to a local park and have two small dogs which we never let out into the yard unsupervised. I've seen coyotes in the neighborhood on a number of occasions.

In my state, coyotes are "open season" - there's no limit on taking them, and we can take them year round - as several of my buddies are fond of doing.

What most people around here don't know is that the state actually hires coyote hunters to quietly take care of the population - unbeknownst to most - which I totally support. I can't stand coyotes, the thought that one of them could attack and eat one of our precious pets.

 

[Lisa]

Coyotes are increasingly widespread in the suburbs. See Are coyotes moving into your neighborhood? - Science News . Predators of the human variety are widely feared. Some people, in neighborhood discussions are saying, and I am paraphrasing, "the premise that they are not a threat to children or small pets is false" and "(i)t’s irresponsible to say that children are safe."

What do we do? Keep our children inside or in cars? Do we avoid unstructured play for children because of the "big, bad...coyote"? Same question with human child molesters.Kids need to run around, bicycle etc. Don't we need to teach our children, as we were taught when we were young, not to talk to strangers?

At most, I would support a "buddy system" leaning towards group activities, such as pick-up games.

Human sprawl is the problem, not coyotes, or even bobcats. They are not aggressive toward people.

Encounters with coyotes happen regularly across the United States as well as in Canada, Mexico and parts of Central America. In Chicago, Ill., for instance, coyotes once denned on the top floor of a parking garage across from Soldier Field, the home stadium of the Chicago Bears football team. In 2015, New York City police officers in trucks, cars and helicopters chased a coyote through Riverside Park in Manhattan. They aimed to move the animal out of the city. After three hours, they gave up the chase. The coyote had simply hidden itself too well.


Occasionally, coyotes may bite or attack people or their pets. However, coyotes mostly avoid people. Raphael is glad he’s gotten to see them so many times.

 

[Phys251]

Coyotes are one of those "unspoken problems" where I live. My wife and I live in a semi-urban environment, but we have three different packs of coyotes nearby. Small dogs, cats - family pets are frequently "lost" to these vermin. We live in a rather large community, adjacent to a local park and have two small dogs which we never let out into the yard unsupervised. I've seen coyotes in the neighborhood on a number of occasions.

In my state, coyotes are "open season" - there's no limit on taking them, and we can take them year round - as several of my buddies are fond of doing.

What most people around here don't know is that the state actually hires coyote hunters to quietly take care of the population - unbeknownst to most - which I totally support. I can't stand coyotes, the thought that one of them could attack and eat one of our precious pets.

The coyotes were there first.

 

[JasperL]

Are Dingos taking your babies. Film at 11

These things come up all the time on Nextdoor in my area. People move in and are irrationally scared of anything wild. It's a regular occurrence for people to warn of hawks or possibly owls, to take in all dogs, danger from the sky!!! Same at the dog park when we used to go to the small dog area. A red tail hawk flies over and little dog owners start gathering up the dogs... 🤪

A barred owl or red tailed hawk are likely the biggest predators in my area, and they weight about 2lbs or so. That's not a risk to my min. schnauzer or anything bigger than a new puppy. If they attack it's to protect a nest, not for lunch.

 

[EdwinWillers]

These things come up all the time on Nextdoor in my area. People move in and are irrationally scared of anything wild. It's a regular occurrence for people to warn of hawks or possibly owls, to take in all dogs, danger from the sky!!! Same at the dog park when we used to go to the small dog area. A red tail hawk flies over and little dog owners start gathering up the dogs... 🤪

A barred owl or red tailed hawk are likely the biggest predators in my area, and they weight about 2lbs or so. That's not a risk to my min. schnauzer or anything bigger than a new puppy. If they attack it's to protect a nest, not for lunch.

True - the red-tailed hawks are pretty big, but not so big as to attack a pet unless it's really small. I've actually seen them attack morning doves around here - a sad sight; but that gives you an idea the size of their prey. Squirrels too, and small rabbits.

We do have several large nesting owls nearby that love to hoot it up in our back yard tree - and while they're really not a threat to our pups, it's nevertheless a little disconcerting.

Coyotes though - another story. They'll jump fences and take away pets as large as 20-25#. I hate 'em. One of the neighbor ladies lost her Bischon to a coyote - as she watched.... very sad and angering...

 

[Patriotic Voter]

The coyotes were there first.

And of course totally harmless to any kid who never messes with them. All people have to do is stay at least 25 yards away. But, of course, no kid will ever obey that order without wearing a dog leash. You can't oversupervise a kid when coyotes are spotted.

 

[Michael Cole]

Coyotes, bears and cougars. They all make it down into the city one in awhile. Well, the coyotes pretty much live here. See them all the time.

Nobody has been attacked, to the best of my knowledge

 

[Chomsky]

True - the red-tailed hawks are pretty big, but not so big as to attack a pet unless it's really small. I've actually seen them attack morning doves around here - a sad sight; but that gives you an idea the size of their prey. Squirrels too, and small rabbits.

We do have several large nesting owls nearby that love to hoot it up in our back yard tree - and while they're really not a threat to our pups, it's nevertheless a little disconcerting.

Argh!

If there's anything as annoying as a rooster crowing hours before dawn, it might be an owl hooting before dawn.

We had one that would sit on my neighbor's chimney, and hoot every damn early morning before dawn. It did this for years, right outside me bedroom window. As annoying as anything, I tell you!

Coyotes though - another story. They'll jump fences and take away pets as large as 20-25#. I hate 'em. One of the neighbor ladies lost her Bischon to a coyote - as she watched.... very sad and angering...

I once saw a coyote catch & kill what appeared to be a small fox.

It was quite a sight. Before my eyes, the Coyote changed into a wild predator. All looks of canine likeness were gone. It had the heart & soul of a wild killing machine. I was actually taken back by it. If you think you know dogs, I assure you - you don't know coyotes. Wild & domestic are two whole 'nother worlds!

 

[EdwinWillers]

The coyotes were there first.

That's my wife's argument too whenever she sees a new housing development going up - "I feel for the coyotes and prairie dogs and other critters... they were here first."

But what are we supposed to do? Not build? Or, better yet - let's pay them reparations!

 

[EdwinWillers]

Argh!

If there's anything as annoying as a rooster crowing hours before dawn, it might be an owl hooting before dawn.

We had one that would sit on my neighbor's chimney, and hoot every damn early morning before dawn. It did this for years, right outside me bedroom window. As annoying as anything, I tell you!

Oh, I hear ya; owls are annoying as all get out - their hooting somehow effortlessly reverberates through walls - you can hear it above the stereo or tv even..

But - I have one worse, much worse - the mockingbird. Utter devils at night outside an open window.

I once saw a coyote catch & kill what appeared to be a small fox.

It was quite a sight. Before my eyes, the Coyote changed into a wild predator. All looks of canine likeness were gone. It had the heart & soul of a wild killing machine. I was actually taken back by it. If you think you know dogs, I assure you - you don't know coyotes. Wild & domestic are two whole 'nother worlds!

No doubt. Our office is in town and one day the owner saw a coyote trotting down the street with a cat in its mouth, as if it owned the road.

My buds who hunt them show no mercy - and I'm glad they don't. They might look "dog-like" and one might feel a pang of sympathy for them on that account - but like you say, they're anything but.

 

[Helix]

 

[EdwinWillers]

View attachment 67385134

LOL

 

[Chomsky]

Oh, I hear ya; owls are annoying as all get out - their hooting somehow effortlessly reverberates through walls - you can hear it above the stereo or tv even..

But - I have one worse, much worse - the mockingbird. Utter devils at night outside an open window.

Hah! Never had that experience. Now, I don't want one.

But straight-up, pretty much any bird near an open window, while one is trying to sleep, can be loud!

No doubt. Our office is in town and one day the owner saw a coyote trotting down the street with a cat in its mouth, as if it owned the road.

My buds who hunt them show no mercy - and I'm glad they don't. They might look "dog-like" and one might feel a pang of sympathy for them on that account - but like you say, they're anything but.

I'm tellin' you, my friend, as a life-long dog owner, including having multiples and fosters, that encounter chilled me. Seriously.

I've seen dog attacks, but this was a whole 'nother league. It was the killer instinct call of the wild. That dog-like, almost cute looking thing, transformed into a vicious killing machine like no dog I've seen. Fast as a blur, focused on killing, with a speed, a viciousness, a strength, and a fierceness, like nothing I've seen. It was a fury, a literal fury, a blur, shaking the life out of the animal it was crushing & gnarling between it's jaws. It was nothing like a dog. It was pure wild.

As we watched it all go down from inside our car, stopped, only maybe 15 yards away, I told my speechless wife we'll lever let one of those things ever get near any living thing of ours!

And here's the surprising thing. This coyote was pretty darn big! It almost looked like a wolf. I'm guessing it had to be pushing a solid 40 lbs. Unless we were deceived by the abundant fur.

 

[Schism]

The Dingo got my baby!

 

[JasperL]

True - the red-tailed hawks are pretty big, but not so big as to attack a pet unless it's really small. I've actually seen them attack morning doves around here - a sad sight; but that gives you an idea the size of their prey. Squirrels too, and small rabbits.

We do have several large nesting owls nearby that love to hoot it up in our back yard tree - and while they're really not a threat to our pups, it's nevertheless a little disconcerting.

Coyotes though - another story. They'll jump fences and take away pets as large as 20-25#. I hate 'em. One of the neighbor ladies lost her Bischon to a coyote - as she watched.... very sad and angering...

I'm jealous of your nesting owls. We have them around, Barred Owls, and I hear them regularly but I only see them maybe once or twice a year, and it's almost always when the crows are after them. I always love it when I spot them.

I've never seen a red tailed hawk attack doves, but I think it's because our resident Cooper's Hawks are the ones that mostly do that. I feed birds and the ones that come to the feeder drop seed on the ground and the doves gather to eat that. There's regularly a Cooper's Hawk at the bottom of our yard and I'm sure he's just picking one out for supper. I don't like to see it - seen it once and don't want to again - but it's just what happens. I'll find the pile of feathers occasionally.

And I agree about coyotes. Small pets, cats especially, are definitely part of their food supply in this area, and it's sad when the owners post notices and I know there's no chance once they're missing for more than a day or so. I've warned several with cats who moved into our neighborhood - hope they listened, but we see cats on many walks at night and I never know who they belong to. Our dogs just want to play with them....

I'm actually pretty glad one of our young dogs is a beagle/Great Pyrenees mix and he's big enough - about 60lbs and the coyotes in my area are pretty small - to protect himself and our min. schnauzer. I actually think if the coyotes were around he'd smell them and run them off, or keep them at bay, with his barks etc. The Great Pyrenees livestock guarding dog genes definitely kick in and he gets alert and ready, with huge deep barks, when we cross that smell, unlike anything else - not other dogs, cats, raccoons, skunks, rabbits, etc. Just coyotes. It's a bit embarrassing when it's during our nightly walks but there's nothing I can do. We'll occasionally hear the coyotes yipping back at him, from a distance.... Of course that just sends him over the edge. 🤪

 

[Lisa]

I've never seen a red tailed hawk attack doves, but I think it's because our resident Cooper's Hawks are the ones that mostly so that. I feed birds and the ones that come to the feeder drop seed on the ground and the doves gather to eat that. There's regularly a Cooper's Hawk at the bottom of our yard and I'm sure he's just picking one out for supper. I don't like to see it - seen it once and don't want to again - but it's just what happens. I'll find the pile of feathers occasionally.

And I agree about coyotes. Small pets, cats especially, are definitely part of their food supply in this area, and it's sad when the owners post notices and I know there's no chance once they're missing for more than a day or so. I've warned several with cats who moved into our neighborhood - hope they listened, but we see cats on many walks at night but I never know who they belong to. Our dogs just want to play with them....

I'm actually pretty glad one of our newest dogs is a beagle/Great Pyrenees mix and he's big enough - about 60lbs and the coyotes in my area are pretty small - to protect himself and our min. schnauzer. I actually think if the coyotes were around he'd smell them and run them off, or keep them at bay, with his barks etc. The Great Pyrenees livestock guarding dog genes definitely kick in and he gets alert and ready, with huge deep barks, when we cross that smell, unlike anything else - not other dogs, cats, raccoons, skunks, rabbits, etc. Just coyotes. It's a bit embarrassing when it's during our nightly walks but there's nothing I can do. We'll occasionally hear the coyotes yipping back at him, from a distance.... Of course that just sends him over the edge. 🤪

Red-tailed hawks are common in my area and Ive seen them attack birds, rabbits, and squirrels even in my yard. I was attacked by one on a bike ride when they somehow mistook my bike helmet for food and tried to pull it off my head. Thankfully I had sunglasses on because it tried to peck me.

I've seen coyote tracks in the Cuyahoga Valley National Park north of Akron. The park is overcrowded with deer and that is a favorite meal.

Coexisting with Coyotes - Cuyahoga Valley National Park (U.S. National Park Service)

www.nps.gov

 

[Jay59]

The world's largest population of coyotes is in the hills of Los Angeles County. It's been that way for decades.

For those of you in the east, LA County is bigger than Delaware and Rhode Island combined, so that's a lot of real estate, but still.

 

[EdwinWillers]

I'm jealous of your nesting owls. We have them around, Barred Owls, and I hear them regularly but I only see them maybe once or twice a year, and it's almost always when the crows are after them. I always love it when I spot them.

I've never seen a red tailed hawk attack doves, but I think it's because our resident Cooper's Hawks are the ones that mostly do that. I feed birds and the ones that come to the feeder drop seed on the ground and the doves gather to eat that. There's regularly a Cooper's Hawk at the bottom of our yard and I'm sure he's just picking one out for supper. I don't like to see it - seen it once and don't want to again - but it's just what happens. I'll find the pile of feathers occasionally.

And I agree about coyotes. Small pets, cats especially, are definitely part of their food supply in this area, and it's sad when the owners post notices and I know there's no chance once they're missing for more than a day or so. I've warned several with cats who moved into our neighborhood - hope they listened, but we see cats on many walks at night and I never know who they belong to. Our dogs just want to play with them....

I'm actually pretty glad one of our young dogs is a beagle/Great Pyrenees mix and he's big enough - about 60lbs and the coyotes in my area are pretty small - to protect himself and our min. schnauzer. I actually think if the coyotes were around he'd smell them and run them off, or keep them at bay, with his barks etc. The Great Pyrenees livestock guarding dog genes definitely kick in and he gets alert and ready, with huge deep barks, when we cross that smell, unlike anything else - not other dogs, cats, raccoons, skunks, rabbits, etc. Just coyotes. It's a bit embarrassing when it's during our nightly walks but there's nothing I can do. We'll occasionally hear the coyotes yipping back at him, from a distance.... Of course that just sends him over the edge. 🤪

Yeah, owls are amazing birds - never really realized how much so till we moved out here. Silent fliers! I had one fly over my head from behind (a little ways up) and never heard a thing. I've got some photos of them just perched on a nearby roof or tree, just hanging out.

A Beagle/Great Pyrenees mix? That's different. Several neighbors have Great Pyrenees - really cool dogs - they just lumber along on their walks, but like you said, when they catch that coyote scent (and there's a lot of it around here), they switch gears real quick.

 

[EdwinWillers]

Hah! Never had that experience. Now, I don't want one.

But straight-up, pretty much any bird near an open window, while one is trying to sleep, can be loud!

We had one that'd perch on a branch maybe 10 feet outside our window at night. Mockingbirds run through a litany of various bird calls and other sounds I guess they pick up on their own. But the "singing" is just non-stop. First an oriole, then a sparrow, then a robin, then a jay, then... then... then...

I'm tellin' you, my friend, as a life-long dog owner, including having multiples and fosters, that encounter chilled me. Seriously.

I've seen dog attacks, but this was a whole 'nother league. It was the killer instinct call of the wild. That dog-like, almost cute looking thing, transformed into a vicious killing machine like no dog I've seen. Fast as a blur, focused on killing, with a speed, a viciousness, a strength, and a fierceness, like nothing I've seen. It was a fury, a literal fury, a blur, shaking the life out of the animal it was crushing & gnarling between it's jaws. It was nothing like a dog. It was pure wild.

As we watched it all go down from inside our car, stopped, only maybe 15 yards away, I told my speechless wife we'll lever let one of those things ever get near any living thing of ours!

And here's the surprising thing. This coyote was pretty darn big! It almost looked like a wolf. I'm guessing it had to be pushing a solid 40 lbs. Unless we were deceived by the abundant fur.

That is incredibly sobering. I pray I never have to witness anything like that, let alone have to experience it.

Some nights its unnerving in our subdivision, with three different packs of them howling off in the distance. You feel surrounded.

I'm very cautious when I walk our pups - we've had Westies for over 30 years now - all rescues, and the thought that anything could harm them is chilling. I carry a Buck 110 at all times around here, just in case - you know, like I'd really go Daniel Boone on them - but I carry one, regardless.

 

[JasperL]

Yeah, owls are amazing birds - never really realized how much so till we moved out here. Silent fliers! I had one fly over my head from behind (a little ways up) and never heard a thing. I've got some photos of them just perched on a nearby roof or tree, just hanging out.

A Beagle/Great Pyrenees mix? That's different. Several neighbors have Great Pyrenees - really cool dogs - they just lumber along on their walks, but like you said, when they catch that coyote scent (and there's a lot of it around here), they switch gears real quick.

Yeah, it's different, and pretty rare if the 'matches' for that combo at Embark are any indication - I've seen three so far. We did a DNA test - mom 100% beagle and very small (we met the mom - can't imaging the 'coupling' was fun for her), dad 100% GP. We were surprised that it was 50/50, but now that he's grown, it makes sense and he's got both traits. Spends every walk if allowed with nose on the ground, but at about 9-10 months started to "guard" the house, etc.

And I am fascinated by the genes at work with the dog. That reaction to coyotes is entirely innate. I don't think he's actually ever seen one, and he certainly didn't learn to guard against them and we couldn't possibly train it, but he knows the scent and it sends him into a state he NEVER gets with any other animal. Stands tall, front legs out wide, head and tail up, hackles up, the vocalization. With scents of other dogs, or meeting other dogs, he gets excited (in a friendly, "here's a possible playmate!!!" way) or is indifferent.