• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every person's position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Can we have an electric car dominated society soon?

Andyh2299

National Mentor
Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Jun 7, 2022
Messages
1,370
Reaction score
147
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Slightly Conservative
Can we have an electric car dominated society soon? The main issue is recycling the batteries, and other hazards associated with it. I believe it is a good way to fight climate change and reduce pollution.
 
Can we have an electric car dominated society soon? The main issue is recycling the batteries, and other hazards associated with it. I believe it is a good way to fight climate change and reduce pollution.

Norway is on track on ending the sell of new fossil fuel cars by 2025.


There are also a lot of advancment in recycling and making the batteries more sustainable.


 
What is the main issue?
 
A large percentage of electric power is still produced from fossil fuels. So the shift to electric cars is not so much a revolution, as a demand for revolution.

I'm more interested in the revolution which will come with self-driving cars. Granting equal mobility to everyone, at only slighter greater cost, will achieve what even the best public transport has failed to achieve. Government will be able to issue "autonomous taxi vouchers" to the elderly and disabled. And to the poor also: poor people need transport to attend job interviews, and one of the questions they will be asked is whether they have their own car. If they can say unequivocally Yes, they can afford autonomous taxis to work, they're on a level footing with applicants who say Yes they own a car.

Ideally, self-driving cars and vans can fill the needs of delivery which currently adds to congestion on our roads. But before that happens there will be multiple vans, only partly full, actually making congestion worse. To hurry the transition I would tax all vehicles by miles traveled. And if autonomous vehicles prove themselves, then also institute roads and freeways where driver-vehicles suffer an added tax. Bad driving is the main cause of congestion: it forces good drivers to be more 'defensive' not to mention causing accidents.

A lot of people enjoy driving, but I think most of them would gladly trade it away, in exchange for getting where they are going more quickly, more reliably, and with less chance of dying.
 
What is the main issue?

Well, sources of electricity for instance. Not every country is Norway, with their huge deployment of hydro.
 
Norway is on track on ending the sell of new fossil fuel cars by 2025.

Yeah.......

I'd love to see a few hundred thousand happy Norwegian help this guy dig out your minerals for you.

DRC-cobalt-mine-resources-GettyImages-630671656.jpg
 

Can we have an electric car dominated society soon?​


No.
 
Yeah.......

I'd love to see a few hundred thousand happy Norwegian help this guy dig out your minerals for you.

DRC-cobalt-mine-resources-GettyImages-630671656.jpg

The same could be said of gold or diamonds, which have limited industrial usage. No, don't argue with me about diamonds: industrial diamonds like you have on your nifty knife-sharpener, are not dug from the ground. They're manufactured. And gold is mostly hoarded, since it is traditionally considered too valuable for semi-disposable uses like electrical connectors.

Lithium exists in vast salt basins, which the US has plenty of. Supply will certainly follow demand, and highly industrialized methods will fill supply so the poor black man down a hole won't have a job at all.

Your appeal to the injustices of the international market is noted. If you're walking the walk, it had better be in US made shoes.
 

Can we have an electric car dominated society soon?​


No.

Yes of course we can.

It's just a matter of differential taxation, accentuating the market for different kinds of energy. Cost matters to most people.

Should we? Well I haven't taken a side on that yet.
 
Can we have an electric car dominated society soon? The main issue is recycling the batteries, and other hazards associated with it. I believe it is a good way to fight climate change and reduce pollution.
Dude, this is the kind of post that gets you banned from the republican party. Pollution to some folks is a bad thing, to others, it's money. We don't need no stinkin' regulations on pollution, that kind of crap screws up our profits.
 
Can we have an electric car dominated society soon? The main issue is recycling the batteries, and other hazards associated with it. I believe it is a good way to fight climate change and reduce pollution.
Imagine a hypothetical world where every single car is a battery electric, and charged from a carbon free source. It would cut global CO2 emissions by about 10%. Net zero is a cut of 44%. In the real world that the cut would not be 10% because the cars would not be changed from carbon free sources and could take several decades.
I think the current crop of battery electric cars are not a real solution, better battery technology could change that, but has been slow to develop.
I think man made carbon neutral fuels have a much better possibility.
 
Yeah.......

I'd love to see a few hundred thousand happy Norwegian help this guy dig out your minerals for you.

DRC-cobalt-mine-resources-GettyImages-630671656.jpg



Car, oil, laptop and mobile phone companies have for a long time bought cobalt from Kongo without caring about child labor and other human rights violations. That it's first now those issues are finally getting attention and being addressed, for example through EU's Battery Pass. There a big reason for that is that green industries are under much more scrutiny and demand to be sustainable than other industries.
 
A large percentage of electric power is still produced from fossil fuels. So the shift to electric cars is not so much a revolution, as a demand for revolution.

I'm more interested in the revolution which will come with self-driving cars. Granting equal mobility to everyone, at only slighter greater cost, will achieve what even the best public transport has failed to achieve. Government will be able to issue "autonomous taxi vouchers" to the elderly and disabled. And to the poor also: poor people need transport to attend job interviews, and one of the questions they will be asked is whether they have their own car. If they can say unequivocally Yes, they can afford autonomous taxis to work, they're on a level footing with applicants who say Yes they own a car.

Ideally, self-driving cars and vans can fill the needs of delivery which currently adds to congestion on our roads. But before that happens there will be multiple vans, only partly full, actually making congestion worse. To hurry the transition I would tax all vehicles by miles traveled. And if autonomous vehicles prove themselves, then also institute roads and freeways where driver-vehicles suffer an added tax. Bad driving is the main cause of congestion: it forces good drivers to be more 'defensive' not to mention causing accidents.

A lot of people enjoy driving, but I think most of them would gladly trade it away, in exchange for getting where they are going more quickly, more reliably, and with less chance of dying.

Electric cars can already today have a big impact in reducing CO2 emissios. There the CO2 emissios for electric cars are even lower in Poland that have a lot more coal power than the USA and the EU avarage.


While yes it can also be important with investments into self driving taxis, public transport, walking paths and bike lanes create more freedom and choice for people. While also saving families a lot of money.



 
Imagine a hypothetical world where every single car is a battery electric, and charged from a carbon free source. It would cut global CO2 emissions by about 10%. Net zero is a cut of 44%. In the real world that the cut would not be 10% because the cars would not be changed from carbon free sources and could take several decades.
I think the current crop of battery electric cars are not a real solution, better battery technology could change that, but has been slow to develop.
I think man made carbon neutral fuels have a much better possibility.

The level of CO2 emissios for vehicles are that high even with billions of people still not being able to afford a car. So it shows the great need to both a rapid transition towards electric cars but also create more affordable and sustainable alternatives to private car ownership.

There electric vehicles can also be used for energy storage and thereby help to speed up the transition towards renewable energy.
 
The level of CO2 emissios for vehicles are that high even with billions of people still not being able to afford a car. So it shows the great need to both a rapid transition towards electric cars but also create more affordable and sustainable alternatives to private car ownership.

There electric vehicles can also be used for energy storage and thereby help to speed up the transition towards renewable energy.
I don’t think the idea of using private car batteries as a way to sustain the electrical grid is a bit of a pipe dream, what benefit would the car owner get for using up very limited charge cycles on their private car?
 
Can we have an electric car dominated society soon? The main issue is recycling the batteries, and other hazards associated with it. I believe it is a good way to fight climate change and reduce pollution.
I think so. We have to keep in mind that there was a lot of problems with the petrol based automobile, so it stands to reason such will be true for the next generation of transportation.
 
I don’t think the idea of using private car batteries as a way to sustain the electrical grid is a bit of a pipe dream, what benefit would the car owner get for using up very limited charge cycles on their private car?

Electric car batteries already have long lifespans so that car owners can financial benefit from using the battery for energy storage. There electric car batteries can also get a second life as energy storage.

"“The battery will outlive the car,” says Graeme Cooper confidently. “Today, most EV batteries have a life expectancy of 15 to 20 years within the car – and a second life beyond.”

It’s also worth noting that EV battery technology is still evolving, so as tech develops we expect batteries’ lifespan to increase – as well as becoming cheaper, smaller and even lighter."



There are also electric cars with the range that is ten times more than the daily commute. So it can be great opportunities to charge the car than the supply of electricity is high and the price low.
 
Electric car batteries already have long lifespans so that car owners can financial benefit from using the battery for energy storage. There electric car batteries can also get a second life as energy storage.

"“The battery will outlive the car,” says Graeme Cooper confidently. “Today, most EV batteries have a life expectancy of 15 to 20 years within the car – and a second life beyond.”

It’s also worth noting that EV battery technology is still evolving, so as tech develops we expect batteries’ lifespan to increase – as well as becoming cheaper, smaller and even lighter."



There are also electric cars with the range that is ten times more than the daily commute. So it can be great opportunities to charge the car than the supply of electricity is high and the price low.
Supplying the grid on a regular basis would greatly shorten the battery life. Added charge and discharge cycles will break down the batteries quickly. How will that provide a financial benefit to the car owner beyond storage of their own solar power?
 
Can we have an electric car dominated society soon? The main issue is recycling the batteries, and other hazards associated with it. I believe it is a good way to fight climate change and reduce pollution.
Not until an electric car can go 3-400 miles on a charge. Then recharging them takes about 5 minutes or so that it takes to fill up a gas tank today. With electric cars, long trips or vacations are out of the question. Then how much room does the batteries take inside the car. I assume if one is only using the electric car to drive to and from work, school or shopping, then that would work. Less than 100 miles a day or around that.

I’m not sure how these hybrid electric cars work. When one is driving on gas, that that charge up the batteries? If so, perhaps hybrids is a way to go short term. Then how much do electric cars costs? Are they cheaper then gas fueled vehicles or more expensive? Again I don’t know. Could they ever replace my truck which I live out in the country? I’ll stick with what I got.
 
Not until an electric car can go 3-400 miles on a charge. Then recharging them takes about 5 minutes or so that it takes to fill up a gas tank today. With electric cars, long trips or vacations are out of the question. Then how much room does the batteries take inside the car. I assume if one is only using the electric car to drive to and from work, school or shopping, then that would work. Less than 100 miles a day or around that.

I’m not sure how these hybrid electric cars work. When one is driving on gas, that that charge up the batteries? If so, perhaps hybrids is a way to go short term. Then how much do electric cars costs? Are they cheaper then gas fueled vehicles or more expensive? Again I don’t know. Could they ever replace my truck which I live out in the country? I’ll stick with what I got.
I have a Ford Maverick hybrid pickup on order and will report after I have it a while.
Hybrids come in several different varieties,
Most have both a mechanical and electrical drive, but the plug in hybrids only have electric motors driving the wheels (like a locomotive).
The efficiency of most hybrids comes from using the energy lost when stopping the vehicle to start it moving again. This causes a reversal of the Mileage numbers, so the maverick truck gets 43 mph in town and 34 mpg on the highway.
The plug in hybrids do the same thing but can run some distance on battery alone. This means that short daily trips can be done with energy from the power company or your own solar panels, and would be cheaper than buying gasoline at today’s prices.
 
Okay, a quick question. What is the price difference on a Ford Maverick hybrid pickup and a regular Maverick that runs on gas only?
 
Okay, a quick question. What is the price difference on a Ford Maverick hybrid pickup and a regular Maverick that runs on gas only?
They are the same price, I think the base model 2023 was ~$21,000. The only problem is they take a long time to get one.
 
Soon?
Probably not.
There is still a lot that needs to be done is upgrading and changing the national infrastructure to accommodate a majority electric car US.
Is it inevitable to happen at some point?
Yes.
 
Back
Top Bottom