Can gay people have babies

[Schweddy]

:wcm to Debate Politics!

 

[carolyn-]

I believe that gays can be loving and caring people, and even more loving than a lot of others. What kind of church do you go to?

I personally have many gay friends that are extremely caring people. They are soft-natured, tend to be a little more sensitive to other people and truly, probably the most amazing people i've met. The problem is, the discrimination from the people of the society the little child will grow up to have, as i've wrote on another thread, is/will be distinctively noticable. The comments like, "Oooh your mom's a male, Oooh you dont have a mom, you jus have two dads" will be a stab in the heart for the poor little child. It is tormenting to actually let a child grow up to have this kind of discrimination set upon them the first time they call their mom.. err dad mom?

The problem is: ALL of us grew up to have our parents being a male and a female, (excluding single parent child..) It is far much better for a male and a woman to raise their child, rather than a male and another male to raise the child. Because all of us grew up knowing that boys like girls and girls like boys.. to us, heterosexual, there is this extreme disgust to look at male kissing male. Not to mention, sometimes we find it extremely intriguing too. However, we really do not want to put the little child through this turmoil of growing up knowing that his mom's sexuality is undefined. Moreover, the little child might just grow up hating women. and hence, might just lead the little child into turning just like their dad/moms .. GAYS. If this were to be accepted, and not debated, then it'll probably be utopia by then. But until we reach utopia, may we not have our little kids turn into little gays..


By the way, well said, sebastiansdreams (

**Oh yes, gays are usually more handsome than normal straight guys. HAH ( okay, out of point. :doh

 

[Gandhi>Bush]

I know a guy who has two moms.

::Ahem::

He is heterosexual.

By the way, Frued suggested that during the Phallic stage of development, the child falls in love with the parent of the opposite sex. This causes an intense subconcious hatred for the parent of his own sex. Many people think that Frued was simply a cocaine addict with a doctoral degree. His ideas of psychosexual development are to this day debated. Do you think that there is anything in Frued's thinking that carries weight in this argument?

I personally think that we are attracted to the opposite sex naturally as when we see them our neurotransmitters and what not kick in and say, "I want me a piece of that." Nuerotransmitters don't fire because of what your parents did.

Do heterosexuals openly french in front of their children? They do nothing illicit I think, because they know that that isn't something children need to see. Homosexuals have the same sense I think.

 

[sebastiansdreams]

By the way, Frued suggested that during the Phallic stage of development, the child falls in love with the parent of the opposite sex. This causes an intense subconcious hatred for the parent of his own sex. Many people think that Frued was simply a cocaine addict with a doctoral degree. His ideas of psychosexual development are to this day debated. Do you think that there is anything in Frued's thinking that carries weight in this argument?.

Firstly, Frued was the father of psychology because he himself was the single man in history who needed it the most. Frued, while he did have a very noble idea of examining the mind, was very very close minded in his own research and deductions. He was so convinced of his theory of sex and aggresion that I feel he failed to note a variety of other very real inlinations and cornerstones. I do, to an extent, believe that there is a reality to his Oedipus complex theory... however it is much more subtle than he originally presented it in his thesis. I do completely feel that the most effective and productive thing for a child is a loving and supportive heterosexual family life, because it just cannot be replaced. Homosexuals are people just like anyone else. They can be good parents and they can be bad parents. But, the difference is, that a homosexual couple cannot exhibit totally the genetic characteristics of the opposite sex. In other words, I love my father dearly, but his exact equal could not replace my mother, because she is a woman. As wonderful as a father can be, he cannot be a mother, and as wonderful as a mother can be, she cannot be a father. And I just do not think that is an equal alternative. Granted, it is better, by far, in many ways, than a single parent household. But the geniunly happy heterosexual household cannot be replaced.

 

[Gandhi>Bush]

So, Sebastian, do you think gays should be able to adopt, only as a last resort, or not at all?

 

[sebastiansdreams]

I do not think that the government has the right to make a law either allowing it nor banning it. So if a homosexual family wishes to adopt a child from a federal institution, then that is their own business. I do however strongly suggest that it ought to be at the discretion of any private adoption agency to deny ANYONE adoption of a child.

 

[Cinnamon]

So, Sebastian, do you think gays should be able to adopt, only as a last resort, or not at all?

If gays of either sex can adopt, then should singles of either sex be allowed to adopt? Can single guys adopt just like single women can? Or if multiple incomes are needed then why not commited housemates who are not a "sexual couple"? Why not a bunch of guys like a fraternity or a bunch of girls like a sorority or a mixture of both sexes or all five sexes? Surely such arrangements can't be worse than a bunch of nursery or school staff or a succession of many foster homes.

 

[Pacridge]

If gays of either sex can adopt, then should singles of either sex be allowed to adopt? Can single guys adopt just like single women can? Or if multiple incomes are needed then why not commited housemates who are not a "sexual couple"? Why not a bunch of guys like a fraternity or a bunch of girls like a sorority or a mixture of both sexes or all five sexes? Surely such arrangements can't be worse than a bunch of nursery or school staff or a succession of many foster homes.

Welcome to Debate Politics!

Not sure I understand the "all five sexes" comment.

 

[Kenneth T. Cornelius]

If gays of either sex can adopt, then should singles of either sex be allowed to adopt? Can single guys adopt just like single women can? Or if multiple incomes are needed then why not commited housemates who are not a "sexual couple"? Why not a bunch of guys like a fraternity or a bunch of girls like a sorority or a mixture of both sexes or all five sexes? Surely such arrangements can't be worse than a bunch of nursery or school staff or a succession of many foster homes.

There used to be a soap opera called "Our Gal Sunday", based on the life of a girl raised by a couple of miners in Colorado. This ran for years and years (and years and years) without anyone ever expressing fears of a gay household.

 

[carolyn-]

There used to be a soap opera called "Our Gal Sunday", based on the life of a girl raised by a couple of miners in Colorado. This ran for years and years (and years and years) without anyone ever expressing fears of a gay household.

IS that even allowed? Adoption without a marriage certificate?

 

[Cinnamon]

Pacridge,
There may be six sexes or more. Male, Female, Gay, Lesbian, Both, Neuter. The latter may be due to emotional, social, and sexual detachment or withdrawal. This could be caused by absorption or retreat into academic pursuits. This could also be due to being repulsed by or rejected by prior sexual experiences of self or others. In other words, they just are not sexual toward or with anybody.

Carolyn,
I know of at least one very high income, 40-something, female who adopted a child by herself. I wonder if a guy could do that. It seems they could.
http://www.adopting.org/ncsap.html

Ken,
I doubt that guys could raise a girl in such a manner any more. Being the single dad of a teenage girl would be very hard, probably harder than being the single mom of a teenage boy. Social services and busybodies would be looking for any excuse to presume sexual abuse by the dad.

 

[Androvski]

Gay people can not have babies. The reason that gay marriages need to be banned is because if we all become gay there will be no more humans. Two women or two men can not produce a child its not possible. There is no reason to influence kids that being Gay is ok becuase like I said there would be no way of reproduction.

If half the worlds population were gay,there would still be too many births.Maybe there should be a lot more gay people,that way we would cut the worlds population,perhaps then the Earth would be inhabitable a bit longer.
Surely less Humans is a good thing,environmentally speaking anyway.

 

[Kenneth T. Cornelius]

Ken,
I doubt that guys could raise a girl in such a manner any more. Being the single dad of a teenage girl would be very hard, probably harder than being the single mom of a teenage boy. Social services and busybodies would be looking for any excuse to presume sexual abuse by the dad.

I disagree with this. The reason I brought Our Gal Sunday up was because she was raised by TWO guys, and we were talking about gay relationships.

 

[Cinnamon]

I disagree with this. The reason I brought Our Gal Sunday up was because she was raised by TWO guys, and we were talking about gay relationships.

By two gays. Then that may defuse the risk of sexual abuse by the adults since they are not really males.

 

[Cinnamon]

Were those two male miners gay? I've known a lot of miners and thus I expect that miners, at least hard rock underground miners, would not be gay. If these were two straight males then my premise that such a family would not be left intact for long by the forces of lawyers, social services, advocates, and other meddlers seeking to find evidence of sexual abuse even if they had to make it up or "recover" it.

But if these were two gays. Then that may defuse the risk of charges of sexual abuse by the adults since they are not really males. Older guys might be not be as suspect either. Maybe guys should mary women thirty years younger than themselves. Then, by the time the kids reach puberty, the dads would be regarded by the meddlers as just neutered old farts.

 

[ShamMol]

By two gays. Then that may defuse the risk of sexual abuse by the adults since they are not really males.

They are not really males? What are they? Freaks? Is that what you are getting at?

 

[Cinnamon]

They are not really males? What are they? Freaks? Is that what you are getting at?

DON'T go putting words in my mouth or making up words in my text that are not there!

What I wrote earlier also was:
There may be six sexes or more. Male, Female, Gay, Lesbian, Both, Neuter.

So which are they?

They clearly are not male in the complete definition of that term.

If you want to use a disparaging term, go right ahead.

 

[ShamMol]

DON'T go putting words in my mouth or making up words in my text that are not there!

What I wrote earlier also was:
There may be six sexes or more. Male, Female, Gay, Lesbian, Both, Neuter.

So which are they?

They clearly are not male in the complete definition of that term.

If you want to use a disparaging term, go right ahead.

The definition for male is...

1. Of, relating to, or designating the sex that has organs to produce spermatozoa for fertilizing ova.
2. Characteristic of or appropriate to this sex; masculine.
3. Consisting of members of this sex.
2. Virile; manly.
3. Botany.
1. Relating to or designating organs, such as anthers or antheridia, that produce gametes capable of fertilizing those produced by female organs.
2. Bearing stamens but not pistils; staminate: male flowers.
4. Designating an object, such as an electric plug, configured for insertion into a recessed part or socket.

I don't see liking women or being heterosexual there. They produce sperm which can or cannot fertilize ova (ie-priests don't fertilize ova, does that make them not male?). My point is that they are male, they just have a different sexual orientation which doesn't make them any less male.

 

[Kenneth T. Cornelius]

Were those two male miners gay? I've known a lot of miners and thus I expect that miners, at least hard rock underground miners, would not be gay. If these were two straight males then my premise that such a family would not be left intact for long by the forces of lawyers, social services, advocates, and other meddlers seeking to find evidence of sexual abuse even if they had to make it up or "recover" it.

But if these were two gays. Then that may defuse the risk of charges of sexual abuse by the adults since they are not really males. Older guys might be not be as suspect either. Maybe guys should mary women thirty years younger than themselves. Then, by the time the kids reach puberty, the dads would be regarded by the meddlers as just neutered old farts.

The subject of their being gay never arose. This obsession with homosexuality is a recent phenomenon.

 

[neccy60]

What is the point of this? Suggesting population control by having half of us gay? No. Just....no. I think mandatory sterilization after one kid is better than this, and I am also against that as well.

 

[Androvski]

What is the point of this? Suggesting population control by having half of us gay? No. Just....no. I think mandatory sterilization after one kid is better than this, and I am also against that as well.

Iam gay and I've got two kids.I didn't decide that I'd had a"bellyful"of Women until I was Thirty yrs old(no offence to Women in general,just the ones I knew).I'm not suggesting that half of us turn gay to reduce the population,I just said that if half the population were gay there would still be too many births.
To suggest that people should not be gay in order to maintain or increase the population is another matter.
Mandatory sterilization after one child?I don't really go along with that.China have been trying to enforce one child per family(although not through sterilization)for a long time now,their population has to some extent stabilized,but the methods of enforcing that law have been excessive to say the least.

 

[Voice of Reason]

Gay people can not have babies. The reason that gay marriages need to be banned is because if we all become gay there will be no more humans. Two women or two men can not produce a child its not possible. There is no reason to influence kids that being Gay is ok becuase like I said there would be no way of reproduction.

Dear Mee,

Perhaps you should examine what you just said. Does this mean that you will become gay? I for one will not, so perhaps I am doomed to a future of loneliness and exile in this Gay New World.

The Voice

 

[Androvski]

Dear Mee,

Perhaps you should examine what you just said. Does this mean that you will become gay? I for one will not, so perhaps I am doomed to a future of loneliness and exile in this Gay New World.

The Voice

Loneliness would be unavoidable for a heterosexual in a predominantly homosexual world,but I'm sure you would not be exiled.We would not persecute heterosexuals in the same way that many of them have persecuted us over the years.
Anyway it's never going to happen,so you can back away from the wall now.

 

[JustineCredible]

Enough Of The Rhetoric And Diatribe!

Look, gays/lesbians can and do have babies!

If you don't believe me, just ask my sixteen year old son!
I didn't adopt him, I didn't go through expensive invetro-fertilization.

No, insted I grew up in the midwest during the 1960's - 1980's. I was a victim of a social structure that taugh little girls that being gay was bad or sick. So, to seem "normal" I dated guys and eventually even married one. We had a child..and all the while I hoped beyond hope that somehow doing so would "cure" me of my being a lesbian.
I knew who I was but couldn't accept it.
Not until I found myself divorced and faced with the very real moral dilema of raising my son alone. I had to decide how I would raise him, whether to raise him to learn to lie about himself and hate himself or to raise him to be comfortable in his own skin and be honest.
To do that I had to set the example.

Luckily I was blessed with supportive and loving family and friends.
I found real love of my life, and for the past eight years we have raised an honest, well adjusted, happy, healthy, compassionate, hard working young man.
Not only CAN gays and lesbians become parents, we do at ever increasing rates!

What's even better is that we are raising children who are happy, healthy, well loved and well informed!

We adopt, foster, raise our own flesh and blood as well as children of family members. Our children are safe, well educated, honest, caring, NORMAL!
There is no statistics showing that gay and lesbian parents raise children to "become" gay or lesbian, no more so than do straight parents!
...what's even funnier about the whole thing...

I was raised by STRAIGHT PARENTS! Guess what?

I'm gay!

 

[26 X World Champs]

Re: Enough Of The Rhetoric And Diatribe!

Look, gays/lesbians can and do have babies!

I was raised by STRAIGHT PARENTS! Guess what?

I'm gay!

Hi Justine! Welcome to our little part of the world! :wcm

Great post! I hope that your beautifully written words will get through to some of the homophobes that we have here....Even if they do not, please know that you're reaching a lot of people and reinforcing what we already know, namely that one's sexual orientation has absolutely nothing to do with parenting....