California AB 1157 aka the "Affordable Rent Act" Would Actually Cause Rents To Go Up . . . A LOT (1 Viewer)

[ALiberalModerate]

You're speaking in relative, not absolute, terms. Go back, reread the article I posted, and note how Texas is rapidly moving out of affordability terms.

In absolute terms, if you can purchase a home in a city with a strong economy for 300k or less, it is affordable by any measure. Housing in California is 3 to 5 times as expensive as it is in comperable Texas cities.

 

[Phys251]

In absolute terms, if you can purchase a home in a city with a strong economy for 300k or less, it is affordable by any measure. Housing in California is 3 to 5 times as expensive as it is in comperable Texas cities.

We're going to have to agree to disagree on this one. Houston is not the affordable city that you make it out to be. California's housing crisis is irrelevant to that point.

 

[ALiberalModerate]

We're going to have to agree to disagree on this one. Houston is not the affordable city that you make it out to be. California's housing crisis is irrelevant to that point.

Tell me how Houston is unaffordable when you can purchase a home there for 266k on average? How is it unaffordable, do the math and show me how that is unaffordable?

 

[Phys251]

Tell me how Houston is unaffordable when you can purchase a home there for 266k on average? How is it unaffordable, do the math and show me how that is unaffordable?

That's great for those who are making a bunch of money. How about the working class, which is struggling to get by?

Affordable Housing Crisis - A Guide for Houston Families - Houston Habitat for Humanity

Discover solutions for affordable housing in Houston and learn how families can overcome the crisis to secure a stable home. Read our comprehensive guide.

www.houstonhabitat.org

Is Habitat for Humanity lying about this?

 

[What if...?]

California will try anything to avoid building more housing. No rent-control scheme is too ridiculous, convoluted, or economically illiterate for California. But God forbid they actually let people build stuff on their own land.

A couple years ago I was feeling encouraged that maybe California was turning a corner when they passed a bunch of YIMBY legislation in short succession. But since then they've mostly let NIMBYs continue to tie it up in the courts so not much has actually gotten built. I've concluded that even when California passes good laws, they are less interested in the outcome than they are in looking like they're doing something about the problem.

California is a good example of how a monolithic Democratic state should NOT be run...and if Democrats are smart they will learn from this failure and try to figure out what they did wrong so that this doesn't replicate elsewhere.

San Diego is mass producing high end apartment building downtown. And they let just about everybody build an ADL to use as a rental.

The rentals cost the mortgage payment.

So those of us who rent are just paying for all the new housing.

 

[ALiberalModerate]

That's great for those who are making a bunch of money. How about the working class, which is struggling to get by?

Affordable Housing Crisis - A Guide for Houston Families - Houston Habitat for Humanity

Discover solutions for affordable housing in Houston and learn how families can overcome the crisis to secure a stable home. Read our comprehensive guide.

www.houstonhabitat.org

Is Habitat for Humanity lying about this?

Do the math. Don’t just google to try to find an article that seems to support your contention. The average sales price for a home in Houston is 266k. It is also a city with a strong economy and lots of opportunity. People in poverty cannot afford to buy a house in Houston just like people in poverty cannot afford to buy a home in any wealthy country on earth otherwise they wouldn’t live in poverty. However, someone in the middle class can afford a home in Houston. Name a large city on the face of the earth with cheaper housing relative to average area incomes than Houston.

 

[Phys251]

Do the math. Don’t just google to try to find an article that seems to support your contention. The average sales price for a home in Houston is 266k. It is also a city with a strong economy and lots of opportunity. People in poverty cannot afford to buy a house in Houston just like people in poverty cannot afford to buy a home in any wealthy country on earth otherwise they wouldn’t live in poverty. However, someone in the middle class can afford a home in Houston. Name a large city on the face of the earth with cheaper housing relative to average area incomes than Houston.

So this:

The key findings log that families in need of decent, affordable housing face the biggest challenges. There are only 7 million affordable units for 11 million households with extremely low incomes, but of the 7 million, 3.3 million are occupied by households with higher incomes. Texas is one of six states with the most severe shortages, with Houston ranking 5th for worst metropolitan areas in the country, according to the 2024 State of the Nation’s Housing report.

is a lie?

 

[ttwtt78640]

In all fairness, no one has ever said "My grandmother was born in that trailer up there."

Some (yet far from all) manufactured (mobile) homes are built as well as ‘stick built’ homes. If set on a decent foundation, properly tied down (and skirted), have adequate (2x8 placed 16” OC) floor joists (many don’t) and receive adequate routine maintenance, manufactured homes built after 2006 (when they got rid of MDF sub-flooring) will last quite a while.

 

[ttwtt78640]

Do the math. Don’t just google to try to find an article that seems to support your contention. The average sales price for a home in Houston is 266k. It is also a city with a strong economy and lots of opportunity. People in poverty cannot afford to buy a house in Houston just like people in poverty cannot afford to buy a home in any wealthy country on earth otherwise they wouldn’t live in poverty. However, someone in the middle class can afford a home in Houston. Name a large city on the face of the earth with cheaper housing relative to average area incomes than Houston.

Housing costs are lower in San Antonio, TX than in Houston, TX.

Living in San Antonio vs Houston 🆚 | Pros and Cons of Houston vs San Antonio Living – Cost of Living + More

Houston or San Antonio: where should you live? 🏙️ Here’s the San Antonio vs Houston cost of living, crime, pros & cons, and other comparisons to help you choose!

2collegebrothers.com

Houston vs San Antonio Living

Houston Vs San Antonio Living: Delve into our detailed comparison on cost of living, climate, real estate, and more to help you decide at WanBridge.com

wanbridge.com

 

[ALiberalModerate]

So this:



is a lie?

Where on earth can people with extremely low incomes buy a home? You are conflating the need for greater HUD assistance (which is largely a federal issue), with home affordability. Homes are not going to be free anywhere, so there will always be people that cannot afford a home without assistance. However, if you can buy a home in Houston Texas, a worldclass city with a strong economy, for less than 300k, that is affordable by any standard on earth.

 

[Phys251]

Where on earth can people with extremely low incomes buy a home? You are conflating the need for greater HUD assistance (which is largely a federal issue), with home affordability. Homes are not going to be free anywhere, so there will always be people that cannot afford a home without assistance. However, if you can buy a home in Houston Texas, a worldclass city with a strong economy, for less than 300k, that is affordable by any standard on earth.

You didn't answer my question. Is what H4H saying in that quote a lie?

 

[ALiberalModerate]

Housing costs are lower in San Antonio, TX than in Houston, TX.

Living in San Antonio vs Houston 🆚 | Pros and Cons of Houston vs San Antonio Living – Cost of Living + More

Houston or San Antonio: where should you live? 🏙️ Here’s the San Antonio vs Houston cost of living, crime, pros & cons, and other comparisons to help you choose!

2collegebrothers.com

Houston vs San Antonio Living

Houston Vs San Antonio Living: Delve into our detailed comparison on cost of living, climate, real estate, and more to help you decide at WanBridge.com

wanbridge.com

They really aren't comparable though. Houston is a much, much larger metro than San Antonio. It's like comparing Birmingham to Atlanta.

 

[ALiberalModerate]

You didn't answer my question. Is what H4H saying in that quote a lie?

I am not disputing that people living in poverty cannot afford to buy a home in Houston, just like they can't afford to buy a home in any major city on earth. Houston is a rapidly growing metro, it has been one of the fastest growing metro in the country for decades. That is why people in poverty are having a hard time finding housing there. That doesn't change the fact that Houston is affordable to working class people. Not people in poverty, because that is the whole thing about living in poverty, its ****ing poverty.

Joe Biden has this saying, "Don't compare me to the almighty, compare me to the alternative." Name a large city on earth that you can make the kind of money you can in Houston and buy a home for 266k. Houston has home prices of cities that have declined in population for decades (like Buffalo or Cleveland), despite having a rapidly growing population and tons of opportunity. Tell me what other city on earth has managed to do that.

 

[ttwtt78640]

Earlier in the thread, I posted the average single family home sales prices for the 4 largest cities in Texas:

Average home price in Houston: $267,854
Average home price in Dallas: $311,280
Average home price in Austin: $522,717
Average home price in San Antonio: $252,434

Of those cities, only Austin is unaffordable. The largest city in Texas is Houston. If you can buy a single family home affordably in Houston, and you can, there isn't going to be as much demand for high density multifamily housing. Given the choice between a house with a yard vs a high rise, most people will opt for the house with the yard and in a free market, that is what builders will build to meet demand. Just the same, Houston is the nation's 4th largest city, but has the 3rd most highrises of any city in the country. I would challenge you to find a city on earth that has more affordable housing relative to incomes than Houston enjoys.

Do you have any evideder $40Knce that residents in Texas are demanding more high density housing than is available?

My girlfriend and I live in Uhland, TX which is about 25 miles from Austin, TX and manage to live on our (combined) SS retirement incomes of under $40K/year. We own (mortgage free) our 952 sq. ft. manufactured (mobile) home (bought new in 2020) and rent the 1/2 acre lot (with septic) it sits on (currently for $600/month).

 

[Phys251]

I am not disputing that people living in poverty cannot afford to buy a home in Houston, just like they can't afford to buy a home in any major city on earth. Houston is a rapidly growing metro, it has been one of the fastest growing metro in the country for decades. That is why people in poverty are having a hard time finding housing there. That doesn't change the fact that Houston is affordable to working class people. Not people in poverty, because that is the whole thing about living in poverty, its ****ing poverty.

There is a large overlap between working-class people and impoverished people. Houstonians struggle to find affordable living.

Joe Biden has this saying, "Don't compare me to the almighty, compare me to the alternative." Name a large city on earth that you can make the kind of money you can in Houston and buy a home for 266k. Houston has home prices of cities that have declined in population for decades (like Buffalo or Cleveland), despite having a rapidly growing population and tons of opportunity. Tell me what other city on earth has managed to do that.

Once again, you desperately want to frame this in relative rather than absolute terms. Houston ranks as one of the worst cities in the country for affordable housing shortages, thanks to NIMBY-ism and suburban sprawl, which Houston is infamous for. They need more high-density housing.

 

[ALiberalModerate]

There is a large overlap between working-class people and impoverished people. Houstonians struggle to find affordable living.



Once again, you desperately want to frame this in relative rather than absolute terms. Houston ranks as one of the worst cities in the country for affordable housing shortages, thanks to NIMBY-ism and suburban sprawl, which Houston is infamous for. They need more high-density housing.

In terms of housing costs relative to incomes, its one of the less expensive cities in the country and of cities that are rapidly growing, there is no city less expensive than Houston other than San Antonio and Fort Worth: https://www.visualcapitalist.com/mapped-home-price-to-income-ratio-of-large-u-s-cities/

Both in relative terms and absolute terms (home sale prices are 266k on average), it is affordable. You might argue that everyone in Houston cannot afford housing, but that is a ridiculous argument by itself because that is true of every city on earth.

 

[Phys251]

In terms of housing costs relative to incomes, its one of the less expensive cities in the country and of cities that are rapidly growing, there is no city less expensive than Houston other than San Antonio and Fort Worth: https://www.visualcapitalist.com/mapped-home-price-to-income-ratio-of-large-u-s-cities/

Both in relative terms and absolute terms (home sale prices are 266k on average), it is affordable. You might argue that everyone in Houston cannot afford housing, but that is a ridiculous argument by itself because that is true of every city on earth.

You need to stop using averages and start using medians. In addition, consider all of the Houston metro area instead of just Houston proper.

https://www.nar.realtor/sites/defau...e-prices-q1-2025-single-family-2025-05-08.pdf (PDF)

The MEDIAN home price in metro Houston is over $300k. How many working-class people can afford that?

 

[ttwtt78640]

In terms of housing costs relative to incomes, its one of the less expensive cities in the country and of cities that are rapidly growing, there is no city less expensive than Houston other than San Antonio and Fort Worth: https://www.visualcapitalist.com/mapped-home-price-to-income-ratio-of-large-u-s-cities/

Both in relative terms and absolute terms (home sale prices are 266k on average), it is affordable. You might argue that everyone in Houston cannot afford housing, but that is a ridiculous argument by itself because that is true of every city on earth.

The poverty rate (and cost of living) is higher in California than it is in Texas.

In 2023, California had a significantly higher poverty rate than Texas. California's poverty rate was 18.9%, while Texas's was 13.7%. This means that a larger proportion of California's population was living below the poverty line compared to Texas. Factors contributing to higher poverty in California: California faces a high cost of living, significant income inequality, and a lack of affordable housing.

 

[Maidenrules29]

would you rather be a software engineer earning $160k a year in Houston Texas, or one earning $189k a year in the Bay Area?

LOL you couldn't pay me any amount to live in either of those cities.

 

[SkyChief]

question: If you have not raised rent in 8 years why would you raise rent just because of the law AB1157? More to the point, would you raise rent if AB 1157 did not exist?

No, because there is no need to (at this time). If needed, I would raise the rent - which might require a 3% or 4% increase.

AB 1157 doesn't allow that discretion to rental-property owners, so each year we'll automatically raise the rents to the legal limit (2%). My friends said they would do the same.

Not saying you should or should not raise rent. One should expect a return in rental property. Just trying to understand why aB 1157 would trigger you to raise rent 2% each and every year when you have not in the past.

Because before the rent-hike cap, I could raise the rents when needed to the appropriate amount. If AB 1157 passes, property owners will need to hedge rent hikes to keep up with inflation and Property Tax hikes.

Sadly, it will be impossible for rental property owners to use rent-hikes to offset inflation and Property Tax hikes.

Seems like there's a permanent disconnect between the California lawmakers, their thinking and the rather obvious to others real life impacts of the legislation they pass into law.
How do they continue to get reelected?

Most of California's electorate are as stupid, or as ignorant as the lawmakers.

 

[eohrnberger]

Most of California's electorate are as stupid, or as ignorant as the lawmakers.

Indeed.
Yet some wrongly believe that CA, it's legislators, its electorate, should be the model for the entire nation.

 

[ALiberalModerate]

LOL you couldn't pay me any amount to live in either of those cities.

Well a lot of people do just the same.

 

[poppopfox]

As the saying goes . . . "Stupid is, as stupid does." This expression means that we can expect stupid people to say and do stupid things. Case in point: California lawmakers, who are proudly the stupidest collective body of lawmakers in the country, have predictably misnamed their absurd Rent-Control bill.

What AB 1157 will do:

•Authorizes Permanent Price Controls On Single-Family Homes, ADUs, and Condominiums. This bill would lower property values and discourage new housing construction, exacerbating California’s housing crisis.

• Targets Small Property Owners, Hitting Them The Hardest. Nearly 40% of California’s rental housing is owned by small “Mom & Pop” housing providers.

• Would Lead To Higher Market Rents. By discouraging new housing construction and pushing small housing providers out of the market, this bill would drive up market rents, hurting working families.

• Ignores Multiple Voter Mandates AGAINST Statewide Rent Control. California voters have rejected statewide rent control three times, most recently last year where every county in the state voted NO on statewide rent control.

• Limits annual rent increases to only 2%, which doesn't even keep up with inflation.

Here are the things that AB 1157 won't do:

• Does NOT provide funding for affordable housing or a requirement that it be built.

• Does NOT provide specific provisions to reduce rent.

I own a few rental properties in southern California. Most of our tenants haven't seen a rent hike in 8 years. If this nutty bill passes, I will definitely hike rents the absolute maximum amount (2%) without any thought. It will be automatic annual rent hikes for ALL our tenants.

I have friends who also own multiple rental units, and they have expressed the same sentiments.

This bill (AB 1157) is poison, and it would ultimately result in higher rents for renters. It's possibly the dumbest bill I have seen from the nincompoops in Sacramento.

Got a source to go with that cut and paste?

 

[Deuce]

As the saying goes . . . "Stupid is, as stupid does." This expression means that we can expect stupid people to say and do stupid things. Case in point: California lawmakers, who are proudly the stupidest collective body of lawmakers in the country, have predictably misnamed their absurd Rent-Control bill.

What AB 1157 will do:

•Authorizes Permanent Price Controls On Single-Family Homes, ADUs, and Condominiums. This bill would lower property values and discourage new housing construction, exacerbating California’s housing crisis.

• Targets Small Property Owners, Hitting Them The Hardest. Nearly 40% of California’s rental housing is owned by small “Mom & Pop” housing providers.

• Would Lead To Higher Market Rents. By discouraging new housing construction and pushing small housing providers out of the market, this bill would drive up market rents, hurting working families.

• Ignores Multiple Voter Mandates AGAINST Statewide Rent Control. California voters have rejected statewide rent control three times, most recently last year where every county in the state voted NO on statewide rent control.

• Limits annual rent increases to only 2%, which doesn't even keep up with inflation.

Here are the things that AB 1157 won't do:

• Does NOT provide funding for affordable housing or a requirement that it be built.

• Does NOT provide specific provisions to reduce rent.

I own a few rental properties in southern California. Most of our tenants haven't seen a rent hike in 8 years. If this nutty bill passes, I will definitely hike rents the absolute maximum amount (2%) without any thought. It will be automatic annual rent hikes for ALL our tenants.

I have friends who also own multiple rental units, and they have expressed the same sentiments.

This bill (AB 1157) is poison, and it would ultimately result in higher rents for renters. It's possibly the dumbest bill I have seen from the nincompoops in Sacramento.

Weird that you linked no evidence of any of your claims here.

 

[slavablueberryjam]

In absolute terms, if you can purchase a home in a city with a strong economy for 300k or less, it is affordable by any measure. Housing in California is 3 to 5 times as expensive as it is in comperable Texas cities.

There is no such thing as a strong economy and houses for 300k or less. None.