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Bush's Admin is a slur on all U.S citizens

windofchange

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Forgive me if this is provocative but I want to know how so called patriots who voted for Bush reconcile the fact that they voted for an imbecile who makes the US and ever increasing joke to the rest of the world. I’m not trying to say anything about the country but from an outsiders perspective Bush makes your whole nation look stupid (and don’t get me started on Ol’ Rummy) . What do people think?
 

ProudAmerican

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I think everyone has a right to their opinion.

I also dont think most Americans care what the rest of the world thinks.

we have 4.8% unemployment, and a rocking economy. all of this while fighting a war that has been a long time comming.

I would say maybe the rest of the world might want to focus their negativity on a country that is full if internal strife that has leaders that clearly cant get the job dont at home.....

like say.....maybe, FRANCE!!!
 
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windofchange said:
Forgive me if this is provocative but I want to know how so called patriots who voted for Bush reconcile the fact that they voted for an imbecile who makes the US and ever increasing joke to the rest of the world. I’m not trying to say anything about the country but from an outsiders perspective Bush makes your whole nation look stupid (and don’t get me started on Ol’ Rummy) . What do people think?

:lol: I say welcome to the forum, wind. With words like embicile and stupid, you'll make a lot of friends here. :2wave:
 

128shot

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ProudAmerican said:
I think everyone has a right to their opinion.

I also dont think most Americans care what the rest of the world thinks.

we have 4.8% unemployment, and a rocking economy. all of this while fighting a war that has been a long time comming.

I would say maybe the rest of the world might want to focus their negativity on a country that is full if internal strife that has leaders that clearly cant get the job dont at home.....

like say.....maybe, FRANCE!!!


Clearly you don't understand the real opposition against bush.


Not to mention we calculate our unemployment numbers much differently than europes (that has alot to do with why theirs is seemingly higher than ours), and that "rocking economy" has 2 downfalls. The money being pumped in it by the Federal Reserve and the Dollar is threatend.


Not to mention one of our greatest national security threats (arguably what we should have gone after eliminating in the first place) isn't a terrorist with a few bombs (I'm trying to be a realist here, I hope OSama burns in hell), its our huge dependance on oil.
 
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128shot said:
Not to mention one of our greatest national security threats (arguably what we should have gone after eliminating in the first place) isn't a terrorist with a few bombs (I'm trying to be a realist here, I hope OSama burns in hell), its our huge dependance on oil.
Do you know the amount of oil we receive from the Arab countries in which we fight the war on terror?
 

disneydude

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ProudAmerican said:
I also dont think most Americans care what the rest of the world thinks.

we have 4.8% unemployment, and a rocking economy. all of this while fighting a war that has been a long time comming.


Yeah, because having a good foreign policy is so unimportant.

Also, a "rocking economy"? What planet are you on? Clearly you don't live in the real world. You must be part of the wealthy elite that has benefitted from the increasing corporatist control of this country. Real wages have declined for most Americans and high paying manufacturing jobs are being outsourced by corporations looking for cheap labor in third world countries in exchange for lower paying service industry jobs.
If this is what you call a rocking economy your standards are set low. I would say its more of a rocky economy.
 

Simon W. Moon

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windofchange said:
Forgive me if this is provocative...
Sure, forgiveness is easy. However,...

Moderator's Warning:
No matter the strength of your desire to engage in civil discourse, the tone of your OP (Original Post) is unlikely to engender civility. Rather than tempting folks beyond their capacity to resist a digression into uncivil remarks in the civil forums, I'm going to move this thread to The Basement where such digressions carry no official consequences.


windofchange said:
but I want to know how so called patriots who voted for Bush reconcile the fact that they voted for an imbecile who makes the US and ever increasing joke to the rest of the world. I’m not trying to say anything about the country but from an outsiders perspective Bush makes your whole nation look stupid ...
I voted for him the first time because he was less incumbent than Gore. I voted for him the second time because I think it's better for the country that the Bush Admin et al should sleep in the bed that they made. That way we'll all know who **** the bed. I think a number of things will continue to go south. If Kerry were in the WH, he'd be getting the blame and Bush Admin et al would not have to assume responsibility for what they have done. Then more of the same would come down the pike too soon. But now, as the chickens come home to roost and the American electorate grows more distrustful and disatisfied with the Bush Admin et al and rightly blames them for some (but definitely now all) of the more dicey and difficult predicaments we're in now. This term is the necessary repudiation of the Bush Admin et al in the eyes of the electorate.
Unfortunately, we don't have an alternative party with the balls to do what it's supposed to do and hold the other party accountable. Sad day for the GOP to have so bested the loyal opposition. Weakened the party really.
 

ProudAmerican

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Yeah, because having a good foreign policy is so unimportant.

define "good" foreign policy.

Also, a "rocking economy"? What planet are you on? Clearly you don't live in the real world.

the current economy is every bit as good as the one the left PRAISED under Bill Clinton.

4.8% unemployment!!!!! you do realize that 3% is considered FULL employment right?
 

americanwoman

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windofchange said:
Forgive me if this is provocative but I want to know how so called patriots who voted for Bush reconcile the fact that they voted for an imbecile who makes the US and ever increasing joke to the rest of the world. I’m not trying to say anything about the country but from an outsiders perspective Bush makes your whole nation look stupid (and don’t get me started on Ol’ Rummy) . What do people think?


I think it's funny your mood says tolerant.

But where are you from? What country can possibly have it better than we have it here it the US?
 

Ivan The Terrible

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Americanwoman,

I think it's funny your mood says tolerant.

Well yeah he means tolerant of libreal sh-it.


But where are you from? What country can possibly have it better than we have it here it the US?

Iraq.
 

mixedmedia

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americanwoman said:
I think it's funny your mood says tolerant.

But where are you from? What country can possibly have it better than we have it here it the US?
You must realize that much of the world is content not to be America, right? People living in many places in the world believe they have it better than we do. Should be no skin off our teeth.
 

americanwoman

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mixedmedia said:
You must realize that much of the world is content not to be America, right? People living in many places in the world believe they have it better than we do. Should be no skin off our teeth.


I guess so. I just love it here so much and all the freedom we enjoy daily it's kinda hard to imagine living somewhere else. Like, I love Mexico but I think it would be hard to live there. Your right though, no sweat off my back!:)
 

cnredd

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americanwoman said:
I guess so. I just love it here so much and all the freedom we enjoy daily it's kinda hard to imagine living somewhere else. Like, I love Mexico but I think it would be hard to live there. Your right though, no sweat off my back!:)
You mean the sweat is STILL on your back?...

eeewwwwwwww!!!....:doh
 

mixedmedia

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cnredd said:
You mean the sweat is STILL on your back?...

eeewwwwwwww!!!....:doh

and I still have skin on my teeth, what of it hotshot? ;)

what is skin on teeth anyway? Anyone?
 

cnredd

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mixedmedia said:
and I still have skin on my teeth, what of it hotshot? ;)

what is skin on teeth anyway? Anyone?
I'm still tryin' to figure out someone who says their blood is boiling...:shrug:
 

128shot

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KCConservative said:
Do you know the amount of oil we receive from the Arab countries in which we fight the war on terror?


and the money they get from that pays dividends to terrorists. Vicious cycle.


Osama Bin Laden is alot of things, but he understands this. If you disrupt the flow of oil to the west, you have committed the ultimiate attack. It would be a sweeping victory.


So are you willing to let the cornerstone of industrial civilization sit on the backs of a few Arabs?
 

disneydude

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ProudAmerican said:
define "good" foreign policy.



the current economy is every bit as good as the one the left PRAISED under Bill Clinton.

4.8% unemployment!!!!! you do realize that 3% is considered FULL employment right?

You are obviously joking or else you have no contact with the real world. Yes, unemployment may be down but so are "real wages". The amount that the average American family brings home has declined significantly over the last 6 years, while corporate America's pockets have gotten fatter and fatter. Pick up a newspaper or listen to an economist and they will tell you that the actual number of real jobs has declined during the GWB administration that gains in jobs have been from the expansion of the government under Bush (so much for GOP small government). Higher paying manufacturing jobs are being sent overseas so that Corporate executives can get richer at the expense of the middle class. The middle class has shrunk under this administration and the average American is having a harder and harder time making ends meet.
You say the economy is doing well? I guess well compared to the first term of GWB but certainly not well by any legitimate standards.

In the 2005 State of the Union address, Bush said that more Americans are going back to work and that the economy is growing and healthy. The numbers don't necessarily support this assumption. Job growth over the last 18 months has fallen short of administration predictions by 1,703,000—more than one-third fewer jobs than the president's Council of Economic Advisers said would be created. Present employment levels show only 119,000 more individuals working than when Bush took office in 2001, which is effectively a decrease in employment rates, as the total civilian labor force grew by more than two million workers in 2004 alone, according to the Department of Labor. Additionally, the most recent data from the Census Bureau show that the average income for middle-class households has dropped by $1,525 since its peak in 2000. The labor force participation rate—the percentage of people either working or looking for work—fell in Jan. 2005 to a seasonally adjusted 65.8 percent, the lowest rate since 1988.
Sources: USA Today, "Fewer Americans participating in labor force or seeking jobs," Barbara Hagenbaugh, Feb. 6, 2005; Department of Labor, "Employment status of the civilian population by sex and age," Feb. 2005; Center for American Progress, "American Progress Report: Talking Points," Feb. 2, 2005; Center for American Progress, "On the January Employment Situation," Scott Lily, Feb. 4, 2005; "State of the Union," President Bush, Feb. 2, 2005; Economic Policy Institute, Feb. 4, 2005.

As of May, 2005, there have been 893,000 jobs created over the first 52 months of the Bush presidency - a gain that is due solely to the 917,000 jobs created in the government sector that offset the 24,000 jobs lost in the private sector. Since the Great Depression, no other president who served at least 52 months has overseen a net loss in private sector jobs through this point. In addition to lack of job growth, real weekly and hourly wages have declined since the start of the recession. At a time when middle-class Americans are experiencing stagnant wages and vanishing benefits, CEO pay continues to rise.
Source: Center for American Progress, Economic Policy Weekly, Jenna Churchman, June 6, 2005

During the first three years of the Bush-Cheney administration, the unemployment rate increased by one-third and 2.2 million jobs were lost, and the country has gone from a $281 billion surplus to a $521 billion deficit. Debt has increased 23% from $5.7 trillion, to $7 trillion. Bush recently restated his pledge to create 2.6 million jobs, stating "5.6% unemployment is a good national number." However, the New York Times recently uncovered a White House report indicating that the president is considering reclassifying low-paid fast-food jobs as higher-paid manufacturing jobs to make it appear like the unemployment rate is going down.
Sources: MSNBC Transcript, Feb. 8; The New York Times

When speaking with a group of women small business owners on Jan. 9, Bush said that "unemployment dropped today to 5.7 percent," claiming that this "is a positive sign that the economy is getting better." Unfortunately, according to the Baltimore Sun, that is not the case. The Sun reported that underlying that positive number was "grim economic news—only a handful of new jobs were created and hundreds of thousands of discouraged people dropped out of the workforce." Although unemployment fell from 5.9 percent to 5.7 percent in December, only 1,000 new jobs were created. Furthermore, the work force typically grows when the economy advances, but in this instance it shrank due to the 309,000 people who stopped looking for work. The withdrawal of these workers from the work force, not new jobs, pushed the unemployment rate down, as no significant number of jobs were created in December. The Sun went on to say that "the December numbers are a continuation of a long period of inadequate job creation." The economy has lost more than 2 million jobs since employment peaked in Feb. 2001, and gains in recent months have been "miniscule."
Sources: White House Office of the Press Secretary, "President Speaks with Women Small Business Owners on the Economy," Jan. 9, 2004; Baltimore Sun, "Falling Jobless Figure Deceptive," Jan. 9, 2004.
 
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Deegan

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disneydude said:
You are obviously joking or else you have no contact with the real world. Yes, unemployment may be down but so are "real wages". The amount that the average American family brings home has declined significantly over the last 6 years, while corporate America's pockets have gotten fatter and fatter. Pick up a newspaper or listen to an economist and they will tell you that the actual number of real jobs has declined during the GWB administration that gains in jobs have been from the expansion of the government under Bush (so much for GOP small government). Higher paying manufacturing jobs are being sent overseas so that Corporate executives can get richer at the expense of the middle class. The middle class has shrunk under this administration and the average American is having a harder and harder time making ends meet.
You say the economy is doing well? I guess well compared to the first term of GWB but certainly not well by any legitimate standards.


You know how to get a rich man's money?

You make, have, or sell him/her something he/she needs!

Do you think rich people shop at "Wal-Mart"?

Do you think rich people hire, buy, or associate with those who despise them?

Answers these questions, and then consider the divide you want to create, I'll bet you find yourself wanting.........they do as well.;)
 
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128shot said:
and the money they get from that pays dividends to terrorists. Vicious cycle.


Osama Bin Laden is alot of things, but he understands this. If you disrupt the flow of oil to the west, you have committed the ultimiate attack. It would be a sweeping victory.


So are you willing to let the cornerstone of industrial civilization sit on the backs of a few Arabs?

This was my question:

Originally Posted by KCConservative
Do you know the amount of oil we receive from the Arab countries in which we fight the war on terror?

Do you know the answer or not?
 

windofchange

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I would like to firstly state that I am in fact a citizen of Australia, however this does not mean that I think Australia is better or worse than the United state, there are aspects of the US that I enjoy there are aspects I don’t as with my own country. I recognise the fact that Australia has allot to be thankful to America for, but I think that nationalism is essentialy useless and damaging. This why I can say with absolute sincerity that I neither look down upon or envy anyone in the US you are who you are and that’s that.

Secondly I find it hard to swallow that because you are free and because you have a society that tolerates individual opinion and individual speech that this makes it wrong to criticise the government or the nation. I think that because of our freedoms every American and every Australian has the right if not the duty to do all in his/her power to enjoy those rights and make their country and the world a better place. I do not for one second assume that I have the right to tell you what to think or do or to judge you for your decisions but I do feel that given that our nations are at war for the sake of “freedom” I should encourage through my opinions healthy and productive introspection and debate. Rights are useless unless they are exercised
 

128shot

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KCConservative said:
This was my question:

Originally Posted by KCConservative
Do you know the amount of oil we receive from the Arab countries in which we fight the war on terror?

Do you know the answer or not?


From Afghanistan? None, they have relatively little oil to my knowledge.

From Iraq? Well, so far it doesn't seem like the Iraqis will let us have them, but 120 billion to 200 billion is possible.

I missed the question, sorry.




I hope I understood it correctly. However, the bulk of our oil is still coming from Saudi Arabia, AND our oil is a volitale region.


Are you still sure we should depend on oil from the region?
 
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128shot said:
From Afghanistan? None, they have relatively little oil to my knowledge.

From Iraq? Well, so far it doesn't seem like the Iraqis will let us have them, but 120 billion to 200 billion is possible.
Per what? A year? Provide your source please. I think you'll find plenty of evidence to show this is not a war for oil. It is why the left gave up this claim last year.
 

cnredd

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128shot said:
I hope I understood it correctly. However, the bulk of our oil is still coming from Saudi Arabia, AND our oil is a volitale region.

A) Try again...

B) Western Europe gets more oil from Saudi Arabia than us...

This leads to the question...Why isn't Western Europe doing more since their stakes are higher?...

A) Because they know that we'll end up doing their dirty work...as always...while they can sit on their pedestals telling us how evil and arrogant we are...

:shrug:
 
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