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Bush Lied When He Said He Doesnt Know Abramoff

danarhea

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1) According to the Bush's administration's own logs, Jack Abramoff and his lobbying team met with members of the Bush administration almost 200 times during the first 10 months of his presidency.

2) Jack Abramoff was a Bush Pioneer, and raised more than $100,000.00 for the Bush campaign in 2000.

5) Jack Abramoff raised $36,000.00 for Bush from corporate interests in the Marianas Islands who wanted attempts at minimum wage laws shut down.

4) Under the open records act, Jack Abramoff and Bush have ties going back as far as 1997.

5) At least 2 people who worked at Abramoff's firm, Preston Gates, ended up as members of the Bush administration: David Safavian and Patrick Pizella. Safavian, of course, is under indictment stemming from his efforts to shut down the Abramoff investigation.

Article is here.
 

tecoyah

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Of course he lied....it was so blatantly obvious as to be insulting. If he didnt know him....he is likely the ONLY politician in washington who didnt.
 

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I thought Bush simply claimed he didn't remember if he had met Abramoff. I'm sure that's also a lie though....
 
H

hipsterdufus

This is pretty funny. Why didn't this judge recuse himself from prosecuting Abramoff in the first place? Didn't he think anyone would notice a possible conflict of interest being nominated to a fedral judgeship and all? :doh

Maybe Ashcroft will replace Hillman. :roll:
Prosecutor Will Step Down From Lobbyist Case

By PHILIP SHENON and ELISABETH BUMILLER
Published: January 27, 2006
WASHINGTON, Jan. 26 — The investigation of Jack Abramoff, the disgraced Republican lobbyist, took a surprising new turn on Thursday when the Justice Department said the chief prosecutor in the inquiry would step down next week because he had been nominated to a federal judgeship by President Bush.

The prosecutor, Noel L. Hillman, is chief of the department's public integrity division, and the move ends his involvement in an inquiry that has reached into the administration as well as the top ranks of the Republican leadership on Capitol Hill.

The administration said that the appointment was routine and that it would not affect the investigation, but Democrats swiftly questioned the timing of the move and called for a special prosecutor.
http://www.nytimes.com/2006/01/27/politics/27judge.html

FYI:

Here's another tidbit. Did you know that Abramoff cut his teeth in the 80's supporting the right wing Aparthied government in South Africa that jailed Nelson Mandela? Yep. He did.
 
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FreeThinker

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Washington has thousands of lobbyists of which Abramoff is 1. You expect the most powerful man on earth to remember one guy that raised a couple thousand dollars for his campaign?

And a conservative lobbyist raising money for a conservative presidential candidate... oooooo..... scandalous!

btw Clinton never had sexual relations with Monica Lewinsky.
 

aps

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FreeThinker said:
Washington has thousands of lobbyists of which Abramoff is 1. You expect the most powerful man on earth to remember one guy that raised a couple thousand dollars for his campaign?
How many lobbyists do you know who raised $100,000 for the Bush/Cheney campaign?

One--Jack Abramoff

How many lobbyists do you know sat in meetings held by White House staff?

One--Jack Abramoff

And a conservative lobbyist raising money for a conservative presidential candidate... oooooo..... scandalous!
It's not a problem--but he pretends that he doesn't know Abramoff? If his relationship with Abramoff is so insignificant, then what is he hiding by not releasing the photos? Don't bother answering the question--it's purely rhetorical.

btw Clinton never had sexual relations with Monica Lewinsky.
Hi. My name is FreeThinker (and every other repub on this message board). Whenever I see my wittle Bushy wushy getting attacked, I MUST bring up something related to Clinton because I have nothing substantive to say about the subject, and I need to change the subject.

Good debating there. LOL
 
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aps said:
How many lobbyists do you know who raised $100,000 for the Bush/Cheney campaign?

One--Jack Abramoff

How many lobbyists do you know sat in meetings held by White House staff?

One--Jack Abramoff
How do either of these things prove the president knew him? I mean, I know what you believe, but tell us how you base it on the above statements?
 

aps

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KCConservative said:
How do either of these things prove the president knew him? I mean, I know what you believe, but tell us how you base it on the above statements?
I see what you're asking. Bush made it seem as thought he doesn't even remember meeting him--ever. I have a hard time believing that. This is just based on plain ol' common sense. He had multiple pictures taken with Abramoff. Yes, yes--lots of people do. But when someone is able to raise that much $$ for the Bush/Cheney campaign, do you genuinely think that Bush does not have an idea of who this person is?

I'm not saying that Bush was "involved" in any wrongdoing with Abramoff--but I don't buy the fact that he doesn't know him at all. Even if Abramoff's connection is Karl Rove, I still believe Bush had some knowledge of who Abramoff is. Why he pretends not to know Abramoff's existence is a little too convenient and suspicious to me.
 

aps

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KCConservative said:
your perception
This is why I don't like having discussions with you--I provide you with an explanation for why I have stated what I stated and all you can say is, ""your perception." Why do I even bother with you?
 

dragonslayer

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danarhea said:
1) According to the Bush's administration's own logs, Jack Abramoff and his lobbying team met with members of the Bush administration almost 200 times during the first 10 months of his presidency.

2) Jack Abramoff was a Bush Pioneer, and raised more than $100,000.00 for the Bush campaign in 2000.

5) Jack Abramoff raised $36,000.00 for Bush from corporate interests in the Marianas Islands who wanted attempts at minimum wage laws shut down.

4) Under the open records act, Jack Abramoff and Bush have ties going back as far as 1997.

5) At least 2 people who worked at Abramoff's firm, Preston Gates, ended up as members of the Bush administration: David Safavian and Patrick Pizella. Safavian, of course, is under indictment stemming from his efforts to shut down the Abramoff investigation.

Article is here.
Good Lord, this administration lies about everything. Bush is going to lie in State of the Union address. This administration is the single most corrupt government in our modern history. The American People mean nothing to Bush. Only Profits, and you can bet that when bush collects his, after his presidency, he will be a billionaire.
 
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dragonslayer said:
Good Lord, this administration lies about everything. Bush is going to lie in State of the Union address. This administration is the single most corrupt government in our modern history. The American People mean nothing to Bush. Only Profits, and you can bet that when bush collects his, after his presidency, he will be a billionaire.
partisan opinionated rhetoric :cool:
 

Stinger

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aps said:
How many lobbyists do you know who raised $100,000 for the Bush/Cheney campaign?

One--Jack Abramoff

How many lobbyists do you know sat in meetings held by White House staff?

One--Jack Abramoff
Are you claiming both of these to be factually true, and do you have evidence to back them up. That Abramoff was the ONLY lobbyists to do either of these?


It's not a problem--but he pretends that he doesn't know Abramoff?
Well that's a statement of fact which I KNOW you have no evidence of, what is the basis for this? You're claiming that you know for a fact that Bush is pretending he doesn't know Abramoff, prove it.

If his relationship with Abramoff is so insignificant, then what is he hiding by not releasing the photos? Don't bother answering the question--it's purely rhetorical.
OH now it's "if", well which is it, your factual claim that he knew Abramoff and is pretending otherwise or you don't know therefore the big "IF". And why not release any of the photos, why give the Dems fodder for their silly rhetoric, why feed them bogus campaign propaganda. Geez use you thinker.
 
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Stinger said:
Are you claiming both of these to be factually true, and do you have evidence to back them up. That Abramoff was the ONLY lobbyists to do either of these?
I asked aps this very question.
 

aps

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Stinger said:
Are you claiming both of these to be factually true, and do you have evidence to back them up. That Abramoff was the ONLY lobbyists to do either of these?
It's the only one I know. Here's the evidence to show that he attended meetings at the White House and donated $100,000.

http://www.sierratimes.com/06/01/04/Bush.htm

http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2006-01-17-abramoff-white-house_x.htm

http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2006/01/23/politics/main1227860.shtml

http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/news/politics/13721059.htm


Well that's a statement of fact which I KNOW you have no evidence of, what is the basis for this? You're claiming that you know for a fact that Bush is pretending he doesn't know Abramoff, prove it.
What I am surmising, Stinger (is it okay if I surmise about certain things?), is that Bush is pretending that he doesn't even know who Jack Abramoff is. And what I mean by that is if someone showed Bush a picture of me, he wouldn't know me at all. However, Jack Abramoff has been in the news for months now. He has attended staff meetings at the White House. He is a "pioneer" for the Bush campaign. He has had an estimated 6 pictures taken with Abramoff.

And Bush would like us to believe he has NO IDEA who Abramoff is? I'm not buying it, Stinger. Abramoff has to be a face that Bush recognizes.


OH now it's "if", well which is it, your factual claim that he knew Abramoff and is pretending otherwise or you don't know therefore the big "IF". And why not release any of the photos, why give the Dems fodder for their silly rhetoric, why feed them bogus campaign propaganda. Geez use you thinker.
My belief is that Bush knew who Abramoff is, and it would be very easy to say, "I know who he is, but I had no personal dealings with him, and I certainly didn't conduct any unethical behavior with him." If his relationship with Abramoff was truly innocent, why not provide the pictures of him and Abramoff? SIX pictures--he's not going to recognize this guy?

Our president is a friggin' liar--as usual.
 
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aps said:
This is why I don't like having discussions with you--I provide you with an explanation for why I have stated what I stated and all you can say is, ""your perception." Why do I even bother with you?
My intent was not to frustrate you, aps. Im showing you that your suspicions are unfounded, unwarranted. Your accusations are based on this:

"Bush made it seem as though...."

"Why he pretends not to know ...."


Don't you see, it's not rooted in anything oter than your perception.
 
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Stinger

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Quote:
Originally Posted by FreeThinker
Washington has thousands of lobbyists of which Abramoff is 1. You expect the most powerful man on earth to remember one guy that raised a couple thousand dollars for his campaign?


You>> How many lobbyists do you know who raised $100,000 for the Bush/Cheney campaign?

One--Jack Abramoff

How many lobbyists do you know sat in meetings held by White House staff?

One--Jack Abramoff


Me>> Are you claiming both of these to be factually true, and do you have evidence to back them up. That Abramoff was the ONLY lobbyists to do either of these?[/quote]

aps said:
It's the only one I know. Here's the evidence to show that he attended meetings at the White House and donated $100,000.
So your insinuation that he is the only one is bogus. That YOU don't know of any others is certainly not evidence he was the only one.

http://www.sierratimes.com/06/01/04/Bush.htm
What I am surmising, Stinger (is it okay if I surmise about certain things?), is that Bush is pretending that he doesn't even know who Jack Abramoff is.
No you made that as a statement of fact, which it is not. And your surmisings are not very convincing at all.

And what I mean by that is if someone showed Bush a picture of me, he wouldn't know me at all. However, Jack Abramoff has been in the news for months now.
Yes which is why to even hint that because Bush might recogonize his picture means he had any kind of relationship with him.

He has attended staff meetings at the White House.
He attended "staff-level meetings" not "staff meetings". Meaning a staffer could have met with a bunch of donors and gave them a brifing on some sort of nonsense about anything.

He is a "pioneer" for the Bush campaign.
So are lots of people who raise $100,000.

He has had an estimated 6 pictures taken with Abramoff.
So what, so have lots of people.

And Bush would like us to believe he has NO IDEA who Abramoff is?
You are in no position to know what Bush would or would not like an certainly don't speak for him. Again your assumptions are not convincing at all.

I'm not buying it, Stinger. Abramoff has to be a face that Bush recognizes.
It's called wishful thinking.


My belief is that Bush knew who Abramoff is,
Your wish is, why would you believe something when there is no evidence of such?

and it would be very easy to say, "I know who he is, but I had no personal dealings with him, and I certainly didn't conduct any unethical behavior with him."
Sure if it were true, but what if it isn't, you would feel better if he just lied?

If his relationship with Abramoff was truly innocent,
Your statement is false from the start because once again you present your pure assertions as fact.

Our president is a friggin' liar--as usual.
Your self-serving accusations do not substitute for facts with anyone around here.
 

aps

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Stinger said:
Quote:
Originally Posted by FreeThinker
Washington has thousands of lobbyists of which Abramoff is 1. You expect the most powerful man on earth to remember one guy that raised a couple thousand dollars for his campaign?


You>> How many lobbyists do you know who raised $100,000 for the Bush/Cheney campaign?

One--Jack Abramoff

How many lobbyists do you know sat in meetings held by White House staff?

One--Jack Abramoff


Me>> Are you claiming both of these to be factually true, and do you have evidence to back them up. That Abramoff was the ONLY lobbyists to do either of these?



So your insinuation that he is the only one is bogus. That YOU don't know of any others is certainly not evidence he was the only one.

http://www.sierratimes.com/06/01/04/Bush.htm


No you made that as a statement of fact, which it is not. And your surmisings are not very convincing at all.



Yes which is why to even hint that because Bush might recogonize his picture means he had any kind of relationship with him.



He attended "staff-level meetings" not "staff meetings". Meaning a staffer could have met with a bunch of donors and gave them a brifing on some sort of nonsense about anything.



So are lots of people who raise $100,000.



So what, so have lots of people.



You are in no position to know what Bush would or would not like an certainly don't speak for him. Again your assumptions are not convincing at all.



It's called wishful thinking.




Your wish is, why would you believe something when there is no evidence of such?



Sure if it were true, but what if it isn't, you would feel better if he just lied?



Your statement is false from the start because once again you present your pure assertions as fact.



Your self-serving accusations do not substitute for facts with anyone around here.
The fact that you had to go through my post in as much detail as you did, lets me know that you think there may be something to my surmising.......

I appreciate the compliment, Stinger. :lol:
 

aps

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KCConservative said:
My intent was not to frustrate you, aps. Im showing you that your suspicions are unfounded, unwarranted. Your accusations are based on this:

"Bush made it seem as though...."

"Why he pretends not to know ...."


Don't you see, it's not rooted in anything oter than your perception.
KC, this is me analyzing facts that have been presented. Maybe I'm right, maybe I'm wrong. You may think my suspicions are unfounded, which is fine, as that is your opinion. At least I think outside the box.
 

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aps said:
The fact that you had to go through my post in as much detail as you did, lets me know that you think there may be something to my surmising.......

I appreciate the compliment, Stinger. :lol:
Once again your surmising does you no good. It was simply pointing out that your assertions posing as statements of fact are without merit, why won't you admit that you have no evidence at all to support them?

Hey remember the picture of Mrs. Bill Clinton posing with Jorge Cabreera



So that does make her involved in his drug smuggling?
 

aps

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Stinger said:
Once again your surmising does you no good. It was simply pointing out that your assertions posing as statements of fact are without merit, why won't you admit that you have no evidence at all to support them?
But I have evidence to support my surmises, which I laid out above. You just don't agree with the conclusion I reached as a result.

Hey remember the picture of Mrs. Bill Clinton posing with Jorge Cabreera



So that does make her involved in his drug smuggling?
This just shows me that you clearly did not read my posts. I have never stated that Bush was involved in bribery or anything illegal with Abramoff. I am in no way attempting to allege any "guilty by association." It's Bush's wanting to hide any information regarding him and Abramoff that has made me suspicious. Those who have NOTHING to hide would have no problem releasing pictures or providing information.

Maybe Abramoff met with the "cleaning" staff of the White House and gave them some tips on how to clean a toilet bowl. LOL :lol:
 

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aps said:
But I have evidence to support my surmises, which I laid out above. You just don't agree with the conclusion I reached as a result.
You have no evidence you have assumptions.

It's Bush's wanting to hide any information regarding him and Abramoff that has made me suspicious. Those who have NOTHING to hide would have no problem releasing pictures or providing information.
Already responded to, why should he? Why should he give the Democrats and the leftist media pictures so they can create a phoney issue? He has no obligation to do so.

Maybe Abramoff met with the "cleaning" staff of the White House and gave them some tips on how to clean a toilet bowl. LOL
Who said that? It is noted that your assertions which you planted as fact are nothing of the sort.
 

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aps said:
KC, this is me analyzing facts that have been presented. Maybe I'm right, maybe I'm wrong. You may think my suspicions are unfounded, which is fine, as that is your opinion. At least I think outside the box.
How about dealing with facts. Like Abramoff got Senator Harry Reid to write a letter in support of one of his Indian Tribe clients and the next day he wrote a letter in support of them. Isn't it time Reid stopped hiding and releases all his pictures and emails and correspondence. What is he hiding? Shouldn't we have an investigation?
 

easyt65

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danarhea said:
1) According to the Bush's administration's own logs, Jack Abramoff and his lobbying team met with members of the Bush administration almost 200 times during the first 10 months of his presidency.

2) Jack Abramoff was a Bush Pioneer, and raised more than $100,000.00 for the Bush campaign in 2000.

5) Jack Abramoff raised $36,000.00 for Bush from corporate interests in the Marianas Islands who wanted attempts at minimum wage laws shut down.

4) Under the open records act, Jack Abramoff and Bush have ties going back as far as 1997.

5) At least 2 people who worked at Abramoff's firm, Preston Gates, ended up as members of the Bush administration: David Safavian and Patrick Pizella. Safavian, of course, is under indictment stemming from his efforts to shut down the Abramoff investigation.

Article is here.
Why don't you go after the information about the Democrats who knew and took money from the man as rabidy as you have Bush. I am sure it will come as no surprise to you, like Enron, he wanted to be a big time political player with influence - he was paying both sides and meeting with ALL the influential players, including the likes of Ms. Clinton, Kerry, Dean, and others.
So, don't try to make it sound like lobbyists paying politicians is 1) new and 2) restricted to one side of the aisle or the other. The reason the Democrats, in fact, are being as quiet as they are is because Kerry and the top Dems don't want their part in this scandal to come to light!

This is yet just another Washington political lobbyist scandal....and the only ones who can cut the funding from the lobbyists off are the same men who are benefitting the most in the form of millions to their re-election war chests. No way in hades they will kill the goose that lays the golden eggs. Ol' Abe will go to jail, it will blow over, then it will be back to work as usual, unfortunately!
 

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Stinger said:
Hey remember the picture of Mrs. Bill Clinton posing with Jorge Cabreera



So that does make her involved in his drug smuggling?
Even though I don't care for George Bush, I really don't see any concern for him not dislosing any pictures. He said that he had gotten his picture taken with hundreds of people, it doesn't mean he befriended them, or done dealings with them, it just part of his job in being the President. I don't know, he could be lying though?
 
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