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Bring the Rule of law to school!

Mr. D

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Bring the Rule of law to school!

One of the mistakes most school districts make that hurts students is to treat crime differently on a public school campus! The law should be applied the same on a public school campus as in the mall, movie theater or on the street. Very often students steal, disrupt, threaten or assault and they are given school punishments rather than having the local police arrest them! At school you are free to commit a crime without being arrested! Wonderful message to send to kids! Principals should approach crime on campus just as a store owner in the mall would! Forget suspensions and calls to Momma! Call the police and let them handle it! When kids get put in jail for slugging someone or stealing, it may set a standard of behavior! Let parents whine and pickup their little darling at the police station! The alternative is having schools where kids can commit crimes without worrying about arrest! It's that way now in most schools unless a teacher hits a student! They the world falls on them! :roll:
 

alphamale

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Mr. D said:
Bring the Rule of law to school!

One of the mistakes most school districts make that hurts students is to treat crime differently on a public school campus! The law should be applied the same on a public school campus as in the mall, movie theater or on the street. Very often students steal, disrupt, threaten or assault and they are given school punishments rather than having the local police arrest them! At school you are free to commit a crime without being arrested! Wonderful message to send to kids! Principals should approach crime on campus just as a store owner in the mall would! Forget suspensions and calls to Momma! Call the police and let them handle it! When kids get put in jail for slugging someone or stealing, it may set a standard of behavior! Let parents whine and pickup their little darling at the police station! The alternative is having schools where kids can commit crimes without worrying about arrest! It's that way now in most schools unless a teacher hits a student! They the world falls on them! :roll:
Just one more facet of the government schools. In a private school, the little bastaards are given the bum's rush out the front door, never to return. Are you a competent teacher? Then support the privatization of schools - your life will be better.
 
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FallingPianos

Mr. D said:
Bring the Rule of law to school!

One of the mistakes most school districts make that hurts students is to treat crime differently on a public school campus! The law should be applied the same on a public school campus as in the mall, movie theater or on the street. Very often students steal, disrupt, threaten or assault and they are given school punishments rather than having the local police arrest them! At school you are free to commit a crime without being arrested! Wonderful message to send to kids! Principals should approach crime on campus just as a store owner in the mall would! Forget suspensions and calls to Momma! Call the police and let them handle it! When kids get put in jail for slugging someone or stealing, it may set a standard of behavior! Let parents whine and pickup their little darling at the police station! The alternative is having schools where kids can commit crimes without worrying about arrest! It's that way now in most schools unless a teacher hits a student! They the world falls on them! :roll:
the prisons, police, and court systems are over burdened as it is. They dont exist to solve all of our disputes, they're here to protect us from violence, and as a place to go when disputes cannot be settled any other way.
 

Mr. D

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star2589 said:
the prisons, police, and court systems are over burdened as it is. They dont exist to solve all of our disputes, they're here to protect us from violence, and as a place to go when disputes cannot be settled any other way.
I'm referring to violence and theft, not being late to class! So commit a crime in a public school and you have to write, "I won't assault other students!" 100 times on the board! Nice lesson to teach! Here's a thought, maybe if kids knew they would be arrested for breaking the law while at school we wouldn't need so many police and prisons after they drop out!
 
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FallingPianos

Mr. D said:
I'm referring to violence and theft, not being late to class! So commit a crime in a public school and you have to write, "I won't assault other students!" 100 times on the board! Nice lesson to teach! Here's a thought, maybe if kids knew they would be arrested for breaking the law while at school we wouldn't need so many police and prisons after they drop out!
with violence, there are times that I would agree. If a big kid is beating up a smaller kid, then I have no problem with getting the police involved. If the kids are evenly matched, I think it would just be better to descipline them at school.

as for stealing, there's nothing to stop the victem from going to a police station and filing a report, and I have no problem with the school recomending they do so. but the police arent going to be very helpful if the item wasnt valuable, and even if it was, there isnt a whole lot they can do. The problem I have, is with calling the police before trying to resolve it at school, or expecting the police to come to the school to resolve it.
 

Mr. D

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star2589,

Well your attitude explains why so many kids feel free to commit crime at school without fearing consequences! Instead of calling schools "Crime Free Areas", we can call them "Free Crime Areas"! I hope you support the same rules in your favorite restaurant and at the mall. If men are the same size let them beat each other senseless! Just let the restaurant or mall resolve it!

You want to know what's wrong with American schools? Here's part of it! Refusal to make our students live by our laws! Allowing schools to be a haven for behavior that is illegal at the local mall. I've never met a parent that didn't support discipline in the schools, UNTIL YOU CALL THEM ABOUT THIER KID!
 
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FallingPianos

Mr. D said:
star2589,

Well your attitude explains why so many kids feel free to commit crime at school without fearing consequences! Instead of calling schools "Crime Free Areas", we can call them "Free Crime Areas"! I hope you support the same rules in your favorite restaurant and at the mall. If men are the same size let them beat each other senseless! Just let the restaurant or mall resolve it!

You want to know what's wrong with American schools? Here's part of it! Refusal to make our students live by our laws! Allowing schools to be a haven for behavior that is illegal at the local mall. I've never met a parent that didn't support discipline in the schools, UNTIL YOU CALL THEM ABOUT THIER KID!
I suppose I should ask you something before saying anything further. do you advocate this for elementry age kids, or just for highschool kids?
 

Mr. D

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star2589 said:
I suppose I should ask you something before saying anything further. do you advocate this for elementry age kids, or just for highschool kids?
I think common sense standards should apply to police being involved in the mall or in a school. Obviously minor scuffles and stealing a candy bar is not what we are talking about. The seriousness of the offense is the issue rather than the age. I've seen crimes commited in the 6th and 7th grade at school that definitely should have involved a ride to the police station if for no other reason to set a standard and teach kids the direction they are headed. The police/district attorney can apply good judgment as to when to prosecute and when to just release kids to parents with warning. The time required for police to be involved at that age may very well prevent having to deal with those kids as future criminals.

My main point is that public schools should not be a safe haven for commiting an assault or theft that would get you arrested in a restaurant. Today that is exactly the way it is in most public schools! Many kids are simply suspended with a parent conference for an action that would get them arrested in Denny's Restaurant! What kind of message does that send?
 
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FallingPianos

Mr. D said:
I think common sense standards should apply to police being involved in the mall or in a school. Obviously minor scuffles and stealing a candy bar is not what we are talking about. The seriousness of the offense is the issue rather than the age.
alright.

Mr. D said:
I've seen crimes commited in the 6th and 7th grade at school that definitely should have involved a ride to the police station if for no other reason to set a standard and teach kids the direction they are headed.The police/district attorney can apply good judgment as to when to prosecute and when to just release kids to parents with warning. The time required for police to be involved at that age may very well prevent having to deal with those kids as future criminals.
I can agree with most of that, exept the part about the ride to the police station. if the ride is given by a member of the school staff, instead of a police officer, a door is opened for an expensive lawsuits that schools cant affort.

Mr. D said:
My main point is that public schools should not be a safe haven for commiting an assault or theft that would get you arrested in a restaurant. Today that is exactly the way it is in most public schools! Many kids are simply suspended with a parent conference for an action that would get them arrested in Denny's Restaurant! What kind of message does that send?
well, it was my understanding that serious assults and thefts do get reported to the police, but perhaps I was mistaken about that.
 

BodiSatva

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At our school...a gang infested one in the East Bay...we did have students arrested for fighting and stealing...at least at our school, it solved nothing.

I hear you regardless Mr. D

This is an issue that should always be addressed. Most of the students at our school had not been arrested at school prior to this school. But I feel that it was too little, too late...these kids were set in their ways.
 

Mr. D

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BodiSatva

Arresting kids certainly doesn't cure them, but is certainly has more effect than suspending them and sending them home to momma! So what if I get into a fist fight with someone I don't like in a Dennys? I guess they should suspend me from the restaurant for a week and send me home to think about it! If a kid attacks me at the mall without any provocation he's getting prosecuted and his parents are getting sued. Why should he be exempt from that consequence because he's at a public school? No wonder there is so much crime in the schools and we blame lack of educational progress on teachers. It's the responsiblity of a public school to teach kids the natural consequences of their actions, not to provide a place where they can commit crime and be protected from dealing with the police! The school also has a responsibility to the kids that are there to learn without fighting and acting like animals!

Schools need to stop being afraid of the parents of kids that have no discipline and demand that "equal protection under the law" extend to schools also! Break the law at school, go to jail! A valuable lesson schools should teach to help out police down the road!
 
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bus

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star2589 said:
as for stealing, there's nothing to stop the victim from going to a police station and filing a report,
Wait! *gasp* You mean, violent crimes and other law violations can also be reported to the police in addition to whatever the school dictates as dicispline? What a novel idea.

Mr. D there are police and law in public schools. The highschool I attended even had a full time city police officer at the school. Additionally, many states have passed law against minors and specifically violent crimes.
 

BodiSatva

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Mr D knows that there area police in schools...he has been teaching for 30 years or something close to that...

I hear you D. Arresting does nothing other than to delay the source issue.
I feel that a crime is a crime no matter where it occurs.

"Schools need to stop being afraid of the parents of kids that have no discipline " - Mr D

This is out of context, but some of us were very afraid of the psychotic mothers and gang affiliated fathers. They are not people to be trifled with...but it was amazing to talk with some of the ones that seemed scary, for it was amazing to see that they were not stupid, and they did not want their kids to follow their footsteps...some valued education, they just did not know how to get their kids to value it...
 

wackestmc

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I agree completely. We do need rule of law in schools.

But not for the same reason many others want it.

I want it, because, if we had true american law in schools, students would be more free and have more rights, not because I think there's so much crime going down.

Any almost every public school system, major offenses posing any real threat ARE ALREADY dealt with by law enforcment; drugs, guns, etc.

However, I've been doing a lot of research on students' rights. The Supreme Court of 1969 stated in Brown v. Board of Education that no teachers or students left behind their legal and constitutional rights at the schoolhouse gates. Though, many many other times, the same court ruled that these same rights, while being protected, can sure as hell be bent *** backwards in the name of discipline.

If we had true American law in schools, I'd be happy to go to school each day knowing I had my rights protected at last.
 
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