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Breakdown of Bin Laden audiotape

cnredd

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I don't think there's anything new here in Osama Bin Laden's new audiotape...

If you look closely, you can see that everything he said is the exact same thing we've been hearing from the left for quite awhile...

He's got the talking points down pat!...:cool:


My message to you is about the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan and how to end them. I did not intend to speak to you about this because this issue has already been decided. Only metal breaks metal, and our situation, thank God, is only getting better and better, while your situation is the opposite of that.

"The idea that we're going to win the war in Iraq is just plain wrong," Democratic Party Chair Howard Dean told a San Antonio radio show on Monday
But I plan to speak about the repeated errors your President Bush has committed in comments on the results of your polls that show an overwhelming majority of you want the withdrawal of American troops from Iraq. But he (Bush) has opposed this wish and said that withdrawing troops sends the wrong message to opponents, that it is better to fight them (bin Laden's followers) on their land than their fighting us (Americans) on our land.

Published on Thursday, March 17, 2005 by CommonDreams.org
Why Iraq Withdrawal Makes Sense
by Norman Solomon

In mid-March, an ABC News/Washington Post poll found that a large proportion of the U.S. population has a negative view of the war. For instance, the poll asked: "All in all, considering the costs to the United States versus the benefits to the United States, do you think the war with Iraq was worth fighting or not?" Only 45 percent said "worth fighting," while 53 percent said "not worth fighting."

Such nationwide poll numbers hardly indicate a country where few people are interested in proposals for extricating U.S. troops from Iraq. But the point is not only that political space exists in the United States for a grassroots movement to effectively organize for a swift pullout. It's also the best alternative for Iraq.

Consider the perspective of David Enders, a brave American journalist who has been in Iraq most of the time since the invasion. While writing for such outlets as MotherJones.com, the Nation magazine and the British daily Independent, he actually covers Iraqi society firsthand rather than staying behind American lines. Days ago, responding to my questions via email from Iraq, Enders provided some of the reasons for his assessment that American troops should leave rather than stay. For instance:


"It is the will of the Iraqi people." Enders cites a recent survey by Iraqi pollster Saadun Al-Dulaimie, who found that 85 percent of Iraqi people want U.S. troops out of their country as soon as possible.

"The U.S. does not provide security for the average Iraqi, and it never has."

"The U.S. has not prevented a civil war from taking place. If anything, it has exacerbated it."

"It is not morally derelict to pull out; it's morally derelict to stay. Returning real control and sovereignty to Iraqis is the most effective way to prevent the country from breaking apart. U.S. troops complain Iraqis don't want to stand up and fight for themselves, and a big part of the reason is the occupiers' presence."
I can reply to these errors by saying that war in Iraq is raging with no let-up, and operations in Afghanistan are escalating in our favor, thank God, and Pentagon figures show the number of your dead and wounded is increasing not to mention the massive material losses.

Violence Increasing in Afghanistan By Tom Regan
The Christian Science Monitor

Tuesday 17 January 2006

Suicide bombers bring new wave of terror, concerns about "re-Talibanization" of country...
....

And so to return to the issue, I say that results of polls please those who are sensible, and Bush's opposition to them is a mistake.

The reality shows that the war against America and its allies has not been limited to Iraq as he (Bush) claims. Iraq has become a point of attraction and restorer of (our) energies. At the same time, the mujahideen (holy warriors), with God's grace, have managed repeatedly to penetrate all security measures adopted by the unjust allied countries. The proof of that is the explosions you have seen in the capitals of the European nations who are in this aggressive coalition. The delay in similar operations happening in America has not been because of failure to break through your security measures. The operations are under preparation and you will see them in your homes the minute they are through (with preparations), with God's permission.

America's Not Safer
by Charley Reese

It was a blunder from start to finish, and it has made the American people less secure, not more secure. More people hate us, and fewer nations are willing to cooperate with us on any international mission.

We have sent a message to our enemies that while we might be able to crush their conventional forces handily, we are no better at fighting a guerrilla war than we were when the North Vietnamese drove us out of Southeast Asia. We have sent a message to the entire Arab world that under no circumstances will we treat the Palestinians with even a semblance of justice and that we will condone whatever Israel chooses to do. Bush has never grasped the fact that the Palestinian issue is paramount in every Arab country.

If you think that makes America safer, then you should apply for a job as a Bush speechwriter.
Based on what has been said, this shows the errors of Bush's statement _ the one that slipped from him _ which is at the heart of polls calling for withdrawing the troops. It is better that we (Americans) don't fight Muslims on their lands and that they don't fight us on ours.

Quit Meddling in the Middle East
by Rep. Ron Paul

Respect for self-determination really is the cornerstone of a sensible foreign policy, yet many Americans who strongly support U.S. sovereignty advocate interventionist policies that deny other nations that same right. The interventionist approach that has dominated American foreign policy since World War I has produced an unmitigated series of disasters. From Korea to Vietnam to Kosovo to the Middle East, American military and economic meddling has made numerous conflicts worse, not better. Washington and Jefferson had it right when they warned against entangling alliances, and the history of the 20th century proves their point. The simple truth is that we cannot resolve every human conflict across the globe, and there will always be violence somewhere on earth. The fatal conceit lies in believing America can impose geopolitical solutions wherever it chooses.
We don't mind offering you a long-term truce on fair conditions that we adhere to. We are a nation that God has forbidden to lie and cheat. So both sides can enjoy security and stability under this truce so we can build Iraq and Afghanistan, which have been destroyed in this war. There is no shame in this solution, which prevents the wasting of billions of dollars that have gone to those with influence and merchants of war in America who have supported Bush's election campaign with billions of dollars.

Merchants of Death:
Corporations that sell war, then profit from the bloodshed

It's pretty clear that the invasion and occupation of Iraq was not about the weapons of mass destruction (where ARE they?). Or about restoring sovereignty to Iraq (what about the 14 permanent U.S. military bases newly built there?). Or about ending the vast illegal imprisonment and torture of Iraqis (no comment necessary).

But as they say in detective novels, "Follow the money." Wouldn't it be important to learn about the billions and billions of dollars that certain companies are making from U.S. invasions and occupations? And would it surprise you that these very same companies have been contributing massive amounts to candidates, have "friends in high places" in the government, and have been "advising" the Department of Defense for years?
Nice words Mister BL...But we've heard it all before...right here in our very own country...:roll:
 
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Good point. Sounds like Howard Dean and OBL employ the same speech writer.
 

BWG

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cnredd said:
I don't think there's anything new here in Osama Bin Laden's new audiotape...

If you look closely, you can see that everything he said is the exact same thing we've been hearing from the left for quite awhile...

He's got the talking points down pat!...:cool:

Charley Reese, a conservative columnist
http://www.conservativechronicle.com/columnists/reese/

Ron Paul is a Libertarian/Republican

The Christian Science Monitor - Liberal/Left?
 

mixedmedia

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BWG said:
That's right! Charley Reese writes for the paper here in Orlando. Has been and still is a conservative, but he does not support the war and endorsed Kerry last year over Bush as did the Sentinel - the first time the Sentinel endorsed a Democrat for president in 40 YEARS. The Sentinel is absolutely NOT a liberal newspaper.

The Orlando Sentinel has endorsed John Kerry for President:

Four years ago, the Orlando Sentinel endorsed Republican George W. Bush for president based on our trust in him to unite America. We expected him to forge bipartisan solutions to problems while keeping this nation secure and fiscally sound.

This president has utterly failed to fulfill our expectations. We turn now to his Democratic challenger, Sen. John Kerry, with the belief that he is more likely to meet the hopes we once held for Mr. Bush

My friends, this is not a "liberal media" attack:

Our choice was not dictated by partisanship. Already this election season, the Sentinel has endorsed Republican Mel Martinez for the U.S. Senate and four U.S. House Republicans. In 2002, we backed Republican Gov. Jeb Bush for re-election, repeating our endorsement of four years earlier. Indeed, it has been 40 years since the Sentinel endorsed a Democrat -- Lyndon Johnson -- for president.

And all along where has our President been a "uniter, not a divider"? The Sentinel trusts that Kerry will be that uniter:

In sum, we believe Mr. Kerry would be a more bipartisan and effective leader than Mr. Bush. In the Nov. 2 general election, the Sentinel endorses John Kerry for president of the United States.
http://www.appalachia-alumni-association.net/blog/archives/000688.html
I wasn't living here at the time, but when my sister called to tell me I was flabbergasted, it was one of the highlights for me in the run-up to last year's elections - too bad it didn't pan out like I hoped, LOL.
 

vandree

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..... Maybe instead of wiretapping innocent Americans, Bush should wiretap Al-Jazeera to find out how these tapes get there?
 
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vandree said:
..... Maybe instead of wiretapping innocent Americans, Bush should wiretap Al-Jazeera to find out how these tapes get there?
Or maybe you could share with us what 'innocent Americans" were wiretapped.
 

oldreliable67

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One thing this bin Laden message clearly shows: he either has access to the internet and is spending a lot of time keeping up to date on US politics and polls, or some of his minions are doing so and keeping him updated. It appears likely that whereever he is hiding, he has internet access or is at least near internet access.

What do you suppose, cable, DSL or dial-up? Come on, NSA, do your thing!
 
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oldreliable67 said:
One thing this bin Laden message clearly shows: he either has access to the internet and is spending a lot of time keeping up to date on US politics and polls, or some of his minions are doing so and keeping him updated. It appears likely that whereever he is hiding, he has internet access or is at least near internet access.

What do you suppose, cable, DSL or dial-up? Come on, NSA, do your thing!
It's not too difficult for him to get an idea of how things are going. I'm sure Al-Jazeera loves publishing the comments of Howrd Dean, John Murtha, John Kerry, Al Gore, Ted Kennedy and Hillary Clinton. They tell him he's winning.
 
H

hipsterdufus

vandree said:
..... Maybe instead of wiretapping innocent Americans, Bush should wiretap Al-Jazeera to find out how these tapes get there?
A bit sarcastic, but a valid point. I've heard several reports on the huge amount of data that is being accumulated, with not enough people to sift through the pertinent information. That was also one of the failures of not stopping 9/11.

As for OBL - I can't believe that he is still out there. It pisses me off EVERY DAY. Four years and counting after 9/11. Heckuva job Bush.
(Spare me the blame Clinton first debate please)

Now watch the GOP grab hold of this tape to take more rights away from me and you, and watch the country say...

What time is American Idol on?

Now who's being sarcastic?
 

mixedmedia

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And as far as OBL using American sentiment in his statement, I don't find it surprising or even particularly disturbing. What's a little more disturbing to me is that my own fellow citizens would try to, implicitly, use that as proof that those who don't support the war are somehow "directing" OBL. This war is unpopular, not just with "liberals."

But have they confirmed that this tape is his voice? I haven't heard that, yet? Been "out of the loop" today.
 

oldreliable67

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mixedmedia said:
But have they confirmed that this tape is his voice? I haven't heard that, yet? Been "out of the loop" today.
Yes, it has been confirmed.
 
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