BOOM: U.S. adds whopping 312,000 jobs in December

[Grokmaster]

UH-OH!! More problems for the "EVERYTHING IS BAD!!!!" Left Narrative. Not only is the economy STILL BOOMING, UNEMPLOYMENT at RECORDS LOWS, WAGES MAKING THEIR BIGGEST GAINS (3.2% annual increase) IN OVER A DECADE, ISIS STILL CRUSHED, the POTUS STILL CONFRONTING CHINESE (ETAL) TRADE PRACTICES...but NOW the economy added a WHOPPING 312,000 jobs in December.


Tsk!! Tsk !! Bu-bu-bu-but CLIMATE CHANGE !!!! :lamo





BOOM: U.S. adds whopping 312,000 jobs in December


The U.S. labor market is charging forward.

The Bureau of Labor Statistics reported Friday that non-farm payrolls grew by 312,000 in December, surging past expectations of 184,000. The BLS also upwardly revised its figure for non-farm payroll additions in November to 176,000, from 155,000 previously reported.

The unemployment rate rose to 3.9% in December. The unemployment rate was 3.7% in November, the lowest overall unemployment level since 1969. The uptick was due to the labor force participation rate increasing to 63.1% in December from 62.9% in November.

Average hourly earnings – a closely watched metric of inflation pressures in the economy – increased 0.4% over last month and 3.2% over the previous year. This exceeded expectations of wage growth of 0.3% over last month and 3% over last year. Wages rose 3.1% over the prior year in both November and October.




https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/live-u-jobs-report-124747132.html

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Let's see...whaddaya think will leadoff the comments ?

LAUGHABLE LEFT CLAIMS about how "HORRIBLE" everything "REALLY IS! "...or just the USUAL ATTACKS on ME, while DESPERATELY IGNORING THE GREAT NEWS for AMERICA, BADS NEWS FOR DEMOCRATS/LEFTISTS ?


Getting popcorn for the ASSURED COMEDIC ENTRIES!!!

 

[Grokmaster]

Must be hard trying to turn this into bad news!!

 

[bluesmoke]

UH-OH!! More problems for the "EVERYTHING IS BAD!!!!" Left Narrative. Not only is the economy STILL BOOMING, UNEMPLOYMENT at RECORDS LOWS, WAGES MAKING THEIR BIGGEST GAINS (3.2% annual increase) IN OVER A DECADE, ISIS STILL CRUSHED, the POTUS STILL CONFRONTING CHINESE (ETAL) TRADE PRACTICES...but NOW the economy added a WHOPPING 312,000 jobs in December.


Tsk!! Tsk !! Bu-bu-bu-but CLIMATE CHANGE !!!! :lamo





BOOM: U.S. adds whopping 312,000 jobs in December


The U.S. labor market is charging forward.

The Bureau of Labor Statistics reported Friday that non-farm payrolls grew by 312,000 in December, surging past expectations of 184,000. The BLS also upwardly revised its figure for non-farm payroll additions in November to 176,000, from 155,000 previously reported.

The unemployment rate rose to 3.9% in December. The unemployment rate was 3.7% in November, the lowest overall unemployment level since 1969. The uptick was due to the labor force participation rate increasing to 63.1% in December from 62.9% in November.

Average hourly earnings – a closely watched metric of inflation pressures in the economy – increased 0.4% over last month and 3.2% over the previous year. This exceeded expectations of wage growth of 0.3% over last month and 3% over last year. Wages rose 3.1% over the prior year in both November and October.




https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/live-u-jobs-report-124747132.html

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Let's see...whaddaya think will leadoff the comments ?

LAUGHABLE LEFT CLAIMS about how "HORRIBLE" everything "REALLY IS! "...or just the USUAL ATTACKS on ME, while DESPERATELY IGNORING THE GREAT NEWS for AMERICA, BADS NEWS FOR DEMOCRATS/LEFTISTS ?


Getting popcorn for the ASSURED COMEDIC ENTRIES!!!

View attachment 67247338

You can’t give any evidence that the positive economic trends under Trump are significantly better than under Obama. The trends are a continuation of the Obama trends. Trump’s success is standing on the shoulders of the Obama economy. And know that one month does not make the economy, good or bad.

BTW, the REAL wage increase, which accounts for inflation, was about .2% for the 12 mos. ending November. I don’t yet know the real wage change ending December.

 

[Grokmaster]

You can’t give any evidence that the positive economic trends under Trump are significantly better than under Obama. The trends are a continuation of the Obama trends. Trump’s success is standing on the shoulders of the Obama economy. And know that one month does not make the economy, good or bad.

BTW, the REAL wage increase, which accounts for inflation, was about .2% for the 12 mos. ending November. I don’t yet know the real wage change ending December.

Bull****. Wages are outpacing inflation by over 2%, manufacturing jobs are INCREASING, instead of decreasing, we just finished our first year of OVER 3% ANNUAL GROWTH since BEFORE former Pres.Mommy Pants.

All this while CRUSHING ISIS, (you remember them...the "JV", right? The savages the Obamidiot ARMED with the Libyan military arsenal with his "arab spring" STUPIDITY? ), fending off a seditious political Witch Hunt, confronting Red China's tech theft and unfair trade practices, jolting the EU into paying its share of defense, forcing them to change their unfair trade practices, replacing NAFTA, and overseeing the lowest unemployment in DECADES...lower than anything Obama ever accomplished.

How's the view from down there?

 

[Grokmaster]

312,000 Jobs Added In December, Manufacturing Growing 714% Faster Under Trump Than Obama

With the December jobs number, President Trump now has two full years of economic performance to compare with his predecessor, President Obama. The two biggest statistical standouts are:

•Manufacturing jobs are growing at a 714% faster clip under Trump than over a similar time under Obama , and;

•Under Obama, federal state and local government employment grew 6 times faster than did manufacturing jobs, while under Trump, that ratio has been reversed, with manufacturing jobs growing 5 times faster than government jobs


https://www.forbes.com/sites/chuckd...4-faster-under-trump-than-obama/#5f6afe245b50

 

[holbritter]

You can’t give any evidence that the positive economic trends under Trump are significantly better than under Obama. The trends are a continuation of the Obama trends. Trump’s success is standing on the shoulders of the Obama economy. And know that one month does not make the economy, good or bad.

BTW, the REAL wage increase, which accounts for inflation, was about .2% for the 12 mos. ending November. I don’t yet know the real wage change ending December.

How long does that line work for? Just curious.

 

[bluesmoke]

Bull****. Wages are outpacing inflation by over 2%, manufacturing jobs are INCREASING, instead of decreasing, we just finished our first year of OVER 3% ANNUAL GROWTH since BEFORE former Pres.Mommy Pants.

All this while CRUSHING ISIS, (you remember them...the "JV", right? The savages the Obamidiot ARMED with the Libyan military arsenal with his "arab spring" STUPIDITY? ), fending off a seditious political Witch Hunt, confronting Red China's tech theft and unfair trade practices, jolting the EU into paying its share of defense, forcing them to change their unfair trade practices, replacing NAFTA, and overseeing the lowest unemployment in DECADES...lower than anything Obama ever accomplished.

How's the view from down there?

View attachment 67247350

Still, you can’t give any evidence that the positive economic trends under Trump are significantly better than under Obama. Nor any evidence of significant rate of improvement in any economic trend. You mouth figures without any supporting source data. Instead, you reply with additional unsupported claims after failing to have given any evidence to support your original claims, thus being unfounded.

Looks like from your photo you're keeping your head up.

 

[bluesmoke]

How long does that line work for? Just curious.

For as long as pertinent to the claim being made.

 

[Condor060]

Still, you can’t give any evidence that the positive economic trends under Trump are significantly better than under Obama. Nor any evidence of significant rate of improvement in any economic trend.

So lets agree Obama was handed a s***y deal and turned it around. I have no problem with that. Hell, I voted for him in his first term as well. But understating the obvious isn't going to gander any support for the left.


Obama wasn't the only guy to get handed a bad economy and employment record either. You do remember the great depression. But he is the only President in history that actually doubled the national debt of all proceeding 43 presidents combined and you can't blame that on Bush.

Yes, Obama was able to get things moving again but again, at the slowest recovery in US history. Even his claim that we should get used to where we are coupled with (whats Trump going to do, wave a magic wand) speech suggest he was convinced Trump was going to be a disaster.

If you are willing to give credit to a moving economy under anyone's administration then you obviously realize the opposite is true as well. Bush showed us how to tank an economy, right? So Trump is just as amenable to tank the economy as Bush did.

Yet 141 historical highs in the stock market up 45% going from Obamas 17,000 to Trumps 26,000 is just luck. It charged forward the day Trump eliminated all of the Obama admin regulations on business and has continued to grow with another historical high just 3 days ago.

Obama made it clear, Where is Trump going to get all these new jobs from, just because he says it without a single shred of evidence how he's going to get there, yet we now have over 6 million new jobs with the lowest unemployment rate since the 60s. I don't care who you are, thats saying something.

I am not here to beat on Obama. He did what he could do with what he had to work with and his own abilities but as far as the current state of our economy and a presidents ability to destroy a countries ability to survive in the markets just as he can be productive, Obama isn't the reason we are where we are right now. He handed off what he could do and it wasn't all bad but taking credit for where we are right now? Not even a consideration.

 

[Jay59]

So lets agree Obama was handed a s***y deal and turned it around. I have no problem with that. Hell, I voted for him in his first term as well. But understating the obvious isn't going to gander any support for the left.


Obama wasn't the only guy to get handed a bad economy and employment record either. You do remember the great depression. But he is the only President in history that actually doubled the national debt of all proceeding 43 presidents combined and you can't blame that on Bush.

Yes, Obama was able to get things moving again but again, at the slowest recovery in US history. Even his claim that we should get used to where we are coupled with (whats Trump going to do, wave a magic wand) speech suggest he was convinced Trump was going to be a disaster.

If you are willing to give credit to a moving economy under anyone's administration then you obviously realize the opposite is true as well. Bush showed us how to tank an economy, right? So Trump is just as amenable to tank the economy as Bush did.

Yet 141 historical highs in the stock market up 45% going from Obamas 17,000 to Trumps 26,000 is just luck. It charged forward the day Trump eliminated all of the Obama admin regulations on business and has continued to grow with another historical high just 3 days ago.

Obama made it clear, Where is Trump going to get all these new jobs from, just because he says it without a single shred of evidence how he's going to get there, yet we now have over 6 million new jobs with the lowest unemployment rate since the 60s. I don't care who you are, thats saying something.

I am not here to beat on Obama. He did what he could do with what he had to work with and his own abilities but as far as the current state of our economy and a presidents ability to destroy a countries ability to survive in the markets just as he can be productive, Obama isn't the reason we are where we are right now. He handed off what he could do and it wasn't all bad but taking credit for where we are right now? Not even a consideration.

That's asking too much. It's more that he was along for the ride.

I am curious why this thread was dusted off. Care to impart some insight?

 

[Condor060]

That's asking too much. It's more that he was along for the ride.

These is no such thing as a ride along. This is a 24/7 job where just a stupid act or even a stupid comment from a President can drive down the markets overnight thousands of points. I actually think you are an intelligent individual. You just don't like Trump. I get it. But you honestly don't think you are going to convince me that presidential actions (or non actions) won't affect anything. You know better then that.

I am curious why this thread was dusted off. Care to impart some insight?

Just like every other thread in here. To bolster for your particular candidate. I mean, if they weren't dusted off and repeated, this DP site would just die a silent death. If we wereonly to post the days news every day, there wouldn't be much to fight about now would there. lol

 

[Jay59]

These is no such thing as a ride along. This is a 24/7 job where just a stupid act or even a stupid comment from a President can drive down the markets overnight thousands of points. I actually think you are an intelligent individual. You just don't like Trump. I get it. But you honestly don't think you are going to convince me that presidential actions (or non actions) won't affect anything. You know better then that.

Just like every other thread in here. To bolster for your particular candidate. I mean, if they weren't dusted off and repeated, this DP site would just die a silent death. If we wereonly to post the days news every day, there wouldn't be much to fight about now would there. lol

Backward. There are no exceptions to ride along.

Presidents have relatively little control of the economy. What control they have mostly concerns timing. Economic events will occur regardless, but the timing can be advanced or delayed somewhat. President Obama managed to even out the economy at a very slow pace. He deserves that much credit. However, the recovery would have happened if he had done nothing and the waste of the two stimulus packages would have been saved.

There are exceptions. Major changes in tax or money policy have lasting impact. However, they are also slow to kick in, hard to predict.

 

[Condor060]

Backward. There are no exceptions to ride along.

Presidents have relatively little control of the economy.

This is where we are just going to have to agree to disagree. The mere sound bite of Trump taunting China with those tariffs knocked the market down 1500 points. His deregulation's and tax incentives alone spiked the stock market to historical highs and gardened huge US company support by giving away hundreds of millions to employees as bonuses.

 

[SonOfDaedalus]

Yet 141 historical highs in the stock market up 45% going from Obamas 17,000 to Trumps 26,000 is just luck. It charged forward the day Trump eliminated all of the Obama admin regulations on business and has continued to grow with another historical high just 3 days ago.

1. What was DOW at the day Trump was sworn into office?

2. What was DOW at the day Obama was sworn into office?

3. What was the low point?

4. Did we have a historically long Bull market under Obama? Did we hit historic highs under Obama?

5. What was unemployment rate when Trump took office?

And it makes no sense to blame Obama for the deficits when it was Bush's economic collapse, Bush's wars that drove the deficits. Obama actually reduced the deficits. Until deficits reach zero the debt will always grow. That's basic math.

 

[SonOfDaedalus]

These is no such thing as a ride along. This is a 24/7 job where just a stupid act or even a stupid comment from a President can drive down the markets overnight thousands of points. I actually think you are an intelligent individual. You just don't like Trump. I get it. But you honestly don't think you are going to convince me that presidential actions (or non actions) won't affect anything. You know better then that.

If I made you CEO of Amazon today, do you think it would suddenly stop being a profitable company? Do you think it would stop growing?

Would you agree that it's much easier to take over a growing profitable company than a declining company that's hemorrhaging money?

You're an intelligent person. I'm sure you see my point. It takes much less effort to take over a healthy economy.

And finally, a tax break to corporations will automatically boost the DOW. It's a giveaway not an accomplishment in and of itself. The goal was not to boost the DOW but to raise wages. But corporations have focused on buybacks.

 

[Deuce]

Must be hard trying to turn this into bad news!!

Obama had a dozen months over 300,000 jobs created and you didn't compliment him on any one of those months. Why is that, Grok?

 

[Condor060]

If I made you CEO of Amazon today, do you think it would suddenly stop being a profitable company? Do you think it would stop growing?

We aren't talking about CEO here. If my daddy left me with full executive authority over Amazon as President of the company, we have an entirely different ball game. But Amazon doesn't even come close meaning they have a product (Commission sales and delivery of goods) How does this compare to President of the United States and the most powerful man in the world?

Don't you think you are just undervaluing the office of President just a tad here? The task of keeping things on a stable growth path depends mainly on the actions of the Federal Reserve. The chair of the Fed, who’s chosen by the president, has a large impact on how monetary policy is conducted. In addition, members of the board of governors (which includes the chair), who are also appointed by the president, have a majority of the 12 votes on the monetary policy committee.

The combination of some or all of these factors could have resulted in a much different trajectory and govern the country’s vulnerability to financial crises in the future. The president also plays a role in determining how GDP is divided between various income classes and how much protection workers have against lost income when they lose their jobs.

Also the president has a large impact on fiscal policy, an essential component of the response to economic growth. During normal times, monetary policy is powerful enough to offset fluctuations in the economy on its own and this is just basic economy stuff. We haven't even began to discuss foreign policy and combative military problems or how that effects this country.

If the President with all of his executive authority is just a ride along guy (which is just ludicrous) whats all the beef about? Why not just have a rotating panel of people that take over every few months and ride right along? Come on, do we really need to have this conversation?

You couldn't possibly compare a single company president having the same effect on its company and the leader of the free world.

 

[bluesmoke]

So lets agree Obama was handed a s***y deal and turned it around. I have no problem with that. Hell, I voted for him in his first term as well. But understating the obvious isn't going to gander any support for the left.


Obama wasn't the only guy to get handed a bad economy and employment record either. You do remember the great depression. But he is the only President in history that actually doubled the national debt of all proceeding 43 presidents combined and you can't blame that on Bush.

Yes, Obama was able to get things moving again but again, at the slowest recovery in US history. Even his claim that we should get used to where we are coupled with (whats Trump going to do, wave a magic wand) speech suggest he was convinced Trump was going to be a disaster.

If you are willing to give credit to a moving economy under anyone's administration then you obviously realize the opposite is true as well. Bush showed us how to tank an economy, right? So Trump is just as amenable to tank the economy as Bush did.

Yet 141 historical highs in the stock market up 45% going from Obamas 17,000 to Trumps 26,000 is just luck. It charged forward the day Trump eliminated all of the Obama admin regulations on business and has continued to grow with another historical high just 3 days ago.

Obama made it clear, Where is Trump going to get all these new jobs from, just because he says it without a single shred of evidence how he's going to get there, yet we now have over 6 million new jobs with the lowest unemployment rate since the 60s. I don't care who you are, thats saying something.

I am not here to beat on Obama. He did what he could do with what he had to work with and his own abilities but as far as the current state of our economy and a presidents ability to destroy a countries ability to survive in the markets just as he can be productive, Obama isn't the reason we are where we are right now. He handed off what he could do and it wasn't all bad but taking credit for where we are right now? Not even a consideration.

“Obama wasn't the only guy to get handed a bad economy and employment record either. You do remember the great depression.”

Good point. He wasn’t the “only guy”. He was one of the TWO guys to be handed one of the two worst economies ever.

“But he is the only President in history that actually doubled the national debt of all proceeding 43 presidents combined and you can't blame that on Bush.”

Wrong on all three points. The debt did not double under Obama and it increased by a higher percentage under Bush2. Yes, Bush is at least partially to blame for the increased debt because $831B was budgeted under Obama’s American Recovery and Reinvestment Act to help us out of the Great Recession. Like I said in my prior reply to the other poster, which you apparently agreed with, you can’t provide any evidence to support this claim either.

“Yes, Obama was able to get things moving again but again, at the slowest recovery in US history.”

Slowest recovery from the second worst economy in history and starting at a -2.5% real GDP. Still, better growth than under Bush2 and the 4th longest continuous economic growth in our history.

“Even his claim that we should get used to where we are coupled with (whats Trump going to do, wave a magic wand) speech suggest he was convinced Trump was going to be a disaster.”

That we should get used to slower growth was not a comment on Trump but on projected world economic growth and management. Cite the quote that suggests (weak term) your “disaster” claim. BTW, the average American does not share in a higher GDP growth rate.

“If you are willing to give credit to a moving economy under anyone's administration then you obviously realize the opposite is true as well. Bush showed us how to tank an economy, right? So Trump is just as amenable to tank the economy as Bush did.”

Yup. Should the economy tank under Trump, I’m willing to give him credit for that.

“Yet 141 historical highs in the stock market up 45% going from Obamas 17,000 to Trumps 26,000 is just luck. It charged forward the day Trump eliminated all of the Obama admin regulations on business and has continued to grow with another historical high just 3 days ago.”

The market did great under Obama and is doing great under Trump. Just a correction: Year-end 2016 the market closed at 26,527. But who’s counting. BTW, with only about half of Americans owning stock, and obviously they typical American owning less than higher income individuals, the stock market really doesn’t help the most people. In fact, it is one of the greatest causes of the wealth gap.

This reply is continued on next post.

 

[bluesmoke]

So lets agree Obama was handed a s***y deal and turned it around. I have no problem with that. Hell, I voted for him in his first term as well. But understating the obvious isn't going to gander any support for the left.


Obama wasn't the only guy to get handed a bad economy and employment record either. You do remember the great depression. But he is the only President in history that actually doubled the national debt of all proceeding 43 presidents combined and you can't blame that on Bush.

Yes, Obama was able to get things moving again but again, at the slowest recovery in US history. Even his claim that we should get used to where we are coupled with (whats Trump going to do, wave a magic wand) speech suggest he was convinced Trump was going to be a disaster.

If you are willing to give credit to a moving economy under anyone's administration then you obviously realize the opposite is true as well. Bush showed us how to tank an economy, right? So Trump is just as amenable to tank the economy as Bush did.

Yet 141 historical highs in the stock market up 45% going from Obamas 17,000 to Trumps 26,000 is just luck. It charged forward the day Trump eliminated all of the Obama admin regulations on business and has continued to grow with another historical high just 3 days ago.

Obama made it clear, Where is Trump going to get all these new jobs from, just because he says it without a single shred of evidence how he's going to get there, yet we now have over 6 million new jobs with the lowest unemployment rate since the 60s. I don't care who you are, thats saying something.

I am not here to beat on Obama. He did what he could do with what he had to work with and his own abilities but as far as the current state of our economy and a presidents ability to destroy a countries ability to survive in the markets just as he can be productive, Obama isn't the reason we are where we are right now. He handed off what he could do and it wasn't all bad but taking credit for where we are right now? Not even a consideration.

Continued from prior post.

“Obama made it clear, Where is Trump going to get all these new jobs from, just because he says it without a single shred of evidence how he's going to get there, yet we now have over 6 million new jobs with the lowest unemployment rate since the 60s. I don't care who you are, thats saying something.”

Cite the source, that includes context, of your claim. I know Obama didn’t believe we could get back the manufacturing jobs we had before (17,000). Again, the current unemployment rate is from a continuation of the improving trend established under Obama.

“I am not here to beat on Obama.”

You know that’s not true. You want me to feed your own words back to you?

“He did what he could do with what he had to work with and his own abilities”

Yeah. Abilities that got us out of the second worst economy in our entire history and put us even with where we were before the recession, when people thought all was hunky-dory.

“but as far as the current state of our economy and a presidents ability to destroy a countries ability to survive in the markets just as he can be productive,”

I don’t know what you mean by “destroy a countries ability to survive in the markets…”.

“Obama isn't the reason we are where we are right now.”

Including Obama, there are many reasons we are where we are right now. All I’m saying is that Obama established positive economic trends that have continued and logic would say there is a connection.

“He handed off what he could do and it wasn't all bad”

Translation: “Most was bad.” Yeah. You’re not beating-up on Obama. You also can’t provide any evidence of what was “bad”.

“but taking credit for where we are right now? Not even a consideration.”


Correct. I’m giving him credit for giving Trump all that it took to get where we are now. Where do you think we would be if Trump got the economy Bush2 gave Obama? Specifically, how Trump’s tax plan would have played vs. Obama’s tax plan and the ARRA.

 

[Condor060]

Continued from prior post.

BTW, with only about half of Americans owning stock, and obviously they typical American owning less than higher income individuals, the stock market really doesn’t help the most people.

The stock market affects everyone:

Its behavior affects bond market prices, which affect how much you pay for a mortgage or how difficult it is for you to get a loan and the interest you pay on that loan

Companies with growing stock prices can more easily attract financing or use equity financing, making it easier for them to hire and expand. Companies with falling stocks often slash jobs to try to become more profitable

Even if you don't own stocks, if you or one of your family members has a pension plan, that pension is partially invested in stocks, meaning its solvency may depend on stocks.

This includes public pensions which we taxpayers are responsible for. Stock returns create investment taxes which increase government receipts and decrease debt & deficits, allowing for more social program.

It doesn't only effect people who trade or invest.

Wrong on all three points. The debt did not double under Obama and it increased by a higher percentage under Bush2

Obama Added $8.588 trillion, a 74% increase from the $11.657 trillion debt at the end of Bush’s last budget, FY 2009 which was the total of all 43 preceding presidents.

Yup. Should the economy tank under Trump, I’m willing to give him credit for that.

But even you admit that economy's can tank under every president, so when does Trump get any credit. I suspect never.

That we should get used to slower growth was not a comment on Trump but on projected world economic growth

It was a comment on the current economic state of this country which was obviously wrong and showed his williness to settle for the economy he was in the last year of his presidency.

 

[bluesmoke]

The stock market affects everyone:

Its behavior affects bond market prices, which affect how much you pay for a mortgage or how difficult it is for you to get a loan and the interest you pay on that loan

Companies with growing stock prices can more easily attract financing or use equity financing, making it easier for them to hire and expand. Companies with falling stocks often slash jobs to try to become more profitable

Even if you don't own stocks, if you or one of your family members has a pension plan, that pension is partially invested in stocks, meaning its solvency may depend on stocks.

This includes public pensions which we taxpayers are responsible for. Stock returns create investment taxes which increase government receipts and decrease debt & deficits, allowing for more social program.

It doesn't only effect people who trade or invest.




Obama Added $8.588 trillion, a 74% increase from the $11.657 trillion debt at the end of Bush’s last budget, FY 2009 which was the total of all 43 preceding presidents.



But even you admit that economy's can tank under every president, so when does Trump get any credit. I suspect never.



It was a comment on the current economic state of this country which was obviously wrong and showed his williness to settle for the economy he was in the last year of his presidency.

“Its behavior affects bond market prices, which affect how much you pay for a mortgage or how difficult it is for you to get a loan and the interest you pay on that loan”

Typically, when stock prices rise, bond prices drop. When bond prices drop, treasury note yields rise. When treasury note yields rise, mortgage interest rates rise. So, no, in that case a rising stock market works against the borrower on a home loan. However, the Fed does use quantitative easing, as done during and after the Great Recession, which helped spurn a rise in the stock market while keeping borrowing rates low.

“Companies with growing stock prices can more easily attract financing or use equity financing, making it easier for them to hire and expand. Companies with falling stocks often slash jobs to try to become more profitable”

It isn’t falling stock prices itself that cause unemployment. In the Great Recession, it was a lack of funds for lending, leading to a decline in loans available due to overselling inappropriate sub-prime mortgages to home borrowers who could not afford the payments. Housing prices fell, so there was no fallback equity for the banks to collect. Hence, the Fed’s quantitative easing. As a matter of fact, many loans were made to minorities who qualified for lower rates but were given higher rates they could not keep up payments for. So, no money for investment of any kind. No chance for economic growth. Stock prices drop and employees are dropped. Yes, employment goes up with stock prices, though somewhat lagging. However, it’s the economy that affects stock prices and therefore employment.

“Even if you don't own stocks, if you or one of your family members has a pension plan, that pension is partially invested in stocks, meaning its solvency may depend on stocks.”

“This includes public pensions which we taxpayers are responsible for. Stock returns create investment taxes which increase government receipts and decrease debt & deficits, allowing for more social program.”

Pension fund portfolios and retirement vehicles with higher percentage of equity investment are highly correlated with the up-and-down swings of the stock market and thus exposed to considerable risk and uncertainty. Most people retiring do not get significant benefit from stocks to help much in their retirement.

You can’t show the data, including giving a reference, that shows most people get much of a benefit from owning stocks.

Like I said, the stock market really doesn’t help the most people.

(This reply continued on next post)

 

[bluesmoke]

The stock market affects everyone:

Its behavior affects bond market prices, which affect how much you pay for a mortgage or how difficult it is for you to get a loan and the interest you pay on that loan

Companies with growing stock prices can more easily attract financing or use equity financing, making it easier for them to hire and expand. Companies with falling stocks often slash jobs to try to become more profitable

Even if you don't own stocks, if you or one of your family members has a pension plan, that pension is partially invested in stocks, meaning its solvency may depend on stocks.

This includes public pensions which we taxpayers are responsible for. Stock returns create investment taxes which increase government receipts and decrease debt & deficits, allowing for more social program.

It doesn't only effect people who trade or invest.




Obama Added $8.588 trillion, a 74% increase from the $11.657 trillion debt at the end of Bush’s last budget, FY 2009 which was the total of all 43 preceding presidents.



But even you admit that economy's can tank under every president, so when does Trump get any credit. I suspect never.



It was a comment on the current economic state of this country which was obviously wrong and showed his williness to settle for the economy he was in the last year of his presidency.

(continued from prior post)

“Obama Added $8.588 trillion, a 74% increase from the $11.657 trillion debt at the end of Bush’s last budget, FY 2009 which was the total of all 43 preceding presidents.”

You’re making an inequitable comparison and using nominal, I think, not real dollars (adjusted for inflation). Inequitable because the better comparison is by percentage, not dollars. Using dollars adjusted for inflation, the debt under Obama’s 8 fiscal years increased 48.9%. Under Bush2’s 8 yrs it was 69.5% and under Reagan it went up over 2 times. It’s just plain ludicrous to use non-inflation adjusted dollars. Even using nominal dollars, your “was the total of all 43 preceding presidents” is just plain wrong and you can’t show the data and source to support your falsehood.

“But even you admit that economy's can tank under every president, so when does Trump get any credit. I suspect never.”

Yes, it can tank. Other than the down years Bush gave Obama, the economy didn’t tank under Obama. It’s too early to judge Trump on the overall economy. Except to criticize his giveaway to the rich and large corps for which there was no return.

“It was a comment on the current economic state of this country which was obviously wrong and showed his williness to settle for the economy he was in the last year of his presidency.”

Yeah, this country is included in the world. I don’t know what you mean by “obviously wrong”. Real GDP is expected to drop to about 2.4% for 2019, with 2.2% in 2017 and 2.8-9% in 2018, all are within Obama territory. Not what Trump wants, hence his going Rumplestiltskin on the Fed. He promised a lot more for his $2.3T tax cut to the rich and large corps. He can always blame the Fed bank. He never takes responsibility for anything.