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Betsy DeVos set to rewrite guidance on college sexual assault cases, giving new rights to accused

Christian White Men are the most persecuted group in all of human history. Every Trump supporter knows this. ;)

That's not what this is about, goodness you people are insufferable when challenged with an issue or situation you lack the wherewithal to debate the subject rationaly.
 
You're basing your argument on just one case??? Good gawd! :doh

Wow MG. It's a LONG article, FULL of examples, of situations and really breaks it down. I was hoping, that the source being not a right wing site would elicit you to take a gander. I thought you were genuinely interested in the why I would (and others) feel these changes are good.

It's obvious now you are not. That article is very informative and does a great job of documenting the need for changes. I posted merely one snippet to give you a sliver of insight. And you went and embarrassed yourself. You aren't interested in open dialogue on this matter, and you really are not able or willing to look at the issue even when it's from a source far closer to your side of the aisle as it were.

So do us a favor, leave this thread. I have no desire to further banter with a witless snark whose not even willing to take a moment to listen.
 
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Ok, the only example I can think of offhand was the Duke lacrosse team thing, which was pretty shameful, but they weren't found guilty of anything.

No doubt there are others, but I don't see a false accusation crisis in schools. My own incomplete experience suggests schools tend to circle the wagons and stonewall on the accused's behalf, most particularly of abusive teachers.

Examples must be plentiful, if our best option is to make it easier for school admins to ignore the accusations.

We need to meet in the middle regarding these types of allegations. I don't think that there's going to be a large group of victims looking to falsely accuse others, but we have to protect the due process of the accused as well lest this become a kangaroo court in nature.
 
Ok, the only example I can think of offhand was the Duke lacrosse team thing, which was pretty shameful, but they weren't found guilty of anything.

No doubt there are others, but I don't see a false accusation crisis in schools. My own incomplete experience suggests schools tend to circle the wagons and stonewall on the accused's behalf, most particularly of abusive teachers.

Examples must be plentiful, if our best option is to make it easier for school admins to ignore the accusations.

It’s not a matter of ignoring allegations. This is about ensuring that colleges and universities have robust due process if they are to usurp the role of police as an investigative authority in a criminal matter and mete out punitive measures against students. Some are better at this than others.
 
By what ever means are required, and to these assholes willingness to use violence and/or lies registers in their pea brains as "Being Serious".

They lack the required morality.

They are children.

YUK

Yuk? :lamo

You just described the guy you elected as your leader, to a "T".

Violence:

19510578_334932460273028_4437980780719315754_n.jpg


Pea Brain:
'Idiot,' 'Dope,' 'Moron': How Trump's aides have insulted the boss

Lack Morality:
President Trump has made 4,229 false or misleading claims in 558 days
Stormy Daniels and Donald Trump, brought to you by Mike Pence and the religious right

Act like a child:
Trump's tweets on Trudeau 'childish and need to stop
Your next president, Donald Trump, basically tweets like a 12-year old


You literally voted for the guy who represents what you say you hate. Maybe it's time to come out of the bubble? And you do realize what type of people Trump loves, right?

Donald Trump declares 'I love the poorly educated'

You should think about why that is.
 
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What a load of crap.

How about the accused even being able to defend themselves in the hearing?
Or is that too much to expect now, with 'presumed guilt' becoming the new leftist legal standard?

Yeah, yeah, just as long as the PC fascists get what they want. :roll:
I'm frankly fed up with it, and sick of it.

Bugger off and **** up someone else's country and legal system with your garbage ideology.

Astounding that leveling the playing field for accused triggers the progressives.
 
People accused of sexual misconduct can defend themselves during a hearing.

This seems really hard for you.

What seems really hard is understanding that due process was replaced with SJW tribunals, where the accused had no Constitutional rights.
 
I think the leftist paradigm shifted into something of a monster, the further through the years we've gone.

What was the terminology.
-It's better to let 10 guilty men go free, than to imprison 1 innocent man?-

I think they've tried to reverse that course for a while now.

They quite literally have. There are feminazis out there who believe that if innocent men get caught up in their "rape culture" Crusade, oh well. Too bad, so sad.
 
It’s not a matter of ignoring allegations. This is about ensuring that colleges and universities have robust due process if they are to usurp the role of police as an investigative authority in a criminal matter and mete out punitive measures against students. Some are better at this than others.

OP Link said:
The new rules would reduce liability for universities, tighten the definition of sexual harassment, and allow schools to use a higher standard in evaluating claims of sexual harassment and assault.

That reads to me like the schools:

1. Have less on the line (reduced liability.)

2. Would have to consider fewer types of incidents via tighter definitions. (Sorry, that's awful but not technically sexual harassment.)

3. Have set a higher barrier to entry for accusers ("higher standards in evaluating accusations", AKA disregarding anything that they think won't come back to bite them.)


For a crime that goes famously under reported, these changes seem intent on squashing accusations with bureaucracy.

I'm no expert on the topic, but these particular changes seem to be more about making the school's job easier, rather than eliminating harassment or even stopping false accusations.

Why not just a sharp penalty when a false accusation is exposed?
 
It’s not a matter of ignoring allegations. This is about ensuring that colleges and universities have robust due process if they are to usurp the role of police as an investigative authority in a criminal matter and mete out punitive measures against students. Some are better at this than others.

I think this is a great start, but we need to go further in reversing the failed liberal policies which put police matters and due process in the hands of school officials. Yes, I'm looking at you, Obama.
 
That reads to me like the schools:

1. Have less on the line (reduced liability.)

2. Would have to consider fewer types of incidents via tighter definitions. (Sorry, that's awful but not technically sexual harassment.)

3. Have set a higher barrier to entry for accusers ("higher standards in evaluating accusations", AKA disregarding anything that they think won't come back to bite them.)


For a crime that goes famously under reported, these changes seem intent on squashing accusations with bureaucracy.

I'm no expert on the topic, but these particular changes seem to be more about making the school's job easier, rather than eliminating harassment or even stopping false accusations.

Why not just a sharp penalty when a false accusation is exposed?

Read this article, it really covers the bases on the matter. Seriously, READ IT.
https://www.debatepolitics.com/redi...rtable-truth-about-campus-rape-policy/538974/
 
Wow MG. It's a LONG article, FULL of examples, of situations and really breaks it down. I was hoping, that the source being not a right wing site would elicit you to take a gander. I thought you were genuinely interested in the why I would (and others) feel these changes are good.

It's obvious now you are not. That article is very informative and does a great job of documenting the need for changes. I posted merely one snippet to give you a sliver of insight. And you went and embarrassed yourself. You aren't interested in open dialogue on this matter, and you really are not able or willing to look at the issue even when it's from a source far closer to your side of the aisle as it were.

So do us a favor, leave this thread. I have no desire to further banter with a witless snark whose not even willing to take a moment to listen.

No, it's not full of examples. AT ALL. I have no idea what the **** you are talking about. Did you link the right article? The one I read DID NOT have multiple examples of actual cases. It just lists changes from Obama to DeVos. :roll:

And keep the insults to yourself.
 
No, it's not full of examples. AT ALL. I have no idea what the **** you are talking about. Did you link the right article? The one I read DID NOT have multiple examples of actual cases. It just lists changes from Obama to DeVos. :roll:

And keep the insults to yourself.

wadwo “kojo” bonsu, 23, was on track to graduate in the spring of 2016 with a degree in chemical engineering from the University of Massachusetts at Amherst. Bonsu, who was born in Maryland, is the son of Ghanaian immigrants. He chose UMass because it gave him the opportunity to pursue his two passions, science and music. He told me he hoped to get a doctorate in polymer science or chemical engineering. At UMass he was a member of the National Society of Black Engineers. He also joined a fraternity (he was the only black member), played guitar in a campus jazz band, and tutored jazz guitarists at a local high school.
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https://www.theatlantic.com/educati...rtable-truth-about-campus-rape-policy/538974/

Mark Hathaway, a California attorney who has dealt with several no-complainant complaints, says that the zeal with which these complaints are sometimes handled can be wounding psychologically to both the accused and his partner. Hathaway represented a young man who was in bed with his girlfriend in her dorm room. They were fooling around but not having intercourse. In the next bed was the girlfriend’s roommate and a male student. They thought that the girlfriend had had too much to drink to be able to consent to sexual activity. They mentioned their concern to a resident adviser, who was obligated to report it to the Title IX office, which then opened an investigation. “The girl says nothing happened; it was all consensual,” Hathaway told me. “But the school still goes forward.”

Because the school considered her a witness, the girlfriend was compelled to answer questions; had she refused to cooperate, she could have been disciplined. (If she had been the complainant, she would have had the right to decline.) Hathaway told me she “was in tears because she was required to explain to total strangers intimate sexual details.” The school concluded, despite her statements to the contrary, that she couldn’t have consented to the sexual encounter, and suspended her boyfriend for a semester. He was also required to attend eight sessions with a therapist on the topic of alcohol and sexual relationships.
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Plus the one I original posted, that's 3 prime examples, as well as breaking down the faults in the Obama system and why changes just need to be made.

Also, I asked you to stop posting in this thread if you were just going to keep with the snark. I've shown you to be dishonest, not interested in learning anything and snarky. Get out.
 
I think the leftist paradigm shifted into something of a monster, the further through the years we've gone.

What was the terminology.
-It's better to let 10 guilty men go free, than to imprison 1 innocent man?-

I think they've tried to reverse that course for a while now.
As long as those accused and charged are not of their tribe Dems seem to have fallen inline behind Ellison, supporting him, ignoring the abuse he committed.

Sent from my Pixel 2 using Tapatalk
 
Read this article, it really covers the bases on the matter. Seriously, READ IT.
https://www.debatepolitics.com/redi...rtable-truth-about-campus-rape-policy/538974/

Sheesh, what a tome! Count me out for parts 2 and 3.

Those examples are awful, I suppose if those descriptions are the norm then changes are needed.

I'd prefer that police\courts handle these things, though it's clearly gone to far to unwind easily.

I guess I'm glad I'm not in school any more. I'd encourage people not to live on campus, so these rules have somewhat less grip.

To some extent I was reacting to Betsy DeVos, with whom I have other policy disagreements, but she may have a point here.
 
People accused of sexual misconduct can defend themselves during a hearing.

This seems really hard for you.

you aware of the Amherst case?
 
Christian White Men are the most persecuted group in all of human history. Every Trump supporter knows this. ;)

is that sort of a lame attempt to excuse college codes that assume guilt?
 
Yeah, they're pretty rampant.

as one article noted-its going to take some wealthy students to force colleges into trial to really destroy this presumed guilty nonsense. Its complete BS and its time some of these colleges get their dirty laundry aired out in public.
 
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