Bernie sanders wants to tax stock trades to pay for free college

[ludin]

So all taxes are "thievery"? Are you against all taxes then?


Haha something getting mentioned that is used to challenge your position is not a straw man.. Using the same knowledge you use to draw a logical conclusion in the form of a question is not a straw man. Its literally using your own knowledge and train of thought to ask a question.

and the strawman continues. you not challenging you are distorting.

Nope. Its a question.

distortion.

:lamo Oh no! You have to answer questions! Why cant you just answer the questions?

Nope I don't have to answer distortion of what I say that is why I am calling you out on it.

Nope. I asked you a question....

can repeat it all you want to you didn't address anything but the broad paint brush and distortion of my post.
you on the other hand have failed to support your own idea.

I have given you 2 separate ways you can attempt to do this and you refuse to do either. this means your ideology is a failure.

Constitutional authority. Politics. The right to hold an opinion.

Really what constitutional amendment give you right to someone else's property please tell me (this should be a good one)

 

[ludin]

because they already are.

prove other people are paying for free college for all students in America.

http://ticas.org/sites/default/files/pub_files/Debt_Facts_and_Sources.pdf

there you go you can give as much money as you want to them. although I wouldn't really quote anything from them as proof.
they are slightly biased in their view point.

although as I posted there are plenty of affordable colleges that you can get a good education from.

already addressed.

not really you made a list of excuses.

you're paying for people who fall through the cracks already, and yet you still refuse to see that the money is better invested on the front end.

There is already money available for them to go to college, but if they won't work for that then there is no reason they would work in college or anywhere else.

 

[Helix]

prove other people are paying for free college for all students in America.

strawman. refer to my earlier posts about entitlement spending vs level of education.

there you go you can give as much money as you want to them. although I wouldn't really quote anything from them as proof.
they are slightly biased in their view point.

although as I posted there are plenty of affordable colleges that you can get a good education from.

already addressed, and you didn't disprove the data presented in the link.

There is already money available for them to go to college, but if they won't work for that then there is no reason they would work in college or anywhere else.

then enjoy paying for their public assistance instead of making the investment on the front end.

 

[TheDemSocialist]

and the strawman continues. you not challenging you are distorting.


distortion.



Nope I don't have to answer distortion of what I say that is why I am calling you out on it.


can repeat it all you want to you didn't address anything but the broad paint brush and distortion of my post.
you on the other hand have failed to support your own idea.

I have given you 2 separate ways you can attempt to do this and you refuse to do either. this means your ideology is a failure.

Holy ****. :doh Way to ignore a whole post.

Really what constitutional amendment give you right to someone else's property please tell me (this should be a good one)

Well saying that is not an amendment to it, but its article 1 section 8 that gives the power to Congress to levy taxes, and that this bill uses what is essentially a financial transaction tax, and that financial transaction taxes have long withstood any constitutional challenge, we have had some from 1914-1966, and we essentially have one (but its essentially minimal at .0034%) and collected by the SEC..... So yea...

 

[ludin]

strawman. refer to my earlier posts about entitlement spending vs level of education.

nope no strawman at all. I am simply asking you to prove your statement.

already addressed, and you didn't disprove the data presented in the link.

I don't need to disprove the data. the data is meaningless to me.
the fact is you don't support your own ideology that is good enough.

I have given you at least 2 options and you refuse to do either.

then enjoy paying for their public assistance instead of making the investment on the front end.

then a free college isn't going to change that.

 

[ludin]

Holy ****. :doh Way to ignore a whole post.

nope I am simply ignoring your slew of logical fallacies.

Well saying that is not an amendment to it, but its article 1 section 8 that gives the power to Congress to levy taxes, and that this bill uses what is essentially a financial transaction tax, and that financial transaction taxes have long withstood any constitutional challenge, we have had some from 1914-1966, and we essentially have one (but its essentially minimal at .0034%) and collected by the SEC..... So yea...

there we go again you distort what was asked into something else.
I didn't ask you for the tax section.

you said that people had the right to other property I asked you for the constitutional amendment that gives you this right.
the fact is there isn't one.

now if you want to go into taxes. then congress can levy taxes, however the fact that this will never get through congress makes it moot.
however as I have said.

if you feel that the government isn't getting enough of your money you can freely give it to them.

 

[Blemonds]

I will stick with the tax on stocks.

That's the way envy works

 

[Helix]

nope no strawman at all. I am simply asking you to prove your statement.

refer to the charts that you probably ignored.

I don't need to disprove the data. the data is meaningless to me.

i am Jack's complete lack of surprise.

the fact is you don't support your own ideology that is good enough.

false.

I have given you at least 2 options and you refuse to do either.

i've already supported my argument. your refusal to acknowledge that is not a refutation.

then a free college isn't going to change that.

actually, i argued for debt free access to post secondary education. but yes, i do support free college, as well. better to spend the money on that than on many other things.

 

[tech30528]

Interesting. He knows it will never pass, so he doesn't have to back it up, and the youth willeat it up without understanding that. Perfect liberal policy: buy your votes with other people's money.

 

[Fletch]

It's nice to have somebody fighting for education.

Bernie Sanders Wants to Tax Stock Trades to Pay for Free College - Bloomberg Politics

Bernie Sanders wants to take from the rich in order to make public college tuition-free for everyone else. On Tuesday, Sanders will hold a press conference in the nation's capital at which he will introduce a plan to use a so-called Robin Hood tax on stock transactions to fund tuition at four-year public colleges and universities. Sanders' bill sets a 50-cent tax on every "$100 of stock trades on stock sales, and lesser amounts on transactions involving bonds, derivatives, and other financial instruments," the group Robin Hood Tax on Wall Street said Monday in a press release. "The Robin Hood tax would also slow the growth of automated high frequency trading, which makes the stock market more dangerous," the press release stated. "A small tax would make risky HFT unprofitable, and help reduce the excess speculation on commodities like food and gas that drives up prices, which will protect the economy from computer-generated collapses and market manipulation."

Sanders, who is the only candidate so far to mount a formal challenge to Democrat Hillary Clinton, argues that making college tuition-free will help America compete in the global marketplace. "We live in a highly competitive global economy and, if our economy is to be strong, we need the best-educated work force in the world," the Vermont senator said in a press release on Sunday. "That will not happen if, every year, hundreds of thousands of bright young people cannot afford to go to college, and if millions more leave school deeply in debt."

Sanders is an honest liberal (thus disproving my contention that such creatures don't exist). He aptly names it the Robin Hood tax. Robin Hood was also known as the Thief of Sherwood Forest because what he, and now Sanders, advocate is just that: Theft. So the rest of you dishonest liberals can stop pretending that the whole of your ideology isn't built upon that single word. Plus it is appropriate that the repressive, intolerant, totalitarian, windmill loving left would find their hero in Dark Ages literature. Well done Bernie. Keep talking.

 

[sawdust]

Sanders is an honest liberal (thus disproving my contention that such creatures don't exist). He aptly names it the Robin Hood tax. Robin Hood was also known as the Thief of Sherwood Forest because what he, and now Sanders, advocate is just that: Theft. So the rest of you dishonest liberals can stop pretending that the whole of your ideology isn't built upon that single word. Plus it is appropriate that the repressive, intolerant, totalitarian, windmill loving left would find their hero in Dark Ages literature. Well done Bernie. Keep talking.

Robin Hood stole from the government to give to the poor. The Sheriff of Nottingham was the government. Sanders is far from Robin Hood. Thankfully he has no chance of being elected. He'd tax all of us into poverty.

 

[Montecresto]

Sanders is an honest liberal (thus disproving my contention that such creatures don't exist). He aptly names it the Robin Hood tax. Robin Hood was also known as the Thief of Sherwood Forest because what he, and now Sanders, advocate is just that: Theft. So the rest of you dishonest liberals can stop pretending that the whole of your ideology isn't built upon that single word. Plus it is appropriate that the repressive, intolerant, totalitarian, windmill loving left would find their hero in Dark Ages literature. Well done Bernie. Keep talking.

Taxes equate to thievery? When the Feds tax me to conduct any number of military adventurism abroad, are they then not thieving from me. IOW is it only thievery to you when the monies collected are spent on something which you don't agree with, hmm?

 

[LowDown]

It's nice to have somebody fighting for education.

Pouring more money into education is the last thing we need. If ever there were an example of diminishing returns...

We spend more on each student than any other country except for maybe Luxemborg and the results we are seeing are abysmal.

We need radical reform of the educational system starting with abolishing teacher's unions and getting rid of 75% of administrators.

Before we produce more PhDs in gender studies we need more jobs available.

 

[Fletch]

Taxes equate to thievery? When the Feds tax me to conduct any number of military adventurism abroad, are they then not thieving from me. IOW is it only thievery to you when the monies collected are spent on something which you don't agree with, hmm?

Cant you read? Or do I have to dumb down my posts for you?

 

[Montecresto]

Cant you read? Or do I have to dumb down my posts for you?

That's a rebuttal, lol. They're dumb enough already.

 

[Peter Grimm]

sure i did. your refusal to acknowledge it is not a refutation of the data that i posted, nor is your utterly ridiculous analogy.

So you don't understand the concept that correlation doesn't imply causation. Cool, well thanks for proving my point: education won't benefit everyone. Even if you've taken a stat class at some point, clearly nothing sank in. So therefore, why should my tax dollars go to waste providing education to people who will glean nothing from it?

 

[akrunner88]

So you don't understand the concept that correlation doesn't imply causation. Cool, well thanks for proving my point: education won't benefit everyone. Even if you've taken a stat class at some point, clearly nothing sank in. So therefore, why should my tax dollars go to waste providing education to people who will glean nothing from it?

More than anything, to piss people like you off. I support such a policy out of spite, and not for any real economic reasons. Although the benefits of higher education for more people go beyond economics.

 

[Peter Grimm]

Wake up and smell the coffee.

That's Bernie Sanders idea here, But the GOP will probably never let it happen.

Not sure how wrecking the stock market for middle class investors maximizes productivity

 

[Helix]

So you don't understand the concept that correlation doesn't imply causation. Cool, well thanks for proving my point: education won't benefit everyone. Even if you've taken a stat class at some point, clearly nothing sank in. So therefore, why should my tax dollars go to waste providing education to people who will glean nothing from it?

go back and reread my posts in the thread.

 

[Peter Grimm]

Productivity and achievement aren't the same thing at all. Productivity is about profit. Your education argument is about profit and money, too. Does education only have value because it allows people to produce more wealth? And you seem to be tying achievement to money as well. No one who isn't earning money can ever achieve anything? Really? If someone who is broke and on food stamps writes a great novel, they didn't achieve anything?

We seriously need to get over money. It's an artificial construct to facilitate trade. It's rooted in scarcity. There is less scarcity than ever before, and yet somehow we're more obsessed with money and possessions. You can't even frame a fulfilling life or accomplishments outside of accumulating wealth (or even worse, creating wealth for an already wealthy master). Money is going to become obsolete in the future, probably in the near future. We should start moving towards that instead of trying desperately to pretend that it's not coming. We'll all (almost all, except for the small subset of sociopaths whose only happiness comes from feeding their greed) live better and happier lives. Getting past materialism and greed is how you move past the cynicism that you bemoan about modern society.

I didn't say productivity was the same thing as achievement. I said that fulfillment comes from achievement. And while one can achieve many things outside material wealth, how much are those achievements worth if they are rooted in the handouts if others?

Much more respect for someone who achieves something on his own.

As for prosperity equaling greed, that's a misplaced mindset. If we didn't have a vibrant economy, people all over the world would starve.

 

[Peter Grimm]

They'd still have to pass their classes to graduate, and the people who don't care/aren't motivated would still fail those classes.

But any motivated high school student today can get a scholarship to attend.

 

[Peter Grimm]

More than anything, to piss people like you off. I support such a policy out of spite, and not for any real economic reasons. Although the benefits of higher education for more people go beyond economics.

I don't doubt that, and I don't doubt that many of your fellow progressives share that motivation of spite and destructive envy.

However, that's your baggage. I don't share it. I work hard and do the best for myself and my family. Because of that, I'm successful. I wish nothing but the same for you and yours.

I hope you can overcome your anger someday

 

[Peter Grimm]

go back and reread my posts in the thread.

There's nothing profound about what you said that requires rereading by any stretch. You posted graphs showing a correlation between individual education levels and dependence on public assistance.

I simply pointed out a mathematical fact: correlation doesn't imply causation in any way.

Poof, you're wrong. Just admit it and bow out gracefully. One of us learned something in his intro to statistics class. And I didn't require Bernie sanders to pay for it, imagine that

 

[Paschendale]

I didn't say productivity was the same thing as achievement. I said that fulfillment comes from achievement. And while one can achieve many things outside material wealth, how much are those achievements worth if they are rooted in the handouts if others?

Much more respect for someone who achieves something on his own.

As for prosperity equaling greed, that's a misplaced mindset. If we didn't have a vibrant economy, people all over the world would starve.

All of this nonsense about handouts and the myth of doing everything for oneself just shows how completely out of touch right wing propaganda is. Working together to improve things is not a handout. Everything everyone obtains comes from lots of people working very hard. Literally nothing is earned alone. Everything you're saying is rooted in money and property being supreme. You don't even seem to be able to grasp a different mindset.

 

[shrubnose]

Not sure how wrecking the stock market for middle class investors maximizes productivity

Where is maximizing productivity mentioned in the OP? Fill us in. :roll: