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Bernie Sanders Supporters Chant ‘Lock Her Up’ in Philadelphia Protest Against Clinton

Re: Bernie Sanders Supporters Chant ‘Lock Her Up’ in Philadelphia Protest Against Cli

As a US Soldier, if I mishandled classified information and placed it onto an unsecured network I could potentially face life in Prison.
Why should I vote for someone who doesn't follow the same laws I have to follow?

That is exactly correct. The conundrum is in that Trump is an even greater danger, judging by what he has said.
 
Re: Bernie Sanders Supporters Chant ‘Lock Her Up’ in Philadelphia Protest Against Cli

Comey's rationalization of his failure to indict is reducible to absurdity in that he held a recommendation for prosecution to an impossible standard nearly on par with spycraft while intent was not at all a necessary component in similar and recent cases/precedent that carried criminal penalties. Cenk's assessment is basically right on the money:
Cenk is seriously misinformed when he said Hillary's emails were "clearly marked classified" at the time they were sent. None of them were marked classified at the time they were sent or received and Comey confirmed that in his testimony to congress when he admitted the FBI only found three emails that contained "partial" markings...meaning they were improperly marked and could've been reasonably judged as not classified....


REP. MATT CARTWRIGHT: You were asked about markings on a few documents, I have the manual here, marking national classified security information. And I don’t think you were given a full chance to talk about those three documents with the little c’s on them. Were they properly documented? Were they properly marked according to the manual?

JAMES COMEY: No.

REP. MATT CARTWRIGHT: According to the manual, if you're going to classify something, there has to be a header on the document? Right?

JAMES COMEY: Correct.

REP. MATT CARTWRIGHT: So if Secretary Clinton really were an expert about what's classified and what's not classified and we're following the manual, the absence of a header would tell her immediately that those three documents were not classified. Am I correct in that?

JAMES COMEY: That would be a reasonable inference.​



It's well established in criminal law and upheld by the Supreme Court that intent is "essential" and "required" for an offense to occur and to prove guilt at trial....

Mens Rea refers to criminal intent. Moreover, it is the state of mind indicating culpability which is required by statute as an element of a crime. See, e.g. Staples v. United States, 511 US 600 (1994). Establishing the mens rea of an offender is usually necessary to prove guilt in criminal trial. In doing so, the prosecution must prove beyond reasonable doubt that the defendant committed the offense with a culpable state of mind. Justice Holmes famously illustrated the concept of intent when he said “even a dog knows the difference between being stumbled over and being kicked.”....

“Mens rea” is Latin for “guilty mind” and refers to the state of mind an accused had when committing a crime. See Black’s Law Dictionary 1134–35 (10th ed. 2014). At common law, in order to secure a conviction the prosecution was required to prove two essential elements: the actus reus (or “guilty act”) and the mens rea of the accused. See United States v. Apfelbaum, 445 U.S. 115, 131 (1980) (“In the criminal law, both a culpable mens rea and a criminal actus reus are generally required for an offense to occur.”). As the Supreme Court recently reiterated in Elonis, this concept reflects the basic principle that “wrongdoing must be conscious to be criminal” and that a defendant must be “blameworthy in mind” before he can be found guilty. 135 S. Ct. at 2009. Thus, mens rea is “the rule of, rather than the exception to, … Anglo-American criminal jurisprudence.” United States v. United States Gypsum Co., 438 U.S. 422, 436 (1978).

https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/mens_rea


No reasonable prosecutor would indict or take this case to trial.
 
Re: Bernie Sanders Supporters Chant ‘Lock Her Up’ in Philadelphia Protest Against Cli

It's well established in criminal law and upheld by the Supreme Court that intent is "essential" and "required" for an offense to occur and to prove guilt at trial....

No reasonable prosecutor would indict or take this case to trial.

Except reasonable prosecutors absolutely did both take to trial and successfully prosecute people who committed violations of security protocols without proven intent to improperly distribute classified information; hell, in that same video Cenk clearly cites the perfectly applicable precedence of Brian Nishimura who was sentenced for mishandling of classified information without the kind of intent component Comey describes: Bryan Nishimura Committed The Same Exact Crime As Hillary Clinton. He Got Two Years Probation - The Duran | 10 Times People Were Punished For FAR Less Than What Hillary Clinton Did

Even in the outside chance you actually believe that she was technically guilty of nothing illegal, this entire situation is an absolutely scathing indictment of her judgment if not her criminality (and her demonstrable lack of honesty/transparency: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvTJYkTq8BI); either way it is clearly indicative of her lack of fitness for the highest office.
 
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Re: Bernie Sanders Supporters Chant ‘Lock Her Up’ in Philadelphia Protest Against Cli

That's why it's so important for Trump to win. To restore a sense of justice to this country.
I frankly don't trust either Clinton or Trump to do that.

So I'm left considering 3rd party candidates...
 
Re: Bernie Sanders Supporters Chant ‘Lock Her Up’ in Philadelphia Protest Against Cli

But I thought that it was only those unreasonable and wacko right-wingers that were chanting for her to be locked up...

And I thought only the Republican's are the party of malcontents.
 
Re: Bernie Sanders Supporters Chant ‘Lock Her Up’ in Philadelphia Protest Against Cli

I sincerelyh hope I didn't crack mine too soon LOL

Premature ecrackulation?
 
Re: Bernie Sanders Supporters Chant ‘Lock Her Up’ in Philadelphia Protest Against Cli

She didn't have patient's private info on her server...so false analogy. No one was harmed or got hurt from her private server or emails.

Typical Hillary supporter; the end justifies the means. Nixon would have loved you.
 
Re: Bernie Sanders Supporters Chant ‘Lock Her Up’ in Philadelphia Protest Against Cli

Cenk is seriously misinformed when he said Hillary's emails were "clearly marked classified" at the time they were sent. None of them were marked classified at the time they were sent or received and Comey confirmed that in his testimony to congress when he admitted the FBI only found three emails that contained "partial" markings...meaning they were improperly marked and could've been reasonably judged as not classified....


REP. MATT CARTWRIGHT: You were asked about markings on a few documents, I have the manual here, marking national classified security information. And I don’t think you were given a full chance to talk about those three documents with the little c’s on them. Were they properly documented? Were they properly marked according to the manual?

JAMES COMEY: No.

REP. MATT CARTWRIGHT: According to the manual, if you're going to classify something, there has to be a header on the document? Right?

JAMES COMEY: Correct.

REP. MATT CARTWRIGHT: So if Secretary Clinton really were an expert about what's classified and what's not classified and we're following the manual, the absence of a header would tell her immediately that those three documents were not classified. Am I correct in that?

JAMES COMEY: That would be a reasonable inference.​



It's well established in criminal law and upheld by the Supreme Court that intent is "essential" and "required" for an offense to occur and to prove guilt at trial....

Mens Rea refers to criminal intent. Moreover, it is the state of mind indicating culpability which is required by statute as an element of a crime. See, e.g. Staples v. United States, 511 US 600 (1994). Establishing the mens rea of an offender is usually necessary to prove guilt in criminal trial. In doing so, the prosecution must prove beyond reasonable doubt that the defendant committed the offense with a culpable state of mind. Justice Holmes famously illustrated the concept of intent when he said “even a dog knows the difference between being stumbled over and being kicked.”....

“Mens rea” is Latin for “guilty mind” and refers to the state of mind an accused had when committing a crime. See Black’s Law Dictionary 1134–35 (10th ed. 2014). At common law, in order to secure a conviction the prosecution was required to prove two essential elements: the actus reus (or “guilty act”) and the mens rea of the accused. See United States v. Apfelbaum, 445 U.S. 115, 131 (1980) (“In the criminal law, both a culpable mens rea and a criminal actus reus are generally required for an offense to occur.”). As the Supreme Court recently reiterated in Elonis, this concept reflects the basic principle that “wrongdoing must be conscious to be criminal” and that a defendant must be “blameworthy in mind” before he can be found guilty. 135 S. Ct. at 2009. Thus, mens rea is “the rule of, rather than the exception to, … Anglo-American criminal jurisprudence.” United States v. United States Gypsum Co., 438 U.S. 422, 436 (1978).

https://www.law.cornell.edu/wex/mens_rea


No reasonable prosecutor would indict or take this case to trial.
Horse****. People get convicted on crimes the didn't willfully commit all the time.
 
Re: Bernie Sanders Supporters Chant ‘Lock Her Up’ in Philadelphia Protest Against Cli

Except reasonable prosecutors absolutely did both take to trial and successfully prosecute people who committed violations of security protocols without proven intent to improperly distribute classified information; hell, in that same video Cenk clearly cites the perfectly applicable precedence of Brian Nishimura who was sentenced for mishandling of classified information without the kind of intent component Comey describes: Bryan Nishimura Committed The Same Exact Crime As Hillary Clinton. He Got Two Years Probation - The Duran | 10 Times People Were Punished For FAR Less Than What Hillary Clinton Did

Even in the outside chance you actually believe that she was technically guilty of nothing illegal, this entire situation is an absolutely scathing indictment of her judgment if not her criminality (and her demonstrable lack of honesty/transparency: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IvTJYkTq8BI); either way it is clearly indicative of her lack of fitness for the highest office.

Keep in mind...an indictment isn't even a conviction. It's to say that something is worthy of being tried. Surely what Hillary Clinton did is worthy of being sent to trial.
 
Re: Bernie Sanders Supporters Chant ‘Lock Her Up’ in Philadelphia Protest Against Cli

If you have filled these types of jobs then you will have also run into the many situations where you had to babysit officers, especially the higher ranking ones, and make sure they don't try to copy down information into their personal notebook during a briefing and such. These people don't really know the regulations well because they aren't operators and they are entitled to certain access due to their position, not qualification. I'm willing to bet it's 100x worse for high level elected/appointed civilian officials. Not that I'm excusing what Hillary did, just that her being a clueless fool in this area is not surprising to me.

ignorance of the law is no excuse. a term used by many a judge and prosecutor over the years.
not meaning to break the law has never flown in a court of law or any prosecutor I have ever heard of.
 
Re: Bernie Sanders Supporters Chant ‘Lock Her Up’ in Philadelphia Protest Against Cli

Don't worry, even if this lying criminal is indicted, Obama will pardon her. Justice will not be served.

Greetings, Pumpkin Row. :2wave:

Firstly, I see you are new here, so :wcm: Glad you're here!

Obama will be thinking about his legacy and how a pardon might look on his record, IMO, especially now that he is aware of how unfavorable public opinion, from both parties BTW, is of her. I don't see how a pardon would benefit either of them at this point, but who knows? This only further proves what a weird year 2016 is turning out to be! :shock: .. :mrgreen:
 
Re: Bernie Sanders Supporters Chant ‘Lock Her Up’ in Philadelphia Protest Against Cli

Has anyone noticed that Bernie’s campaign rallies filled sports stadiums (Trumps as well) while Hillary's campaign rallies are held in half empty High School Gymnasiums? With people like Wassermann- Schultz counting the DNC primary popular votes is anyone actually 100% sure she actually won?

The rigging that went on in the Dem primary wasn't ballot stuffing (or if it were, it's unlikely to have been the leading order issue). What DWS, the DNC, and Hillary's media mouth pieces did was a much simpler form of rigging: They simply refused to cover Sanders in more than a tiny way (It's funny listening to the justify this, they'll say that they sent reporters to his speeches... They just never did anything more than write a 5th page news article or an unpromoted internet article). When the news did come up, it was usually dismissive of his positives (e.g. he's "too liberal"), and extremely on point about his negatives (e.g. "He does poor amongst minorities"). And those negatives were driven home, again and again. The handful of corporations in control of the news are the only ones with the cable news soapbox, and that soapbox influences people 45-70 quite handily. It's now a proven fact that when the DNC discussed the primary with the news, they made sure to paint Sanders in a negative light, and Clinton in a positive light. We know that MSNBC --whether they admit to it or not-- largely follow the DNC, as does CNN to a lesser degree. Given that rampant number of her supporters in the news, the fact that CNN's Chris Matthews went on live air and said "I can't stand that guy." It wasn't even a conspiracy here. If you had half of a brain and followed the news even poorly, you should have known the media was handing you a steaming pile of **** that you should have taken a closer look at before swallowing.

But even more importantly, they wouldn't discuss his policies with anything but questioning (e.g. "How are you going to pay for that?" --the question that's never asked of a Republican who wants to go to war or give tax breaks). One should never discount the role of media in an election. In this case, Sanders was beaten back by the Clinton-branch of the media.

That's why it's so important for Trump to win. To restore a sense of justice to this country.

Hahahahaha... Sorry, I can't stop laughing at that. Trump is a lying liar and exudes incompetency, who wants his far right-wing VP to run his country for him (A man who's hated in his own state for his rampant mismanagement of it). So we have a choice between a center-right moderate Republican Democrat who's a liar and possibly belongs in jail, and a far-right, incompetent, anti-libertarian baffoon who's also a rampant liar and could also be put in jail for defrauding people.

What I'm trying to say is, I think we have great picks this year.

"...To be clear, this is not to suggest that in similar circumstances a person who engaged in this activity would face no consequences."

Comey admitted that if someone else did had did this besides Hillary Clinton, they would've faced consequences. But since it's Hillary Clinton, she gets off scott-free.

Honestly it wouldn't have mattered if she was charged, because Obama would just pardon her. So it would be useless for the FBI to charge her in the first place.

This is all true, although Obama would have to have been president after she was tried.

Those sports stadiums must have been near elementary schools.

I'm sorry, was that an insult to Sanders? If so, it's hard to tell because it's such a poorly framed insult.
 
Re: Bernie Sanders Supporters Chant ‘Lock Her Up’ in Philadelphia Protest Against Cli

If you have filled these types of jobs then you will have also run into the many situations where you had to babysit officers, especially the higher ranking ones, and make sure they don't try to copy down information into their personal notebook during a briefing and such. These people don't really know the regulations well because they aren't operators and they are entitled to certain access due to their position, not qualification. I'm willing to bet it's 100x worse for high level elected/appointed civilian officials. Not that I'm excusing what Hillary did, just that her being a clueless fool in this area is not surprising to me.

I can't speak to specific situations but there have been a few careless officials in the last year that don't make the headlines. They were dealt with severely.
 
Re: Bernie Sanders Supporters Chant ‘Lock Her Up’ in Philadelphia Protest Against Cli

What's the big deal, they are just undocumented delegates! Bernophobes....

Illegal delegates is not a PC term. I guess you are right.
 
Re: Bernie Sanders Supporters Chant ‘Lock Her Up’ in Philadelphia Protest Against Cli

What makes you think they aren't right wing wacko's?

Bernie is no where near the right and therefor his supporters wouldn't be composed of right-wing wackos?
 
Re: Bernie Sanders Supporters Chant ‘Lock Her Up’ in Philadelphia Protest Against Cli

Greetings, Pumpkin Row. :2wave:

Firstly, I see you are new here, so :wcm: Glad you're here!

Obama will be thinking about his legacy and how a pardon might look on his record, IMO, especially now that he is aware of how unfavorable public opinion, from both parties BTW, is of her. I don't see how a pardon would benefit either of them at this point, but who knows? This only further proves what a weird year 2016 is turning out to be! :shock: .. :mrgreen:
Hello, nice to meet you~
I didn't see where to make introductions, so I just jumped right in.

He's employed by the Establishment, so it isn't his job to think(Not that he does much of that, anyway.) if they want Hillary as their nominee, Obama will have no choice but to comply. I think they also worked out some sort of deal, and they have nobody to fall back on. I think that if it comes down to it, he'll pardon her.
 
Re: Bernie Sanders Supporters Chant ‘Lock Her Up’ in Philadelphia Protest Against Cli

well you do have a point,but i thank she thanks she is above the state department's and it looks like she is,watch this woman's eyes when she speaks,this is one evil person.
i wonder how anyone can vote for this woman unless it is hate driving their vote,it is all about hillary,hell what does it matter,now .
good men died at the hands of this evil lying bitch.


run don run
 
Re: Bernie Sanders Supporters Chant ‘Lock Her Up’ in Philadelphia Protest Against Cli

I'm sorry, was that an insult to Sanders? If so, it's hard to tell because it's such a poorly framed insult.
I was only implying that his supporters are too young to know better~

Too young to understand that Socialism in any configuration is fragile and doomed to fail.
 
Re: Bernie Sanders Supporters Chant ‘Lock Her Up’ in Philadelphia Protest Against Cli


well not being a face book,twitter exc person,i did look it up and it is destruction and sadness,my generation would say FUBAR.

run don run
 
Re: Bernie Sanders Supporters Chant ‘Lock Her Up’ in Philadelphia Protest Against Cli

"...we cannot find a single case that would support bringing criminal charges on these facts."

Then they should have set precedent with this case.
 
Re: Bernie Sanders Supporters Chant ‘Lock Her Up’ in Philadelphia Protest Against Cli

"...To be clear, this is not to suggest that in similar circumstances a person who engaged in this activity would face no consequences."

Comey admitted that if someone else did had did this besides Hillary Clinton, they would've faced consequences. But since it's Hillary Clinton, she gets off scott-free.

Honestly it wouldn't have mattered if she was charged, because Obama would just pardon her. So it would be useless for the FBI to charge her in the first place.

I am not so sure about that.

He is more concerned with his legacy than anything else in the world.
 
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