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Bastardizing Words : "The Truth"

Logicman said:
First of all, it would be correct to say that Jesus was deity incarnated in a human body. So he is not "man" or a “son of man” in the complete species sense of the intended meaning of that scripture.

Fast forward to the Book of Daniel, which was written at a time when the “son of man” phrase had a specific and known meaning. In the context of Daniel 7:13, where one "like a son of man" comes to the Ancient of Days (Almighty God) and is given dominion and sovereign power and universal worship of the sort that God alone possesses, the significance of Jesus' "son of man" usage cannot be overstated. It is functionally equivalent to saying that the one like a son of man is rightful heir and successor to the divine throne. "Son of man" is essentially the same as "Son of God" in this context. And if the person in Daniel 7:13-14 is only someone “like” a son of man, then it certainly implies there must be some differences. Otherwise it would say something like, “A son of man” came before the Ancient of Days.”

In addition, at the time Numbers 23:19 was written, God had not yet become man (Christ), so the statement does not necessarily preclude a future incarnation

Nice try but no cigar.
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That entire post is not supported by the words in the Jewish sculptures. It's an ad hock excuse to cover up a contradiction and fatal flaw in Mainstream Christianity. It fails to take into account that 'God does not change'. "Not het bechine christ', and the 'Becoming Christ' is a change. Saying 'God has not yet become man' violates the 'God does not change'.

Fail less.
 
Dragonfly said:
In this case, it's a little different than people using the word "irregardless".

Typically around here "the truth" is used as a thinly veiled insult, attack, or condemnation. I also feel quite positive it's being done with a very specific intent.

Which of course seems like it'd be a very un-christian tactic to deliver to someone.
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You mean someone saying "the truth" sarcastically.

This usually reverses the meaning, so what they're actually saying is "the lie", or some equivalent meaning.
 
Logicman said:
Nonsense. Don't talk to me about Jewish scripture. You don't believe it yourself.
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You don't know what I believe. I notice you aren't able to counter the points made either. You have to quote mine and then build a straw man
 
RAMOSS said:
That entire post is not supported by the words in the Jewish sculptures. It's an ad hock excuse to cover up a contradiction and fatal flaw in Mainstream Christianity. It fails to take into account that 'God does not change'. "Not het bechine christ', and the 'Becoming Christ' is a change. Saying 'God has not yet become man' violates the 'God does not change'.

Fail less.
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You may wish to read the following: https://www.ourgodgivenmission.com/the-doctrine-of-immutability-knowing-the-god-that-never-changes/
 
tosca1 said:
No.
If every single person with religious faith believes theirs is "the truth", that means, they can't all be the truth. It doesn't eliminate THE TRUTH.
Just because you can't prove who's wrong, doesn't eliminate THE TRUTH, either.

It just means you can't prove it.
And we can REASONABLY ask you......................... why can't you?

There can be all sorts of reasons as to why you can't prove it.
For all we know................... the problem lies with you.
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OK, but if there are 3 (different) religions each with a single believer asserting theirs to be the true religion then at least 2 of them (possibly all 3) are not telling the truth.
 
RAMOSS said:
Why would I want to use that source? Why should I follow a raw link from someone who is too lazy to discuss it?
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Why would anyone wish to use your sources? What's there to discuss? The MESSIAH is perfect and HE remained perfect. And the MESSIAH never swayed from HIS expectations. HIS spirit never changed. I believe you are the lazy one because you are Jewish entirely as the result of some birthright. You didn't choose to be a Jew. I'm not even sure that you wish to be a Jew. My Christianity is of my own selection. Yes, I was born into a Christian; however, I am not automatically a Christian due to some fate of birth. I'm a Christian because I acted on the leading of the HOLY SPIRIT and chose to believe in the atoning work of the MESSIAH/CHRIST (same meaning different language).

i will say that JESUS told a story of the rich man and Lazarus. They apparently were both JEWISH. The rich man very likely followed all the requirements of the LAW. And Lazarus being poor followed little if any. Yet it was Lazarus who ended up in Paradise and the rich man ended up in torment. Man looks on the outward appearances but the LORD looks upon the heart. I'm very sure GOD isn't impressed with what we do. HE is impressed by a contrite heart that cries to GOD.
 
tosca1 said:
No.
If every single person with religious faith believes theirs is "the truth", that means, they can't all be the truth. It doesn't eliminate THE TRUTH.
Just because you can't prove who's wrong, doesn't eliminate THE TRUTH, either.

It just means you can't prove it.
And we can REASONABLY ask you......................... why can't you?

There can be all sorts of reasons as to why you can't prove it.
For all we know................... the problem lies with you.
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What do you mean by "religion" and what do you mean by "truth"? I just need to know where you are coming from.
 
LittleNipper said:
Why would anyone wish to use your sources? What's there to discuss? The MESSIAH is perfect and HE remained perfect. And the MESSIAH never swayed from HIS expectations. HIS spirit never changed. I believe you are the lazy one because you are Jewish entirely as the result of some birthright. You didn't choose to be a Jew. I'm not even sure that you wish to be a Jew. My Christianity is of my own selection. Yes, I was born into a Christian; however, I am not automatically a Christian due to some fate of birth. I'm a Christian because I acted on the leading of the HOLY SPIRIT and chose to believe in the atoning work of the MESSIAH/CHRIST (same meaning different language).

i will say that JESUS told a story of the rich man and Lazarus. They apparently were both JEWISH. The rich man very likely followed all the requirements of the LAW. And Lazarus being poor followed little if any. Yet it was Lazarus who ended up in Paradise and the rich man ended up in torment. Man looks on the outward appearances but the LORD looks upon the heart. I'm very sure GOD isn't impressed with what we do. HE is impressed by a contrite heart that cries to GOD.
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That sounds like religious mania to me. You taking just so stories, and pretending they are true.
 
LittleNipper said:
Why would anyone wish to use your sources? What's there to discuss? The MESSIAH is perfect and HE remained perfect. And the MESSIAH never swayed from HIS expectations. HIS spirit never changed. I believe you are the lazy one because you are Jewish entirely as the result of some birthright. You didn't choose to be a Jew. I'm not even sure that you wish to be a Jew. My Christianity is of my own selection. Yes, I was born into a Christian; however, I am not automatically a Christian due to some fate of birth. I'm a Christian because I acted on the leading of the HOLY SPIRIT and chose to believe in the atoning work of the MESSIAH/CHRIST (same meaning different language).

i will say that JESUS told a story of the rich man and Lazarus. They apparently were both JEWISH. The rich man very likely followed all the requirements of the LAW. And Lazarus being poor followed little if any. Yet it was Lazarus who ended up in Paradise and the rich man ended up in torment. Man looks on the outward appearances but the LORD looks upon the heart. I'm very sure GOD isn't impressed with what we do. HE is impressed by a contrite heart that cries to GOD.
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Have you ever studied the Qu'ran with the same amount of time and effort, and open state of mind you have studied the Bible? Are you as knowledgeable about the the teachings of Islam as you are knowledgeable with the teachings of Christianity? Be honest with your answer.
 
LittleNipper said:
Why would anyone wish to use your sources? What's there to discuss? The MESSIAH is perfect and HE remained perfect. And the MESSIAH never swayed from HIS expectations. HIS spirit never changed. I believe you are the lazy one because you are Jewish entirely as the result of some birthright. You didn't choose to be a Jew. I'm not even sure that you wish to be a Jew. My Christianity is of my own selection. Yes, I was born into a Christian; however, I am not automatically a Christian due to some fate of birth. I'm a Christian because I acted on the leading of the HOLY SPIRIT and chose to believe in the atoning work of the MESSIAH/CHRIST (same meaning different language).

i will say that JESUS told a story of the rich man and Lazarus. They apparently were both JEWISH. The rich man very likely followed all the requirements of the LAW. And Lazarus being poor followed little if any. Yet it was Lazarus who ended up in Paradise and the rich man ended up in torment. Man looks on the outward appearances but the LORD looks upon the heart. I'm very sure GOD isn't impressed with what we do. HE is impressed by a contrite heart that cries to GOD.
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There is no Messiah.
 
LittleNipper said:
What do you mean by "religion" and what do you mean by "truth"? I just need to know where you are coming from.
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I'm talking about religion in general. It doesn't even have to pertain to religion.
It is a statement of fact.

I was addressing this part of the OP:

Every single person with religious faith believes theirs is "the truth", so by definition there is no "truth" in that context.....

Dagonfly's conclusion in his OP is wrong.
No, that doesn't necessarily mean, there is no truth.


And, there's this second part of his statement:

..................because everyone can't be right, and there's no way to prove who's wrong.


to which I answered:
It just means you can't prove it.
And we can REASONABLY ask you......................... why can't you?
There can be all sorts of reasons as to why you can't prove it.
For all we know................... the problem lies with you.


Surely, he's not saying someone worshipping a tree and claiming the tree is the real god should even be considered as a possible "truth?"
What rational person would even think that?
 
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ttwtt78640 said:
OK, but if there are 3 (different) religions each with a single believer asserting theirs to be the true religion then at least 2 of them (possibly all 3) are not telling the truth.
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What are those 3 religions?
 
tosca1 said:
I was addressing this part of the OP:

Every single person with religious faith believes theirs is "the truth", so by definition there is no "truth" in that context.....

Dagonfly's conclusion in his OP is wrong.
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Reading comprehension.

Key words to the point above are something you completely missed. (not surprising at all for anyone paying attention)

Those key words would be: "in that context".

Stop trying to fail so hard.
 
Dragonfly said:
Reading comprehension.

Key words to the point above are something you completely missed. (not surprising at all for anyone paying attention)

Those key words would be: "in that context".

Stop trying to fail so hard.
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Yes............................indeed............................ in that context!

Kindly try to wrap your head around this:
All people claiming their religion to be the truth............................................... DOES NOT MEAN, THERE IS NO TRUTH!
It doesn't eliminate the truth!


Surely, you're not saying someone worshipping a tree and claiming the tree is the real god should even be considered as a possible "truth?"
Then someone says, fire burns trees - therefore Fire god is the truth! You'd consider that to be a possible truth?
Then another one says, water puts out fire! The next one says, Wind controls water! hahahahaha, sounds like an RPG elements! :ROFLMAO:
So, you conclude.....gee.....that means, there is no truth.
 
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Logician Man said:
Have you ever studied the Qu'ran with the same amount of time and effort, and open state of mind you have studied the Bible? Are you as knowledgeable about the the teachings of Islam as you are knowledgeable with the teachings of Christianity? Be honest with your answer.
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I have read portions of the Qu'ran. You may wish to read the following: https://crossexamined.org/simple-reason-quran-word-god/ Man is saved by GOD's redemption and not by works that are interior to a perfect GOD.
 
tosca1 said:
Yes............................indeed............................ in that context!

Kindly try to wrap your head around this:
All people claiming their religion to be the truth............................................... DOES NOT MEAN, THERE IS NO TRUTH!
It doesn't eliminate the truth!


Surely, you're not saying someone worshipping a tree and claiming the tree is the real god should even be considered as a possible "truth?"
Then someone says, fire burns trees - therefore Fire god is the truth! You'd consider that to be a possible truth?
Then another one says, water puts out fire! The next one says, Wind controls water! hahahahaha, sounds like an RPG elements! :ROFLMAO:
So, you conclude.....gee.....that means, there is no truth.
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No. Here's the context you're missing.
You're operating under the assumption that there actually is a "truth".
Remove that assumption (I know you won't).

In the context of religious "truth", it's possible there is no "truth". Which is why it's called faith.

The rest of your nonsense is insane and idiotic.
 
The " Truth" for each & every person is what they "Hope" awaits them after death.
The undeniable dreadful and fearful "Truth" that we all must die forces every person to hold fast to a personal "truth" they hope will be realized following their death.
Any person that says they do not have a hope for what lies beyond the darkness of the grave, is a liar, and the "Truth" is not in them.
 
Eatomus said:
The " Truth" for each & every person is what they "Hope" awaits them after death.
The undeniable dreadful and fearful "Truth" that we all must die forces every person to hold fast to a personal "truth" they hope will be realized following their death.
Any person that says they do not have a hope for what lies beyond the darkness of the grave, is a liar, and the "Truth" is not in them.
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I expect the multiple billions of years after I die will be exactly like the multiple billions of years before I was born.

What's there to fear?
 
RAMOSS said:
You don't know what I believe. I notice you aren't able to counter the points made either. You have to quote mine and then build a straw man
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I do know. You dismiss the supernatural, so the God of Judaism is lost on you. Get a new gig.
 
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