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Bacon may disappear in California as pig rules take effect

Napoleon

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The world isn't fed by local cooperative vegetable gardens, we humans consume MEAT.
People don’t get it. Cant tell you how many people I’ve met who start gardening with the motivation of sustaining their family on what they grow. I don’t rain on their parade by telling them it takes at least 17 acres per person to do that.

It’s no different for meat. It’s a nice thought for all meat to have the fancy buzzwords attached, but the reality is the acreage doesn’t exist to support that.
 

Lord of Planar

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Eggs are not bad for you.
Even BACON isn't bad for you unless you insist on having it every day, with everything, all the time.
Me, I absolutely LOVE bacon but I decided a long time ago to limit my consumption because it does not actually have all that much nutritional value, and I try to make my breakfasts the most nutritious meal of the day.
I'll never give up bacon entirely but I am not going to cry over having to limit consumption to Sunday morning treats or the occasional cheese BLT.
And again, these new substitutes are pretty durn good to this man's palate, so I am interested in some of them, the ones that are actually somewhat nutritious.
I don't eat bacon much. I have some in the fridge I bough last week. I usually eat it when I go out for breakfast, and when it comes with the breakfast, I sill get a side of it too.
 

Court Jester

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Ground beef can be substituted by ground turkey.
No it can't not in my universe. Turkey is not beef. In fact, compared to chicken, turkey is really tasteless and dry and everybody knows that. Thanksgiving was invented to sell turkey, when nobody wanted it. When do most people even bother to buy a turkey in the store to cook, other than for a holiday tradition?

"Turkey Burger" is as useless to me as ketchup on a hot dog.
 

exoplanet

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It's a free county.



What happened to "my body my choice"? Suddenly now you want to tell others how to live their lives, and which choices they are allowed to make?
I'm just saying people are getting plenty of meat and it doesn't have to keep government subsidies on it. Certainly there are economic consequences to the ethical treatment of animals and management of limited ecological resources, but that is a side effect. It's a lot like how requiring catalytic converters was not an attempt to keep people from driving cars.

What does that have to do with animal agriculture. You want to subsidize people, then get YOUR checkbook and send them some money. Or maybe some people need to make better choices in life so they are educated and trained for better jobs and not living pay check to paycheck.
Sorry, but that's not how government works. I don't get to skip paying taxes for schools just because I don't have kids. My federal taxes are used on road and bridges I will never travel, etc...

There was a time in this country when blue collar jobs paid well enough to raise a family. Hard work isn't a guarantee of decent pay and education is often a risky bet. The fact of the matter is that the competition for the few opportunities that are well paying will always leave some people out. They aren't irresponsible, they are just below average which is something we'll always have no matter how many people get MBA's or vo-tech or whatever.

This isn't about any election, it is about the lunacy of the animal rights and hand wringing environmentalists. You would seek to liberate chickens, but won't bat an eye over millions of human fetuses killed and discarded. Some "switches" are thrown the wrong way, obviously.

Civil war is coming. Which side will you be on? I believe bacon and guns will beat tofu and yoga mats.
Civil war has been the go-to for the far right for some time now. This isn't the straw that broke the camel's back. The fact that you can see it as bacon vs tofu just shows how absurd and concocted the anger is on the right. I'm sure there are plenty of older conservatives eating tofu/fake meat because of their health conditions and foodie-lefties that can't stop talking about how much they love bacon. This is high school football rivalry type thinking and you talk like you're ready to pull your guns out and shit on the constitution over it.
 

Colin Norris

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Not until America is a completely Communist state and you are eating tofu-shaped bacon.

Right now, the Marx-o-meter only has us at 2 percent Commie, and that's mostly because of our military. We're Commie in all the wrong places.

When the Marx-o-meter reads 100 percent, we give up.
Oh dear.
You're still beating the communist drum and predicting a communist horde of pillaging soldiers storming the capitol.

Hold on. They did. Only they were republicans. Oh the irony.
 

Lord of Planar

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You are overpaying
I've seen it cheaper if I go farther away, but by much enough to matter. This milk also last a long time and It takes me long enough to go through it, making the cost still not matter. I simply buy it at a grower market for $5.99 that is on my way home from work. I can get the same milk for $4.79 at Whole Foods, but unless I'm in that area or buying at least a bag of stuff from them, I'm wasting time and gas. There is cheaper milk in the same category, but I prefer the milk that comes in glass instead of plastic or waxed paper. The bottle has a $2 returnable charge on it too.
 

SkyFox76

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The chickens have a limited environment to move, but its more like a huge community cage where they still have to move some distance between their nest and where they eat, and there will be bugs for them to eat which is a necessary part of their natural diet. I'm not against this. It's just not like the legal requirements for pasture raised labeling requirements, which you will have eggs from even healthier chickens.
I've been getting fresh eggs from a lady I randomly answered one day about egg cartons and though she doesn't have many they have a nice little gig going for shelter and safe from coyotes.
 

Lord of Planar

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People don’t get it. Cant tell you how many people I’ve met who start gardening with the motivation of sustaining their family on what they grow. I don’t rain on their parade by telling them it takes at least 17 acres per person to do that.

It’s no different for meat. It’s a nice thought for all meat to have the fancy buzzwords attached, but the reality is the acreage doesn’t exist to support that.
No it doesn't. It does not take that much space for a sustainable garden. My grandparents had less than an acre for a garden on their hundred+ acre farm. Come harvest time, my grandmother would pickle and can the vegetables and put them in the earth cellar. They had year round garden food. Of course, had beef, pork, and chicken too which would be slaughtered as needed, and had a sustainable population. The farm itself was probably less than 5 acres of the hundred or more area. Most was scrub oak, that my grandfather would cut for firewood.
 

poppopfox

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I've seen it cheaper if I go farther away, but by much enough to matter. This milk also last a long time and It takes me long enough to go through it, making the cost still not matter. I simply buy it at a grower market for $5.99 that is on my way home from work. I can get the same milk for $4.79 at Whole Foods, but unless I'm in that area or buying at least a bag of stuff from them, I'm wasting time and gas. There is cheaper milk in the same category, but I prefer the milk that comes in glass instead of plastic or waxed paper. The bottle has a $2 returnable charge on it too.
Growing up in the 60's we had a dairy just down the road like yours. I believe the gallon price back then was @two dollars, deposit was a dime. We got our eggs from a chicken farmer just up the road, our potatoes and other veggies from local farmers who grew extras. Those days are gone around here. Happy to here they still exist elsewhere.
 

notquiteright

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California with it's liberal wacky laws and regulations is causing people across the entire nation to pay more for food, which is already sky high. California did it with eggs. Largest producer and consumer, and then it caused out of state producers to need to comply with California standards in those other states, or ranchers could not sell in California. Driving prices up for everyone, especially the working poor. Sacramento is a CANCER on the entire nation and the entire country. Sacramento negatively affects more American lives than Moscow ever did. If China ever sends a nuke our way, I pray it is at Sacramento. To hell with California messing with our bacon. This may cause a civil war.
Time to tuck the MAGA manhood stick back in, there will no civil war.... :rolleyes:

California is 10th in laying hens, The top 3 producers market a third of the total number of eggs produced. Major chicken egg producers are hyping their 'free range' products and chicken still seems like quite a bargain compared to the price of beef. The USDA claims many producers are transitioning to the free range and cage less facilities.

After the big hype and scare of 2015-16 when prices hit over $3.00 a dozen, the spot market price is half that for large and medium eggs, Jumbo comes in under $2.00 a dozen. more scare tactics to try and create backlash over improved bird health... :unsure:

I gut my deer every year- prefer the processor to vacuum pack the meat. The smell of guts spilling out, the miasma, is VERY distinct. One that can make the most ardent hunter puke. That however pales when compared to modern commercial feedlots. The stench coming off cow crap of thousands of head crowded into restrictive lots- they are there to fatten up so movement is discouraged. Hog finishing (fattening) lots are worse.

For all the MAGA ranting about who China should nuke first, the reality is vastly different... imagine that... ✌️
 

Lord of Planar

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I would like to add that the whole milk I buy is from the Northwest in Washington. They use purebred Jersey cows, which produce milk with the highest fat and protein content of all dairy cows.

 

Court Jester

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After the big hype and scare of 2015-16 when prices hit over $3.00 a dozen, the spot market price is half that for large and medium eggs, Jumbo comes in under $2.00 a dozen. more scare tactics to try and create backlash over improved bird health... :unsure:
Well wait for it. Washington and Oregon are on track for their new laws banning all caged poultry eggs and going full free range. Exempting growers with less than 3,000 hens. But you don't think that affect national prices? They do the same thing, demand other states comply with their standard or no dice.

Commiefornia is nuts. Just look at gas prices compared to the rest of the country, and God forbid oil companies try to build any new refineries in California just to meat California's high demand.

I would hope we could get some Federal relief from the damn left coast crazy. Higher everything prices so the liberal elites can virtue signal that they are "more evolved".
 

Lord of Planar

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Commiefornia is nuts. Just look at gas prices compared to the rest of the country, and God forbid oil companies try to build any new refineries in California just to meat California's high demand.
Our gas prices ar among the highest in the nation due to state tax, city tax, and transportation distance. Add a few cents a gallon because we also do not allow self service. I think Oregon had a reasonable higher gas tax even before we were Californicated.

$0.183 Federal
$0.360 State of Oregon
$0.100 City of Portland

$0.543 Total gas tax.
 

MTAtech

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Anyone in their sixties or seventies who visited

a dairy farm
a pig farm
a chicken farm

in the old days and who has seen one in the last ten years or so can tell you that the difference is nothing short of astounding.
I enjoy meat way too much to ever become a total vegetarian however a recent visit about eight years ago definitely inspired me to eat LESS meat.
I was frankly pretty horrified at what I saw, but more importantly, I got the heebie jeebies because the operations looked downright unsanitary and disgusting...
It had nothing to do with libtardism, or PETA or anything else, I was just disgusted, that's all.

So from where I sit, the way we raise meat animals is flat out unsustainable and if fixing some of the more dangerous issues makes meat more expensive, oh well.
Farmers and ranchers can develop smarter and better methods or they can do nothing as ideas like "lab grown meat" become a reality.
And I'll try that lab grown meat too, by the way.
I am not afraid.
You are right. My parents took me to see a dairy with cows as a child. I wouldn't drink milk for a year. The conditions were astoundingly filthy. No wonder the regs require pasteurization.
 

MTAtech

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Our gas prices ar among the highest in the nation due to state tax, city tax, and transportation distance. Add a few cents a gallon because we also do not allow self service. I think Oregon had a reasonable higher gas tax even before we were Californicated.
On the other hand, gas taxes pay for roads and are a good way to encourage car owners to buy more efficient vehicles.
 

notquiteright

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Well wait for it. Washington and Oregon are on track for their new laws banning all caged poultry eggs and going full free range. Exempting growers with less than 3,000 hens. But you don't think that affect national prices? They do the same thing, demand other states comply with their standard or no dice. Commiefornia is nuts. Just look at gas prices compared to the rest of the country, and God forbid oil companies try to build any new refineries in California just to meat California's high demand. I would hope we could get some Federal relief from the damn left coast crazy. Higher everything prices so the liberal elites can virtue signal that they are "more evolved".
I'm getting to the point in my life I've lost count of the 'wait for its' the Rabid Right insists will happen... :rolleyes:

Coffee was going to skyrocket because cocaine production is taking over the coffee plantations. Livestock feed will be more expensive because of Bio-Fuels. Electricity will cost 100 times more because Obama 'forced' coal plants to shut down..... :cautious:

You may have visited a farm or two but you have missed the vast changes in agriculture. Farmers bitch about everything. However progress has been breath taking. Free range is all the rage, grass fed beef on damn near every grocery shelf across the nation. (Grass fed beef are you freaking kidding me??? what real American will skip the heavy marbling- steers fed carbs to the point they have fat INSIDE their major muscle groups)

Grumpy old guys and those who channel their inner grump don't seem to get it, more and more 'regular' suburban folks want healthier choices- healthy foods, it isn't just you the 'liberal elites' and the prices are not going to force starvation on 'the poor'. Medical costs are far more likely.

I'll wager a MAGA hat California won't need any new refineries, they will go green and start lowering their demand for gas. First nukes from China and now Feds coming to your rescue, sounds like a typical MAGA old man shaking his fist at the clouds... ✌️
 

Scrabaholic

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