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Bacon may disappear in California as pig rules take effect

OrphanSlug

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It is only a matter of time before California liberals do to food what they have done with water, complete mismanagement and irresponsible regulation.
 

JANFU

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Liberals are trying to turn us into . . . tofu-eating vegetarians! a Trump supporter joked, but the next Trump supporter didn't get the joke, and a conspiracy was born.

Wait. Was that me? Did I just do it?
It really does seem like half the current conservative "movement" is a circle jerk that sounds an awful lot like this. Facebook fueled CT of stupid proportions.
 

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Why is it unsustainable? What has changed? They die and we eat them. We don't need to worry about they live, or how they feel, we are going to eat them, they aren't pets.
Completely disgusting and portrays humans as lower than other animals.

The animals we force into captivity for our use should be treated humanely. Animals in the wild dont live in filth, trapped, limited in movements, and deliberately/negligently caused pain. In the wild, they make it thru the day...dealing with flies, danger, aggression, etc but if they die, they die. They dont suffer for hours or days or months.

As humans we have the capacity to ensure they dont suffer under our stewardship, under our care, just because we're going to eventually 'use' them. Even the most 'savage of beasts' arent that depraved.
 

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California with it's liberal wacky laws and regulations is causing people across the entire nation to pay more for food, which is already sky high. California did it with eggs. Largest producer and consumer, and then it caused out of state producers to need to comply with California standards in those other states, or ranchers could not sell in California. Driving prices up for everyone, especially the working poor.

Sacramento is a CANCER on the entire nation and the entire country. Sacramento negatively affects more American lives than Moscow ever did. If China ever sends a nuke our way, I pray it is at Sacramento.
The amount of meat Americans eat is insane. Far more poor people suffer from diabetes an other problems related to over-consumption than those that suffer from hunger. We need address the fact that people can work forty hours and still be poor instead of giving them subsidized, unsustainable meat.

To hell with California messing with our bacon. This may cause a civil war.
LOL. Stop pretending you even need a reason. The second conservatives lose an election, they're ready to throw our democracy in a dumpster. The Constitution only matters when it serves your interests.
 

Court Jester

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Completely disgusting and portrays humans as lower than other animals.

You opinion, I don't care what you feel about it, animals which are raised to be consumed, it doesn't matter, they aren't pets, they aren't endangered species. They are protein. And they are humanly treated for what they are... a food commodity.


The animals we force into captivity for our use should be treated humanely. Animals in the wild dont live in filth, trapped, limited in movements, and deliberately/negligently caused pain. In the wild, they make it thru the day...dealing with flies, danger, aggression, etc but if they die, they die. They dont suffer for hours or days or months.

You are naive about the wonderful VIOLENCE of nature. It is a beautiful thing, a necessary thing. To watch a bear tearing the limbs off a living deer to eat may not be pretty to you, but it is nature. Animal life is just one giant food chain, it isn't a Disney movie. But agrigulture is not simply the wild nature, but it is necessary, and it is legal, and it is moral. We raise animals to feed people.

As humans we have the capacity to ensure they dont suffer under our stewardship, under our care, just because we're going to eventually 'use' them. Even the most 'savage of beasts' arent that depraved.

Sure, we all go back to just hunting and gathering, and spend all of time and energy just not starving to death. But then we wouldn't have time for internet or TV, or going to yoga class.

Here is a video. The animal rights terrorists are the exact types you are encouraging. They aren't about "humane treatment", they are about stopping all animal agriculture, they believe animals are on a equal level as humans. They believe "meat is murder". They are crazy... INSANE people. Mostly white, all liberal, and CRAZY.

 

Court Jester

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The amount of meat Americans eat is insane.

It's a free county.

Far more poor people suffer from diabetes an other problems related to over-consumption than those that suffer from hunger.

What happened to "my body my choice"? Suddenly now you want to tell others how to live their lives, and which choices they are allowed to make?

We need address the fact that people can work forty hours and still be poor instead of giving them subsidized, unsustainable meat.

What does that have to do with animal agriculture. You want to subsidize people, then get YOUR checkbook and send them some money. Or maybe some people need to make better choices in life so they are educated and trained for better jobs and not living pay check to paycheck.
LOL. Stop pretending you even need a reason. The second conservatives lose an election, they're ready to throw our democracy in a dumpster. The Constitution only matters when it serves your interests.

This isn't about any election, it is about the lunacy of the animal rights and hand wringing environmentalists. You would seek to liberate chickens, but won't bat an eye over millions of human fetuses killed and discarded. Some "switches" are thrown the wrong way, obviously.

Civil war is coming. Which side will you be on? I believe bacon and guns will beat tofu and yoga mats.
 

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Completely disgusting and portrays humans as lower than other animals.

The animals we force into captivity for our use should be treated humanely. Animals in the wild dont live in filth, trapped, limited in movements, and deliberately/negligently caused pain. In the wild, they make it thru the day...dealing with flies, danger, aggression, etc but if they die, they die. They dont suffer for hours or days or months.

As humans we have the capacity to ensure they dont suffer under our stewardship, under our care, just because we're going to eventually 'use' them. Even the most 'savage of beasts' arent that depraved.

Are you the least bit surprised at his comment? I'm not.
 

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You opinion, I don't care what you feel about it, animals which are raised to be consumed, it doesn't matter, they aren't pets, they aren't endangered species. They are protein. And they are humanly treated for what they are... a food commodity.




You are naive about the wonderful VIOLENCE of nature. It is a beautiful thing, a necessary thing. To watch a bear tearing the limbs off a living deer to eat may not be pretty to you, but it is nature. Animal life is just one giant food chain, it isn't a Disney movie. But agrigulture is not simply the wild nature, but it is necessary, and it is legal, and it is moral. We raise animals to feed people.



Sure, we all go back to just hunting and gathering, and spend all of time and energy just not starving to death. But then we wouldn't have time for internet or TV, or going to yoga class.

Here is a video. The animal rights terrorists are the exact types you are encouraging. They aren't about "humane treatment", they are about stopping all animal agriculture, they believe animals are on a equal level as humans. They believe "meat is murder". They are crazy... INSANE people. Mostly white, all liberal, and CRAZY.



TL:dr If you imply I said we shouldnt raise animals for consumption, you dont read very well.

Here it is again and it's just for reinforcement...YOUR opinion was already clear.

Your post was:
Completely disgusting and portrays humans as lower than other animals.​
The animals we force into captivity for our use should be treated humanely. Animals in the wild dont live in filth, trapped, limited in movements, and deliberately/negligently caused pain. In the wild, they make it thru the day...dealing with flies, danger, aggression, etc but if they die, they die. They dont suffer for hours or days or months.​
As humans we have the capacity to ensure they dont suffer under our stewardship, under our care, just because we're going to eventually 'use' them. Even the most 'savage of beasts' arent that depraved.
 

Lursa

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Court Jester

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Are you the least bit surprised at his comment? I'm not.

These are the people you support. BTW, why do these animal/eco terrorists only attack white owned businesses? Even they are at least smart enough to avoid a Black owned restaurant or farm. Now that would be fun to see. Some bat shity crazy White eco terrorists trying to shut down Black owned BBQ place.

 

Court Jester

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No, not at all. Depravity doesnt even exist in other animals.

Animals ARE NOT moral agents. Is this news to you?
 

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Animals ARE NOT moral agents. Is this news to you?
Thank you! And humans are...and as such, many easily display depravity...towards other animals and even their own kind.

If you are using not being 'moral agents' as an excuse for justifying cruelty and depravity...er, to deny pain and suffering in anything is the start of that slide downward from any moral High Ground.
 

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These are the people you support. BTW, why do these animal/eco terrorists only attack white owned businesses? Even they are at least smart enough to avoid a Black owned restaurant or farm. Now that would be fun to see. Some bat shity crazy White eco terrorists trying to shut down Black owned BBQ place.



I'd ask you to show that I support those people (no I'm not giving the video a view hit) but I already know you've got nothing.
 

Court Jester

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Thank you! And humans are...and as such, many easily display depravity...towards other animals and even their own kind.
We have laws against cruelty to animals, and I already mentioned protecting endangered species. But ranchers are not weirdos putting pet kittens into microwave ovens for sport. They are producing an animal product for LEGAL and MORAL consumption. We are all well aware that means animals will die, and animials will be kept in captivity, and some animals will end up diseased or injured in the process, but that is the nature of farming and ranching.

The world isn't fed by local cooperative vegetable gardens, we humans consume MEAT.

If you are using not being 'moral agents' as an excuse for justifying cruelty and depravity...er, to deny pain and suffering in anything is the start of that slide downward from any moral High Ground.

"Depravity" is a term which describes the human condition of being in rebellion against one who has created this wonderful nature we are part of. It does not define anyone who hunts, fishes, traps, or farms animals.
 

Lursa

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We have laws against cruelty to animals, and I already mentioned protecting endangered species. But ranchers are not weirdos putting pet kittens into microwave ovens for sport. They are producing an animal product for LEGAL and MORAL consumption. We are all well aware that means animals will die, and animials will be kept in captivity, and some animals will end up diseased or injured in the process, but that is the nature of farming and ranching.

The world isn't fed by local cooperative vegetable gardens, we humans consume MEAT.



"Depravity" is a term which describes the human condition of being in rebellion against one who has created this wonderful nature we are part of. It does not define anyone who hunts, fishes, traps, or farms animals.
TL;dr You made yourself very clear.

Why is it unsustainable? What has changed? They die and we eat them. We don't need to worry about they live, or how they feel, we are going to eat them, they aren't pets.

Quote is completely disgusting and portrays humans as lower than other animals.​
The animals we force into captivity for our use should be treated humanely. Animals in the wild dont live in filth, trapped, limited in movements, and deliberately/negligently caused pain. In the wild, they make it thru the day...dealing with flies, danger, aggression, etc but if they die, they die. They dont suffer for hours or days or months.​
As humans we have the capacity to ensure they dont suffer under our stewardship, under our care, just because we're going to eventually 'use' them. Even the most 'savage of beasts' arent that depraved.

I dont care if you object to my opinion. Is it really worth your time to try and justify your post? It's not to me.
 
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Lord of Planar

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So animal rights should be contingent on the choices consumers make? For example, a lot of people either adopt their dogs from an animal shelter or buy from a reputable breeder. However, plenty of dogs are sold from pet stores that usually get their dogs from puppy mills where the breeding dogs often spend their entire lives in small cages. Should we continue to allow puppy mills and just wait for consumers to all finally be responsible in their purchases?

When people are removed from the ultimate consequences of their choice, they often don't make responsible choices. You see a package of meat in a grocery store, the meat looks the same regardless of whether it came from a small farm that treats livestock humanely or a factory farm that doesn't and most consumers act accordingly. Similarly, when people see a cute puppy in a pet store, they often don't think about the living conditions of the puppy's parents. Ultimately, people often have to be told what to do in order to make better choices.
I don't know enough about these so called animal mills, but so few people are willing to have other than a puppy or kitten. I got both my cats from friends. Consumers should have a choice, but when the animals are in such poor conditions that corporate farms use, that is just wrong. The worse of the choices should be shut down. I imagine the chicken farms in Arkansas are really bad conditions as well. How in hell can they ship packed meat all the way to Oregon and be so much cheaper than Oregon Chicken meat, without having too many crammed into the space they have.
 

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Ground beef can be substituted by ground turkey. A slab of steak, well, that's different.
I wonder what the meat efficiency difference if of food, space, and water requirements between different livestock is? Anyone know? Turkey isn't necessarily more efficient without actually quantifying such numbers.
 

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There's a tiny Mexican owned butcher shop about four miles down the street from us on Studebaker Rd. in Downey.
It is literally a hole in the wall operation, and the owners aren't buying any private planes or luxury yachts just yet.
But El Chymal might just be the most ethical, clean and best run butcher shop I've ever seen, and I know how they raise and process their meats because they are one of the only shops that handles almost the entire process themselves, from raising the cattle on their own ranch to the countertop where they grind the meat and package it themselves.
And every single step of their operation is visible in the hundreds of photos plastered on their wall, to video clips they play on the two ancient flat panel screens they have running all day long.

These guys are extremely proud of everything they do, they take great pride in every step of their process. Their beef never sees the inside of some anonymous slaughterhouse and meatpacking plant, it's all in house, one hundred percent, and they want their customers to know as much as possible about the meat that they consume.
Once you've paid attention to what goes on in the big corporate meatpacking operations, you will understand why small local butcher shops are more important now than ever.
Such people need to be supported.
 

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One thing which is almost impossible to avoid when buying meat from large corporate owned operations is the use of carbon monoxide in the packaging phase of the process.
Carbon monoxide is introduced in what's called "modified atmosphere packaging" and CO is used in order to maintain a "fresh pink color" on meats which historically have had a shorter shelf life.
This controversial process may mask meat spoilage, and that's just downright dangerous, another reason why small local butcher shops are important, and also another reason why certain disruptive markets like plant based meat substitutes and lab grown meat deserve a chance.

I can think of no reason why carbon monoxide packaging is good for the consumer, and yet it is legal to use this process in the USA.
It's just that small local shops don't do it.
I believe it also has to be labeled if such a process is used. I occasionally see such labeling here in Oregon.
 

Lord of Planar

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Yep. It's one of those cases where what people imagine the word to mean isn't what the standard prescribe.
The chickens have a limited environment to move, but its more like a huge community cage where they still have to move some distance between their nest and where they eat, and there will be bugs for them to eat which is a necessary part of their natural diet. I'm not against this. It's just not like the legal requirements for pasture raised labeling requirements, which you will have eggs from even healthier chickens.
 

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Lord of Planar

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The "how" they're made plays a role here too, and hard boiled doesn't make the popularity cut. Scrambled eggs are the popular choice, which are often prepared with milk and oil/butter added in the process.
I use olive oil and just a tablespoon of whole milk. It doesn't take much milk to make them better, and too much milk makes them worse.
 
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