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do you want to be able to make your religion into law?
What I find particularly bizarre is the attempt of many atheists to try and frame all people, who have some belief or room for doubt, to be either an extreme believer (dogmatic) or the other, as complete non believer.
Sigh. Listed are numerous beliefs of atheists:
belief 1: there is no god(s) - nothing to believe in
belief 2:religion should be stricken from government
belief 3: the universe was randomly created by Mother Nature.
belief 4: man is the only cause of global warming (not sure why this belief is held by a majority of atheists).
maybe because of belief 5: atheists are heavily influenced by secular authority figures?
Maybe you guys aren't the 'lone wolves' you profess to be?
There are more beliefs, but I only needed to list more than one...
More than 1 belief. A system of beliefs. An ideology. Very similar to religion.
That is the difference. The religious create the "God" figure in their lives, maintain it, and support it for the benefit of religious leaders. The atheist do not create such a "God" like meaning, nothing to maintain, let alone support.
Sigh. Listed are numerous beliefs of atheists:
belief 1: there is no god(s) - nothing to believe in
belief 2:religion should be stricken from government
belief 3: the universe was randomly created by Mother Nature.
belief 4: man is the only cause of global warming (not sure why this belief is held by a majority of atheists).
maybe because of belief 5: atheists are heavily influenced by secular authority figures?
Maybe you guys aren't the 'lone wolves' you profess to be?
There are more beliefs, but I only needed to list more than one...
More than 1 belief. A system of beliefs. An ideology. Very similar to religion.
Belief 1. Yes.
Belief 2. Nope. That's a person in favor of secular government, which any religious person could be as well.
Belief 3. Mother Nature isn't a thing so no atheist actually believes that. Random isn't actually a thing either in terms of how the universe was created. Spontaneous is a word that could be used, but Random doesn't have anything to do with it. And not all atheists would agree on how the universe was created nor do all atheists care about the origins of the universe.
Belief 4. That has nothing to do with atheism. You can be an atheist and a climate change denier too.
Belief 5. You mean SCIENTISTS?! Smart people who discover things about the world we live in and create things? Why wouldn't anyone revere them? At least anyone who doesn't hold a religion that demands that they ignore obvious truths.
Lets maybe ask the American Atheist Society which is a secular non profit group to define atheism, since I think group should be able to define themselves as a religion if they so choose.
What is Atheism? | American Atheists
"What Is Atheism?
No one asks this question enough.
The reason no one asks this question a lot is because most people have preconceived ideas and notions about what an Atheist is and is not. Where these preconceived ideas come from varies, but they tend to evolve from theistic influences or other sources.
Atheism is usually defined incorrectly as a belief system. Atheism is not a disbelief in gods or a denial of gods; it is a lack of belief in gods. Older dictionaries define atheism as "a belief that there is no God." Some dictionaries even go so far as to define Atheism as "wickedness," "sinfulness," and other derogatory adjectives. Clearly, theistic influence taints dictionaries. People cannot trust these dictionaries to define atheism. The fact that dictionaries define Atheism as "there is no God" betrays the (mono)theistic influence. Without the (mono)theistic influence, the definition would at least read "there are no gods."
Why should atheists allow theists to define who atheists are? Do other minorities allow the majority to define their character, views, and opinions? No, they do not. So why does everyone expect atheists to lie down and accept the definition placed upon them by the world’s theists? Atheists will define themselves.
Atheism is not a belief system nor is it a religion. While there are some religions that are atheistic (certain sects of Buddhism, for example), that does not mean that atheism is a religion. Two commonly used retorts to the nonsense that atheism is a religion are: 1) If atheism is a religion then bald is a hair color, and 2) If atheism is a religion then health is a disease. A new one introduced in 2012 by Bill Maher is, "If atheism is a religion, then abstinence is a sexual position."
The only common thread that ties all atheists together is a lack of belief in gods and supernatural beings. Some of the best debates we have ever had have been with fellow atheists. This is because atheists do not have a common belief system, sacred scripture or atheist Pope. This means atheists often disagree on many issues and ideas. Atheists come in a variety of shapes, colors, beliefs, convictions, and backgrounds. We are as unique as our fingerprints."
YOU CAN'T PUT US IN YOUR BOX.
Well from what I have seen here, atheists want to side step the fact they have beliefs.
Anything that is not a incontrovertible fact, is a belief. Any moral judgments on any level glaringly fall into this category and atheists make as many moral judgments in their daily lives as anyone else, including their 'belief' god does not exist, the mountain of semantics notwithstanding.
Well from what I have seen here, atheists want to side step the fact they have beliefs.
Anything that is not a incontrovertible fact, is a belief. Any moral judgments on any level glaringly fall into this category and atheists make as many moral judgments in their daily lives as anyone else, including their 'belief' god does not exist, the mountain of semantics notwithstanding.
Sigh. Listed are numerous beliefs of atheists:
belief 1: there is no god(s) - nothing to believe in
belief 2:religion should be stricken from government
belief 3: the universe was randomly created by Mother Nature.
belief 4: man is the only cause of global warming (not sure why this belief is held by a majority of atheists).
maybe because of belief 5: atheists are heavily influenced by secular authority figures?
Maybe you guys aren't the 'lone wolves' you profess to be?
There are more beliefs, but I only needed to list more than one...
More than 1 belief. A system of beliefs. An ideology. Very similar to religion.
"Atheism is usually defined incorrectly as a belief system. Atheism is not a disbelief in gods or a denial of gods; it is a lack of belief in gods."
What is Atheism? | American Atheists
Please let us atheists define ourselves and stop trying to redefine the english language to make yourself feel better.
Complete claptrap. Atheism applies only to number 1.
Anything that is not a incontrovertible fact, is a belief. Any moral judgments on any level glaringly fall into this category and atheists make as many moral judgments in their daily lives as anyone else, including their 'belief' god does not exist, the mountain of semantics notwithstanding.
he added nothing to believe in which is impossible for any living human that is not a brain dead vegetable to accomplish
This, right here, is the biggest problem presented by the religious mindset. It seeks to equate every opinion or conclusion with every other. KJ here is asserting that his ignorance is as good as another's knowledge. An unfounded belief is in no way equal to a reasoned conclusion, even if it is not "incontrovertible", because nothing truly is. The belief that the world is six thousand years old is by no means equal to the knowledge and conclusion that it is four and a half billion years old.
This is why religion poses a threat to modern society and to progress. It seeks to diminish the importance of knowledge and learning. New information should never be subordinate to age old belief. And we should never be so foolish as to think that they are the same.
So you're saying his definition of atheism is wrong? Take that up with him, I was pointing out the more obvious flaws in his post, not just semantics.
Well from what I have seen here, atheists want to side step the fact they have beliefs.
Anything that is not a incontrovertible fact, is a belief. Any moral judgments on any level glaringly fall into this category and atheists make as many moral judgments in their daily lives as anyone else, including their 'belief' god does not exist, the mountain of semantics notwithstanding.
There is no active belief to being an atheist, whereas there is always an active belief to being religious.
Th So you come in as a Scientologist and are essentially claiming that beliefs in anything but 'science' somehow will destroy society. I beg to differ.
oh yes there is.
being an atheist isnt something that is inherent.
It requires one of the semantics to be true: lack of belief, denial, disbelief, belief there is no god.
No knowledge or never thought about it is completely another story and these people are not atheists.
Its a conscious decision set.
I have already in the first couple pages shown that in fact atheists do have a belief system, when asking an atheist questions, their responses fit the recipe.
what you said are all semantics and can be also stated as: "atheists believe there is no god".
above is identical and exactly same as lack of belief, denial, and disbelief.
You do not need to profess a god to have a belief, so your definition is lacking in accuracy.
I said this is wrong:
nothing to believe in
in fact it is an impossible condition for any conscious human
It's not a matter of facts - we're talking opinions here.30 pages and still zero facts that make atheism in general is a religion lol
does anybody have any . . . or even ONE
According to posts I've read, atheism is a personal choice and choices are based on definitive evidence.Complete claptrap. Atheism applies only to number 1.
Belief 2 is secularism. Many atheists are secularism, but being atheist doesn't make you secularist.
Belief 3 is often implied by the lack of belief in god, but many atheists believe the universe could have been caused by an advanced alien race, or it is a computer simulation.
Belief 4 atheism has zero to do with climate change
Belief 5 football fans are heavily influenced by football players. Chess players are heavily influenced by other chess players. Chefs by other chefs, etc etc etc. Nothing to do with religion.
You might want to look into a little thing called 'correlation does not imply causation' as you fall into that trap 4 separate times in your post.
According to posts I've read, atheism is a personal choice and choices are based on definitive evidence.
(1) Describe evidence that precludes the existence of gods.
(2) Name an atheist who believes religion should be a part of government.
(3) In your rebuttal, you listed an alien race and a computer simulation as examples of other plausibilities for 'creators' of the universe, but how could an atheist believe these? Aliens should be considered an example of gods. Computer simulations, even 'self sustaining' computer simulations, should be considered created by ...gods.
(4) I see a correlation, here. Even though a preponderance of self proclaimed atheists believe global warming is created by man, there's no proof it is a defining belief of an atheist. I take it off the table.
[/QUOTE](5) belief in secular authority. Or do atheists believe in religious authority?
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