At the time the 2cd Amendment was written

[Chillfolks]

so no one dies of heroin overdoses?

That's diffrent it doesn't fit their narrative so you can't bring it up.

 

[TurtleDude]

Personally, I feel that perhaps we wouldn't have as many mass shootings if people didn't reproduce like flies and roaches. Even a few studies have shown that crowding humans rises violence. Seems like quite a few of us insist on having more children than what they can afford. Also, I'm sick and tired of driving behind a mass of humanity, plus I'm tired of paying for others inconsideration..

There is some merit in your position. There have been numerous studies that claim that single parent households are the single greatest determinative as to whether a child ends up in prison.

 

[TurtleDude]

That's diffrent it doesn't fit their narrative so you can't bring it up.

even if guns are banned, there are 400 million and many will last for over a decade (the 45 colt my grandfather carried in France 104 years ago, still works fine). Plus, there will be millions being bought by the military, the police etc. There is no legitimate market for heroin. Heroin has to be constantly made for junkies to use it, and no one is issued heroin by the government. Yet heroin is killing far more Americans than AR 15s or other "assault weapons"

 

[Exquisitor]

So much wrong headed authoritarian bullshit here. I wouldn't vote for you for manure spreader even though you are obviously imminently qualified.

I'm not trying to be authoritarian, unless I'm joking, I just believe that you got to treat a gun like a gun.

As for bullshit, my in-cognizance is getting to be like a manure spreader, what am I going to do?

Sorry, that's just my nutrient grind?

Thank's for the reality check.

Whatever it is I said is two things, art, and my monkey typing at random.

 

[Exquisitor]

Personally, I feel that perhaps we wouldn't have as many mass shootings if people didn't reproduce like flies and roaches. Even a few studies have shown that crowding humans rises violence. Seems like quite a few of us insist on having more children than what they can afford. Also, I'm sick and tired of driving behind a mass of humanity, plus I'm tired of paying for others inconsideration..

I'm tired of paying for welfare babies and people declined to maximize abortion and opposed to Federal Funding.

 

[Glitch]

He was probably a ninja, much deadlier than some rando American, anyway.

The biggest mass murders in the US also did not involve firearms. Besides the 09/11/2001 attacks that killed 2,977 and wounded 25,000+ others, there was the Oklahoma City attack in 1995 that killed 168 and wounded 680 others.

If the goal is to kill as many people as quickly as possible, then a firearm or even multiple firearms is not the best choice.

 

[OpportunityCost]

I'm not trying to be authoritarian, unless I'm joking, I just believe that you got to treat a gun like a gun.

As for bullshit, my in-cognizance is getting to be like a manure spreader, what am I going to do?

Sorry, that's just my nutrient grind?

Thank's for the reality check.

Whatever it is I said is two things, art, and my monkey typing at random.

Its easy to see your authoritarian bent because you call it "your" militia, you have to pack the court to get there, and you have to redefine a right you know is individual so it isn't any longer. Freedom isn't neat and orderly, no matter how much you want it to be.

 

[Crossfire]

The biggest mass murders in the US also did not involve firearms. Besides the 09/11/2001 attacks that killed 2,977 and wounded 25,000+ others, there was the Oklahoma City attack in 1995 that killed 168 and wounded 680 others.

If the goal is to kill as many people as quickly as possible, then a firearm or even multiple firearms is not the best choice.

Please refer to post #45.

 

[Glitch]

Please refer to post #45.

So your point is that we should just ignore your posts because you can never be serious. Got it. Consider yourself ignored.

 

[Crossfire]

So your point is that we should just ignore your posts because you can never be serious. Got it. Consider yourself ignored.

Yes, of course, that is the rational takeaway from my post. You should absolutely not take each post as individual posts; instead, you should get really defensive and use one post to justify your overreaction. It is any wonder why leftists have taken over this forum.

 

[apdst]

Do you even have a sense of humor, or are you always in some defensive posture waiting to combat some viewpoint that may be viewed as opposing you, politically?

I apologize if I missed the sarcasm.

 

[Crossfire]

I apologize if I missed the sarcasm.

Not a problem. We just need to let go every now and then, take a joke, make a joke. Everyone is so tense around here, you could not squeeze a greased BB up their butts. The toxic tribalism is making this place unenjoyable. This is not a battlefield, it is an internet forum. We do not have to be at each others' throats all the time.

 

[Torus34]

Everyone had a muzzle loading musket. An expert infantry man could fire 4 balls in a minute, if it was smooth bore. The accuracy sucked. A shot every 15 seconds sounds kind of high, but that's what the internet says.


At the shootings in Vegas where 50+ victims were shot dead and at Orlando, in that gay bar, where 50+ victims were shot dead, how different would be the outcome if the shooters were using muzzleloaders?

Stripping this down to the basics, the question is; would the casualty count in large mass killings be less if guns with large-capacity magazines were not available?

The answer's an obvious 'Yes'.

The problem for the US, though, is that the horse is already out of the barn. The country has large numbers of these firearms floating around. We can perhaps content ourselves with the knowledge that such mass murders form but a very small part of the annual death toll from firearms. It's not much of a consolation for those families affected.

Regards, stay safe 'n well. Remember the Big 3: masks, hand washing and physical distancing.

 

[TurtleDude]

Stripping this down to the basics, the question is; would the casualty count in large mass killings be less if guns with large-capacity magazines were not available?

The answer's an obvious 'Yes'.

The problem for the US, though, is that the horse is already out of the barn. The country has large numbers of these firearms floating around. We can perhaps content ourselves with the knowledge that such mass murders form but a very small part of the annual death toll from firearms. It's not much of a consolation for those families affected.

Regards, stay safe 'n well. Remember the Big 3: masks, hand washing and physical distancing.

you are only speculating about normal capacity magazines. There are so many variables, your prediction is without merit. But you are correct in the sense that there are millions upon millions of normal capacity magazines in circulation.

A killer who is not being subject to return fire or countermeasures, such as Lanza at SandyHook, would've killed just as many no matter what size magazines he had.

 

[Torus34]

you are only speculating about normal capacity magazines. There are so many variables, your prediction is without merit. But you are correct in the sense that there are millions upon millions of normal capacity magazines in circulation.

A killer who is not being subject to return fire or countermeasures, such as Lanza at SandyHook, [sic] would've killed just as many no matter what size magazines he had.

Hi!

No speculation needed. The data are available. In mass killings where 10 or more people were killed, a check of the weapons used will tell the tale. What can you provide as data to remove your last sentence from the realm of speculation?

Regards, stay safe 'n well. Remember the Big 3: masks, hand washing and physical distancing.

 

[American]

Everyone had a muzzle loading musket. An expert infantry man could fire 4 balls in a minute, if it was smooth bore. The accuracy sucked. A shot every 15 seconds sounds kind of high, but that's what the internet says.


At the shootings in Vegas where 50+ victims were shot dead and at Orlando, in that gay bar, where 50+ victims were shot dead, how different would be the outcome if the shooters were using muzzleloaders?

Actually there were multi-shot weapons under development. This sort of technology was not completely unknown to the Founders. Nevertheless your argument is specious, and lacks any relevance to the argument regarding the natural right of self-defense, and the limits against power over that right expressly stated in the US Constitution.

 

[American]

I'm pretty sure gay bars didn't exist at the time the Second Amendment was written.

Maybe more LGBTQWXYZ members should carry.

 

[TurtleDude]

Hi!

No speculation needed. The data are available. In mass killings where 10 or more people were killed, a check of the weapons used will tell the tale. What can you provide as data to remove your last sentence from the realm of speculation?

Regards, stay safe 'n well. Remember the Big 3: masks, hand washing and physical distancing.

Such as Virginia Tech? Luby's of Texas? the Fort Hood Shootings?

Let me explain the obvious

Because Lanza used a normal capacity magazine for most of the killings of unarmed helpless small children you ASSUME that there would have been less deaths if Lanza only had 10 round reduced capacity magazines. That is pure speculation on your part.

 

[Torus34]

Such as Virginia Tech? Luby's of Texas? the Fort Hood Shootings?

Let me explain the obvious

Because Lanza used a normal capacity magazine for most of the killings of unarmed helpless small children you ASSUME that there would have been less deaths if Lanza only had 10 round reduced capacity magazines. That is pure speculation on your part.

Can you spell 'cherry picking?'

Regards, and the best to you and yours. I'll not respond further to this thread.

 

[TurtleDude]

Can you spell 'cherry picking?'

Regards, and the best to you and yours. I'll not respond further to this thread.

you don't have to respond and thanks for the kind closing, but others might want further edification

lets suppose there are several mass murders where the killers drove heavy pick up trucks into people at 70 MPH. So the powers that be decide to limit pickup trucks to 60 MPH and they must weigh 500 pounds lighter than the ones that were used in a few killings.

Now, I would note that a lighter trucking 60 MPH driven into a group of 4 or 5 people, will kill them as surely as the heavier truck. And that is not cherry picking because I know a great deal about firearms and how easy it is to reload an AR 15 when you are not facing return fire or opponents who can cause you harm. Several terrified 6-7 year old kids are not going to be able to prevent an active shooter from reloading. And when it comes to Paddock, he was barricaded in a sniper's perch with a DOZEN rifles

You may have stopped responding, but can any of those who want magazine bans and ACTUALLY BELIEVE such a ban will cut down on mass murders, name a mass murder where a magazine limit would have both cut down on the deaths and WOULD HAVE PREVENTED THE KILLER from having normal capacity magazines?

 

[TurtleDude]

Maybe more LGBTQWXYZ members should carry.

YZ: yellow Zebras?

seriously, I am a big advocate of gays and lesbians carrying. Our range has periodic ladies only training sessions and we get a fair number of lesbian couples coming to learn and practice.

 

[Waddy]

No, you're hypothetical.

If his guns were illegal, he would not have been able to obtain them.

Also, you're doing nothing illegal until you start shooting, with illegal guns you're walking around while breaking the law and may become visible to the law and identified.

People intent on mass killing will find a way to mass kill. Ever hear of Tim McVay? And in countries that have actually made guns hard to come by, bombing is the favored alternative, or even poison gas. Ever hear of the IRA or Sarin gas in subways? They might even hijack planes and crash them into skyscrapers or the Pentagon. Those guys were only armed with box knives. Get real; we can't even keep drugs out of maximum security prisons. Think of the black market you would create if you banned firearms. Then you sure couldn't track them.

If you really want to do something, get prosecutors to quit plea bargaining away gun charges.

 

[VanceMack]

At the time the first Amendment was written free speech involved in k and quill and public speaking on boxes in town squares. Typeset was hand placed in printer presses. So obviously thats what the protections written then guarantee today.

The OP mindset is childish. The 2nd Amendment was not written to protect the peoples right to carry a musket. It was written to protect the peoples right to secure the free nation and preserve the Constitution from all enemies, foreign and domestic. Technology has changed...the threat has changed, so to have the types of weapons, but again...the 2nd Amendment says nothing about hunting, it says nothing about self defense, and it says nothing about muskets. The 2nd preserves the right of Americans to keep and bear firearms in defense of the free state and it limits the powers of the federal government to restrict those rights.

 

[VanceMack]

I wouldn't make owning any gun illegal, I would only regulate your ability to buy one and you could keep all the guns you already have.

Assuming you could pass regulation, to what end? Do you think having a firearm registered prevents mass shootings? Do you know that Connecticut registers guns and that the weapons involved in the Sandy Hook shooting were registered firearms, legally purchased?

 

[Exquisitor]

Assuming you could pass regulation, to what end? Do you think having a firearm registered prevents mass shootings? Do you know that Connecticut registers guns and that the weapons involved in the Sandy Hook shooting were registered firearms, legally purchased?

I don't want to register anyone's firearm.

The idea is to train and educate the Militia to recognize mental health problems in themselves and others.

The mass shooter thinks, "I have right, to own gun, to shoot my neighbor."

The student with his gun buyer's card thinks, "I have privilege and right that I have earned through hard work and could easily loose."

It's a different resonant vortex.

The student goes to his gun in schitzophrenic rage and there his his gun licence and training telling him to turn in his guns.

It won't stop them all, no, and you can always find the hypothetical case, but such regulation would have a big impact.

It doesn't matter the end, to some, the means are more important.

To the end of a well trained and regulated Militia.