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Arnold Schwarzenegger invokes his Nazi father in emotional message to Russia

We agree on Blair then too.

Why am I " on the wrong side" exactly ?

Because you’re making excuses and deflecting on a situation which is very clear cut. The Ukraine are a democracy who’s only “crime” is wanting to join the EU and NATO like many other countries including countries they share a border with.
The fact that the Russian government are imprisoning opposition voices in their own country to the war should be a red flag for you. Instead you’ve decided to push propaganda that the Kremlin have created.
I mean they destroyed a building yesterday which had the words “Children” written clearly outside it. Thousands of civilians dead, millions have fled and Russia continue to pound their cities.
Again it’s pretty clear cut and being reported by almost the entire globe not just Western Main stream media.
 
He condemned the US mob attack that threatened people on Capitol Hill but never condemned the mob attack on the democratically elected government of Yanuvovych that actually over threw the government and led to 7 years of vicious civil war in Ukriane itself.

He played the Zelensky jew card so as to try to hide from his audience the influence of the neo Nazis in Ukrainian affairs. Recall when Zelensky tried to float the idea of a vote in the Donbas the right wing marched on his offices and let him know that this wasn't going to happen.

Nothing too about eastward NATO expansion being a real dange/threat to the Russian people themselves.

I'm sure there might have been I picked up on in what was a propaganda piece itself.

So while I support all efforts to bring this war to an end, rejecting only the hawks for obvious reasons I have already stated , I wish it could have been a tad more honest. That said, if it was it wouldn't have been so obviously western propaganda.

I'm sure this won't be the last of these types of influencer addresses to push the western narrative that leaves its role out of the commentary altogether

Jus leave the forum for a while and try to educate yourself.
 
I agree with you. Instead of NATO disbanding after the ending of the USSR , like the Warsaw Pact disbanded, it has become the preferred force to accompany US hegemonic foreign policy. The people of Ukraine have been and continue to be used as pawns in the poking of the bear. Sickening that this isn't understood at all by most people here
And it's a good thing too. We need a strong defensive alliance in Europe to counter Russian aggression.
 
Because you’re making excuses and deflecting on a situation which is very clear cut. The Ukraine are a democracy who’s only “crime” is wanting to join the EU and NATO like many other countries including countries they share a border with.
The fact that the Russian government are imprisoning opposition voices in their own country to the war should be a red flag for you. Instead you’ve decided to push propaganda that the Kremlin have created.
I mean they destroyed a building yesterday which had the words “Children” written clearly outside it. Thousands of civilians dead, millions have fled and Russia continue to pound their cities.
Again it’s pretty clear cut and being reported by almost the entire globe not just Western Main stream media.

Understanding why this situation is the way it is isn't imo " making excuses and deflecting on a situation that is clear cut". That actually tells me that you are the victim of your own propaganda system. Shall I go through this a little more? My guess is you haven't the openness of mind toi undertsand that you can take positions on this that are a whole lot less contradictory than what is being passed off here as the infomed view, the non propagandized view and it's simply false.

Ukraine should be allowed to make its own decisions, even though I would question its credentials as a democracy since 2014 when the democratically elected government was ousted in a US backed coup.

In the real world this isn't how things play out, it's not a judgement call , it's just a fact. An easy example

Nicaragua overthrows its dictatorial leader Somoza and is rewarded with a proxy war that destroys the country prosecuted by the US. Who is screaming about Nicaraguan rights to self rule/enjoy sovereignty? Nobody.

There is a war going on in Yemen that has caused nearly 400,000 deaths and is made possible by NATO member states assistance/weapons sales to Saudi Arabia. Not a word. Do you think it's because they are brown and Ukrainians are white? Or that we are the ones selling them cluster munitions etc? Or both?

So on sovereignty, in the real world, it is a case of the powerful do what they like and the weak suffer what they must as a result. Again not a judgement but an acceptance of the reality.

What you people do, all the time btw, is that you mistake reality fact based posting as support for the crimes of Putin when it's not. Your resort to citing a school hit or the death of a pregnant woman as if this only happened in Ukraine and not in the places I mention above. I hate all wars but I don't see the coverage of our wars against people of colour/weaker nations being propagandized like Ukraine has been.

That Russian troops have committed crimes and that the war itself is illegal is noot even being disputed but to write off any inconvenient truthes to the preferred narrative as " Kremlin propaganda " is weak, lazy and inaccurate. That's what you people do and that's why it is yourself that is on the wrong side.
 
And it's a good thing too. We need a strong defensive alliance in Europe to counter Russian aggression.

I don't know how you can seriously parrot that tripe.

NATO forces have been killing people in illegal actions in Iraq, Libya, Syria, Afghanistan , Serbia , etc etc and NATO has become the armed wing of US foreign policy.
 
I don't know how you can seriously parrot that tripe.

NATO forces have been killing people in illegal actions in Iraq, Libya, Syria, Afghanistan , Serbia , etc etc and NATO has become the armed wing of US foreign policy.
It's still clearly needed to protect European countries from Russian aggression. The past 4 weeks prove it.
 
It's still clearly needed to protect European countries from Russian aggression. The past 4 weeks prove it.

The way you just ignore the examples I gave of outright NATO members illegality and war criminality is just breathtaking. No NATO " aggression" there, no?
 
The way you just ignore the examples I gave of outright NATO members illegality and war criminality is just breathtaking. No NATO " aggression" there, no?
I ignored them because they are irrelevant. I never argued that NATO is perfect or that is has never been an aggressor.

NATO is necessary to protect European countries from Russian aggression. This is a statement of fact.
 
I'm sure this won't be the last of these types of influencer addresses to push the western narrative that leaves its role out of the commentary altogether

Biden whitehouse trotting out Teenage TikTok stars too -- because they know anything about economics?
Hell no -- they're just blindly parroting what they've been fed:

 
Biden whitehouse trotting out Teenage TikTok stars too -- because they know anything about economics?
Hell no -- they're just blindly parroting what they've been fed:


Are you "Emperor Shetty?" Or just one of his 900 subscribers?
 
I agree with you -- Arnold himself is too far removed from the events leading up to this war, to properly understand what's been going on.

US-sponsored coup in Ukraine in 2014, and the incorporation of radical elements into Ukraine's military, as well as indiscriminate killing of civilians in Donbass.

Ukraine has become a cauldron for a tug-of-war between rival powers.

Neo-Con Deep Staters like Victoria Nuland, who helped to bring about the illegal invasion of Iraq, have snuck between Republican and Democrat administrations, continually pushing their own agendas for destabilization, including supporting regime change in Ukraine that was only going to build up political pressures in Russia.

I think Nuland and others have likely done this because of the strong backlash against them from European officials over their Iraq invasion. They realized they can't re-shape the Middle East unless they can first bring the Europeans to heel. And the way to do this is through the strength of NATO and revival of Cold War animosities in Europe. This will have unintentional consequences for Asia, where the US had been trying to pivot to in order to contain the power of rising China. Ironically, China's rise was abetted by Cold Warriors like Nixon & Kissinger who made overtures to it in order to contain the Soviet Union through new pressure on its eastern border.

I don't think Ah-nold sees any of this, or has the foreign policy understanding to do so. Likewise, I don't think a lot of the US Congress have the background to see it either.

There will be consequences -- just as there were consequences for the United States from its support of jihadists in Afghanistan.


Honest question.
Do you get paid for this nonsense or do you push this Russian propaganda for free.
 
I don't know how you can seriously parrot that tripe.

NATO forces have been killing people in illegal actions in Iraq, Libya, Syria, Afghanistan , Serbia , etc etc and NATO has become the armed wing of US foreign policy.

Whataboutism, 1 each

"Off topic, please desist from engaging in off topic discussions and read the subforum rules about strict adherence to the stated subject thx"
 
Honest question.
Do you get paid for this nonsense or do you push this Russian propaganda for free.

The problem is that you're so mentally lazy that you're not able to see the deeper reality on this whole situation.

Neo-Con deliberately overthrew pro-Kremlin govt in 2014, knowing that this would stir a hornet's nest. She deliberately supported a Far Right govt to replace it, knowing they'd adopt a hardline policy of going after Russians, which would lead to wider war.

I remember posting back in 2014 about what Nuland had done. You talk like some Johnny-Come-Lately who's only just learned where Ukraine is on a map.
 
The problem is that you're so mentally lazy that you're not able to see the deeper reality on this whole situation.

Neo-Con deliberately overthrew pro-Kremlin govt in 2014, knowing that this would stir a hornet's nest. She deliberately supported a Far Right govt to replace it, knowing they'd adopt a hardline policy of going after Russians, which would lead to wider war.

I remember posting back in 2014 about what Nuland had done. You talk like some Johnny-Come-Lately who's only just learned where Ukraine is on a map.

The people of Ukraine deposed a Putin puppet.
 
More presidential than Biden.

I disagreed with Schwarzenegger during his time as CA Governor (he supported the death penalty) - but he seems to have come around lately by going green and by vigorously opposing Trump(ism) and Hitler-Putin.
He made a great presentation because he’s an actor.

Biden was being presidential by uniting NATO and getting nearly every country in the world to side with Ukraine. He even was successful at getting the Swiss, who were neutral in WWII, to take a side.

Mostly, he was masterful at getting arms together, which usually takes months, on planes to the Ukraine in days or a week.
 
I don't even care that he'd vote in opposition to some policy changes I'd be in favor of, I don't care that he is a conservative, I don't even care that he's not a natural born citizen.
If Arnold ran for POTUS, as a Democrat, I might be persuaded to vote for him. He's a good and decent man, with the heart of an American, even if he's a transplant.
Arnold isn’t eligible to be POTUS. He’s not a native born American.
 
He might as well have said, "Ukraine, I have your back." He's a decent guy.
 
🤣

Godwin called.

So you're saying Svoboda are not pro-Nazi, and that their slogan "Ukraine Above All Others" is in no way an emulation of "Deutschland Uber Alles" coined by the Reich?
You can directly see them celebrating Stepan Bandera -- who led the OUN which participated in the Nazi Holocaust by massacring thousands of ordinary innocent Jews and Poles


One quarter of all Holocaust victims lived on the territory that now forms Ukraine, yet the Holocaust there has not received due attention. This book delineates the participation of the Organization of Ukrainian Nationalists (OUN) and its armed force, the Ukrainian Insurgent Army (Ukrainska povstanska armiia―UPA), in the destruction of the Jewish population of Ukraine under German occupation in 1941–44. The extent of OUN’s and UPA’s culpability in the Holocaust has been a controversial issue in Ukraine and within the Ukrainian diaspora as well as in Jewish communities and Israel. Occasionally, the controversy has broken into the press of North America, the EU, and Israel.

Triangulating sources from Jewish survivors, Soviet investigations, German documentation, documents produced by OUN itself, and memoirs of OUN activists, it has been possible to establish that: OUN militias were key actors in the anti-Jewish violence of summer 1941; OUN recruited for and infiltrated police formations that provided indispensable manpower for the Germans' mobile killing units; and in 1943, thousands of these policemen deserted from German service to join the OUN-led nationalist insurgency, during which UPA killed Jews who had managed to survive the major liquidations of 1942.


Ukrainian nationalists have outlawed any accounts of history that accurately mention their participation in the extermination of Jews

 
So you're saying Svoboda are not pro-Nazi, and that their slogan "Ukraine Above All Others" is in no way an emulation of "Deutschland Uber Alles" coined by the Reich?
You can directly see them celebrating Stepan Bandera -- who led the OUN which participated in the Nazi Holocaust by massacring thousands of ordinary innocent Jews and Poles


Ukrainian nationalists have outlawed any accounts of history that accurately mention their participation in the extermination of Jews


I sad nothing of the sort.

I am saying the laser like focus on a tiny slice of Ukraine in order to demonize the whole of Ukraine screams Godwin.

Svoboda has a membership of 15,000 (out of 41,167,336) and holds one whole seat (out of 450) in the Verkhovna Rada.
 
I sad nothing of the sort.

I am saying the laser like focus on a tiny slice of Ukraine in order to demonize the whole of Ukraine screams Godwin.

No, the fact is that Ukrainian fascists carried out violence at the Maidan, which basically amounted to a Capitol Insurrection to overthrow a legitimately elected govt.


Svoboda has a membership of 15,000 (out of 41,167,336) and holds one whole seat (out of 450) in the Verkhovna Rada.

What about the Poroshenko govt and its Far Right members? How nice of you to whitewash.

How come legitimate examination of the Holocaust and the historical atrocities committed in Ukraine in WW2 are officially outlawed from mentioning culpability of any Ukrainians?
Do you support this law?

Do you support the Victor Yuschenko's declaration Stepan Bandera a "Hero of Ukraine"?


If the Nazism only commands a tiny fraction of support, then why have there been efforts devoted to catering to their views?

 
No, the fact is that Ukrainian fascists carried out violence at the Maidan, which basically amounted to a Capitol Insurrection to overthrow a legitimately elected govt.

Yes. Some did. Others were regular Ukrainians who wanted the Putin puppet out.

What about the Poroshenko govt and its Far Right members? How nice of you to whitewash.

Whitewash what?

It was YOU that brought up Svoboda.

How come legitimate examination of the Holocaust and the historical atrocities committed in Ukraine in WW2 are officially outlawed from mentioning culpability of any Ukrainians?
Do you support this law?

Nope.

Do you support the Victor Yuschenko's declaration Stepan Bandera a "Hero of Ukraine"?

I don't like seeing any Nazi collaborators lionized.

If the Nazism only commands a tiny fraction of support, then why have there been efforts devoted to catering to their views?



What do the numbers show?
 
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