Are we Now sliding down that Slippery Slope?

[tecoyah]

If this becomes a standard practice within our society, We have lost a big chunk of what makes us free...and I fear it will be an indication of things to come. What do you all think of this situation, and in particular, those of you who have supported Guantanamo.

"White House Proposal Would Expand Authority of Military Courts
August 2, 2006



A draft Bush administration plan for special military courts seeks to expand the reach and authority of such "commissions" to include trials, for the first time, of people who are not members of al-Qaeda or the Taliban and are not directly involved in acts of international terrorism, according to officials familiar with the proposal.

The plan, which would replace a military trial system ruled illegal by the Supreme Court in June, would also allow the secretary of defense to add crimes at will to those under the military court's jurisdiction. The two provisions would be likely to put more individuals than previously expected before military juries, officials and independent experts said.

The draft proposed legislation, set to be discussed at two Senate hearings today, is controversial inside and outside the administration because defendants would be denied many protections guaranteed by the civilian and traditional military criminal justice systems. "

http://www.civilrights.org/issues/cj/details.cfm?id=45974

 

[tecoyah]

I am honestly perplexed at the lack of interest in this story....and hope it is not indicative of the nature of our political system right now. While I realize there is virtually no chance this will move beyond the senate, the simple fact it is even under consideration strikes fear into my soul.

 

[Patrickt]

I just read this thread to see which slippery slope you were discussing. There are so many.

I am concerned but for me it isn't an issue for the "Bush adminstration" any more than the preceding ones. Did it strike fear in your heart when the military was used at Waco? Did it strike fear in your heart when the police officers in the Rodney King case were put on trial twice for the same criminal act? Did it strike fear in your heart when the courts started allowing secret testimoney that neither the defendant nor his attorney were allowed to hear? Did it strike fear in your heart when the federal government started assuming jurisdiction over crimes that had always been the jurisdiction of the states? Did it strike fear when witness refusing to provide evidence or lying to police officers became a crime? Did it strike fear in your heart when the federal government said the man who was hired to kill Randy Weaver and accidentally killed his wife had total immunity to prosecution because he was working, under contract, to the federal government? Or, for that matter, did it strike fear in your heart when you learned that President Roosevelt had interned the Japanese-Americans?

No, I think the "now" in your post is pointless.

 

[tecoyah]

Individual cases of abuse, cause me concern, Government attempts at blanket removal of constitutional rights cause me fear. In answer to your opinion of my fears....yes it did cause me some concern when Waco went down, but the Rodney King issue held far too many Political/Racial, undertones to be taken as a serious threat to constitutional rights.

The rest of your post seems rather irrelevant to the topic, when taken in context, with the exception of Roosevelt, and I was far to young to understand the implications of his actions, let alone form an opinion of the politics underlying his actions. While I well understand your post was a sarcastic Jab....it fails to address the implications pointed out in my post, IE: the move towards a form of Martial Law should American Citizens lose the ability to be represented, and recieve a trial when accused of wrong doing. If your post was meant to give this attempt a green light...so be it, just remember it may some day be you, and yours that are held without charge.

 

[Patrickt]

The specific incidents I mentioned all involved what you say you're afraid of. One of the problems at Waco was the use of military in a civilian matter, with Rodney King it was the elimination of the right to avoid double jeopardy, with Ruby Ridge it was government employees killing the wrong person and the state not even having the right to take the killer to trial. Making all the violations federal simply moves any control farther from the people. And, for me, prosecuting people who commit no crime other than lying to the police, not under oath, is part and parcel of the whole thing.

I see what's happening now as merely a continuation of what's been going on for decades. Thinking it started with President Bush and will end in two years when he leaves office is a mistake. The issue isn't this president or that president or even this party or that party. The problem is Washington.

 

[Voidwar]

Hate to be a downer, but I can tell you when the slide ends . . .

Our rights as citizens will slowly be whittled away, until an American Citizen blows a cop away for enforcing an unconstitutional law, and his fellow American Citizens back him up and call it a good shooting.

Like a police roadblock, where they stop every car regardless of cause.

Every kid who ever took civics knows that this is illegal search and seizure, but until we have fellow Americans who will support our right to blow away those cops who violate our rights, the rights will slowly wither away.

 

[Alastor]

It's not a lack of interest. Judging by the votes (nine to nothing) I'd say we're all in agreement so far, and there's very little to argue about.

I don't think any sentient human being would like the broad wording of the proposal nor the use of military courts in such a vague and reaching manner.

 

[nogoodname]

It's not a lack of interest. Judging by the votes (nine to nothing) I'd say we're all in agreement so far, and there's very little to argue about.

I don't think any sentient human being would like the broad wording of the proposal nor the use of military courts in such a vague and reaching manner.

10 to nothing know