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Arab guilty of rape after consensual sex with Jew

danarhea

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A Palestinian man has been convicted of rape after having consensual sex with a woman who had believed him to be a fellow Jew.


Sabbar Kashur, 30, was sentenced to 18 months in prison on Monday after the court ruled that he was guilty of rape by deception. According to the complaint filed by the woman with the Jerusalem district court, the two met in downtown Jerusalem in September 2008 where Kashur, an Arab from East Jerusalem, introduced himself as a Jewish bachelor seeking a serious relationship. The two then had consensual sex in a nearby building before Kashur left.
This issue is a sticky one. Is the conviction proper, or was the Arab man wrongfully convicted of rape? Personally, I believe no criminal charges should have been filed, but there is definitely a civil suit here for misrepresentation.

What would it be like in America if Rape by Deception was a crime? Just think of all those guys at McDonald's, who tell women that they are scientists or corporate executives, that would be in prison right now. That could be at least 20% of everybody who posts on the internet. LOL.

Seriously, though, what do you think?

Article is here.
 
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Middleground

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Wow... a man deceiving a woman in order to get her in the sack??? Call Ripley's Believe It or Not, that has got to be a first! :roll::roll::doh
 

Frozengale

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OMG! SOMEONE LIED ABOUT THEMSELVES! IT'S THE END OF THE WORLD!
Isn't this basically just a sex-con? I mean how can that even be considered Rape? By definition rape is a non consensual thing, she consented under false premises, but it's still consent.

EDIT- I think Rape by deception would be more along the lines of blackmailing someone into having sex with you.
 

MaggieD

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This issue is a sticky one. Is the conviction proper, or was the Arab man wrongfully convicted of rape? Personally, I believe no criminal charges should have been filed, but there is definitely a civil suit here for misrepresentation.

What would it be like in America if Rape by Deception was a crime? Just think of all those guys at McDonald's, who tell women that they are scientists or corporate executives, that would be in prison right now. That could be at least 20% of everybody who posts on the internet. LOL.

Seriously, though, what do you think?

Article is here.
I can't even understand why you would call it a sticky issue. It was consensual sex. Enough said. I will never understand this culture or religion. It is so archiac as to be mind-boggling. If these people want to be respected in the world and have a place on the world stage, they've got to look into themselves and begin slowly changing these ridiculous practices.

If this kind of law were allowed in the US, our prisons couldn't even hold the offenders. "I'm single." "I'm divorced." "I'm a doctor." And, yes, some Christians would say they were Jews. Parish the thought.

By the way, is this woman, an Arab, in any danger of being stoned to death because she had sex before marriage?
 

danarhea

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I can't even understand why you would call it a sticky issue. It was consensual sex. Enough said. I will never understand this culture or religion. It is so archiac as to be mind-boggling. If these people want to be respected in the world and have a place on the world stage, they've got to look into themselves and begin slowly changing these ridiculous practices.

If this kind of law were allowed in the US, our prisons couldn't even hold the offenders. "I'm single." "I'm divorced." "I'm a doctor." And, yes, some Christians would say they were Jews. Parish the thought.

By the way, is this woman, an Arab, in any danger of being stoned to death because she had sex before marriage?
True, they might say "I'm Catholic" too. :mrgreen:
 

d0gbreath

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I can't even understand why you would call it a sticky issue. It was consensual sex. Enough said. I will never understand this culture or religion. It is so archiac as to be mind-boggling. If these people want to be respected in the world and have a place on the world stage, they've got to look into themselves and begin slowly changing these ridiculous practices.

If this kind of law were allowed in the US, our prisons couldn't even hold the offenders. "I'm single." "I'm divorced." "I'm a doctor." And, yes, some Christians would say they were Jews. Parish the thought.

By the way, is this woman, an Arab, in any danger of being stoned to death because she had sex before marriage?
Arab man, Jewish woman.
 

Aunt Spiker

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Rape by deception is actually a crime - somewhere (like in one state) in the US . . . I remember a debate about it from *years* ago.
I think it had to do with a woman who was really a genetic man lying about her gender-change.
 

MaggieD

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O!M!G!
California and Tennessee already have "rape by fraud" legislation. If the law passes here, a common concern is that the legislation's vague language regarding deception will result in women who have been seduced by men posing as someone else or claiming to be unmarried filing rape charges.
Massachusetts considering it as well. Rape 'by Deception' May Become A Crime In Massachusetts - CBS News

Guys, a whole bunch a'you are in a whoooole bunch a'trouble.
 

soccerboy22

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Ikari

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I don't know. I kinda understand the premise behind it; yet each party involved made choices and nothing was forced. I mean, history is riddled with men who have lied in order to get some booty. The dude's a jerk for lying, and the girl is dumb for believing the lie and hooking up in that manner. But was it actually a crime? I don't really think so.
 

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Well, when you consider that (I think) it's against the law to lie about the STDs you have to your partner, this makes a bit more sense. Granted, it's a very different situation, but some of the same logic applies.
 

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Seriously, though, what do you think?
I find the sentence just laughable.
How many females and males have lied or bent the truth to get someone in the sack?
If it was not forced, it is not rape. He should face no charges.
 

Dav

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I find the sentence just laughable.
How many females and males have lied or bent the truth to get someone in the sack?
If it was not forced, it is not rape. He should face no charges.
But what if it was STD status that was being lied about?
 

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But what if it was STD status that was being lied about?
There is a world of difference between sentencing someone to death by knowingly passing on a deadly disease and just having a fool around, later regretting it and claim rape.
 

Middleground

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But what if it was STD status that was being lied about?
Well that is an interesting point.

I can't say I know the law, but I'd presume that it would be up to the party to ask for a doctor's certificate if they wanted to know for absolute sure. I have known couples who agreed to get tested before becoming intimate. Takes some of the romance away, I guess, but it's 100% safe.

I do know that if one has knowledge that the are HIV positive, they must inform any potential partner before intercourse or face charges. At least here in Canada.
 

Hatuey

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.... I demand that everyone on dating sites be arrested RIGHT now. Except for e-Harmony. Their commercials are cute.
 

digsbe

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I guess it depends on what you mean by "consent." Is it more important that she consented to having sex with the man? Or is it more important that she consented to having sex with the Arab man claiming to be Jewish? Personally I think the man should be jailed. Obviously she would have changed her mind if the man wasn't a Jew. She consented to having sex with the "Jewish" man, not the lying Arab guy. I think it's a violation of women's rights and abuse to allow people to lie and seduce others into having sex.
 

Hatuey

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I guess it depends on what you mean by "consent." Is it more important that she consented to having sex with the man? Or is it more important that she consented to having sex with the Arab man claiming to be Jewish? Personally I think the man should be jailed. Obviously she would have changed her mind if the man wasn't a Jew. She consented to having sex with the "Jewish" man, not the lying Arab guy. I think it's a violation of women's rights and abuse to allow people to lie and seduce others into having sex.
Would you be saying the same thing if it was a Jewish man being put to prison because of a Muslim woman? Doubt it. Something tells me you'd be here telling us how backwards Islam is.
 
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digsbe

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Would you be saying the same thing if it was a Jewish man being put to prison because of a Muslim woman? Doubt it.
Actually I would be. Why make false judgement? Would you be ok with some woman saying she was a porn star, an atheist, and an expert at sex only to find out after having sex with her that "he" is a trans-gendered male to female, and is a Scientologist who works in their religion's offices?
 

Hatuey

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Actually I would be. Why make false judgement? Would you be ok with some woman saying she was a porn star, an atheist, and an expert at sex only to find out after having sex with her that "he" is a trans-gendered male to female, and is a Scientologist who works in their religion's offices?
It doesn't matter if it's okay or not. It's not illegal to dupe someone into having sex. THUS consensual sexual relations.
 

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Would you be saying the same thing if it was a Jewish man being put to prison because of a Muslim woman? Doubt it. Something tells me you'd be here telling us how backwards Islam is.
But the "Islam is backwards" stereotype relates to the stereotype that Muslims don't protect women enough. Since this is basically the opposite problem, where the woman is possibly being over-protected, I don't think any prejudice is relatable here.
 

Hatuey

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But the "Islam is backwards" stereotype relates to the stereotype that Muslims don't protect women enough. Since this is basically the opposite problem, where the woman is possibly being over-protected, I don't think any prejudice is relatable here.
Yes, the overprotection of women is not a stereotype.
 

digsbe

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It doesn't matter if it's okay or not. It's not illegal to dupe someone into having sex. THUS consensual sexual relations.
Evidently it's illegal in Israel to do this. And as Maggie said there are anti "rape by fraud" legislations in TN, CA, and possibly MA. I am arguing that it should be illegal to lie in order to get sex.
 
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