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AP Source: Volkswagen reaches $14.7B emissions settlement

So you want the government to give them a pass after deceiving them for profit?

They should have given them a pass beforehand. Second the "deception" is minor. To be honest the remedy for the vehicles causes a lot more damage than not doing anything if there is any damage from not doing anything.
 
I hope this means we won't have to see those pieces of crap on the roads anymore.
 
yes, a heavily regulated communist country is a paradise for libertarians? Why? Because of some incorrect assumption that EPA regulations are anti-libertarian ideology.

Get a clue.

I'm pretty sure that these VW's are road legal in China, They have pretty much zero environmental regulations. Hell you're free to dump raw sewage in a swimming pool. Burn tires, anything, Perfect.
 
Volkswagen should not have defrauded it's customers to begin with.

They probably should not have. Also, there really shouldn't be a problem with the engine they made and how it runs. But the government says it's bad, so the consumer has to have the exact same engine, but have it run like crap.
 
I'm pretty sure that these VW's are road legal in China, They have pretty much zero environmental regulations. Hell you're free to dump raw sewage in a swimming pool. Burn tires, anything, Perfect.

Dumb argument built on a false premise.

Environmental regulations are not innately anti-libertarian.
 
I removed my cat from my car and put on a race pipe, if I blip it just right it will shoot flames!... Why, more powa!
 
They probably should not have. Also, there really shouldn't be a problem with the engine they made and how it runs. But the government says it's bad, so the consumer has to have the exact same engine, but have it run like crap.

Yes, the consumer has to stop spitting out pollutants into my neighborhood. Damn you, government.
 
They should have given them a pass beforehand. Second the "deception" is minor. To be honest the remedy for the vehicles causes a lot more damage than not doing anything if there is any damage from not doing anything.

So would you be okay with Sony designing a super fast computer that lied about its power consumption to the point that it broke laws because it possibly caused fires? Would you then allow the people that bought it to continue using their fire hazard computers simply because "SUPER POWA"?
 
So would you be okay with Sony designing a super fast computer that lied about its power consumption to the point that it broke laws because it possibly caused fires? Would you then allow the people that bought it to continue using their fire hazard computers simply because "SUPER POWA"?

Hah, I was literally just reading about AMD's RX-480 graphics card that just launched. Not a regulatory thing directly, but some reviewers are finding it exceeds the power draw spec for the PCI-E slot it sits in. This potentially causes serious trademark issues with the PCI-E labeling as well as possibly damaging motherboards/starting a fire.

The situation still seems to be in the "denial" phase.
 
Hah, I was literally just reading about AMD's RX-480 graphics card that just launched. Not a regulatory thing directly, but some reviewers are finding it exceeds the power draw spec for the PCI-E slot it sits in. This potentially causes serious trademark issues with the PCI-E labeling as well as possibly damaging motherboards/starting a fire.

The situation still seems to be in the "denial" phase.

And Nvidia takes another step forward. Seriously though, if we had companies like VW doing this for cars to try and get away with it, what is stoping electronics companies from doing things similar even if the device is fire hazard.
 
Considering that the engineers did the cheat because the cars performance would suck without it I have no idea why anyone would want to do the "repairs". Now this all depends upon how much they pay for the cars. Remember that people will need to buy again when they would not have otherwise, there will be a tax penalty, I hope VW is chipping in some money for that. And for inconvenience. And as penalty for lying to customers.

$30,000 per car before administrative costs does not seem like enough, but we shall see.
 
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Would you rather have spent money on a car that you can drive or look at?

depends on where you live, in Washington you only have to emission test in King and Snohomish (the two urban) counties. I live in Mason county and lived in Kitsap County before that, None of the vehicles I have owned would pass emissions, one had a broken 02 sensor, another was missing a catalytic converter entirely, etc. well my mazda and current crown Vic would pass

I mean if I bought a scam VW I could re-register and drive it for years and no one would be any the wiser, and in nearly every state except for California emissions are not required at all, only required in certain urban areas (oh and there's a whole industry of fraud in which certain emissions testers will grant clean bills to anyone who pays enough clean bills), or only required the first time a car is registered.

so in reality, if you keep your VW and never make a lot of noise in 95% of the country you will be able to drive it.
 
Considering that the engineers did the cheat because the cars performance would suck without it I have no idea why anyone would want to do the "repairs". Now this all depends upon how much they pay for the cars. Remember that people will need to buy again when they would not have otherwise, there will be a tax penalty, I hope VW is chipping in some money for that.

They want to do the "repairs" because the car isn't legal to drive without them. Failing to comply is something regulators can probably catch. A simple database check on who is a registered owner vs. who has taken the repair/buyback option. "So I don't get fined" isn't the greatest motivation but it can be effective.

I also hope VW is held responsible for those additional costs.

I would also bet money that other manufacturers are doing this and just haven't been caught yet, and are probably now ****ting bricks because the EPA probably has an inclination to double check.
 
depends on where you live, in Washington you only have to emission test in King and Snohomish (the two urban) counties. I live in Mason county and lived in Kitsap County before that, None of the vehicles I have owned would pass emissions, one had a broken 02 sensor, another was missing a catalytic converter entirely, etc. well my mazda and current crown Vic would pass

I mean if I bought a scam VW I could re-register and drive it for years and no one would be any the wiser, and in nearly every state except for California emissions are not required at all, only required in certain urban areas (oh and there's a whole industry of fraud in which certain emissions testers will grant clean bills to anyone who pays enough clean bills), or only required the first time a car is registered.

so in reality, if you keep your VW and never make a lot of noise in 95% of the country you will be able to drive it.

Yeah but the EPA now has the name and address of every person in the country with an out-of-spec vehicle. You don't have to trip an emissions test because they already know for a fact you aren't in compliance.
 
Libertarians ideology has absolutely no mechanism for any environmental protection whatsoever.

Sure it does! When over time enough people get sick from pollution we will simply stop buying pollution machines. The wonderful magic of the unfettered marketplace!
 
Sure it does! When over time enough people get sick from pollution we will simply stop buying pollution machines. The wonderful magic of the unfettered marketplace!

True, true. Cancer patients buy very few cars.
 
Considering that the engineers did the cheat because the cars performance would suck without it I have no idea why anyone would want to do the "repairs". Now this all depends upon how much they pay for the cars. Remember that people will need to buy again when they would not have otherwise, there will be a tax penalty, I hope VW is chipping in some money for that. And for inconvenience. And as penalty for lying to customers.

$30,000 per car before administrative costs does not seem like enough, but we shall see.

If I lived somewhere that doesn't do emissions testing (and I do) I wouldn't even bother.
 
Yeah but the EPA now has the name and address of every person in the country with an out-of-spec vehicle. You don't have to trip an emissions test because they already know for a fact you aren't in compliance.

But they can't force the sale of the vehicle and the vehicle is "road legal" when it's registered by state authorities. I do not believe they have the legal power to tell a state they cannot issue a license plate, and state authorities cannot refuse to issue you a plate if you meet their legal criteria. California is the exception, they might refuse to re-register your vehicle no matter what papers you bring due to the media nature of the problem. Having briefly lived in Southern California and knowing the area fairly well, it's an open secret that it's easy to circumvent emissions. if you have someone bringing in some 89 Tercel with the coffee can exhaust spewing white smoke, everyone knows that car is not emissions compliant, but they got papers to show it is.

this is VWs problem legally, VW will take the fall for it.

They really shouldn't because the EPAs standard is so absurd, these cars would pass emissions in most every other industrialized country in the world. I think the standards were specifically made to shield US auto makers from competition with high efficiency diesel motors. if we fully went to diesel over gas it would save maybe over 30% of our oil consumption and the foreign makers would have a direct advantage. it's not about the environment.
 
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But they can't force the sale of the vehicle and the vehicle is "road legal" when it's registered by state authorities. I do not believe they have the legal power to tell a state they cannot issue a license plate, and state authorities cannot refuse to issue you a plate if you meet their legal criteria.

this is VWs problem legally, VW will take the fall for it.

They really shouldn't because the EPAs standard is so absurd, these cars would pass emissions in most every other industrialized country in the world. I think the standards were specifically made to shield US auto makers from competition with high efficiency diesel motors. if we fully went to diesel over gas it would save maybe over 30% of our oil consumption and the foreign makers would have a direct advantage. it's not about the environment.

It is not a conspiracy to prevent deisel cars, america tried that before, with the gm diesel cars and the mercedes diesels, that would get up to 50 mpg. America lost interest due to gm early diesels being junk, and mercedes diesels being too expensive to maintain.

In america emissions classes go by vehicle size, while in europe they go by engine displacement. In america a compact car will have the same emissions requirements whether it has a 3 cyl suziki engine, or a v6. In europe, the larger the displacement, the less lenient.

I will put it this way, europes emmission regs are awkward, a v6 that will put out half the emissions of a 4 cyl will fail but the 4 cyl will pass, based off displacement. They designed their emissions laws to discourage high displacement engines over actually reducing emmissions.

In america, a full size truck is a full size truck, and will be rated based on gvw and light or heavy duty. That vw diesel would pass us standards if it was dropped in a truck, but fails compact and mid size car emmissions regulations. Also the vw diesels produced up to 40x the legal amount for their vehicle class in america, enough nox where if enouh were on the road, the smog crisis of california in the 60's and 70's would like like a cakewalk.
 
If I lived somewhere that doesn't do emissions testing (and I do) I wouldn't even bother.

That will not work, the EPA will be demanding proof that every car was either bought or fixed.
 
They want to do the "repairs" because the car isn't legal to drive without them. Failing to comply is something regulators can probably catch. A simple database check on who is a registered owner vs. who has taken the repair/buyback option. "So I don't get fined" isn't the greatest motivation but it can be effective.

I also hope VW is held responsible for those additional costs.

I would also bet money that other manufacturers are doing this and just haven't been caught yet, and are probably now ****ting bricks because the EPA probably has an inclination to double check.

Given all the changes that the EU has made in response for sure the EPA is going to try to keep up so as to not be laughed at by the rest of the experts around the globe, this has already been plenty embarrassing.
 
Yeah but the EPA now has the name and address of every person in the country with an out-of-spec vehicle. You don't have to trip an emissions test because they already know for a fact you aren't in compliance.

Not the owners problem. EPA cant do anything to them.
 
Not the owners problem. EPA cant do anything to them.

Wrong, they can bring a tow truck and Haul Away the illegally polluting car.

I am pretty sure, are there any lawyers in the house?
 
Wrong, they can bring a tow truck and Haul Away the illegally polluting car.

I am pretty sure, are there any lawyers in the house?

Actually no they cant. It was the company that sold a product that was "faulty". The owner purchased it in good faith. Same thing happened to International and their MAX force motors. They are all still on the road or in a junk pile.
 
Actually no they cant. It was the company that sold a product that was "faulty". The owner purchased it in good faith. Same thing happened to International and their MAX force motors. They are all still on the road or in a junk pile.

I like my VW as is. Can the government force me to fix it?
No, the EPA can’t compel a consumer to participate in a recall, be it for safety or for emissions. But you won’t get the cash payments. That’s the point of the payments -- to make it worthwhile for vehicle owners to get the emissions systems working or get the cars off the road.
What About My Car? Details of the VW Settlement for Owners - Bloomberg

WOW. So if VW does not offer enough just keep the car as is and drive it into the ground since you cant sell it. I bet if too many people do it there will be a law created just for them, to force the issue.

We shall see.
 
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