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Any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religion

any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religion


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obvious Child

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I just want to get a clear picture on where people stand after it's been argued that any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief constitutes a religion.
 

shlunka

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Re: Any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religi

You need to supply a specific definition of religion, there are many, and depending on the one applied, the answer will change.
 

a351

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Re: Any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religi

I've always assumed some sort of religious belief was required in order to qualify as a religion. Maybe I'm just old fashioned.
 

specklebang

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Re: Any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religi

To be a religion, you need to define a structured set of beliefs. You must pick a god and a method of communicating with that god.
 

obvious Child

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Re: Any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religi

I've always assumed some sort of religious belief was required in order to qualify as a religion. Maybe I'm just old fashioned.
Wait, so rejection of wearing orange socks on Wednesday is not a religion?

My lack of belief regarding polka-dot shirts in Uzbekistan is not a religion?
 

Buck Ewer

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Re: Any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religi

Atheism is no more a religion than anarchy is a form of government.
 

a351

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Re: Any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religi

Wait, so rejection of wearing orange socks on Wednesday is not a religion?

My lack of belief regarding polka-dot shirts in Uzbekistan is not a religion?
I suppose not, but the rhetoric of the anti orange sock cultists is insufferable.
 

ttwtt78640

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Re: Any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religi

I just want to get a clear picture on where people stand after it's been argued that any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief constitutes a religion.
I believe that I will have another beer, but that is not a religion.

I do not believe that I will have another beer, but that is not lack of religion, simply my current state of mind.

I will never have another beer, well that is simply a lie. ;)
 

obvious Child

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Re: Any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religi

I believe that I will have another beer, but that is not a religion.

I do not believe that I will have another beer, but that is not lack of religion, simply my current state of mind.

I will never have another beer, well that is simply a lie. ;)
You better beware the beer fans. Some of them take beer consumption to religious like levels. Them and Futboll Fans. Some of them may shank you.

Does worshiping beer constitute a religion? I guess so under these new criteria as to what's a religion.

Doesn't this make us all multi-denominationalist? We all have millions of beliefs, lack of beliefs and rejection of beliefs and since those are now "religions" we're all multi-denominationalist
 

Arcana XV

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Re: Any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religi

This idea that atheism is a religion comes from certain theists who insist on putting a label they're familiar with on a philosophy that is completely alien to them. If it makes them feel better, who cares? I'm comfortable with my lack of belief. Let them call it whatever they want. It changes nothing to this fundamental aspect of my character.
 

grip

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Re: Any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religi

I've noticed two distinct differences in atheists. One version seems to state the obvious that there's no observable proof of a supreme being and the other seems angry at anyone who believes different. Sort of the polar opposite of bible thumpers.
 

DiAnna

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Re: Any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religi

This idea that atheism is a religion comes from certain theists who insist on putting a label they're familiar with on a philosophy that is completely alien to them. If it makes them feel better, who cares? I'm comfortable with my lack of belief. Let them call it whatever they want. It changes nothing to this fundamental aspect of my character.
True enough. I am merely annoyed when someone feels they have the right to rudely tell me that my lack of belief in deities is a religion, just like any other, because they, the religious, say so. That is a complete lack of intellectual honesty. Oh, and adding that I'm going to hell for practicing the "religion of atheism" is just adding a cherry on top of their idiotic ideological dogma.

Arrogance combined with ignorance is profoundly irritating... and depressingly common.
 

DiAnna

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Re: Any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religi

I've noticed two distinct differences in atheists. One version seems to state the obvious that there's no observable proof of a supreme being and the other seems angry at anyone who believes different. Sort of the polar opposite of bible thumpers.
I'm a firm believer in freedom of religion, and freedom of everyone to worship or not worship as they please. The only time I get angry is when I am told that the lack of belief in deities is, in fact, a religion... and I'm going to hell for it. Yeah, that gets me pissy. :)
 

Arcana XV

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Re: Any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religi

True enough. I am merely annoyed when someone feels they have the right to rudely tell me that my lack of belief in deities is a religion, just like any other, because they, the religious, say so. That is a complete lack of intellectual honesty. Oh, and adding that I'm going to hell for practicing the "religion of atheism" is just adding a cherry on top of their idiotic ideological dogma.

Arrogance combined with ignorance is profoundly irritating... and depressingly common.
I hear you. It irritates me only to the extent that I find their reasoning intellectually lazy. I have low tolerance for that kind of thing. But, ultimately, it doesn't affect me all that much.
 

grip

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Re: Any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religi

I'm a firm believer in freedom of religion, and freedom of everyone to worship or not worship as they please. The only time I get angry is when I am told that the lack of belief in deities is, in fact, a religion... and I'm going to hell for it. Yeah, that gets me pissy. :)
I agree it's completely obnoxious to tell anyone what to believe, one way or the other. Even if there was readily available proof for everyone that there was a supreme being it wouldn't necessarily make you believe that Being was wishing you benevolence. I think how you live your life is a greater testimony towards what you believe than any worshiping, mouth service or plethora of good deeds.
 

obvious Child

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Re: Any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religi

This idea that atheism is a religion comes from certain theists who insist on putting a label they're familiar with on a philosophy that is completely alien to them.
Indeed. And the only way they are able to include Atheism as a religion is if they define religion as any set of beliefs, lack of beliefs or rejection of beliefs. But that makes my rejection of wearing orange socks on Wednesday a religion. Does the word "religion" have any meaning at that point outside of being completely absurd?

Can I start a tax exemption for the Church of No Orange Wednesday Socks?
 

Removable Mind

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Re: Any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religi

True enough. I am merely annoyed when someone feels they have the right to rudely tell me that my lack of belief in deities is a religion, just like any other, because they, the religious, say so. That is a complete lack of intellectual honesty. Oh, and adding that I'm going to hell for practicing the "religion of atheism" is just adding a cherry on top of their idiotic ideological dogma.

Arrogance combined with ignorance is profoundly irritating... and depressingly common.
Di...what people don't realize is that Atheist Hell is wayyyyyyyyyyyyyy worse than Religious Hell. We have to go to Atheist Hell and stay dead for eternity.

It won't be near as fun as our counterpart parts.. .in Religious Hell...who have to watch porno for endless hours on TV and the Internet only to realize they have no genitals. Where they have to go out every night to night clubs where there's no music, booze or drugs... and have to pick up somebody to make out with the opposite of their sexual orientation...forever.
 

Arcana XV

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Re: Any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religi

Indeed. And the only way they are able to include Atheism as a religion is if they define religion as any set of beliefs, lack of beliefs or rejection of beliefs. But that makes my rejection of wearing orange socks on Wednesday a religion. Does the word "religion" have any meaning at that point outside of being completely absurd?

Can I start a tax exemption for the Church of No Orange Wednesday Socks?
lol

It also gives brand new meaning to the phrase "I believe in myself".
 

maquiscat

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Re: Any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religi

I just want to get a clear picture on where people stand after it's been argued that any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief constitutes a religion.
Where are you getting that argument from?

You better beware the beer fans. Some of them take beer consumption to religious like levels. Them and Futboll Fans. Some of them may shank you.
Does worshiping beer constitute a religion? I guess so under these new criteria as to what's a religion.
Doesn't this make us all multi-denominationalist? We all have millions of beliefs, lack of beliefs and rejection of beliefs and since those are now "religions" we're all multi-denominationalist
Part of religion is a spirituality. All religions have a spirituality but not everyone with a spirituality has a religion.

This idea that atheism is a religion comes from certain theists who insist on putting a label they're familiar with on a philosophy that is completely alien to them. If it makes them feel better, who cares? I'm comfortable with my lack of belief. Let them call it whatever they want. It changes nothing to this fundamental aspect of my character.
While I've heard this a few times, most of what I hear in reguards to atheism and religion, is the religious and evangelical like behavior of some athiest as they "preach" their non-belief mentality. I personally find it funny as they try to convince people against religion with a fervor passing that of many of the religious.

I've noticed two distinct differences in atheists. One version seems to state the obvious that there's no observable proof of a supreme being and the other seems angry at anyone who believes different. Sort of the polar opposite of bible thumpers.
I'm going to disagree with you that there is no observable proof and say that more accurately that there is no reproducable proof. i.e. there is no proof that is anything more than eyewitness, at least when you don't automatically accept the premise that God (whichever you might choose) is behind everything.
 

obvious Child

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Smeagol

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Re: Any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religi

I just want to get a clear picture on where people stand after it's been argued that any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief constitutes a religion.
I don't think it always does but it can. I do recall the federal courts once declared atheism as a religion in granting equal rights as other faith-based groups at a prison somewhere.

I think most thinking people believe something. In my opinion once that belief also engages in association with others of like beliefs and activism in some form, it might meet the criteria of being religious....maybe. I also have a personal definition that it often has little to nothing to do with God as its adherents often in practice substitute their group for God, despite possibly denying they are doing so.
 

maquiscat

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Re: Any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religi

This Thread. Later pages.

http://www.debatepolitics.com/polls/168711-atheism-religion.html

Fair enough. I was making a beer/hooligan joke.
That post just seemed the best for noting about spirituality, but there were other possibilities.

Skimed the first few pages, but with over 50, didn't bother to go through the whole thing. I would say that athism is a belief, although I am on the line as to whether or not it's a belief system. Not a religion though. It just has people who are very religious about their non-religiousness.
 

obvious Child

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Re: Any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religi

I don't think it always does but it can. I do recall the federal courts once declared atheism as a religion in granting equal rights as other faith-based groups at a prison somewhere.
Wasn't that more to ensure no discrimination happened on lack of religion? It was probably just easier to throw it in for legal writing sake.

I think most thinking people believe something. In my opinion once that belief also engages in association with others of like beliefs and activism in some form, it might meet the criteria of being religious....maybe.
What constitutes something? "Association with others of like beliefs and activism in some form" means alot of things can be religion. MEAT Clubs or Cooking/Culinary Clubs on high schools who share a love of meat/other foods and community service would be religions.
 

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Re: Any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religi

I've noticed two distinct differences in atheists. One version seems to state the obvious that there's no observable proof of a supreme being and the other seems angry at anyone who believes different. Sort of the polar opposite of bible thumpers.
The latter probably comes mostly from growing up with bible thumpers. I grew up in the Bible Belt, in a city with several very large, very active, very fundamentalist Southern Baptist congregations. They witness everywhere. You can't make it from your car to the curb without some little jerk on your back, and they'll scream and rant and just ooze derision and contempt if you say, "No thank you, I'm not a Christian". After taking it a few times, you start turning around and telling them to **** off.

The constant barrage of hostility from those people leave others who grew up in that kind of an environment convinced at all Christians are that way. After all, all the ones they've ever seen are.

I was very hostile and aggressive towards people evangelizing for that reason, until I moved out of the Bible Belt and found a different breed of religious people. Basically, hate breeds hate, and courtesy breeds courtesy.
 

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Re: Any belief, any lack of belief and any rejection of belief to constitute a religi

Wasn't that more to ensure no discrimination happened on lack of religion? It was probably just easier to throw it in for legal writing sake.
If I recall the inmates themselves were claiming their atheism was a religion, not something arbitrarily assigned by the courts. The courts only said, okay if you insist.

What constitutes something? "Association with others of like beliefs and activism in some form" means alot of things can be religion. MEAT Clubs or Cooking/Culinary Clubs on high schools who share a love of meat/other foods and community service would be religions.
That's why I said maybe. I personally think if the devotion to the group and its precepts take on cult-like characteristics, I'd start to wonder.
 
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