Anti Syrian politician assassignated!

[t125eagle]

Anti-Syria politician killed in Lebanon - Yahoo! News

 

[jujuman13]

All Hizbollah need do now is assassinate yet 1 more Minister in the Lebanese Government, this will bring down that Government, which is exactly what Hizbollah want.
The country then goes under a caretaker Government until new elections can be held.
With these new elections Hizbollah will coerce as many of it's followers as it can into voting for Hizbollah candidates.
Then they will, if they gain a majority, kill the international tribunal into the killing of a previous Lebanese Anti Syrian Prime Minister.
If they fail to gain a majority they will use whatever leverage they can to demand yet more seats in Lebanese Parliament.
A great pity that Israel was unable to wipe them out.
Be really good if someone assassinated Nasrallah who currently heads up Hizbollah in Lebanon.

 

[PeteEU]

All Hizbollah need do now is assassinate yet 1 more Minister in the Lebanese Government, this will bring down that Government, which is exactly what Hizbollah want.

And you know for a fact that they are behind this assasination? I thought the standard parole was it was Syria (also without any evidence). For all we know, it could be Isreal trying to stir up a civil war that would keep Hizbollah busy.. we simply dont know.

The country then goes under a caretaker Government until new elections can be held.

And that is a bad thing considering the make up of Lebanons democracy?.. not that it would change much.

With these new elections Hizbollah will coerce as many of it's followers as it can into voting for Hizbollah candidates.

How can you coerce a follower? A follower would most likely vote for you .. because he is a follower! And because of Lebanons democracy is set as it is, Hizbollah or that religious minority can only get a certain about of seats in parlement. This is based on pre civil war census data on how big each religious and ethinc groups are... and back then the religious and ethinic group Hizbolla are a part of was small compared to now. Its the same system that gives the Presidency to a christian every time.. which is one of the problems as the present president is not liked by his own followers and was put in place by Syria (according to the anti syrian crowd of course) and is impossible to remove.

Then they will, if they gain a majority, kill the international tribunal into the killing of a previous Lebanese Anti Syrian Prime Minister.

They cant gain a majority, no one can according to the lebanese system.

If they fail to gain a majority they will use whatever leverage they can to demand yet more seats in Lebanese Parliament.

They can demand as much as they want, but it requires a bit more than demands. And if thier people are a majority or a larger minority than thier seats at present show, why should they not get more seats? Or are you suddenly against democracy? (not that I would like Hizbollah to gain more power).

A great pity that Israel was unable to wipe them out.

They would not exist if it was not for Isreal and the US, soo

Be really good if someone assassinated Nasrallah who currently heads up Hizbollah in Lebanon.

So that we could get an even more radical cleric heading that organisation? At least we know what we got now.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

And you know for a fact that they are behind this assasination? I thought the standard parole was it was Syria (also without any evidence).

OK so it's a coincidence that 5 anti-Syrian figures have been assasinated since Hariri's assassination.

For all we know, it could be Isreal trying to stir up a civil war that would keep Hizbollah busy.. we simply dont know.

When in doubt blame the Jews.

 

[Gardener]

When in doubt blame the Jews.

and then whine pitiously about the tragic unfairness of it all when people point out the antisemitism inherent in the scapegoating.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

and then whine pitiously about the tragic unfairness of it all when people point out the antisemitism inherent in the scapegoating.

Don't you just love their Eddie Haskel routine?

 

[PeteEU]

OK so it's a coincidence that 5 anti-Syrian figures have been assasinated since Hariri's assassination.

Its about time that Americans learn that in the Middle East nothing is black and white and the obvious is often not the correct answer. One could also say its way too obvious that its Syria. And who wants the Syrian regime to fall? The US and Isreal....

Of course the anti Syrian groups will use these assasinations as a pretence to blame Syria, even though said assasinations has brought nothing but problems for the Syrian goverment. Plus doing the "syrian card" also brings backing from the US (and Isreal.. which aint a plus in the region) and in part the west in general.

But it could be rouge elements within the Syrian goverment.. we simply do not know. Thats what the UN investigation is all about.

When in doubt blame the Jews.

Ahh the good old anti semitic card. When in doubt throw that in someones face.

Like it or not Isreal is a key player in the region and hence one has to look that way too, just as one has too look at Syria and other nations/organisations. If ones enemy is divided or occupied with something else, then he aint ones back is he now? Why totaly ignore the posibility that Isreal has had something to do with said assasinations? Its not like Isreal has not done assasinations as part of its policy in the region, is it now?

I am not saying that Isreal are behind it, as there is no evidence, just as there is no evidence that Syria is behind it. For all we know he could be involved in a mob style revenge bullshit with in his own party.

But of course blaming Syria is just as easy as anti semites blaming Jews for it .. right?

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

Its about time that Americans learn that in the Middle East nothing is black and white and the obvious is often not the correct answer. One could also say its way too obvious that its Syria. And who wants the Syrian regime to fall? The US and Isreal....

Of course the anti Syrian groups will use these assasinations as a pretence to blame Syria, even though said assasinations has brought nothing but problems for the Syrian goverment. Plus doing the "syrian card" also brings backing from the US (and Isreal.. which aint a plus in the region) and in part the west in general.

But it could be rouge elements within the Syrian goverment.. we simply do not know. Thats what the UN investigation is all about.

It's blatantly obvious that Syria is behind the killings, your assertions to the contrary are regurgetated Islamo-fascist propaganda and it really is quite sad. Your bullshit ranks right up there with the claims that the Mossad was behind 9-11, I'm not buying it for a ****ing second it's anti-Israel neo-Nazi propaganda.

Ahh the good old anti semitic card. When in doubt throw that in someones face.

Don't play that bullshit with me, anti-zionism is the new PC code in the leftist montra for anti-Jew, the Jew has always been the scapegoat for the international left just as the leopard can't change his spots neither can the leftist change his hate for the Jew.

Like it or not Isreal is a key player in the region and hence one has to look that way too, just as one has too look at Syria and other nations/organisations.

That makes absolutely no god damn sense except in the paranoid mind of the leftist, let's see 5 anti-Syrian figures have been killed since Hassiri, all of which have been pro-Israel and you're blaming Israel? Tell me how that makes sense? It doesn't make any ****ing sense it's bullshit propaganda coming from an anti-semetic new left Nazi from Europe.

If ones enemy is divided or occupied with something else, then he aint ones back is he now? Why totaly ignore the posibility that Isreal has had something to do with said assasinations?

Because the Christains leaders who have being killed are pro-Israel and opposed to the enemies of Israel, it doesn't make any ****ing sense.

But of course blaming Syria is just as easy as anti semites blaming Jews for it .. right?

It's blatantly obvious that Syria is behind it, and your assertions to the contrary are a ****ing joke.

 

[PeteEU]

It's blatantly obvious that Syria is behind the killings, your assertions to the contrary are regurgetated Islamo-fascist propaganda and it really is quite sad. Your bullshit ranks right up there with the claims that the Mossad was behind 9-11, I'm not buying it for a ****ing second it's anti-Israel neo-Nazi propaganda.

It is obvious? Lets see, the Syrians say they did not do it (but of course we dont belive them), but the anti Syrian crowd who all want to hurt Syrian in any form they can say that Syria did it.. so we automatically belive them? Why? Because they are christians? Because they are anti Syrian? Remember what happened the last time the world believed an anti Saddam movement and what happened then? I am not ruling out that its Syria or some rogue syrian group within the goverment, but I also do not rule out others who have to gain from this.

Don't play that bullshit with me, anti-zionism is the new PC code in the leftist montra for anti-Jew, the Jew has always been the scapegoat for the international left just as the leopard can't change his spots neither can the leftist change his hate for the Jew.

Thats funny.. real funny. Guess you dont read much history. Who used the Jew as a scapegoat through history? The ruling class and the church and they were a bunch of lefties now? The left are anti-jew? Have you heard the anti jew stuff so called ultra right wing wackos are promoting these days? What some religious christians are saying?

That makes absolutely no god damn sense except in the paranoid mind of the leftist, let's see 5 anti-Syrian figures have been killed since Hassiri, all of which have been pro-Israel and you're blaming Israel? Tell me how that makes sense? It doesn't make any ****ing sense it's bullshit propaganda coming from an anti-semetic new left Nazi from Europe.

I am blaming Isreal? dont put words in my mouth. I said I am not ruling them out in being involved.. thats hardly blaming them. I am also not ruling out the CIA, AL Q and others who set to gain from creating friction in the area. Its you that is hell bent in blaming Syria without a shred of proof other than someone is knocking off anti Syrian politicans.

Because the Christains leaders who have being killed are pro-Israel and opposed to the enemies of Israel, it doesn't make any ****ing sense.

Now they are pro Isreal? Where on earth did you get that from? Or are you just assuming they are because they are christian?

It's blatantly obvious that Syria is behind it, and your assertions to the contrary are a ****ing joke.

And I am saying it might be too obvious and people are not looking else where because of this and that is a mistake.

 

[Gardener]

But of course blaming Syria is just as easy as anti semites blaming Jews for it .. right?

At least you have admitted you are an antisemite.

It's a start.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

It is obvious? Lets see, the Syrians say they did not do it (but of course we dont belive them), but the anti Syrian crowd who all want to hurt Syrian in any form they can say that Syria did it.. so we automatically belive them? Why? Because they are christians? Because they are anti Syrian? Remember what happened the last time the world believed an anti Saddam movement and what happened then? I am not ruling out that its Syria or some rogue syrian group within the goverment, but I also do not rule out others who have to gain from this.

This is preposterouos double speak blame the victim bullshit, 5 anti-Syrian figures have been assasinated since Hissari, and you don't think Syria is responsible, take your ****ing head out of the sand.

Thats funny.. real funny. Guess you dont read much history. Who used the Jew as a scapegoat through history? The ruling class and the church and they were a bunch of lefties now? The left are anti-jew? Have you heard the anti jew stuff so called ultra right wing wackos are promoting these days? What some religious christians are saying?

A) Nazism is a product of the left.

B) "True, it is a fixed idea with the French that the Rhine is their property, but to this arrogant demand the only reply worthy of the German nation is Arndt's: "Give back Alsace and Lorraine". For I am of the opinion, perhaps in contrast to many whose standpoint I share in other respects, that the reconquest of the German-speaking left bank of the Rhine is a matter of national honour, and that the Germanisation of a disloyal Holland and of Belgium is a political necessity for us. Shall we let the German nationality be completely suppressed in these countries, while the Slavs are rising ever more powerfully in the East?" -- Friedrich Engles

"This is our calling, that we shall become the templars of this Grail, gird the sword round our loins for its sake and stake our lives joyfully in the last, holy war which will be followed by the thousand-year reign of freedom." -- Friedrich Engles

"Let us consider the actual, worldly Jew -- not the Sabbath Jew, as Bauer does, but the everyday Jew. Let us not look for the secret of the Jew in his religion, but let us look for the secret of his religion in the real Jew. What is the secular basis of Judaism? Practical need, self-interest. What is the worldly religion of the Jew? Huckstering. What is his worldly God? Money. Very well then! Emancipation from huckstering and money, consequently from practical, real Jewry, would be the self-emancipation of our time.... We recognize in Jewry, therefore, a general present-time-oriented anti-social element, an element which through historical development -- to which in this harmful respect the Jews have zealously contributed -- has been brought to its present high level, at which it must necessarily dissolve itself. In the final analysis, the emancipation of the Jews is the emancipation of mankind from Jewry". -- Karl Marx

I am blaming Isreal? dont put words in my mouth. I said I am not ruling them out in being involved.. thats hardly blaming them. I am also not ruling out the CIA, AL Q and others who set to gain from creating friction in the area. Its you that is hell bent in blaming Syria without a shred of proof other than someone is knocking off anti Syrian politicans.

It goes to motive, and Syria has it in spades, your assertions that Israel or the CIA are behind it are laughable and only proof that you have your head in the sand.

Now they are pro Isreal? Where on earth did you get that from? Or are you just assuming they are because they are christian?

Because the Israelis backed the Christain militias in the civil war and the Christians are who wanted Israel in the region at that time.

And I am saying it might be too obvious and people are not looking else where because of this and that is a mistake.

No that's not a mistake it's common sense, your twisted delusions of conpsiracy are ridiculous on their face and anyone with a shred of reason would realize that.

 

[PeteEU]

This is preposterouos double speak blame the victim bullshit, 5 anti-Syrian figures have been assasinated since Hissari, and you don't think Syria is responsible, take your ****ing head out of the sand.

And that is still your only evidence that it is 100% sure its Syria? Even 90% sure its Syria?

I think it MIGHT be someone in Syria, but I am not convinced because the evidence is not conclusive.

A) Nazism is a product of the left.

So it was only the Nazies that have blamed the Jews throughout history? And still the old "nazies were lefties" crap from you.

B) "True, it is a fixed idea with the French that the Rhine is their property, but to this arrogant demand the only reply worthy of the German nation is Arndt's: "Give back Alsace and Lorraine". For I am of the opinion, perhaps in contrast to many whose standpoint I share in other respects, that the reconquest of the German-speaking left bank of the Rhine is a matter of national honour, and that the Germanisation of a disloyal Holland and of Belgium is a political necessity for us. Shall we let the German nationality be completely suppressed in these countries, while the Slavs are rising ever more powerfully in the East?" -- Friedrich Engles

Eh? whats a land spat between France and Germany and some idiots (one of many) idea of a "master race" got to do with this? And its Engels.

"This is our calling, that we shall become the templars of this Grail, gird the sword round our loins for its sake and stake our lives joyfully in the last, holy war which will be followed by the thousand-year reign of freedom." -- Friedrich Engles

Again.. eh?

"Let us consider the actual, worldly Jew -- not the Sabbath Jew, as Bauer does, but the everyday Jew. Let us not look for the secret of the Jew in his religion, but let us look for the secret of his religion in the real Jew. What is the secular basis of Judaism? Practical need, self-interest. What is the worldly religion of the Jew? Huckstering. What is his worldly God? Money. Very well then! Emancipation from huckstering and money, consequently from practical, real Jewry, would be the self-emancipation of our time.... We recognize in Jewry, therefore, a general present-time-oriented anti-social element, an element which through historical development -- to which in this harmful respect the Jews have zealously contributed -- has been brought to its present high level, at which it must necessarily dissolve itself. In the final analysis, the emancipation of the Jews is the emancipation of mankind from Jewry". -- Karl Marx

So? Jews were bankers and money lenders for centuries and were hated because of this. Only natural Karl Marx would have a thing for bankers...

Why dont you go back further to before Karl Marx? Before the "left" was basicly invented? You do know that Jews have been scapegoats for more than the last 150 years? Who claimed them as scapegoats before that? And what political ideas grew from these people and organisations? What side is the party or ideology of God, King and Country? What parties and ideology grew from the Nobles and people in power in pre democractic societies?

It goes to motive, and Syria has it in spades, your assertions that Israel or the CIA are behind it are laughable and only proof that you have your head in the sand.

Yes motive. What motive does Syria have to getting the world even more on thier backs and possibly getting "liberated" by the US?

Only motive thats been floating out there is that they are doing it to get attention and be taken seriously as a partner in getting peace in the middle east. Or is the motive they want to start a new civil war so they can go back in with troops and "retake" Lebanon?

What is there motive.. do you know?

Because the Israelis backed the Christain militias in the civil war and the Christians are who wanted Israel in the region at that time.

Err no. They backed ONE christian malitia, that was wiped out or fled to Israel when Israel left Lebanon without telling thier "allies". In fact the goverment (which is part christian) and the president (who is christian) has condemed Israel time and time again.. especially when 1200 citizens were killed by the IDF bombs. But do you have any proof that the Christians in Lebanon are pro Isreal?

No that's not a mistake it's common sense, your twisted delusions of conpsiracy are ridiculous on their face and anyone with a shred of reason would realize that.

So now its delusional to ask questions? Its spreading a conspiracy idea by asking.. hmm no wait a minute, what are the facts here and what are the rumors. Who has motive and who is set to gain from it? Ever ask those questions?

 

[Joby]

the Jew has always been the scapegoat for the international left

uhhh...wasn't it a jew who wrote the manifesto of the 'international left'?
so marxists hate jews-even though they take the name of one? hmmm... :roll:

Anyway, I personally believe it was done by a group with strong Syrian ties, though not Hezbollah or Syria. I believe both groups, especially Hezbollah, do not wish to cause a civil war. We'll probably see Hezbollah take a little softer approach towards ending the crisis, as they've already said war is completely offthe table.

As for Syria, well, it just doesn't fit their style. When Hafez had Bashir Geyamel (pierres uncle) and Rafik Hariri done away with it was using explosives in a well planned and executed attack, utilizing pro-syria terrorist cells.

This was probably done with an AK, in the middle of a Christian neighborhood, in the middle of the capital. It was probably a terrorist cell with few, small official ties to Damascus.

But that's just my opinion. I could be wrong.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

uhhh...wasn't it a jew who wrote the manifesto of the 'international left'?
so marxists hate jews-even though they take the name of one? hmmm... :roll:

Funny you should mention that:

"True, it is a fixed idea with the French that the Rhine is their property, but to this arrogant demand the only reply worthy of the German nation is Arndt's: "Give back Alsace and Lorraine". For I am of the opinion, perhaps in contrast to many whose standpoint I share in other respects, that the reconquest of the German-speaking left bank of the Rhine is a matter of national honour, and that the Germanisation of a disloyal Holland and of Belgium is a political necessity for us. Shall we let the German nationality be completely suppressed in these countries, while the Slavs are rising ever more powerfully in the East?" -- Friedrich Engles

"This is our calling, that we shall become the templars of this Grail, gird the sword round our loins for its sake and stake our lives joyfully in the last, holy war which will be followed by the thousand-year reign of freedom." -- Friedrich Engles

"Let us consider the actual, worldly Jew -- not the Sabbath Jew, as Bauer does, but the everyday Jew. Let us not look for the secret of the Jew in his religion, but let us look for the secret of his religion in the real Jew. What is the secular basis of Judaism? Practical need, self-interest. What is the worldly religion of the Jew? Huckstering. What is his worldly God? Money. Very well then! Emancipation from huckstering and money, consequently from practical, real Jewry, would be the self-emancipation of our time.... We recognize in Jewry, therefore, a general present-time-oriented anti-social element, an element which through historical development -- to which in this harmful respect the Jews have zealously contributed -- has been brought to its present high level, at which it must necessarily dissolve itself. In the final analysis, the emancipation of the Jews is the emancipation of mankind from Jewry". -- Karl Marx

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

And that is still your only evidence that it is 100% sure its Syria? Even 90% sure its Syria?

I think it MIGHT be someone in Syria, but I am not convinced because the evidence is not conclusive.

Ya I'm sure you're right it's just a giant coincidence that 5 anti-Syrian figures have been rubbed out in the last year.

So it was only the Nazies that have blamed the Jews throughout history? And still the old "nazies were lefties" crap from you.

I didn't say that it was only the Nazis but it has always been the Europeans.

Eh? whats a land spat between France and Germany and some idiots (one of many) idea of a "master race" got to do with this? And its Engels.

Proof that the new left and most certainly the European left is based on anti-semeitic tenants from Marx and Engels.

So? Jews were bankers and money lenders for centuries and were hated because of this. Only natural Karl Marx would have a thing for bankers...

Why dont you go back further to before Karl Marx? Before the "left" was basicly invented? You do know that Jews have been scapegoats for more than the last 150 years? Who claimed them as scapegoats before that? And what political ideas grew from these people and organisations? What side is the party or ideology of God, King and Country? What parties and ideology grew from the Nobles and people in power in pre democractic societies?

I wouldn't know I'm not Euro Trash.

Yes motive. What motive does Syria have to getting the world even more on thier backs and possibly getting "liberated" by the US?

What would Syria have to gain by eliminating vocal Syrian opponents? Hmm that's a tuff one. :roll:

Err no. They backed ONE christian malitia, that was wiped out or fled to Israel when Israel left Lebanon without telling thier "allies". In fact the goverment (which is part christian) and the president (who is christian) has condemed Israel time and time again.. especially when 1200 citizens were killed by the IDF bombs. But do you have any proof that the Christians in Lebanon are pro Isreal?

That maybe so but it isn't Israel that wants to be the puppet master of the Lebanese government as does Syria.

So now its delusional to ask questions? Its spreading a conspiracy idea by asking.. hmm no wait a minute, what are the facts here and what are the rumors. Who has motive and who is set to gain from it? Ever ask those questions?

The motive is that this assasination has created political deadlocke and created a situation where Hezbollah a Syrian proxy might just get exactly what they wanted IE more control over the Lebanese government.

 

[Joby]

A) Nazism is a product of the left.

uhhhh....

All right. Let's have this discussion.

Under industrilization, society has been divided into the owners of capital, and labor.

Karl Marx advocated a system in which the laborers would own the capital. In fact, there would be no capital. It would all be 100% owned by the labor controlled state, and the state would ensure that each laborer got an equal share (this is were most leftist nations trip up). Eventually, with each laborer having an equal share of wealth, and the means of production, the need for a state would decline, and one would disappear. Therefore, society would be a stateless, classless commune.

Adolf Hitler advocated an economic system in which corporations would become as efficient as possible. They were corralled by the state after years of depression, and, instead of fighting each other, were turned to create the war machine that was Nazi Germany. The corporations benefited greatly, while inefficient small businesses were done away with-some even outlawed.
As Mussolini put it, Fascism could more accurately be called 'corporatism' because it was the merger of state and corporate power--NOT State and Labor Power, as advocated by Marx. Which could explain why many wages in Germany went down following the Nazi takeover. Look outside the window for another example of "Corporatism"

This is a very, very basic explanation. Need anything clarified, let me know.


B) "True, it is a fixed idea with the French that the Rhine is their property, but to this arrogant demand the only reply worthy of the German nation is Arndt's: "Give back Alsace and Lorraine". For I am of the opinion, perhaps in contrast to many whose standpoint I share in other respects, that the reconquest of the German-speaking left bank of the Rhine is a matter of national honour, and that the Germanisation of a disloyal Holland and of Belgium is a political necessity for us. Shall we let the German nationality be completely suppressed in these countries, while the Slavs are rising ever more powerfully in the East?" -- Friedrich Engles

He's sarcastically refering to the stupidity of patriotism. Something most Europeans agree with, hence the European Union.

"This is our calling, that we shall become the templars of this Grail, gird the sword round our loins for its sake and stake our lives joyfully in the last, holy war which will be followed by the thousand-year reign of freedom." -- Friedrich Engles

Yes, utopia would be nice. We're still a way off, though.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

uhhhh....

All right. Let's have this discussion.

Under industrilization, society has been divided into the owners of capital, and labor.

Karl Marx advocated a system in which the laborers would own the capital. In fact, there would be no capital. It would all be 100% owned by the labor controlled state, and the state would ensure that each laborer got an equal share (this is were most leftist nations trip up). Eventually, with each laborer having an equal share of wealth, and the means of production, the need for a state would decline, and one would disappear. Therefore, society would be a stateless, classless commune.

Adolf Hitler advocated an economic system in which corporations would become as efficient as possible. They were corralled by the state after years of depression, and, instead of fighting each other, were turned to create the war machine that was Nazi Germany. The corporations benefited greatly, while inefficient small businesses were done away with-some even outlawed.

The Nazi's advocated an end to private property as well:

"Private property" as conceived under liberalistic economic order was a reversal of the true concept of property. This "private proprerty" represented the right of the individual to manage and to speculate with inherited or acquired property as he pleased, without regard to the general interests...German socialism had to overcome this "private", that is, unrestrained and irresponsible view of property. All property is common property. The owner is bound by the people and the Reich to the responsible management of his goods. His legal position is only justified when he satisfies this responsibility to the community.

(Ernst Huber, Nazi party spokesman; National Socialism, prepared by Raymond E. Murphy, et al; quoting Huber, Verfassungsrecht des grossdeutschen Reiches (Hamburg, 1939))

Nazism and Communism are both forms of collectivism they are two sides of the same socialist coin:

Collectivism

Typology

Collectivism can be divided into "horizontal collectivism", wherein equality is stressed and individuals are largely interwoven with their in-group, and "vertical collectivism", wherein people submit to authorities and are willing to sacrifice themselves for what they see as the greater good of the collective. [4] Examples of horizontal collectivism are Israeli kibbutz, while examples of vertical collectivism are fascist societies.

Collectivism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

As Mussolini put it, Fascism could more accurately be called 'corporatism' because it was the merger of state and corporate power--

That quote that I've seen so many of these people who know nothing about what they're talking about spew from their misinformed mouths is an internet hoax it's a phony a fake total bullshit, and it is completely contradictory to any of Mussolini's economic policies. Mussolini himself was a devout socialist until he joined mainstream politics to gain power.

NOT State and Labor Power, as advocated by Marx. Which could explain why many wages in Germany went down following the Nazi takeover. Look outside the window for another example of "Corporatism"

Your problem is that you don't know the difference between a corporate and a corporation.

B) "True, it is a fixed idea with the French that the Rhine is their property, but to this arrogant demand the only reply worthy of the German nation is Arndt's: "Give back Alsace and Lorraine". For I am of the opinion, perhaps in contrast to many whose standpoint I share in other respects, that the reconquest of the German-speaking left bank of the Rhine is a matter of national honour, and that the Germanisation of a disloyal Holland and of Belgium is a political necessity for us. Shall we let the German nationality be completely suppressed in these countries, while the Slavs are rising ever more powerfully in the East?" -- Friedrich Engles

He's sarcastically refering to the stupidity of patriotism. Something most Europeans agree with, hence the European Union.

LMFAO he wasn't being sarcastic he was dead serious.

"This is our calling, that we shall become the templars of this Grail, gird the sword round our loins for its sake and stake our lives joyfully in the last, holy war which will be followed by the thousand-year reign of freedom." -- Friedrich Engles

Yes, utopia would be nice. We're still a way off, though.

That was a standard Hitler rant, by grail he means blood as in German blood as in Aryan blood.

I notice you failed to comment on Marx's rant on the Jews.

 

[PeteEU]

Ya I'm sure you're right it's just a giant coincidence that 5 anti-Syrian figures have been rubbed out in the last year.

I dunno is it? I have asked again and again.. do you have any other proof that it was the Syrians?

I didn't say that it was only the Nazis but it has always been the Europeans.

So that they US barred Jews fleeing Germany from entering the US before the US entered the war, was what?

And considering that Jews originate close to Europe is it odd that they moved to Europe or other places near? Plus the US was not exactly on the freaking map...so as Homer Simpson would say.. DUGH!

Proof that the new left and most certainly the European left is based on anti-semeitic tenants from Marx and Engels.

And the anti-semeitic crap from Kings, Queens, Nobles and the Christian Church was ?

I wouldn't know I'm not Euro Trash.

So you are denying that the "conservative" or right has its roots in the ruling class and church?

What would Syria have to gain by eliminating vocal Syrian opponents? Hmm that's a tuff one. :roll:

Considering Syria is not in Lebanon anymore, what would they gain by such an elimination? Or is it normal that nations bump off critics in other nations that are not even thier own citizens?

That maybe so but it isn't Israel that wants to be the puppet master of the Lebanese government as does Syria.

And the US dont want to be a "puppet" master of the so called "democratic" elected pro US goverment? Dont you think a few million or even billion dollars might flow extra to support said goverment?

The motive is that this assasination has created political deadlocke and created a situation where Hezbollah a Syrian proxy might just get exactly what they wanted IE more control over the Lebanese government.

How would they get more control? The Lebanese goverment is predetermind for peak sake. The PM has to be a Sunni, the President a Christian and the speaker a Shia. The parelement is elected proportionally depending on the group, not political party, but group aka, shai, sunni, christian. So unless they agree in changing totaly thier whole system of goverment, then its nearly impossible for Hezbollah to gain a majority or much more power.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

I dunno is it? I have asked again and again.. do you have any other proof that it was the Syrians?

I'll admit that it's circumstantial evidence but it's evidence none the less.

So that they US barred Jews fleeing Germany from entering the US before the US entered the war, was what?

Not all Jews:

Later immigration
The immigration restrictions of the late 1920s prevented many Jews from coming to the United States, yet some 100,000 German Jews did arrive in the 1930s, escaping Hitler’s persecution. During the Holocaust, less than 30,000 Jews a year reached the United States, and some were turned away due to immigration policies.

History of the Jews in the United States - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

And considering that Jews originate close to Europe is it odd that they moved to Europe or other places near? Plus the US was not exactly on the freaking map...so as Homer Simpson would say.. DUGH!

I don't even get your meaning here.

And the anti-semeitic crap from Kings, Queens, Nobles and the Christian Church was ?

Anti-semetism inherent in the culture of Euro-trash.

So you are denying that the "conservative" or right has its roots in the ruling class and church?

I wouldn't consider the CDP to be "conservative."

Considering Syria is not in Lebanon anymore, what would they gain by such an elimination? Or is it normal that nations bump off critics in other nations that are not even thier own citizens?

They're not in Lebanon anymore because of the critisisms of the anti-Syrian politicians, they want control of Lebanese politics which is why they want the anti-syrian factions out of the way and replaced with their voice in the country IE Syria's proxy Hezbollah.

And the US dont want to be a "puppet" master of the so called "democratic" elected pro US goverment? Dont you think a few million or even billion dollars might flow extra to support said goverment?

What does this have to do with anything we're talking about the assasination of anti-Syrian figures, try to stay on topic.

How would they get more control?

By wiping out the opposition.

The Lebanese goverment is predetermind for peak sake. The PM has to be a Sunni, the President a Christian and the speaker a Shia. The parelement is elected proportionally depending on the group, not political party, but group aka, shai, sunni, christian. So unless they agree in changing totaly thier whole system of goverment, then its nearly impossible for Hezbollah to gain a majority or much more power.

Hezbollah is demanding more power in parliament and if they can't get it through the ballot box they'll get it through force.

The government is deadlocked, the Shia ministers have withdrawn from parliament, and the opposition is being wiped out. If you can't see what's happening then you are blind.

Lebanon deadlocked ahead of Hizbullah ultimatum
By ASSOCIATED PRESS
BEIRUT, Lebanon

Rival Lebanese politicians failed to agree on Saturday on a Hizbullah demand to form a national unity government, raising fears of a showdown in the streets two days ahead of an ultimatum set by the militant group to reach a deal or face massive protests that threaten to bring down the government.

The breakdown of the talks came a day after the government received a draft document setting up an international tribunal to try suspects in the 2005 assassination of former Prime Minister Rafik Hariri - another potential land mine in the escalating tensions between the Western-backed government and its opponents.

Lebanon deadlocked ahead of Hizbullah ultimatum | Jerusalem Post

Lebanon's crisis worsens with 2-day strike ahead of decisive cabinet session Sam F. Ghattas, Canadian Press
Published: Friday, November 24, 2006

Hezbollah ignored a call by Prime Minister Fuad Saniora on Thursday night for six pro-Hezbollah cabinet ministers to return to their posts. The six resigned in protest earlier this month just before the cabinet gave its initial approval to the international tribunal.

In a Friday prayers sermon, a senior Shiite Muslim cleric said Saniora must resign because Shiites hated him and his departure was the only solution to the political deadlock.

"If you want the (Shiite) ministers to withdraw their resignations, Saniora should resign because he is hated by some people," said Sheik Abdul Amir Qabalan, the deputy head of the Higher Shiite Muslim Council. "He must rectify the government's situation by going home before the country is in ruins."

The political standoff in Lebanon pits Syria's opponents, mostly Christians and Sunni Muslims, against Damascus's allies, mostly Shiite Muslims, led by the powerful Hezbollah guerrilla group. Anti-Syrians dominate the government and parliament, but Hezbollah is threatening to bring down the government with a wave of mass protests unless it and its allies are given more power.

Tuesday's assassination of industry minister Pierre Gemayel, an anti-Syrian Christian leader, reignited anger at Damascus, which dominated Lebanon for nearly three decades but was forced to withdraw it troops last year over accusations it was behind the killing of Hariri. Damascus has denied any role in the slayings of Hariri, Gemayel or four other anti-Syrian politicians the past two years.

Even at the height of the civil war, Lebanon has never witnessed this level of polarization among its sects, this kind of political mobilization and the crisis at such a dead end," wrote Sateh Noureddine, managing editor of the daily As-Safir.

Lebanon's crisis worsens with 2-day strike ahead of decisive cabinet session

 

[jujuman13]

Quote by TOT
(It's blatantly obvious that Syria is behind the killings)

Not so, unless you are able (in your usual inimitable style) to actually provide a link that PROVES this your assertation.

The furthest you can state is that considering there have been 5 assassinations of Anti-Syrian Politicians plus another 10 attempts on other Anti- Syrian Politicians, it is entirely possible that Syria might be blamed.

Another possibility is Russia could be behind these killings, Russia has not given up it's attempts to rule the world.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

Quote by TOT
(It's blatantly obvious that Syria is behind the killings)

Not so, unless you are able (in your usual inimitable style) to actually provide a link that PROVES this your assertation.

The furthest you can state is that considering there have been 5 assassinations of Anti-Syrian Politicians plus another 10 attempts on other Anti- Syrian Politicians, it is entirely possible that Syria might be blamed.

Another possibility is Russia could be behind these killings, Russia has not given up it's attempts to rule the world.

Well that might make sense if they were anti-Russian figures but they weren't thus that makes absolutely no sense.

 

[PeteEU]

I'll admit that it's circumstantial evidence but it's evidence none the less.

Then why cant you say it "looks" like, or most likely, instead of "its Syria".

Not all Jews:

So you are hiding behind immigration rules? Anti semitic immigration rules?

I don't even get your meaning here.

As in it being obvious-

Anti-semetism inherent in the culture of Euro-trash.

And where did American come from? Your attacks against Europe for being anti-semetic throughout history is pathetic. Of course we were, as we used them as scapegoats.. just as we used Gypsis, gays, and other minorities. But who was it that started it? It was the nobles, ruling class and the church.. all heavly linked to the conservative movement. Using minorities as scapegoats is a long tradition not only in Europe but also in the US and try denying that.

I wouldn't consider the CDP to be "conservative."

And I would not call Democrats for socialist or liberals.. so what.

They're not in Lebanon anymore because of the critisisms of the anti-Syrian politicians, they want control of Lebanese politics which is why they want the anti-syrian factions out of the way and replaced with their voice in the country IE Syria's proxy Hezbollah.

Boy thats some conspiracy idea.. got any proof or links? Only thing I do agree with is that Syria wants influence in Lebanon, but that goes back centuries.

What does this have to do with anything we're talking about the assasination of anti-Syrian figures, try to stay on topic.

It has everything to do with it. Assasinating pro american anti syrian politicans in a middle eastern country?

By wiping out the opposition.

Then they are doing a shitty job of it.

Hezbollah is demanding more power in parliament and if they can't get it through the ballot box they'll get it through force.

Ever thought they might have a case for demanding more power? That their ethnic groups % of the population has risen since the last census a few decades ago? You cant be for a democracy if said democracy is biased against a miniority. Or is another case of only being for democracy if its the "good guys" that get elected?

The government is deadlocked, the Shia ministers have withdrawn from parliament, and the opposition is being wiped out. If you can't see what's happening then you are blind.

Is it.. on what? giving the rivals more power? Yep they are and knocking off anti syrian politicans wount change that deadlock... infact it most likely will make it worse.

But keep blaming Syria without any proof.. guess we all can start doing that. I blame Bush for global warming, the weeds in my garden and that Kevin got kicked out by Britney.

 

[Trajan Octavian Titus]

Then why cant you say it "looks" like, or most likely, instead of "its Syria".

Because it's blatantly obvious who is behind the killings.

So you are hiding behind immigration rules? Anti semitic immigration rules?

If they were anti-semetic immigration rules then how did 30,000 Jews a year make it into the U.S.?

Using minorities as scapegoats is a long tradition not only in Europe but also in the US and try denying that.

I don't believe there has ever been any pogroms in the U.S..

Boy thats some conspiracy idea.. got any proof?

Ya 5 anti-Syrian political figures have been assasinated in the last year.


It has everything to do with it. Assasinating pro american anti syrian politicans in a middle eastern country?



Then they are doing a shitty job of it.



Ever thought they might have a case for demanding more power? [/quote]

No because Hezbollah only holds 8 seats in Parliament, if the people supported them then they would hold more seats and thus have more power but they want to gain more power through non-Democratic means.

Is it.. on what? giving the rivals more power? Yep they are and knocking off anti syrian politicans wount change that deadlock... infact it most likely will make it worse.

No it's likely to cause a civil war after which Syria will once again become dominant over Lebanon.

 

[easyt65]

Latest News:

Hezbollah, the Syrian and Iranian-backed terrorist cockroaches who infest Lebanon, does not like anyone questioning them or their actions - their RIGHT to assassinate any leader they want - so they are calling for nation-wide protest of the Tribunal created by Lebonese vote that is supposed to find and prosecute those who assassinated Hariri and Gemayel! They are declaring that they will overthrow the goverment!

So Syria systematically assassinates anti-Syrian leaders in independent, yet Syriana and Iranian terrorist-infested, Lebanon. When justice is demanded by the Lebonese people, Hezbollah/Syria/Iran flex their muscles by protesting and calling for an over-throw of the Lebonese government!

Ok, where is the Freakin' U.N. NOW? The U.N. passed a sanction and promised THEY would see to the disarmament of Hezbollah....instead they sacrificed Lebanon for the sake of 'peace'! They have 'GIVEN' Lebanon to the terrorists for the sake of the 'peace' that will ensue after Hezbollah has taken completely over the country! It is the U.N.'s job to help ensure/protect sovereign nations' stability, yet Koffi and the U.N. are engaged in 3rd-party brokering of deals where the U.N. instead hands sovereign nations over to terrorists and Muslim extremist terrorist states!

This is clear evidence that Syria and Iran are moving without fear to enslave Lebanon, as well as Iraq and Afghanistan (our troops are currently fighting Syrian and Iranian troops in each of these nations). The have no reason to fear U.N. repraisal because the U.N. is working with/FOR them, handing over nations like Lebanon to them!

Meanwhile, our own politicians are making excuses and declaring what is being said by Syria and Iran (when they declare they will take over the entire middle east, destroy Israel, and destroy the U.S.) is not what they REALLY mean! No, WE are too busy being Politically correct, worried about offending anyone to take seriosuly the war for our very survival that is being fought!

What we are witnesssing is not a defeat in Iraq but the demise of our entire nation/future. We continue to embrace a criminal U.N. who has turned its back on its original mission, a U.N. who embraces terrorists and Muslim extremists, a U.N. who plays the 'Judas' to democratic/sovereign nations/people like Lebanon by handing them over to the world's enemies and to people like the Iraqis by stealing their money while propping up the dictator who is taping/torturing/gassing/murdering them, a U.N. who stands and cheers communist/fascist dictators who calls our President 'Satan', who refuses to police its own but instead harbors criminals, and a U.N. who is supporting the Muslim Extremist assault on the rest of the world!

Our leaders continue to betray this nation by allowing muillions of criminals to flood INTO our nation, who allow all the jobs to flow OUT of our nation to go to slave labor, who allow billions of U.S. dollars to flow INTO Mexico, and who demand the already burdened U.S. taxpayer to pay OUT millions in tax funding to give these criminals access to every social program this country offers to LEGAL citizens - ALL for their (these politicians) OWN BENEFIT - to be re-elected, retain power, and thus be rewarded for their betrayal by drawing their paychecks, bribes, lobbyist kickbacks/perks, and 'war chests'!

Its all about enough to make you throw up, toss up your hands in despair, and believe this country is going to he!! in a handbasket! You can see the train coming now, and you can also see our world leaders playing politics on the tracks so much that they are oblivious to the danger they are putting us all in! Yeeha!

 

[PeteEU]

This is gonna be fun...

Latest News:

Hezbollah, the Syrian and Iranian-backed terrorist cockroaches who infest Lebanon, does not like anyone questioning them or their actions - their RIGHT to assassinate any leader they want - so they are calling for nation-wide protest of the Tribunal created by Lebonese vote that is supposed to find and prosecute those who assassinated Hariri and Gemayel! They are declaring that they will overthrow the goverment!

Lebinese vote? Did not know the lebanese people voted on said tribunal... thought it was the cabinet that did that.

So Syria systematically assassinates anti-Syrian leaders in independent, yet Syriana and Iranian terrorist-infested, Lebanon. When justice is demanded by the Lebonese people, Hezbollah/Syria/Iran flex their muscles by protesting and calling for an over-throw of the Lebonese government!

Got any links where Iran and Syria call for the over-throw of the goverment in Lebanon? Heck got any proof that Syria is behind the assasinations? Sure it looks like it, but got any proof at all the world has not seen? And I would not exactly call the assasinations systematic.

Ok, where is the Freakin' U.N. NOW? The U.N. passed a sanction and promised THEY would see to the disarmament of Hezbollah....instead they sacrificed Lebanon for the sake of 'peace'!

Where in the resolution does it say that the UN is to disarm Hezbollah?

They have 'GIVEN' Lebanon to the terrorists for the sake of the 'peace' that will ensue after Hezbollah has taken completely over the country!

Acutally that was in part Isreal, the French/British, the US and the UN. The terrorists only came to Lebanon because of Isreal and Hizbollah only exists because of Isreal and US actions. The political make up of Lebanon, based on religious/ethnic lines is a leftover from the French/British and is one of the problems that lead to the civil war and is one of the main problems even today.

It is the U.N.'s job to help ensure/protect sovereign nations' stability, yet Koffi and the U.N. are engaged in 3rd-party brokering of deals where the U.N. instead hands sovereign nations over to terrorists and Muslim extremist terrorist states!

Where on earth in the UN charter does it say this?

This is clear evidence that Syria and Iran are moving without fear to enslave Lebanon, as well as Iraq and Afghanistan (our troops are currently fighting Syrian and Iranian troops in each of these nations). The have no reason to fear U.N. repraisal because the U.N. is working with/FOR them, handing over nations like Lebanon to them!

While I agree that Syria and Iran seem to be heavily involved in Iraq, I dont agree that Syria is involved in Afganistan. Iran sure, but Syria? As for Lebanon, Syria has always been a factor in Lebanons history, just as Isreal has, as well as Jordan. Iran's only influence is Hizbollah who would not exist if it had not been for Isreal and the US/France in the 1980s. Do you really think Iran gives a rats *** about Lebanon? Its all about Isreal, the more Iran can piss off or hurt Isreal the better in thier eyes. Syria only wants its land back and as long as that aint happening, ******* of Isreal by envolving it self in Lebanon is the next best thing. Attacks from Lebanon aint attacks from Syria, so Syria cant be bombed in retaliation. If they are, the Isreal is the starter of a war, not Syria.

Meanwhile, our own politicians are making excuses and declaring what is being said by Syria and Iran (when they declare they will take over the entire middle east, destroy Israel, and destroy the U.S.) is not what they REALLY mean!

When has Syria called for destruction of the US? Iran has always been a nut job on the world stage and its sad that the present US administration only now figured that out, dispite the US laying the ground work for radical Islam by supporting the Shah.

Solve the Isreal/Palestinian problem, and much of the problems in the middle east will be solved.. but thats been said for 40 years and those who can do something about it, have done nothing... in fact they have done just about everything to make it worse.

No, WE are too busy being Politically correct, worried about offending anyone to take seriosuly the war for our very survival that is being fought!

Haha, so its political correct to piss off the world on the war on terror? To make fun off, and demonize ones allies? Not being a team player is being political correct? Oh yea its a genocide in Darfur (cause thats politicaly correct) but its not a civil war in Iraq (because the right wingers say it aint, so thats political correct).. hypocrits.

What we are witnesssing is not a defeat in Iraq but the demise of our entire nation/future.

If there is a demise of the US, then it aint because of a defeat in Iraq, but because of pissant idiots like George Bush and Cheney.

We continue to embrace a criminal U.N. who has turned its back on its original mission,

It has? Do you even know its original mission? Do you even know what the UN can and can not do?

a U.N. who embraces terrorists and Muslim extremists,

And embraced communists, socialist, facists, conservatives and even a few anarchists.. your point? Do you want a global forum where only democratic nations are allowed? What is the standard of "democratic"? Be carefull.. the US might not even be included then.

a U.N. who plays the 'Judas' to democratic/sovereign nations/people like Lebanon by handing them over to the world's enemies

Calling Lebanon a democracy is like calling Russia a democracy. Sure they "vote" but when seats in parlament and goverment are preditermind to goto a certain religious/ethnic group then its hardly a democracy. The goverment is preformed.. just have to fill in the spots with people. And the world's enemies are exactly who? Osama Bin Laden? Iran? Syria? North Korea? Muslims? Global warming? Fat people? Britney Spears? Bill Clinton? All of the above?

and to people like the Iraqis by stealing their money while propping up the dictator who is taping/torturing/gassing/murdering them,

Can you explain this one? All contracts in the UN Oil for Food went past a US representive, a UK representive and others before being okayed.. several times the UN raised questions on contracts, but the council overseeing the program passed them anyways... More money was earned (by far) by illegal smuggling through Jordan and Turkey, something the UN complained about several times, but the UNSC, with the US, UK and others, ignored, because said smuggling was a good source of income for 2 allies and much of the smuggled oil landed in US, UK, French and Russian companies. Blaming the UN solely for the "propping up" of Saddam is idiotic, partisan and brain dead.

a U.N. who stands and cheers communist/fascist dictators who calls our President 'Satan',

Yea that was funny.

who refuses to police its own but instead harbors criminals,

Who exactly should it police that it has not done already? Arrest Kofi for what?

and a U.N. who is supporting the Muslim Extremist assault on the rest of the world!

And you can of course link this public endorsement of the extremist muslim assult right?

Our leaders continue to betray this nation by allowing muillions of criminals to flood INTO our nation, who allow all the jobs to flow OUT of our nation to go to slave labor, who allow billions of U.S. dollars to flow INTO Mexico, and who demand the already burdened U.S. taxpayer to pay OUT millions in tax funding to give these criminals access to every social program this country offers to LEGAL citizens - ALL for their (these politicians) OWN BENEFIT - to be re-elected, retain power, and thus be rewarded for their betrayal by drawing their paychecks, bribes, lobbyist kickbacks/perks, and 'war chests'!

Yea but you voted those guys out of office.. just one guy left of that whole bunch.. he is in the White House... 2 years to go and they all gone... so get the champagne on ice.