• This is a political forum that is non-biased/non-partisan and treats every persons position on topics equally. This debate forum is not aligned to any political party. In today's politics, many ideas are split between and even within all the political parties. Often we find ourselves agreeing on one platform but some topics break our mold. We are here to discuss them in a civil political debate. If this is your first visit to our political forums, be sure to check out the RULES. Registering for debate politics is necessary before posting. Register today to participate - it's free!

Anti-Fascist murders by neo-nazis

FinnMacCool

DP Veteran
Joined
Aug 23, 2005
Messages
2,272
Reaction score
153
Location
South Shore of Long Island.
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Very Liberal
There have been many reports of members of the group Antifa, which is a militant worldwide anti-fasicst organization, being killed in Russia by neo-nazis. It is common for there to be stabbings and beatings. I don't have many good sources for this information, most of it comes from third party sources unfortunately.

I feel like this type of violence is going to lead to tit-for-tat murders and more violence.
 
Last edited:

alexa

DP Veteran
Joined
May 14, 2009
Messages
4,684
Reaction score
1,340
Gender
Female
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
There have been many reports of members of the group Antifa, which is a militant worldwide anti-fasicst organization, being killed in Russia by neo-nazis. It is common for there to be stabbings and beatings. I don't have many good sources for this information, most of it comes from third party sources unfortunately.

I feel like this type of violence is going to lead to tit-for-tat murders and more violence.
any chance of a link. Goggling did not produce for me.
 

Infinite Chaos

DP Veteran
Joined
Oct 28, 2007
Messages
18,504
Reaction score
8,591
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
-- members of the group Antifa, which is a militant worldwide anti-fasicst organization, being killed in Russia by neo-nazis --
This type of thing has been going on for a while, firstly Asiatic Russians and African students were being beaten and killed in Moscow then bombs outside synagogues and now it's Anti-fa members. The peak of such attacks and killings was in the 2006 period and was "supposed" to have fallen drastically - wonder if there's a new surge of self-styled nazi groups have become brave for some reason. Mind you, if you read some of the articles below - one gang of skinheads killed a 9 year old Tajik girl brutally and were sentenced for "hooliganism" so you could wonder how far the Nazi style sympathies lie in Russia.

2006 BBC article

2006 Times online
 

FinnMacCool

DP Veteran
Joined
Aug 23, 2005
Messages
2,272
Reaction score
153
Location
South Shore of Long Island.
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Very Liberal
This type of thing has been going on for a while, firstly Asiatic Russians and African students were being beaten and killed in Moscow then bombs outside synagogues and now it's Anti-fa members. The peak of such attacks and killings was in the 2006 period and was "supposed" to have fallen drastically - wonder if there's a new surge of self-styled nazi groups have become brave for some reason. Mind you, if you read some of the articles below - one gang of skinheads killed a 9 year old Tajik girl brutally and were sentenced for "hooliganism" so you could wonder how far the Nazi style sympathies lie in Russia.

2006 BBC article

2006 Times online
Yes, it's really bad over there.

Especially since most of the members of Antifa are Communists and Anarchists, the government doesn't really care about them, unfortunately.
 

Republic_Of_Public

Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Sep 16, 2009
Messages
2,922
Reaction score
343
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Conservative
I shouldn't worry for a wave of Nazi sympathy across Russia. Given that the Nazis trashed, killed, burned and raped their way across Russia from 1941-43 I'd say any pro-Nazi rump there would be very small and very stupid. A true neo-Nazi movement? Can't see it..


Mind, also considering the long dark night the Russians have mostly come out of since 1991, perhaps it's also not surprising that communists and anarchists wouldn't get much consideration either. Judges probably see these young extremists in their casebooks all as bad as each other. Certainly, anti-fascists here seem to enjoy a rumble as much as the likes of the EDL.

Still, if a murder's been done then the perpetrators should be sent down properly for it with no excuses made.
 
Last edited:

Infinite Chaos

DP Veteran
Joined
Oct 28, 2007
Messages
18,504
Reaction score
8,591
Gender
Undisclosed
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
I shouldn't worry for a wave of Nazi sympathy across Russia. Given that the Nazis trashed, killed, burned and raped their way across Russia from 1941-43 I'd say any pro-Nazi rump there would be very small and very stupid. A true neo-Nazi movement? Can't see it..
Whether Russia becomes a Nazi style state only time will tell however one of the links I should have posted last night (can't find it this morning) was of a 1998 report where a journalist watched young racists handing out leaflets at a Russian war memorial gathering.

He noted the incongruity but also that the gatherers took the leaflets without question.

As for a small rump - it's certainly strained relations between the ethnic quarters of Russia and "European"Russia. The leaders in Tajikistan and Kyrgyzstan have complained to Putin and Medvedev, calling for transparent investigations.

-- Judges probably see these young extremists in their casebooks all as bad as each other.
One group of Nazis has been sentenced in 2007/8 and the judge who sent them down was shot dead this year. Not sure how that will affect things now - but the main claim by external groups was that low level bureaucrats and enforcement (police etc) had strong sympathies and would close an eye to such groups.

Certainly, anti-fascists here seem to enjoy a rumble as much as the likes of the EDL.

Still, if a murder's been done then the perpetrators should be sent down properly for it with no excuses made.
Neither the Antifa nor the EDL / National Front have committed 350 murders. That's how many racist murders have been committed in Russia in the last 6 years alone.

We allow groups like the BNP and the EDL here because of our free speech but they don't overstep the mark (as far as I know) into repeat murder because our policing is way better and our laws are enforced much better than in Russia. That's not to acknowledge the attacks on jewish graves or attacks on muslims etc.
 

Z3n

I invented Human Nature
DP Veteran
Joined
Jan 7, 2010
Messages
1,251
Reaction score
287
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Undisclosed
Anti-Fa and Neo-Nazis clash all the time in isolated incidences. If you want, @ the op, I can give you some links and websites to more information on this very underground struggle.

The problem is you have two groups of doctrinaire militants seeing the other as something completely imposing and existential to their worldview's progression.
 

FinnMacCool

DP Veteran
Joined
Aug 23, 2005
Messages
2,272
Reaction score
153
Location
South Shore of Long Island.
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Very Liberal
Anti-Fa and Neo-Nazis clash all the time in isolated incidences. If you want, @ the op, I can give you some links and websites to more information on this very underground struggle.
That would be nice, although I think I know a lot more about this struggle then the average person, as I'm an adamant antifa supporter, though not a blind one.

The problem is you have two groups of doctrinaire militants seeing the other as something completely imposing and existential to their worldview's progression.
Well both groups are very marginalized in today's society, but I support Antifa because I think in certain places and times, it is justifiable to use violence. The fact that another antifa member has been murdered, and the lack of action by the russian police, does bring up some questions though.
 

Republic_Of_Public

Banned
DP Veteran
Joined
Sep 16, 2009
Messages
2,922
Reaction score
343
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Conservative
In this country violence for political ends can get you arrested in the end, even if you're a darling of the 'anti-fash' branches of the media. But certain people will just never understand:

Communist Party of Great Britain - "Violence is alright as long as our people do it!"

http://www.debatepolitics.com/europe/68555-edl-choose-bolton.html



The extremist-backed UAF broke through police lines designed to keep them away from the EDL, who themselves had permission to stage their own demo. Over 50 UAF thugs were arrested, including boss Weyman Bennett on charges of conspiracy to commit violent disorder. Martin Smith also had his collar felt.

Riots have also been initiated against BNP-related events, for example at Oxford University where Nick Griffin had been invited to speak. Despite no grounds to pre-empt or defend from violent overtures by the BNP, baying UAF mobs intimidated and attacked people wishing to enter the hall, virtually regardless of their political affiliations or cares for Griffin himself.


Unless you're defending yourself, using mobs to cause trouble on the pretext of fighting fascism only makes you just as bad as any other thugs you say you're different from.

_________________________________________________________

Mind, others get off scot-free, leaving only Peter Tatchell to complain: http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/stand...lled-jews-filth-to-speak-at-kings-colleges.do

TRUE anti-fascists?! http://www.thestudentroom.co.uk/showthread.php?t=1080040
 
Last edited:

Hoplite

Technomancer
DP Veteran
Joined
Feb 6, 2010
Messages
3,779
Reaction score
1,077
Location
California
Gender
Male
Political Leaning
Moderate
I shouldn't worry for a wave of Nazi sympathy across Russia. Given that the Nazis trashed, killed, burned and raped their way across Russia from 1941-43 I'd say any pro-Nazi rump there would be very small and very stupid. A true neo-Nazi movement? Can't see it..
Actually the neo-nazi skinhead movement has found a resurgence among Russian youth. Many feel disenfranchised because of bad economic circumstances and blame a surge of immigration.
 
Top Bottom