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Another contradiction in the Bible

Valery

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Most Christians say Jesus is God, but the Bible says no one can see God and live.

Exodus 33:20 "But," he said, "you cannot see my face, for no one may see me and live.""

1 John 4:12 "No one has seen God at any time; if we love one another, God abides in us, and His love is perfected in us."

John 5:37 "And the Father who sent Me, He has testified of Me. You have neither heard His voice at any time nor seen His form."

This one's a real puzzle:

John 1:18 "No one has seen God at any time; the only begotten God who is in the bosom of the Father, He has explained Him."

Source: https://bible.knowing-jesus.com/topics/Not-Seeing-God
 

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The Qur'an states that it is a perfect book preserved on tablets in heaven (Surah 85:21-22). If the Qur'an is a perfect book from Allah, then there shouldn't be any contradictions in it. Of course, the Muslims will deny any contradictions exist in the Qur'an, but they do. Some of the contradictions below could be debated, but some of them are clearly contradictions.

 

Elora

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Most Christians say Jesus is God, but the Bible says no one can see God and live.

Exodus 33:20 "But," he said, "you cannot see my face, for no one may see me and live.""

1 John 4:12 "No one has seen God at any time; if we love one another, God abides in us, and His love is perfected in us."

John 5:37 "And the Father who sent Me, He has testified of Me. You have neither heard His voice at any time nor seen His form."

This one's a real puzzle:

John 1:18 "No one has seen God at any time; the only begotten God who is in the bosom of the Father, He has explained Him."

Source: https://bible.knowing-jesus.com/topics/Not-Seeing-God
From your fingertips to trinity believer's eyes/ears/mind...you've merely proven there is no contradiction there, only false doctrine...
 

tosca1

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Most Christians say Jesus is God, but the Bible says no one can see God and live.

Exodus 33:20 "But," he said, "you cannot see my face, for no one may see me and live.""

1 John 4:12 "No one has seen God at any time; if we love one another, God abides in us, and His love is perfected in us."

John 5:37 "And the Father who sent Me, He has testified of Me. You have neither heard His voice at any time nor seen His form."

This one's a real puzzle:

John 1:18 "No one has seen God at any time; the only begotten God who is in the bosom of the Father, He has explained Him."

Source: https://bible.knowing-jesus.com/topics/Not-Seeing-God
:rolleyes:

That's not a contradiction!


That's more support for Jesus being God! God in HUMAN FORM!
God as Jesus
, therefore - it's not like you're really seeing God's face!

Anyway - God is spirit - so how can people really see Him?
Maybe, we have to be physically dead to see Him. Maybe we have to be in the afterlife. 🤷

Furthermore, Hagar (the mother of Ishmael), saw God (in the form of the Angel of the Lord), and she lived!


Genesis 16
11 The angel of the Lord also said to her:

“You are now pregnant
and you will give birth to a son.
You shall name him Ishmael,[a]
for the Lord has heard of your misery.
12 He will be a wild donkey of a man;
his hand will be against everyone
and everyone’s hand against him,
and he will live in hostility
toward[b] all his brothers.”


13 She gave this name to the Lord who spoke to her: “You are the God who sees me,” for she said, “I have now seen the One who sees me.”


Therefore, we know it is possible to see God.
 
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tosca1

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With God, nothing is impossible!

Biblical people who saw God:


Isaiah 6
Isaiah’s Commission

6 In the year that King Uzziah died,
I saw the Lord, high and exalted, seated on a throne; and the train of his robe filled the temple.
2 Above him were seraphim, each with six wings: With two wings they covered their faces, with two they covered their feet, and with two they were flying.
3 And they were calling to one another:

“Holy, holy, holy is the Lord Almighty;
the whole earth is full of his glory.”

4 At the sound of their voices the doorposts and thresholds shook and the temple was filled with smoke.


5 “Woe to me!” I cried. “I am ruined! For I am a man of unclean lips, and I live among a people of unclean lips, and my eyes have seen the King,
the Lord Almighty.”
 

Valery

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:rolleyes:

That's not a contradiction!


That's more support for Jesus being God! God in HUMAN FORM!
God as Jesus
, therefore - it's not like you're really seeing God's face!

Anyway - God is spirit - so how can people really see Him?
Maybe, we have to be physically dead to see Him. Maybe we have to be in the afterlife. 🤷

Furthermore, Hagar (the mother of Ishmael), saw God (in the form of the Angel of the Lord), and she lived!


Genesis 16
11 The angel of the Lord also said to her:

“You are now pregnant
and you will give birth to a son.
You shall name him Ishmael,[a]
for the Lord has heard of your misery.
12 He will be a wild donkey of a man;
his hand will be against everyone
and everyone’s hand against him,
and he will live in hostility
toward[b] all his brothers.”


13 She gave this name to the Lord who spoke to her: “You are the God who sees me,” for she said, “I have now seen the One who sees me.”


Therefore, we know it is possible to see God.
That's more support for the contradiction. 😅

I know you come up with an excuse for everything, but rarely a convincing one. This one is of those less convincing ones.
 

tosca1

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Moses had seen God! he spoke with God, face-to-face!

Exodus 33

11 Thus
the Lord used to speak to Moses face to face, as a man speaks to his friend. When Moses turned again into the camp, his assistant Joshua the son of Nun, a young man, would not depart from the tent.
 

Elora

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With God, nothing is impossible!

Biblical people who saw God:


Isaiah 6
Isaiah’s Commission

6 In the year that King Uzziah died,
I saw the Lord, high and exalted, seated on a throne; and the train of his robe filled the temple.
2 Above him were seraphim, each with six wings: With two wings they covered their faces, with two they covered their feet, and with two they were flying.
3 And they were calling to one another:

“Holy, holy, holy is the Lord Almighty;
the whole earth is full of his glory.”

4 At the sound of their voices the doorposts and thresholds shook and the temple was filled with smoke.


5 “Woe to me!” I cried. “I am ruined! For I am a man of unclean lips, and I live among a people of unclean lips, and my eyes have seen the King,
the Lord Almighty.”
Woe to you...Isaiah was given a vision...
 

tosca1

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That's more support for the contradiction. 😅

I know you come up with an excuse for everything, but rarely a convincing one. This one is of those less convincing ones.

:)

looks like you're not getting the point. You should read it again.
 

tosca1

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Woe to you...Isaiah was given a vision...

Woe to you......Isaiah was given a vision - VISION OF GOD!

What's the difference?
 

Elora

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Moses had seen God! he spoke with God, face-to-face!

Exodus 33

11 Thus the Lord used to speak to Moses face to face, as a man speaks to his friend. When Moses turned again into the camp, his assistant Joshua the son of Nun, a young man, would not depart from the tent.
To believe that, you would have to believe the Bible lies...or you could accept the truth of the matter...Moses talked with God’s representative and orally received instruction from Jehovah through him, which was often the case...Moses did not see Jehovah, since ‘no man can see God and yet live'...Jehovah did not personally speak to Moses...the Law “was transmitted through angels by the hand of a mediator,” just as Galatians 3:19 states...
 

tosca1

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Most Christians say Jesus is God, but the Bible says no one can see God and live.

Exodus 33:20 "But," he said, "you cannot see my face, for no one may see me and live.""

1 John 4:12 "No one has seen God at any time; if we love one another, God abides in us, and His love is perfected in us."

John 5:37 "And the Father who sent Me, He has testified of Me. You have neither heard His voice at any time nor seen His form."

This one's a real puzzle:

John 1:18 "No one has seen God at any time; the only begotten God who is in the bosom of the Father, He has explained Him."

Source: https://bible.knowing-jesus.com/topics/Not-Seeing-God

To believe that, you would have to believe the Bible lies...or you could accept the truth of the matter...Moses talked with God’s representative and orally received instruction from Jehovah through him, which was often the case...Moses did not see Jehovah, since ‘no man can see God and yet live'...Jehovah did not personally speak to Moses...the Law “was transmitted through angels by the hand of a mediator,” just as Galatians 3:19 states...



Has anyone ever seen God?


Jesus was God in the flesh (John 1:1, 14) so when people saw Him, they were seeing God. So, yes, God can be “seen” and many people have “seen” God.
At the same time, no one has ever seen God revealed in
all His glory.

In our fallen human condition, if God were to fully reveal Himself to us, we would be consumed and destroyed.
Therefore, God veils Himself and appears in forms in which we can “see” Him.




In ALL HIS GLORY - there's the difference.


God veils Himself and appears in forms in which we can “see” Him.
He came as a human in Jesus Christ.
 

Elora

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Has anyone ever seen God?


Jesus was God in the flesh (John 1:1, 14) so when people saw Him, they were seeing God. So, yes, God can be “seen” and many people have “seen” God. At the same time, no one has ever seen God revealed in all His glory. In our fallen human condition, if God were to fully reveal Himself to us, we would be consumed and destroyed. Therefore, God veils Himself and appears in forms in which we can “see” Him.

So, you do believe the Bible lies...got it...
 

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God is not infallible and He does not bestow infallibility on anyone else or their writings.
 

Valery

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Has anyone ever seen God?


Jesus was God in the flesh (John 1:1, 14) so when people saw Him, they were seeing God. So, yes, God can be “seen” and many people have “seen” God.
At the same time, no one has ever seen God revealed in
all His glory.

In our fallen human condition, if God were to fully reveal Himself to us, we would be consumed and destroyed.
Therefore, God veils Himself and appears in forms in which we can “see” Him.




In ALL HIS GLORY - there's the difference.


God veils Himself and appears in forms in which we can “see” Him.
He came as a human in Jesus Christ.
Where did this "all His glory" come from? Does the bible say that when it says no one can see God? Does it say "no one can see God in all his glory"? If it does, you have yourself a weak argument. If it doesn't, you don't have an argument at all.
 

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To believe that, you would have to believe the Bible lies...or you could accept the truth of the matter...Moses talked with God’s representative and orally received instruction from Jehovah through him, which was often the case...Moses did not see Jehovah, since ‘no man can see God and yet live'...Jehovah did not personally speak to Moses...the Law “was transmitted through angels by the hand of a mediator,” just as Galatians 3:19 states...
So, you do believe the Bible lies...got it...

"Got it," ain't a magic term! Saying it doesn't make it happen. :ROFLMAO:

You think you got it.............................. but you don't. :ROFLMAO:
 

tosca1

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So, you do believe the Bible lies...got it...

Where did this "all His glory" come from? Does the bible say that when it says no one can see God? Does it say "no one can see God in all his glory"? If it does, you have yourself a weak argument. If it doesn't, you don't have an argument at all.
:oops:


Because of the verse you gave in your OP!

Exodus 33
20 But,” he said, “you cannot see my face, for man shall not see me and live.”



If God had obvioulsy appeared to men in different forms (angel and Jesus) - what can we assume from that if we take into account
what He said in Exodus 33:20?
Does He have to say it clearly, "therefore, I made myself look like this so he can see me......" :ROFLMAO:
Obviously, there's something about God that these people have not seen - thus, He was not seen in His "FULL GLORY."

That's called logical thinking!

Therefore, we can assume that He's "modified" Himself to be seen by men!




Exodus 33
18 Then Moses said, “Now show me your glory.”

19 And the Lord said, “I will cause all my goodness to pass in front of you, and I will proclaim my name, the Lord, in your presence. I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.
20 But,” he said, “you cannot see my face, for no one may see me and live.”


21 Then the Lord said, “There is a place near me where you may stand on a rock. 22 When my glory passes by, I will put you in a cleft in the rock and cover you with my hand until I have passed by.
23 Then I will remove my hand and you will see my back; but
my face must not be seen.”





See, this is what I mean when I say........................................ you and Elvira, aren't getting it! (n)
 
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Why do you think that?
The nature of the material world is that of shifting sand, in it there is no truth or reality.

Perfection and infallibility exist in the Spiritual world.

There is another corollary associated with the above postulate: Satan doesn't need to produce any counterfeit Scripture, he just uses the ones that God writes.

As a result, God often doesn't write much Himself.

Christ wrote only a few words in the Sand and Caitanya only wrote six verses.

In school did Christ only get one-hundred?

No, so we see that God takes on our limited condition.
 

tosca1

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Most Christians say Jesus is God, but the Bible says no one can see God and live.

Exodus 33:20 "But," he said, "you cannot see my face, for no one may see me and live.""

1 John 4:12 "No one has seen God at any time; if we love one another, God abides in us, and His love is perfected in us."

John 5:37 "And the Father who sent Me, He has testified of Me. You have neither heard His voice at any time nor seen His form."

This one's a real puzzle:

John 1:18 "No one has seen God at any time; the only begotten God who is in the bosom of the Father, He has explained Him."

Source: https://bible.knowing-jesus.com/topics/Not-Seeing-God


Lol... Did you create this thread to distract from the Quran Contradictions I created? :LOL:

Just so you know - I haven't abandoned that thread.
There are so many Quran contradictions I can't make up my mind which ones to post after that first one.
Lol, you seem tongue-tied with that first one - you haven't said a peep! Hahahahaha I'm distracted by the election too - so that gives you a little reprieve. :D
 

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Where did this "all His glory" come from? Does the bible say that when it says no one can see God? Does it say "no one can see God in all his glory"? If it does, you have yourself a weak argument. If it doesn't, you don't have an argument at all.
The god that appeared to Moses was not God, but a cosmic being, it says, "I appeared before Abraham as God."

Just a simple feat of a burning bush and everyone runs around proving God.

To prove God you would have to be bigger than Him.

Moses and Abraham never existed.

There is no reason to believe it, although God could make it the history.

Israel came from the cities of Jericho that fell over seventy years from internal struggle.

Clever priests from India knew of the Lord's approach and preached to the people living in the hills.

The actual history begins in the book of Judges when they said, "Behold, I have given the land unto Judah's hand."
 

Valery

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And so... The voice Jesus spoke with, also was not the voice of God? And the voice Moses heard? And the voice that spoke from the heavens when Jesus was baptised?

John 5:37 "And the Father who sent me has himself testified concerning me. You have never heard his voice nor seen his form,"

It is odd, though, that Jesus would say, "you have never heard his voice or seen his form," because the Bible says that God is spirit. Spirit doesn't have a form. Unless — unless, Jesus meant, that they have never seen God. Full stop.
 

tosca1

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And so... The voice Jesus spoke with, also was not the voice of God? And the voice Moses heard? And the voice that spoke from the heavens when Jesus was baptised?
:rolleyes:


That's so pathetic! Valery -have you seen ventriloquists having conversations with their dummies?:LOL:
Think man - if ventriloquists can do it - why can't God?


Why would God introduce Jesus as His only begotten Son? Didn't God show us (through Jesus) what He means by obedience to the Father?

This has been explained in this thread:



Kindly wrap your heads around this fact:

With God, nothing is impossible!






It is odd, though, that Jesus would say, "you have never heard his voice or seen his form," because the Bible says that God is spirit. Spirit doesn't have a form. Unless — unless, Jesus meant, that they have never seen God. Full stop.
:oops:

How many times do I have to explain this?

You can re-frame the same thing in many different ways - it won't change the answer.

Read POST #18


With God, nothing is impossible!
 

Elora

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:rolleyes:


That's so pathetic! Valery -have you seen ventriloquists having conversations with their dummies?:LOL:
Think man - if ventriloquists can do it - why can't God?


Why would God introduce Jesus as His only begotten Son? Didn't God show us (through Jesus) what He means by obedience to the Father?

This has been explained in this thread:



Kindly wrap your heads around this fact:

With God, nothing is impossible!







:oops:

How many times do I have to explain this?

You can re-frame the same thing in many different ways - it won't change the answer.

Read POST #18


With God, nothing is impossible!
One thing is impossible with God...He does NOT lie, in spite of how you bend the sctripures...
 

tosca1

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One thing is impossible with God...He does NOT lie, in spite of how you bend the sctripures...
:rolleyes:


...........sez the JW recruiter with the JW PHD on Scriptural Butchery. :p


Forget what JW forbids you. If you're participating in a forum ..............................you should read!




That's what happens when you try to debate without reading - your responses tend to be off-key. They're so lame. :ROFLMAO:
Spitting out your lines is kinda like watching an unfunny sitcom with canned laughter! It's so fake! :ROFLMAO:










One thing is impossible with God...He does NOT lie

.....so, don't make Him into a liar!

Don't try to distort and mould the Scriptures into your JW false doctrine.
Because that's what you do when you insists Jesus is not God Himself in human form!


Not only that, you end up practicing idolatry if Jesus is not God Himself. You do to Jesus what Muslims do to Mohammad!

You become a polytheist like Valery!
 
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