Gordy327
DP Veteran
- Joined
- Feb 5, 2022
- Messages
- 22,552
- Reaction score
- 18,595
- Gender
- Undisclosed
- Political Leaning
- Undisclosed
"The purpose of separation of church and state is to keep forever from these shores the ceaseless strife that has soaked the soil of Europe in blood for centuries." James Madison, 1803
I've have on occasion been engaged in articles and with individuals who proclaim that America was founded on "Christian principles" (or is a Christian nation). Often, such claims are made to promote one's own religious beliefs above others or seek to validate those beliefs. Of course, such an assertion is not only based on Christian apologetic nonsense, but it is also factually and historically erroneous. Proponents of the "Christian principle/nation' position may also attempt to quote the founding fathers to support their position. But the quotes cited are often edited, misquoted, or outright false and are usually taken from religiously biased sites or secondary sources. David Barton and the Wallbuilders is one such example. Using such questionable sources and positing the "Christian principle" (or the similarly erroneous 'Christian nation') idea is either willfully ignorant and/or dishonest at best, and clearly demonstrates a lack of credibility on their part. So, to be perfectly clear, America was certainly NOT founded on Christian principles or as a "Christian nation," or any other religious ideology for that matter. Here's why:
Let's start with the document that establishes the foundation of our laws and system of government, the United States Constitution. Many theists will claim the Constitution is divinely inspired or influenced by the religious beliefs of its authors. Nothing could be further from the truth, and a simple review of the Constitution makes this abundantly clear. The Constitution itself is based on English Common Law and the principles of Enlightenment, along with earlier documents of similar concepts such as the Magna Carta. Also, there is (very deliberately) not any religious ideology (Christian or otherwise) or deity referenced within the Constitution or even in the Articles of Confederation, which preceded the Constitution. Neither did the Founding Fathers have religious ideas in mind when drafting the Constitution. Those points are strongly supported by John Adams in his work (emphasis mine), “A Defence of the Constitutions of Government of the United States of America” (1787-1788):
The United States of America have exhibited, perhaps, the first example of governments erected on the simple principles of nature; and if men are now sufficiently enlightened to disabuse themselves of artifice, imposture, hypocrisy, and superstition, they will consider this event as an era in their history. Although the detail of the formation of the American governments is at present little known or regarded either in Europe or in America, it may hereafter become an object of curiosity. It will never be pretended that any persons employed in that service had interviews with the gods, or were in any degree under the influence of Heaven, more than those at work upon ships or houses, or laboring in merchandise or agriculture; it will forever be acknowledged that these governments were contrived merely by the use of reason and the senses.
Mr. Adams could not have been more clear in stating that religion had no place or say in the formation of this country or drafting of the Constitution. If indeed the Founding Fathers had aimed to found a nation based on "Christian principles," it would seem highly unlikely that they would have forgotten to leave out their Christian intentions in the Supreme law of the land. Given that the Founding Fathers did not incorporate any religious ideology or "Christian principles" within the Constitution itself is quite damning and directly opposes any notion of America being founded on "Christian principles."
In addition, the fact that the United States is not founded on Christianity is bluntly stated in Article 11 of the Treaty of Tripoli, drafted in 1796 under George Washington, passed unanimously by Congress (unusual for the time), and signed by John Adams in 1797 (emphasis mine): "As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion,—as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquility, of Mussulmen,—and as the said States never entered into any war or act of hostility against any Mahometan nation, it is declared by the parties that no pretext arising from religious opinions shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries."
---Continued---
I've have on occasion been engaged in articles and with individuals who proclaim that America was founded on "Christian principles" (or is a Christian nation). Often, such claims are made to promote one's own religious beliefs above others or seek to validate those beliefs. Of course, such an assertion is not only based on Christian apologetic nonsense, but it is also factually and historically erroneous. Proponents of the "Christian principle/nation' position may also attempt to quote the founding fathers to support their position. But the quotes cited are often edited, misquoted, or outright false and are usually taken from religiously biased sites or secondary sources. David Barton and the Wallbuilders is one such example. Using such questionable sources and positing the "Christian principle" (or the similarly erroneous 'Christian nation') idea is either willfully ignorant and/or dishonest at best, and clearly demonstrates a lack of credibility on their part. So, to be perfectly clear, America was certainly NOT founded on Christian principles or as a "Christian nation," or any other religious ideology for that matter. Here's why:
Let's start with the document that establishes the foundation of our laws and system of government, the United States Constitution. Many theists will claim the Constitution is divinely inspired or influenced by the religious beliefs of its authors. Nothing could be further from the truth, and a simple review of the Constitution makes this abundantly clear. The Constitution itself is based on English Common Law and the principles of Enlightenment, along with earlier documents of similar concepts such as the Magna Carta. Also, there is (very deliberately) not any religious ideology (Christian or otherwise) or deity referenced within the Constitution or even in the Articles of Confederation, which preceded the Constitution. Neither did the Founding Fathers have religious ideas in mind when drafting the Constitution. Those points are strongly supported by John Adams in his work (emphasis mine), “A Defence of the Constitutions of Government of the United States of America” (1787-1788):
The United States of America have exhibited, perhaps, the first example of governments erected on the simple principles of nature; and if men are now sufficiently enlightened to disabuse themselves of artifice, imposture, hypocrisy, and superstition, they will consider this event as an era in their history. Although the detail of the formation of the American governments is at present little known or regarded either in Europe or in America, it may hereafter become an object of curiosity. It will never be pretended that any persons employed in that service had interviews with the gods, or were in any degree under the influence of Heaven, more than those at work upon ships or houses, or laboring in merchandise or agriculture; it will forever be acknowledged that these governments were contrived merely by the use of reason and the senses.
Mr. Adams could not have been more clear in stating that religion had no place or say in the formation of this country or drafting of the Constitution. If indeed the Founding Fathers had aimed to found a nation based on "Christian principles," it would seem highly unlikely that they would have forgotten to leave out their Christian intentions in the Supreme law of the land. Given that the Founding Fathers did not incorporate any religious ideology or "Christian principles" within the Constitution itself is quite damning and directly opposes any notion of America being founded on "Christian principles."
In addition, the fact that the United States is not founded on Christianity is bluntly stated in Article 11 of the Treaty of Tripoli, drafted in 1796 under George Washington, passed unanimously by Congress (unusual for the time), and signed by John Adams in 1797 (emphasis mine): "As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion,—as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquility, of Mussulmen,—and as the said States never entered into any war or act of hostility against any Mahometan nation, it is declared by the parties that no pretext arising from religious opinions shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries."
---Continued---
R You're wrong.
