America Could Use a Liberal Party

[Rawley]

You can push your spin, and that's all it amounts to.... If you have not read any of the policy... pushing your right wing folklore spin, is only a self deluding cycle of willful ignorance to the fact, you have not read anything about the immigrant policies. No one other than Conservatives, would buy into your folklore spin cycle of commentary.

Suggestion: Reading and Learning would be beneficial, if you'd invest in doing so.

No substance, ad hom again. We're done.

 

[NolanVoyd]

Yup I gave you seven incontrovertable ways he's thrown open the door. You've provided none in his defense.

Nonsense.

You need sources that will be honest with you.

 

[MrWonka]

IMO, the two legacy parties no longer adequately represent that volume of space where most of America exists politically.

Really? Cause where I'm sitting the Democratic Party is abso****inglutely a Liberal party. It's just that millions of morons are too dumb to grasp basic concepts.

 

[Perotista]

Opinion | America Could Use a Liberal Party (Published 2021)

The new division in politics isn’t between liberals and conservatives. It’s between liberals and illiberals.

www.nytimes.com

IMO, the two legacy parties no longer adequately represent that volume of space where most of America exists politically.

If you're talking classic liberalism which our founders were, not the nanny state liberals of today, I agree. The main problem with having a viable third party is that Republicans and Democrats write our election laws as a mutual protection act. If there is one thing both major parties agree on, it's no viable third party will ever rise. Then there is the financial aspect of it. Both major parties owe their hearts and souls to corporations, wall street firms, special interests, lobbyist, mega money donors etc. That where both major parties gets their tens and hundreds of million of dollars to run their campaigns and organizations.

An example for 2016, Joe Biden raised and spent 1.6 billion, Trump 1.1 billion rounded off. Jo Jorgensen, Libertarian Party and the next highest in the money game rasied and spent 2.9 million. If you add up all third party and independent candidates money for 2020 you come out to 6 million dollars vs. the 2.7 billion advantage for the two major parties.

Then you have ballot access, Republicans and Democrats have automatic ballot access, all other parties and independents do not and have to jump through a million and one hoops just to get on the ballot. There's many other reasons for no viable third party. But I think the numbers that emphasis Gallup and the feeling that neither party represents them anymore is the rise in independents from 30% of the electorate in 2006 to 41% today while both major parties shrink. But the two major parties have absolute power when it comes to elections and money, so they could shrink to 10% of the total electorate and still be in total control.

 

[MrWonka]

Also known as the centrists.

The centrists? You mean a bunch of white people who don't want to be full-blown racist, but also know it's not really hurting them and don't want to give up too much white privilege.

 

[calamity]

Opinion | America Could Use a Liberal Party (Published 2021)

The new division in politics isn’t between liberals and conservatives. It’s between liberals and illiberals.

www.nytimes.com

IMO, the two legacy parties no longer adequately represent that volume of space where most of America exists politically.

A Middle of the Road Party consisting of moderate Repubs and Centrist Dems would be the direction I prefer to see things go. Let the extremists fight it out on the fringes.

 

[Bullseye]

Because it is a fact.

Bernie lost. Biden won.

Obviously.

And Biden is no moderate. Obviously: He enlisted Bernie and AOC as consultants. throttled our energy production, opened our borders, and is plotting to steal more of our earning to spent on LW brain farts.

 

[NolanVoyd]

And Biden is no moderate. Obviously: He enlisted Bernie and AOC as consultants. throttled our energy production, opened our borders, and is plotting to steal more of our earning to spent on LW brain farts.

Not even close. He is a life long moderate. The Republican party has just moved so far to the right that even Reagan with his tax increases, amnesty, and gun control is now a liberal.

 

[Bullseye]

Not even close. He is a life long moderate. The Republican party has just moved so far to the right that even Reagan with his tax increases, amnesty, and gun control is now a liberal.

LOL, sure. Tell yourself whatever baloney you need.

 

[Irwin Corey]

America Could Use a Liberal Party

No kidding; what with tRump hamstring all efforts for a smooth and peacefull transistion AND Covid, it's been heads down and butts up. No time to Party for liberals.

 

[MaryP]

Opinion | America Could Use a Liberal Party (Published 2021)

The new division in politics isn’t between liberals and conservatives. It’s between liberals and illiberals.

www.nytimes.com

IMO, the two legacy parties no longer adequately represent that volume of space where most of America exists politically.

I like the sound of that. When do we get past the talking stage? I'm ready to send my

We do have a liberal party: Democratic. The problem is only having one liberal party - not separate socialist, progressive, and liberal parties to get rid of all this "Democrats are socialists and Communists" crap in which moderate Democrats are lumped together with the true socialists who like Bernie Sanders and AOC.

Yes. The Op Ed in the OP didn't mention that the Democrats have their own problems with an extreme wing, and right now it is as loud as the far right. I don't know about anyone else, but it's sure turning me off. Well, I'm an Independent who has never voted a straight ticket in my life. But at this point, my answer is NEITHER!!!

 

[Jay59]

Your claim that Biden "threw open the border",as well as much of your above post is ridiculously factually false. Right wing media is feeding you misinformation again. Facts matter.

I will give you the right wing part, but that does not make it untrue. National Review did a long think piece on how the Trump administration gained control of the border and how the Biden administration threw it away.

The Law Wasn’t the Problem​

As the migrant crisis of 2018–19 built, it became common to say (I wrote it many times myself) that only Congress could reverse the foolish policies and destructive court decisions that made it impossible to stop the tide of migrants coming into the country. The key insight of the administration’s immigration hawks, though, was that the statutory authority already existed to establish order at the border. It was just that the laws providing crucial enforcement tools had never been used, or become encrusted over time with regulatory practices and judicial decisions that made the system balky and ultimately unworkable.​

​

A former official familiar with the issue explains, “If you actually look at and read and understand our immigration laws, they provide for a fair amount of enforcement. These laws were passed, a lot of them in the Nineties; several of the significant bills and laws we relied upon were signed into law by Bill Clinton or supported in a bipartisan way.” The administration’s hawks undertook a constant interrogation of the standard operating procedure: Why are we doing it this way? Is there a law? If not, why can’t we change?​

...​

Overall, the administration had created a tool kit with which it could address the border in multiple ways. “There were a number of pathways that were available to conclude cases quickly,” says the former DHS official. “And the word got out that we were no longer open for business, that it was not just presenting yourself at the border and getting in anywhere you want to go in the country.”​

​

Biden Begins the Great Unraveling​

The word getting out now is the exact opposite. Biden carved out an exception for minors in Title 42, and predictably there has been a surge of minors. He has ended MPP, and thus denied the United States a carefully crafted program to give deserving asylum-seekers full access to our asylum system, without permitting a swath of migrants into the United States regardless of the merits.​

​

If the name of the game in border enforcement is keeping migrants out of the United States, because it will be difficult or impossible to remove them once again, Biden is moving toward giving up on enforcement. The Trump team handed him a road map to controlling the border that he doesn’t want to learn from, or even acknowledge, and so the crisis is starting again, with worse likely to come.​

How Trump Got Control of the Border | National Review

And how Biden created a crisis by throwing it all away.

www.nationalreview.com

One thing that will be a continuing problem for Biden is that the Trump administration was good at its job. This is one example where Biden's people screwed things up because they thought they knew more than the previous group and were wrong.

Why would you make such a JOKE... Everyone knows that is so far from Fact, that its absurd that anyone would even make such a statement.

Because the statement is true.

Classical liberal thinkers--JS Mill, Locke, de Montesquieu, Hume and others--focused on the rights and responsibilities of the individual as distinct from the duties and obligations to the state. The Republican party is the one which most reflects that mindset. Democrats most reflect the royalist views of the period, with the crown morphed into the central authority. It's noteworthy that the later liberal thinker embraced Adam Smith's work.

The centrists? You mean a bunch of white people who don't want to be full-blown racist, but also know it's not really hurting them and don't want to give up too much white privilege.

That's a very racist comment.

Not even close. He is a life long moderate. The Republican party has just moved so far to the right that even Reagan with his tax increases, amnesty, and gun control is now a liberal.

Blaming Reagan for tax increases is akin to blaming Obama for fracking, ie coincidental in time but largely out of the President's control.

 

[RealityNow]

And Biden is no moderate. Obviously: He enlisted Bernie and AOC as consultants. throttled our energy production, opened our borders, and is plotting to steal more of our earning to spent on LW brain farts.

Geez.... what world does this comment come from, because it certainly is not reality.
If you truly believe what you wrote?
Be sure to spread the world to any, that any benefits the government provides that anyone who holds such personal thoughts, send it back with all expediency, including the $1400. while doing so, send back the $600 and don't forget to send the previous $1200, be sure to reimburse the government for the cost of the vaccine if you've taken it.

 

[NolanVoyd]

LOL, sure. Tell yourself whatever baloney you need.

Just the facts mam.

 

[NolanVoyd]

Geez.... what world does this comment come from, because it certainly is not reality.
If you truly believe what you wrote?
Be sure to spread the world to any, that any benefits the government provides that anyone who holds such personal thoughts, send it back with all expediency, including the $1400. while doing so, send back the $600 and don't forget to send the previous $1200, be sure to reimburse the government for the cost of the vaccine if you've taken it.

Trumps ridiculous and cruel policies are what created the problem that Biden is competently and morally dealing with at the border.

 

[Patriotic Voter]

Yes. The Op Ed in the OP didn't mention that the Democrats have their own problems with an extreme wing, and right now it is as loud as the far right. I don't know about anyone else, but it's sure turning me off. Well, I'm an Independent who has never voted a straight ticket in my life. But at this point, my answer is NEITHER!

Extreme Democrats are not a problem like extreme Republicans. You never see them worshiping Bernie Sanders. They complain about left-leaning moderates being too far right, but never call them Republicans in disguise. That is what all Republicans who still think Donald Trump can never make a mistake call everyone moving away from him and toward Ronald Reagan policies: Republicans In Name Only. For one party, divisoin is all about policies. For the other, it is all about choosing between love and hate.

 

[MaryP]

Biden ripped up the Asylum Cooperative Agreements with El Salvador, Guatemala, and Honduras.

He needed to. My understanding is, that agreement made those three countries " Safe havens." Three of the most dangerous and violent countries in this hemisphere? That was a total joke. But it only took effect in one country for a few months and was put on hold by Covid in March 2020. The agreements with the other two countries never went into force.

President Biden will carry on the cooperative agreements to help those countries get their shit together so people won't need to leave in droves..

 

[craig]

None of you care about our country. You argue back an forth trying to make points from the left or the right. And you know the only way can be successful is if we govern from the center. So stop assuaging your egos and help make our country work.

 

[Bullseye]

Just the facts mam.

Not even close.

 

[Bullseye]

Geez.... what world does this comment come from, because it certainly is not reality.

Sorry to burst your bubble but it’s dead on true.

If you truly believe what you wrote?
Be sure to spread the world to any, that any benefits the government provides that anyone who holds such personal thoughts, send it back with all expediency, including the $1400. while doing so, send back the $600 and don't forget to send the previous $1200, be sure to reimburse the government for the cost of the vaccine if you've taken it.

What?

 

[NolanVoyd]

Not even close.

Reagan supported gun control, raised taxes and gave amnesty to illegals. The Republican party has moved so far to the right that Reagan would be a 'radical leftist' according to today's Republicans.

Fact: Biden is a life long moderate. Today's Republicans are so out of touch with reality and history they think he is some sort of leftist.

 

[Bullseye]

Reagan supported gun control, raised taxes and gave amnesty to illegals. The Republican party has moved so far to the right that Reagan would be a 'radical leftist'.

Reagan hasn’t been President for decades; why should I care what he did back then?

 

[NolanVoyd]

Reagan hasn’t been President for decades; why should I care what he did back then?

Because it proves how far the Republicans have moved to the right. Reagan used to be a conservative icon. To today's Republicans he was a radical leftist.

 

[Bullseye]

Reagan supported gun control, raised taxes and gave amnesty to illegals. The Republican party has moved so far to the right that Reagan would be a 'radical leftist' according to today's Republicans.

Fact: Biden is a life long moderate. Today's Republicans are so out of touch with reality and history they think he is some sort of leftist.

Fact: He includes AOC and Bernie among his advisors - that’s not the sign of a moderate. He made be less radical than those two, but he’s not a moderate.

 

[NolanVoyd]

Fact: He includes AOC and Bernie among his advisors - that’s not the sign of a moderate. He made be less radical than those two, but he’s not a moderate.

Right.

That is called a coalition. Biden is a moderate, he tries to include both the left (Bernie) and the right (Manchin and sinema).

Sorry I had to explain that to you.