Am I wrong about the School kids thing?

[Mycroft]

Certainly. There are symbols that instantly relay meaning - good and bad - accurate and perhaps less so - when people see them. The old Confederate stars & bars is one such symbol. The German Nazi swastika for another. And now its MAGA hats. When somebody who does not subscribe to the movement behind the symbol sees them, a set of beliefs and political positions instantly becomes clear in the mind of the observer.

I was struck by the NBC interview with the young man - Nick Sandmann - this morning and I really had to look twice to make sure they had the right kid. In the infamous video he looks like a real smug smartass punk enjoying getting in that older mans face. Then you see him being interviewed by Savannah Guthrie and he looks like a fairly normal kid. Regardless if he is that or not - that is the image we saw with the hateful MAGA hat perched upon his head. That is the message that came across to the nation.

The difference: the MAGA hat. The symbol of Trump and his administration and everything that goes with it. And for many, he is a symbol of bigotry and sexism and authoritarianism and outright political ignorance bordering on criminal negligence which is harming our nation and its people.

Like it or not. Fair or not. Accurate or not. For many, the MAGA hat has become a symbol of hate just like the confederate flag and the German swastika. Those who wear it, especially in political situations, risk others making judgments about them.

That is simply reality right now.

I added to the section you highlighted in read to further clarify it for you.

You haven't clarified anything. You just repeated yourself...including the debunked nonsense that has degraded your credibility.

 

[Chillfolks]

Certainly.... Edit for space.....
I added to the section you highlighted in read to further clarify it for you.

You allowed your prejudice of what you see as the stereotype of a MAGA hat wearer influence your perception of the situation. This is the same thing we see over and over when we talk about teens in hoodies or non customers in Starbucks

 

[haymarket]

You haven't clarified anything. You just repeated yourself...including the debunked nonsense that has degraded your credibility.

You need to go back and read again as I added the clarification you begged for.

 

[haymarket]

You allowed your prejudice of what you see as the stereotype of a MAGA hat wearer influence your perception of the situation. This is the same thing we see over and over when we talk about teens in hoodies or non customers in Starbucks

The reality is that millions of patriotic Americans see a MAGA hat and make a negative judgment about the wearer because Trump has become symbolic of prejudice and racism and sexism and disrespect for the law and for our institutions.

 

[Mycroft]

You need to go back and read again as I added the clarification you begged for.

You need to pay attention to what I highlight.

 

[haymarket]

You need to pay attention to what I highlight.

I did. And I elaborated on it just as you asked.

Are you daring to pretend that the one line you highlighted is to be considered apart from everything else that surrounded it?

 

[Mycroft]

I did. And I elaborated on it just as you asked.

Are you daring to pretend that the one line you highlighted is to be considered apart from everything else that surrounded it?

I already told you...that one line reduces any credibility you might think you have. It makes everything else you blathered dismissable.

Now don't bother me any more. You know you don't really care what I think.

 

[Chillfolks]

The reality is that millions of patriotic Americans see a MAGA hat and make a negative judgment about the wearer because Trump has become symbolic of prejudice and racism and sexism and disrespect for the law and for our institutions.

You can make all the excuses you want/need to. Until you try and over come the prejudices you have nothing will change, you will always stereotype people based on what you see on the outside.

 

[Fletch]

Isn't it GREAT to have a total non issue to whip up the fauxrage in order to distract from the fact your Traitor bumbling fool, wimp, president is gonna go down before he can even get on the 2020 ballot? Simply MAGA huh?:2rofll:

Do any of you liberals pay attention or think for yourselves? It seems not. This issue was 'whipped up' by the left, not the right. It is impossible that you dont know this. Yet you dont. The rest of your post is just complete idiocy.

 

[Checkerboard Strangler]

First let me say i am Catholic and a Trustee of my church so I have no problem with Catholics. Okay, it seems that the more I hear about this confrontation between the Native Americans and the Catholic School kids it seems that the whole thing started with a confrontation between the kids and a group of black Jewish demonstrators. The two groups were apparently yelling at each other when the small group, sounds like three, Native Americans came along and tried to come between the two groups. Then the Catholic kids encircled the three Native Americans and got in their face, with the one Catholic kid seeming to get right in the face of the leader of the Native Americans. The Catholic kid seemed to enjoy the confrontation and looked as if he was smirking at him. I think that the many racist images of those who wear these MAGA hats may influence how each of us feels about the pictures and videos we have seen of this confrontation. Am I wrong in how I portray this incident, if so how?

1. They weren't "black jewish" demonstrators. (LOL)
No Jews actually recognize them as Jewish, they are "Black Hebrew Israelites" who claim that they are the ONLY legitimate descendants of the "twelve tribes of Israel" and THEY do not recognize ANYBODY, not other Jews, not even other black people.
The closest thing to these fools is the Westboro Baptist Church, because according to these so called "israelites" everyone else is going to Hell. And confronting others is what they do, it's ALL they ever do.

2. These Native American drummers have been down there in that patch of monument land for DECADES.
They drum every day, they go up to people and drum at them every day, that is what THEY do.
They were there back in the early 70's when I WAS the age of those Catholic kids from Kentucky.

3. I doubt those little Kentucky country-ass teeny-boppers have ever seen a spectacle like what they encountered that day, not in their entire lives. But I'd bet twenty bucks that the political groups that chaperoned them while in DC see it every single day, because for all these groups, including the March for Life folks, the Israelites and the drummers, this is something of an ad hoc cottage "industry" in DC.

The only group that didn't know what to expect were those kids. Everyone else was in on the gig, including the folks who brought them there. They've been busing in loads of kids, grownups, fanatics, teachers, lobbyists and what not since 1974.
That is what THEY do.

This is the typical everyday scene in that part of DC, every single day, rain or shine.

 

[GhostlyJoe]

1. They weren't "black jewish" demonstrators. (LOL)
No Jews actually recognize them as Jewish, they are "Black Hebrew Israelites" who claim that they are the ONLY legitimate descendants of the "twelve tribes of Israel" and THEY do not recognize ANYBODY, not other Jews, not even other black people.
The closest thing to these fools is the Westboro Baptist Church, because according to these so called "israelites" everyone else is going to Hell. And confronting others is what they do, it's ALL they ever do.

2. These Native American drummers have been down there in that patch of monument land for DECADES.
They drum every day, they go up to people and drum at them every day, that is what THEY do.
They were there back in the early 70's when I WAS the age of those Catholic kids from Kentucky.

3. I doubt those little Kentucky country-ass teeny-boppers have ever seen a spectacle like what they encountered that day, not in their entire lives. But I'd bet twenty bucks that the political groups that chaperoned them while in DC see it every single day, because for all these groups, including the March for Life folks, the Israelites and the drummers, this is something of an ad hoc cottage "industry" in DC.

The only group that didn't know what to expect were those kids. Everyone else was in on the gig, including the folks who brought them there. They've been busing in loads of kids, grownups, fanatics, teachers, lobbyists and what not since 1974.
That is what THEY do.

This is the typical everyday scene in that part of DC, every single day, rain or shine.

So, recognizing that most of your post is probably pretty accurate, I wonder what civics lesson you think these kids learned from this incident. I bet they and their families are more radical now than before. I bet they've come away more aware -- and probably thinking that liberals are absolute monsters.

 

[Checkerboard Strangler]

So, recognizing that most of your post is probably pretty accurate, I wonder what civics lesson you think these kids learned from this incident. I bet they and their families are more radical now than before. I bet they've come away more aware -- and probably thinking that liberals are absolute monsters.

Absolutely and I am sad to say that one can also witness similar ****-shows from the far Left OR far Right at different times and points during any given day as well. The so called "town square" always was worth whatever the body politic was willing to invest in it and not a scintilla more.

Well, we all see what happens on "thuh innernets".
Well, back when I was a teen growing up in the DC suburbs of Maryland, it was impossible to traverse that vast expanse of downtown DC without at least four or five googly-eyed fanatics trying to stuff some sweaty mimeographed parchment in your face...usually having to do with the end of the world or some far-out theory involving international bankers or UFO's or whatever your imagination can come up with.

Not much has changed except for the efficiency of the delivery system, oh and...you don't have to smell their breath.

PS: The old Indian drummers do what they do because they are convinced that Creator has instructed them to do it, whatever that means, but I suspect it is more or less closer to their original purpose than most of the other groups.
That's not to say that they're some paragon of virtue...after all, these guys have lived in DC for a generation.
I'm just saying that if one were to ask what they're drumming for, the stock answer is usually something along the lines of "justice for Native Americans" with some twinkle added for extra spice, like Russell Means or Wounded Knee or the latest pipeline scandals.

 

[Mr Person]

No...no not again. Stop it.

 

[Mr Person]

Do any of you liberals pay attention or think for yourselves? It seems not. This issue was 'whipped up' by the left, not the right. It is impossible that you dont know this. Yet you dont. The rest of your post is just complete idiocy.

Something like 95% of the threads on DP about this are made by conservatives.


STOP

 

[Hypothetical]

Something like 95% of the threads on DP about this are made by conservatives.


STOP

but its a real good subject.

 

[Mr Person]

but its a real good subject.

For what?

A bunch of people sucked to varying degrees and in varying directions. Then some other people sucked. Then we argued about sucking. And now.....wellll....?

 

[Fletch]

Something like 95% of the threads on DP about this are made by conservatives.


STOP

The ISSUE was whipped up by the left. Why would you deny that?



STOP lying and defending liberal idiocy

 

[Fletch]

So, recognizing that most of your post is probably pretty accurate, I wonder what civics lesson you think these kids learned from this incident. I bet they and their families are more radical now than before. I bet they've come away more aware -- and probably thinking that liberals are absolute monsters.

Is there another conclusion to draw? Particularly considering the reaction from mindless liberals in the media and Hollywood and here at DP. Go and review what people on the left said about these kids when the story broke and many continue to say today, then tell me what conclusion you think they should draw.

 

[haymarket]

I already told you...that one line reduces any credibility you might think you have. It makes everything else you blathered dismissable.

Now don't bother me any more. You know you don't really care what I think.

I do not care what you think. That is correct. For you to pretend that what you requested was not provided is a denial of reality.

 

[haymarket]

You can make all the excuses you want/need to. Until you try and over come the prejudices you have nothing will change, you will always stereotype people based on what you see on the outside.

Wearing a MAGA hat is intended to send a political message. Neither you nor anyone who wears one should be surprised when others see it and understand loud and clear what the message is.

 

[Chillfolks]

Wearing a MAGA hat is intended to send a political message. Neither you nor anyone who wears one should be surprised when others see it and understand loud and clear what the message is.

That is the problem. The message you, and others like you think understand is often not what the wearer intended. Instead of listening or talking to the person under the hat you’ve already judged that person based solely on their outward appearance. Do you think judging people on appearance only is a good policy

 

[haymarket]

[/b]

That is the problem. The message you, and others like you think understand is often not what the wearer intended. Instead of listening or talking to the person under the hat you’ve already judged that person based solely on their outward appearance. Do you think judging people on appearance only is a good policy

Let me tell you a story which will answer your question. In the late 1960's I had very long hair and a junk car with anti-war stickers on it. One day I was commuting to college from my folks home where I lived and a cop pulled me out of several cars and gave me a ticket for speeding. I related the story to my father expressing my anger that I had been picked out for obvious reasons. My father looked at me and gave me a bit of blue-collar wisdom :

when you put a target on your chest, don't be surprised when people shoot at it.

When you wear a MAGA hat - and thereby endorse a president who is a racist and a sexist pig and a serial liar and an authoritarian and an outright disgrace to the nation and its people - YES - you are making a statement just like I did with my bumperstickers and long hair in the Sixties. So when people see that kid in that situation and make judgments about him - it comes with the territory.

 

[mike2810]

Let me tell you a story which will answer your question. In the late 1960's I had very long hair and a junk car with anti-war stickers on it. One day I was commuting to college from my folks home where I lived and a cop pulled me out of several cars and gave me a ticket for speeding. I related the story to my father expressing my anger that I had been picked out for obvious reasons. My father looked at me and gave me a bit of blue-collar wisdom :

when you put a target on your chest, don't be surprised when people shoot at it.

When you wear a MAGA hat - and thereby endorse a president who is a racist and a sexist pig and a serial liar and an authoritarian and an outright disgrace to the nation and its people - YES - you are making a statement just like I did with my bumperstickers and long hair in the Sixties. So when people see that kid in that situation and make judgments about him - it comes with the territory.

Got to ask since your old enough. Did you feel the same way with the slogan "Let's Make American Great Again" when Ronald Reagan used it. How about when Bill Clinton used it in 1992?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Make_America_Great_Again


I personally see nothing wrong with someone wanting to have America being "Great." It is the persons actions that count. I can agree with you that Trump is not a good President. In taking a broad view of things wanting the best for America is not a bad thing. imo, Trump is going about it the wrong way.

 

[haymarket]

Got to ask since your old enough. Did you feel the same way with the slogan "Let's Make American Great Again" when Ronald Reagan used it. How about when Bill Clinton used it in 1992?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Make_America_Great_Again


I personally see nothing wrong with someone wanting to have America being "Great." It is the persons actions that count. I can agree with you that Trump is not a good President. In taking a broad view of things wanting the best for America is not a bad thing. imo, Trump is going about it the wrong way.

Neither Ronald Reagan nor Bill Clinton were racist xenophobes with all the faults of Trump. So no - its not the slogan itself but the complete asshole behind the slogan. Trumps red MAGA hats are an in-your-face flag waving to everyone that the wearer supports Trump and his xenophobic racism.

 

[mike2810]

Neither Ronald Reagan nor Bill Clinton were racist xenophobes with all the faults of Trump. So no - its not the slogan itself but the complete asshole behind the slogan. Trumps red MAGA hats are an in-your-face flag waving to everyone that the wearer supports Trump and his xenophobic racism.

You should get over who wears the hat. Much like I got over those who had anti war stickers on their cars and wore long hair. :mrgreen: