All I have to say is...

[austrianecon]

This is what right-to-work states do. Subsidize to steal jobs from other states. They know they'll be bailed out. Meanwhile, they get the jobs and the team. And Uncle Sam and the taxpaper pay. But the IRS should stop that right?

Umm, Ohio isn't a right to work state.

 

[Linc]

But their governor started out that way, his true intentions. he has walked back, hasn't he. Election time must be soon.

Umm, Ohio isn't a right to work state.

 

[austrianecon]

But their governor started out that way, his true intentions. he has walked back, hasn't he. Election time must be soon.

Being a Governor plays no role in what a City does if the law is not right to work. Until a law is passed, Ohio is pro-union. So the City, Nationwide and the State agreed to the deal.

 

[Middleground]

Is there a city left in Canada without a team? Winnipeg and Quebec had teams and those teams moved because of financial reasons. So that's not always true.

When our dollar was 60 cents to the Greenback, then yeah, it became financial. Also, Quebec did not have a proper arena. But both cities strongly supported their teams.

Umm.. Columbus supports the Blue Jackets, it allows them to play basically rent free, it spent billions cleaning up the Arena area (roads and such). If you put a ****ty team in any city they won't be profitable.

LOL. Ever heard of the Maple Leafs? :lol:

In any event, take a look at this link. It shows the NHL attendance for 2012-13. Notice how ALL of the Canadian teams have sold to 100%+ capacity, including the crappy ones?

2012-2013 NHL Attendance - National Hockey League - ESPN

The Blackhawks had a pretty ****ty spell themselves during the 2000's. They started winning again.. and look at the support they are getting. Like I said.. winning is everything is sports. Doesn't matter if you are in Toronto or Austin, Texas (which doesn't have a pro team).. if you are winning fans show up, if you suck your stands are empty.

Not true.. it seems Canadians will mostly support their hockey teams, no matter how much they suck. But in the case of Chicago, I will agree. Thing is, in most big American cities, the NHL has to compete with the NFL, the NBA and MLB... and in most (all?) cases, the NHL will always finish last.

 

[austrianecon]

When our dollar was 60 cents to the Greenback, then yeah, it became financial. Also, Quebec did not have a proper arena. But both cities strongly supported their teams.

Other Canadian teams didn't bugger out.

LOL. Ever heard of the Maple Leafs? :lol:

In any event, take a look at this link. It shows the NHL attendance for 2012-13. Notice how ALL of the Canadian teams have sold to 100%+ capacity, including the crappy ones?

2012-2013 NHL Attendance - National Hockey League - ESPN

You mean the Maple Leafs that made the playoffs and just missed the play offs 2 year prior to this year? Yeah.. Blue Jackets haven't been close 4 year in a row and got swept out of the play offs in 2008/2009.
Also note the size of the arenas for two of those teams. Winnipeg and Edmonton are 1st and 3rd in lack of size of arenas. So if Blue Jacket's Nationwide Arena wasn't 19,000 but say 15,000 like Winnipeg.. the Blue Jackets would have 100% sell out. So this is horrible comparison.

Not true.. it seems Canadians will mostly support their hockey teams, no matter how much they suck. But in the case of Chicago, I will agree. Thing is, in most big American cities, the NHL has to compete with the NFL, the NBA and MLB... and in most (all?) cases, the NHL will always finish last.

Like I said.. two teams left Canada, others stayed so the excuse for the loonie being crappy doesn't fly. And in Chicago a city of 2 million and metro size of 9 million or NYC with a city size of 8 million and metro size of 22 million selling out a arena isn't that hard during NFL and NBA seasons (since these the only two sports going on during hockey) and one of those sports (NFL) is basically 1 day a week. With teams competing for playoffs every year they have fantastic attendance. Now if you located in Columbus and your only real pro team sucks horribly and has done so for the last 13 years are you gonna waste money to watch the game in person? Hell no, you'll watch it on tv.

 

[Boring Bob]

Other Canadian teams didn't bugger out.

In Winnipeg's case, other Canadian teams weren't in one of the dumpiest cities in the country. I lived there 20 years ago. It was not worthy of a professional sports team, whatever the dollar was worth. It has since flourished and become a significantly nicer city, and thus can now afford an NHL team.

You mean the Maple Leafs that made the playoffs and just missed the play offs 2 year prior to this year? Yeah.. Blue Jackets haven't been close 4 year in a row and got swept out of the play offs in 2008/2009.
Also note the size of the arenas for two of those teams. Winnipeg and Edmonton are 1st and 3rd in lack of size of arenas. So if Blue Jacket's Nationwide Arena wasn't 19,000 but say 15,000 like Winnipeg.. the Blue Jackets would have 100% sell out. So this is horrible comparison.

Toronto hasn't won a Stanley Cup since 1967, and they've been sold out for every game since. They've been a terrible hockey team for years now and made it to the playoffs for the first time in 5 years this year. Toronto could be the worst team in the league for 10 straight years and tickets would still be unobtainable. It has nothing to do with the team. Hockey is an integral part of Canadian culture, and people go to the games because they like to watch the sport. "People" meaning a significant portion of the population. I grew up there, and I can't remember a single guy who didn't play hockey at some point. Everyone does it. In the US it's a niche market.

Like I said.. two teams left Canada, others stayed so the excuse for the loonie being crappy doesn't fly. And in Chicago a city of 2 million and metro size of 9 million or NYC with a city size of 8 million and metro size of 22 million selling out a arena isn't that hard during NFL and NBA seasons (since these the only two sports going on during hockey) and one of those sports (NFL) is basically 1 day a week. With teams competing for playoffs every year they have fantastic attendance. Now if you located in Columbus and your only real pro team sucks horribly and has done so for the last 13 years are you gonna waste money to watch the game in person? Hell no, you'll watch it on tv.

This right here is the difference between Columbus and the Canadian hockey markets. The crappy Canadian teams sell out when they suck because people there love the game. Going to a hockey game in Canada is like going to a baseball game in the U.S. Screw the team, its just fun to go. Watching it on TV does not compare. Move the Blue Jackets to Saskatchewan and they could lose every game all year and still have consistently good attendance. Having a popular college team doesn't make Columbus a hockey town. Having a significant portion of the population who loves hockey makes a place a hockey town.

People all over the U.S. watch the NFL. It's part of the culture whether an area has a pro team or not. People go to the games whether a team is winning or not.

Could Columbus be a hockey to wn? I think so. If the team starts winning more people will get into the game and start to enjoy it for its own sake. I believe Chicago would have been a popular hockey market prior to their recent success if Bill Wirtz had allowed the games to be broadcast to the area. There are enough die hard fans of the sport here to keep the team afloat if people are permitted to care about it. I want Columbus to be a popular team, because I want hockey to be a popular sport down here. I honestly just don't think it's there yet.

 

[austrianecon]

In Winnipeg's case, other Canadian teams weren't in one of the dumpiest cities in the country. I lived there 20 years ago. It was not worthy of a professional sports team, whatever the dollar was worth. It has since flourished and become a significantly nicer city, and thus can now afford an NHL team.

And Winnipeg lost the team in 1996. There were several attempts to save the team. From trying to get local owner for the team to a bunch of Winnipeg businessmen who tried to buy the team.. everyone of them looked at the team's books and said no, thank you. This argument just doesn't fly as there are a dozen of sports teams I can name that have their stadiums or arenas in crappy neighborhoods and survived. I'll rattle of a few.. Washington Redskins had RFK, Baltimore Orioles had Memorial Stadium (on 33rd Street) and now Camden Yards, Chicago White Sox have US Cellular Field (Chicago PD has a Narcotic station there), Oakland A's have the Oakland Colliseum, and NY Yankees have Yankee stadium in the South Bronx.

All of these Stadiums are in run down neighborhoods with high crime rates yet somehow they make money.

Toronto hasn't won a Stanley Cup since 1967, and they've been sold out for every game since. They've been a terrible hockey team for years now and made it to the playoffs for the first time in 5 years this year. Toronto could be the worst team in the league for 10 straight years and tickets would still be unobtainable. It has nothing to do with the team. Hockey is an integral part of Canadian culture, and people go to the games because they like to watch the sport. "People" meaning a significant portion of the population. I grew up there, and I can't remember a single guy who didn't play hockey at some point. Everyone does it. In the US it's a niche market.

Toronto is like the Boston/Yankees/Cubs of hockey. You can be ****ty after winning as many Cups as they have. But for the last 4 or 5 years they've missed the playoffs by a few points. I am not saying Canada isn't hockey, what I am saying to you and everyone else is not everything is a sacred cow. Baseball and Football are American as apple pie but teams leave cities all the time due to lack of fan support just like what happen to Winnipeg.

This right here is the difference between Columbus and the Canadian hockey markets. The crappy Canadian teams sell out when they suck because people there love the game. Going to a hockey game in Canada is like going to a baseball game in the U.S. Screw the team, its just fun to go.

Uh, no. It's cause it's the only thing to do at night during the winter (or go to the bar) in Canada. Baseball nor Football in the US works that way. You have to be winners to get the fans out because nobody in their right mind is going to go to a game and watch their team lose for $50 (ticket and parking). The Seattle Mariners had an attendance of 10,000 when the US Men's National Team (Soccer) played in Seattle on June 11th. US Soccer sold 40,000 plus tickets to the game. Seattle was playing Houston Astros, both teams are by far the worst teams in the AL this year.

Watching it on TV does not compare. Move the Blue Jackets to Saskatchewan and they could lose every game all year and still have consistently good attendance. Having a popular college team doesn't make Columbus a hockey town. Having a significant portion of the population who loves hockey makes a place a hockey town.

I never said TV does compare. Blue Jackets still bring in 14-15k fans every game (that's surprises me when seeing ticket prices.. high end is a $150 a game, low end is $15). The same as what Winnipeg brings in now. I never said Columbus is a hockey town because of college sports but rather it's both. Buckeyes rule from early Sept to late Nov for every person who lives in Ohio. Dec til about Spring (April) ball (College Football) it's Blue Jackets. May to August is Columbus Crew (soccer). That's how it works in Columbus and has for the last 12 years.

People all over the U.S. watch the NFL. It's part of the culture whether an area has a pro team or not. People go to the games whether a team is winning or not.

Watching is cheaper then going. People don't go to games if their teams are losing, unless it's a team like Dallas or Washington as it's expensive. So when teams are losing attendance goes down.

Could Columbus be a hockey to wn? I think so. If the team starts winning more people will get into the game and start to enjoy it for its own sake. I believe Chicago would have been a popular hockey market prior to their recent success if Bill Wirtz had allowed the games to be broadcast to the area. There are enough die hard fans of the sport here to keep the team afloat if people are permitted to care about it. I want Columbus to be a popular team, because I want hockey to be a popular sport down here. I honestly just don't think it's there yet.

And that's my point.. Blue Jackets suck so their attendance is not a full sell out and until they are winning they'll stay in that 14-15k attendance range. They'll lose money and have to be bailed out by the City of Columbus every year.

Hockey will never be a popular sport in the US. It hasn't made major gains despite 80 plus years in the US. It's recent TV deal proves this.. $2 billion for 10 years? NFL gets $2 billion a year, MLB has a $800 million a year deal while it actually allowing teams to own TV rights in local markets. So teams can bring in close to $60 to $270 million a year. EPL tv deal with NBC is bring them close to $85 million a year for teams not even located in the US. So that should tell you something.

 

[calamity]

Hawks had a great year. Glad to see them sipping from the Cup at the end of it.

 

[Linc]

Speaking of landfills, imagine Aliens looking at ours, the great scars on Earth. No to mention the swirling caldrons in the ocean. We have some of the worst in Illinois, where both parties are deeply crooked and flawed.

NHL should feel luck anybody would take that landfill.. but I figured New Jersey would have accepted first. :lamo

 

[Linc]

Which is why I assume the Southeast sides of cities are so putrid, so they can blow to the next county or state.

Being a Governor plays no role in what a City does if the law is not right to work. Until a law is passed, Ohio is pro-union. So the City, Nationwide and the State agreed to the deal.

 

[Linc]

What do you think of the trade, signing Bickell, and signing another Bickell/Charra type with their first pick?

Hawks had a great year. Glad to see them sipping from the Cup at the end of it.

 

[calamity]

What do you think of the trade, signing Bickell, and signing another Bickell/Charra type with their first pick?

Anyone Chara-like will keep the Hawks in the conversation for years to come.

 

[Linc]

At his young age, he's supposed to have good hockey skills and be a fan-thriller with his big hits?

Anyone Chara-like will keep the Hawks in the conversation for years to come.