affirmative action?

[hereyago]

Affirmative action has to be one of the worst ideas ever.

The colleges that practice affirmative action are just destroying chances for many students.

 

[flaherty12]

Affirmative action has to be one of the worst ideas ever.

The colleges that practice affirmative action are just destroying chances for many students.

not one of the worst ideas ever, because at a time, it was needed, but it has outlived its usefullness.

 

[Spartacus FPV]

Quotaing was the worst idea ever, AA was the compromise to get us where we are today. Now I feel it should be abolished, and we should function only on merit.

 

[rathi]

It was needed during its conception. Minorities being forced into segregated schools had lasting effects that needed to be compensated for. However, todays kids no longer had to face such hardships, and thus it is no longer necessary.

 

[Thelost1]

Affirmitive Action is racism. it was needed at one point to couterbalance other racism, but it is no longer required.

 

[hereyago]

why don't they abolish affirmative action?

 

[Caine]

why don't they abolish affirmative action?

I dunno...... afraid of being screamed down as Racist.

That tends to happen anytime someone doesn't kiss up to minorities.

 

[Kushinator]

Yes it is very true. At the time of its conception, AA was needed to bring forth tolerance. Tolerance has been achieved and very much so.

We have no segregation, and havent had any for years. Some might try and refute this, but it can go both ways...

So the very aspect of AA is nothing more than a socialist program that has outlived its usefulness just as full scale welfare.

But thats for another time

 

[jallman]

Affirmative action was a provision to level the playing field for a while. There are numerous other programs that provide minorities with opportunity. If the minority group is not living up to their end by utilizing those programs to further their goals of equality, what more can be done? Should the non-minority student be penalized because a slot in grad school is designated for a minority student whether that minority student performed well or not?

The game of social dominance is a team sport. Each team trains its competitors, offers its glory for performing well, and allocates its resources to its consecutive "strings" of players. Within each team, there are the first, second, and third strings and there are bench warmers. There are even those who don't make the cut. It's not up to the winners to reallocate their training time, resources, and play books to the other teams. It is not a requirement morally or ethically to allow lesser players into the all-stars...

When a society moves on to the "championships" so to speak, they need to show the best. In the global arena, they don't care that you have an equal number of shirts and skins on the team...it is about winning and showing the highest productivity, the most ingenuity, and the brightest talent. Diluting our "all-star" team, so to speak, with lesser talents only hurts the country as a whole.

 

[nes]

Does not anyone have the balls to say no to minorities anymore? Why not completely remove race quotas, its racist.

The good student doesn't get in because of his/her Asian race, while some lesser talented student gets in because his/her skin is black.

 

[JJB]

Affirmative action is merely another form of discrimination that does more harm than good. It promotes people on the basis of race instead of merit, and that is wrong.

Still, it is funny how politics evolve. 100 years ago, we would have considered equality under the law to be radical. 50 years ago, we would have considered equality under the law to be liberal. Today, we consider equality under the law to be conservative. I do not understand.

 

[nes]

rofl, this is sad

The republicans today are the democrats of yesterday.
The democrats today are the socialist of yesterday.



I would rather vote for democrat (opps I meant republican), instead of a bunch of socialist (opps I meant democrats).

 

[desertfox]

not only is this unfair to whites its also unfair to whites these are programs that basicly say blacks are inferior to whites and need help getting into college they have definatly outlived there time

 

[PoliticalActivist]

Does not anyone have the balls to say no to minorities anymore? Why not completely remove race quotas, its racist.

The good student doesn't get in because of his/her Asian race, while some lesser talented student gets in because his/her skin is black.

This is one of the most dis-tasteful posts I ever read on Debate Politics. Tell
me what does skincolor have to do with getting a equal education?

 

[jallman]

This is one of the most dis-tasteful posts I ever read on Debate Politics. Tell
me what does skincolor have to do with getting a equal education?

Although I agree that the wording of his post was distasteful, the message was totally valid. Skin color should not have anything to do with equal education. Merit should be the sole qualifier for educational achievement. However, affirmative action nullifies achievement and replaces it with an unfair system of penalizing good students based on nothing more than the fact that their skin color is "minority" enough.

 

[Caine]

Although I agree that the wording of his post was distasteful, the message was totally valid. Skin color should not have anything to do with equal education. Merit should be the sole qualifier for educational achievement. However, affirmative action nullifies achievement and replaces it with an unfair system of penalizing good students based on nothing more than the fact that their skin color is "minority" enough.

Exactly why this lame policy was nicknamed, "Affirmative BLACKTION" Since its focus was on blacks. and when it originally started, it was applied to things other than just Education. Like promotions at work, etc. In the Sgt promotion system of the mid 1980s in my department, you had a promotion number after you were selected. Each promotion period the next (number to be determined) numbers were selected in numerical order.. So say line numbers 1-5 were promoted this time... and 6-10 the next time. Well, during this time when Affirmative Blacktion was started, the department had to skip promotion line numbers to the next black person, and then skip some more to the next black person. Also, more qualified white police officer applicants were denied on the basis of their race.

 

[desertfox]

This is one of the most dis-tasteful posts I ever read on Debate Politics. Tell
me what does skincolor have to do with getting a equal education?

when people are denied an education based on there skin color

 

[Alien Traveler]

As an Alien I am amused by American racial rhetoric. As a consumer I am fooled by affirmative action. For example, what I should say to a black doctor? I do not want to have a black doctor, because I have to suppose he got his MD thanks to affirmative action, not his merits. So, what wording should I use, when I want to say “Sorry pal, I’d prefer to see white/Asian/Indian doctor?"

 

[bigsmitty]

When AA was put into place, it was a noble concept, looking to offset previous acts of racial prejudice. I feel as though, however, after a certain point, it becomes necessary to turn the system loose back onto merit-based, so that it can then correct itself without stepping on anyone else.

 

[Caine]

When AA was put into place, it was a noble concept, looking to offset previous acts of racial prejudice. I feel as though, however, after a certain point, it becomes necessary to turn the system loose back onto merit-based, so that it can then correct itself without stepping on anyone else.

I feel that the 'point' to turn it loose and back to merit based has passed.

 

[bigsmitty]

I feel that the 'point' to turn it loose and back to merit based has passed.

Fair statement, but what's the alternative? Should we just let the issue stagnate?

 

[Caine]

Fair statement, but what's the alternative? Should we just let the issue stagnate?

Alternative to what? Your post isn't very clear........

 

[McTojo]

I think all of you have missed the plot here.

Many of you have already made some very salient points on this issue, but for the most part, you have all missed the plot.
AA was originally intended to help African Americans and handicapped (have we forgotten about them too ?) and other minorities, as well. Here is a short exhaustive list:

Affirmative Action was NOT created solely with black people in mind. It was created with all oppressed peoples in mind who had experienced setbacks in the US to remedy the problem by giving them an equal opportunity to compete for jobs and educational opportunities. That includes: blacks, women, Native Americans, immigrants, handicapped, etc. This system primarily benefits middle-class White women.


It is a proven fact that single white mothers have benefitted from AA more than any other demographics group in America ! So, what are you people talking about here ?

You people are stripping other people of precious opportunities with your words by stating that AA is like a crutch and that it has out lived its usefullness. That is the most absurd statement I've ever heard on this subject. If the Black American was truly taking advantage of this benefit, and it was actually doing what it was intended to do, then yes, it should be modified or ratified in order to reflect the needs of others and the job market.

 

[McTojo]

Affirmative action made provision for all people:

Facts on Executive Order 11246 -- Affirmative Action

This is from their own web-site.

 

[Caine]

Re: I think all of you have missed the plot here.

Many of you have already made some very salient points on this issue, but for the most part, you have all missed the plot.
AA was originally intended to help African Americans and handicapped (have we forgotten about them too ?) and other minorities, as well. Here is a short exhaustive list:

Affirmative Action was NOT created solely with black people in mind. It was created with all oppressed peoples in mind who had experienced setbacks in the US to remedy the problem by giving them an equal opportunity to compete for jobs and educational opportunities. That includes: blacks, women, Native Americans, immigrants, handicapped, etc. This system primarily benefits middle-class White women.


It is a proven fact that single white mothers have benefitted from AA more than any other demographics group in America ! So, what are you people talking about here ?

We are talking about the original Affirmative Action plan, not this "Revised 2002" Edition that you linked to in your next post.

Show me the 80s version of the Affirmative Action plan that was focused on "Middle Class White Women".

You people are stripping other people of precious opportunities with your words by stating that AA is like a crutch and that it has out lived its usefullness.

Because it has. The corporate world is not in a position anymore to not hire someone based upon their race or gender. This day and age a business wants the best person for the job. Regardless of whether they are black, women, or a green alien from outerspace. Thus, this program has outlived its usefullness because only the best person needs to be hired for the job. Not the Black person (because they are black) or the Woman (just because she is a woman), etc, etc. The Best. Regardless of Gender or Race. Why is that so hard to understand?

That is the most absurd statement I've ever heard on this subject.

Your statements have been the most absurd.
If the Black American was truly taking advantage of this benefit, and it was actually doing what it was intended to do, then yes, it should be modified or ratified in order to reflect the needs of others and the job market.[/quote]

The government doesn't need to tell an employer how to hire employees.

And there are enough "historically black" colleges that are hard for whites to get into, so if blacks are so concerned about getting into college why don't they go there?

My local newspaper made a big deal about a latino guy getting into and going to school at a nearby "Historically Black" College. That should tell you the state of such places.......