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Admitting Priviledges

TacticalEvilDan

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Can someone who is in favor of requiring that doctors have admitting privileges at a local hospital in order to perform an abortion at a clinic explain the medical benefit to the mother?

In other words, what benefit is there for such a requirement aside from reducing the number of doctors who are able to perform abortions?

If there are medical benefits to the mother, could these benefits still be had if the clinic simply had to be physically located within X miles of a hospital?

Emergency medical departments are, by and large, wonders of modern medical science. Acute patients can be rapidly diagnosed, stabilized, and admitted to the appropriate department for more specialized care. If they're good enough for victims of gunshot wounds and car accidents, why not patients of abortion clinics?

Has there been a pandemic of mothers bleeding to death that the press has been hiding from the American public?
 

clownboy

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Can someone who is in favor of requiring that doctors have admitting privileges at a local hospital in order to perform an abortion at a clinic explain the medical benefit to the mother?

In other words, what benefit is there for such a requirement aside from reducing the number of doctors who are able to perform abortions?

If there are medical benefits to the mother, could these benefits still be had if the clinic simply had to be physically located within X miles of a hospital?

Emergency medical departments are, by and large, wonders of modern medical science. Acute patients can be rapidly diagnosed, stabilized, and admitted to the appropriate department for more specialized care. If they're good enough for victims of gunshot wounds and car accidents, why not patients of abortion clinics?

Has there been a pandemic of mothers bleeding to death that the press has been hiding from the American public?
As good as they are, emergency personnel are not psychic. They typically don't know the patient and one of the first things they try to access are the patient's medical records and the patient's doctor. If the patient's doctor has admitting privileges that's a huge bonus - especially if that doctor was just under the hood on the same patient.

As for the pandemic, probably not but we have no way to know. Coroners won't put botched abortion as a cause of death.
 

MaggieD

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Can someone who is in favor of requiring that doctors have admitting privileges at a local hospital in order to perform an abortion at a clinic explain the medical benefit to the mother?

In other words, what benefit is there for such a requirement aside from reducing the number of doctors who are able to perform abortions?

If there are medical benefits to the mother, could these benefits still be had if the clinic simply had to be physically located within X miles of a hospital?

Emergency medical departments are, by and large, wonders of modern medical science. Acute patients can be rapidly diagnosed, stabilized, and admitted to the appropriate department for more specialized care. If they're good enough for victims of gunshot wounds and car accidents, why not patients of abortion clinics?

Has there been a pandemic of mothers bleeding to death that the press has been hiding from the American public?
I think it's probably about the extra scrutiny doctors undergo when they apply for admitting privileges in a hospital. Categories of admission procedures:

Admitting privileges - allow a doctor to admit a patient to the hospital
Courtesy privileges - allow a doctor to occasionally admit or to visit and treat patients in the hospital
Surgical privileges - to perform surgery in the hospital's operating room or outpatient surgery area
Patients going to abortion clinics are at the mercy of the doctors performing the surgery. They're in a surgical suite setting that may or may NOT be equipped to handle life-threatening emergencies. And general anesthetic can always present life-threatening emergencies. As can hemorrhaging. If I'm having surgery done, I'm going to make sure my surgeon is accredited by the Joint Commission of Physician Accreditation. It would surprise me if most young women having abortions even think about the credentials of the physicians performing their abortions. Life-threatening complications are rare. Permanent reproductive damage? Nosomuch.

We scream when quacks are allowed to continue practicing medicine. And we scream when the state tries to protect us from them. Which is it?
 

TacticalEvilDan

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As good as they are, emergency personnel are not psychic. They typically don't know the patient and one of the first things they try to access are the patient's medical records and the patient's doctor. If the patient's doctor has admitting privileges that's a huge bonus - especially if that doctor was just under the hood on the same patient.
So require the doctor to communicate with the hospital while the patient is in transit, sharing whatever information or records they have. That should settle any such issue without a requirement for priviledges.

As for the pandemic, probably not but we have no way to know. Coroners won't put botched abortion as a cause of death.
Then it seems to me that until we have data from a reputable source, the argument that admitting privileges will save the lives of women is a non-starter.
 

TacticalEvilDan

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I think it's probably about the extra scrutiny doctors undergo when they apply for admitting privileges in a hospital. Categories of admission procedures:
Patients seeking any treatment from any doctor are always as much at the mercy of that doctor as they allow themselves to be. That's the risk you run when you entrust a professional with what you yourself do not understand. All the certifications in the world aren't going to protect you from a careless idiot, and they aren't going to prevent human error.

At any rate, I'm wandering off-point. What kind of extra scrutiny are you talking about?
 

MaggieD

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Patients seeking any treatment from any doctor are always as much at the mercy of that doctor as they allow themselves to be. That's the risk you run when you entrust a professional with what you yourself do not understand. All the certifications in the world aren't going to protect you from a careless idiot, and they aren't going to prevent human error.

At any rate, I'm wandering off-point. What kind of extra scrutiny are you talking about?
I have no idea. Certifications most certainly do protect patients from idiots. A guy who graduated from medical school thirty years ago is so far behind the curve as to be incompetent.
 

TacticalEvilDan

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I have no idea. Certifications most certainly do protect patients from idiots. A guy who graduated from medical school thirty years ago is so far behind the curve as to be incompetent.
Okay, well, leaving the certification issue aside, an explanation of that "extra scrutiny" goes back to the root of my original question. Thanks anyhow.
 

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What's keeping an abortion clinic from simply calling 9-1-1 when something goes wrong?

EMS shows up, takes the gal to the hospital. I don't see the problem with the way things are now.
 

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The required to be allowed to practice at a hospital is singularly to make it essentially impossible for any doctor to do abortions.

ONCE AGAIN, do they ban doctors who deliver outside of hospitals to have "admitting rights?"
What about midwives, legal but NONE have admitting rights to hospitals.

And, come to think of it, it is IS common for doctors at clinics have someone from the clinic immediately transported by ambulance to a hospital AND for doctors to have patients transported by ambulance from one hospital to another - particularly common where emergency heart surgery is necessary and the small city hospital literally does not perform them.

NEVER, EVER, EVER does that doctor go along in the ambulance and essentially never will go to the other hospital as the patient is in the care of others.

But this logic, NOT doctor should be allowed to have a clinic or private practice for ANY medical procedure or diagnois without "admitting rights" to a hospital.

In short, it is SINGULARLY about trying to backdoor outlaw doctors doing abortions and nothing else. THERE is NO medical procedure, NO clinic, and NO doctor that is required otherwise to be allowed to practice also at a hospital.

It has NOTHING to do with medical practice safety - zero,nada, nothing.
 

joko104

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I have no idea. Certifications most certainly do protect patients from idiots. A guy who graduated from medical school thirty years ago is so far behind the curve as to be incompetent.
Actually, I've found some of the old private practice doctors are the sharpest of all because they are diverse in knowledge. They also tend to not just let drug companies tell them what to do for which everything is solved with a pill.
 

MaggieD

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Actually, I've found some of the old private practice doctors are the sharpest of all because they are diverse in knowledge. They also tend to not just let drug companies tell them what to do for which everything is solved with a pill.
Oh, I'm sure that most doctors (even aged, non-board certified) are pretty competent to perform abortions. It's just one more "reason."

My personal experience through my mom's healthcare is that they are too casual about some of the testing -- if her aged doctor was any example. She was taking Cumadin, required to be tested once a week and had to carry her own blood sample to the lab. Ha! Then one night, he called at 10:30 PM an said, "Hurry to Walgreen's and get some Vitamin K. Your clotting factor is way too low." Really? :rofl

She doesn't see him anymore. I hope he's retired. (But I get your point.)
 

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Oh, I'm sure that most doctors (even aged, non-board certified) are pretty competent to perform abortions. It's just one more "reason."

My personal experience through my mom's healthcare is that they are too casual about some of the testing -- if her aged doctor was any example. She was taking Cumadin, required to be tested once a week and had to carry her own blood sample to the lab. Ha! Then one night, he called at 10:30 PM an said, "Hurry to Walgreen's and get some Vitamin K. Your clotting factor is way too low." Really? :rofl

She doesn't see him anymore. I hope he's retired. (But I get your point.)
Private practice "family doctors" are becoming a thing of the past and nearly all are well up in years. They tend to know a lot about everything but not expertise in anything nor good at spotting really obscure issues.

One thing such doctors are is AFFORDABLE. The family practice doctor - in his 60s - is $50 a visit. A visit to the hospital for my wife with breathing difficulty was met with giving her a "Z-pack" (steroids) and told nothing wrong with her. Then a trip to the FREE clinic confirmed she had serious lung issues, for which she went to the old family doctor prescribed an antibodic and had her use some little breathing device in his office with some solution in it that in two days cleared it up - total for it and the visit? $100.

The hospital? That wrongly diagnoised her (and seriously so?) $1,600.00.

That old doctor doctor telling your mother to go buy some Vitamin K at Walgreens may have saved your mother a $1000.00 trip to the hospital or a $50 dollar prescription for what was, essentially, a $5 bottle of Vitamin K.

At some point, this culture decided that if there are $5,000 worth of tests to make certain the common cold isn't something else, that $5000 must be spent - even if the parents have to not pay rent and car losing both home and job for lack of transportation as zero compromise is even conceivable in medical care.

Curiously, though, it seems nearly all the medical-mistake deaths occur in hospitals where all the specialists are, not the patchwork of old doctors with their little clinics. That is one other plus of the vanishing family doctor - some still don't see patients as just cattle of an endless herd.

But I get your point, like you get mine. :)
 

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Lord forbid we require doctors to be trained, accountable, responsible and well thought enough in the medical community to have priviledges at a local hospital.
 

TacticalEvilDan

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Lord forbid we require doctors to be trained, accountable, responsible and well thought enough in the medical community to have priviledges at a local hospital.
What additional benefit is there to requiring admitting priviledges aside from reducing the number of doctors who are able to perform abortions?

If there are medical benefits to the mother, could these benefits still be had if the clinic simply had to be physically located within X miles of a hospital?
 

CRUE CAB

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What additional benefit is there to requiring admitting priviledges aside from reducing the number of doctors who are able to perform abortions?

If there are medical benefits to the mother, could these benefits still be had if the clinic simply had to be physically located within X miles of a hospital?
I dont think I would want a doctor digging around my insides that was not good enough or not interested enough to have a way to get me into a hospital asap if needed.
But that is me.
 

TacticalEvilDan

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I dont think I would want a doctor digging around my insides that was not good enough or not interested enough to have a way to get me into a hospital asap if needed.
But that is me.
As I've already stated,

Emergency medical departments are, by and large, wonders of modern medical science. Acute patients can be rapidly diagnosed, stabilized, and admitted to the appropriate department for more specialized care. If they're good enough for victims of gunshot wounds and car accidents, why not patients of abortion clinics?
So, again, where's the medical benefit to the mother?
 

CRUE CAB

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As I've already stated,



So, again, where's the medical benefit to the mother?
Oh, heck I dont know. What happens if there is a medical emergency, bleed, stroke, siezure or one of a million things that can happen.
We already know the baby is toast, but lets try to give the mother some help if needed.
Or not, if its all good for the baby do die, so can she.
 

TacticalEvilDan

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Oh, heck I dont know. What happens if there is a medical emergency, bleed, stroke, siezure or one of a million things that can happen.
We already know the baby is toast, but lets try to give the mother some help if needed.
Or not, if its all good for the baby do die, so can she.
Are you saying that putting a patient on an ambulance that goes straight to the nearest ER where the patient is put straight into the hands of a ER doctor isn't sufficient care?
 

AGENT J

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Lord forbid we require doctors to be trained, accountable, responsible and well thought enough in the medical community to have priviledges at a local hospital.
that has nothing to do with admitting privileges, nothing
 

AGENT J

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Can someone who is in favor of requiring that doctors have admitting privileges at a local hospital in order to perform an abortion at a clinic explain the medical benefit to the mother?

In other words, what benefit is there for such a requirement aside from reducing the number of doctors who are able to perform abortions?

If there are medical benefits to the mother, could these benefits still be had if the clinic simply had to be physically located within X miles of a hospital?

Emergency medical departments are, by and large, wonders of modern medical science. Acute patients can be rapidly diagnosed, stabilized, and admitted to the appropriate department for more specialized care. If they're good enough for victims of gunshot wounds and car accidents, why not patients of abortion clinics?

Has there been a pandemic of mothers bleeding to death that the press has been hiding from the American public?
in reality for abortion patients admitting privileges have little to zero benefits that why they are required by the medical industry/field/professionals/regulations
 
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