Abraham and Astronomy

[laska]

Below is a link to the Book of Abraham (only a handful of chapters), an additional revelation restored by Joseph Smith, to go along with the Book of Mormon, Doctrine and Covenants, Book of Moses, and the Joseph Smith translation of the Bible. I guess this is a good place to start the thread out.

Abraham

 

[The face of Jacob]

It's called "The testament of Abraham".

According the Israeli Wikipedia, this book wasn't written by Abraham but by Essenes or Pharisee Jews in the times of the seocnd temple. It's one of the exterior books which are not in the Jewish canon.

Indeed Abraham was an astrologer, he saw in the sky that planet Jupiter is located in the west and it was a sign that he won't have descendants, but G-d is above astrology so he had a descendant in the end. I mentioned another example for that in here.

I read the chapters in your link, it says that Jehova talked to Abraham. It's not Jehova. Nobody knows if it's Jehova, Jahuva or Jehuva. It's a translation from Hebrew, and whenever this word is mentioned in the Tanach - there is no punctuation under the letters (all the other words in the Tanach have punctuation under the letters), all that is written are 4 letters that if you want to translate them to English you will get Y/(J - if you translate I to J),H,V,H, the main understanding is that it's acronym of Yihiye, Hove Ve Haya, which means: He will be, he is present and he was.

 

[Thinker]

Indeed Abraham was an astrologer, he saw in the sky that planet Jupiter is located in the west and it was a sign that he won't have descendants, but G-d is above astrology so he had a descendant in the end.

It's nothing to do with anything supernatural. Astrology is utter nonsense;
there is absolutely no evidence that it works. It's pure superstition, just like
belief in gods.

 

[The face of Jacob]

It's nothing to do with anything supernatural. Astrology is utter nonsense;
there is absolutely no evidence that it works. It's pure superstition, just like
belief in gods.

I think what you say is not true.

Please read what G-d is saying about astrology:

And God said: 'Let there be lights in the firmament of the heaven to divide the day from the night; and let them be for signs, and for seasons, and for days and years;

The main understanding of "For signs" in Judaism means the prediction of the future.

Astrology is like science, it's like the science that says that women above the age of 60 can't be pregnant and we all know that there are women above the age of 60 who were pregnant.

G-d is above science and above of astrology cause he can do miracles that can change the science and the astrology as I said before.

 

[laska]

It's called "The testament of Abraham".

Not the same work, parallels yes, also a lot of differences. You do bring up maybe the greatest secular evidence in support of the Book of Abraham as being authentic though, because the testament of Abraham came to light at the turn of the century, after Joseph Smith. If a fake, how could he have been right on so many points?

 

[The face of Jacob]

It's called "The testament of Abraham".

Not the same work, parallels yes, also a lot of differences. You do bring up maybe the greatest secular evidence in support of the Book of Abraham as being authentic though, because the testament of Abraham came to light at the turn of the century, after Joseph Smith.

When I said that the Israeli Wikipedia says that it wasn't written by Abraham it doesn't mean that the words in the book are not true. It could be that Abraham told his story to his children and they told to theirs untill those ones who wrote this book. The summary of the Orally Torah was also in that process, we have the names of the people who received the Orally Torah from Moses who received it from G-d.

 

[Thinker]

Astrology is like science

You can know very little about science if you make claims like that. Astrology
is not science by any stretch of the imagination, regardless of what any book
may say.

It makes predictions that are either so vague that anything would satisfy
them, or that are just plain wrong. Every properly-constituted test that has
been performed demonstrates this. If astrology were a science, several
different astrologers given the same information would come to the same, or
very similar, conclusions. The fact is, they don't.

..., it's like the science that says that women above the age of 60 can't be pregnant and we all know that there are women above the age of 60 who were pregnant.

Ergo, science does NOT make claims like that. The scientific position is that
the older a woman is, the less likely it is that she can become pregnant. Once
past the menopause, the chances of getting pregnant are extremely small.
Simple observation bears this out.

G-d is above science and above of astrology cause he can do miracles
that can change the science and the astrology as I said before.

You can say it as many times as you like, it still doesn't make it true.

 

[Monk-Eye]

Stigmata

"Stigmata"

Indeed Abraham was an astrologer, he saw in the sky that planet Jupiter is located in the west and it was a sign that he won't have descendants, but G-d is above astrology so he had a descendant in the end. I mentioned another example for that in here.

The hermenuetics about the prophecy, that the one sent to free the israeli slaves would have a problem with water meant that moses would need water in the desert, was funny.

Are you sure it wasn't that moses would come treading water, as the story goes he was placed in a reed basket and floated down the nile.
Those silly sorcerers. And pharoah razed the first born to raise the guilt of hosts (ghosts)?

I like this need for water better - What caused Moses' speech impediment?

The Midrash1 relates an interesting tradition: Moses was exceedingly handsome; whoever saw him could not take their eyes off him. Pharaoh would kiss and hug [Moses], and [Moses] would remove the crown from [Pharaoh’s] head and place it on his own—much as he was destined to do in the future…

The Egyptian sorcerers were present [when Moses donned Pharaoh’s crown] and they said, “We are concerned that this [child] who is removing your crown and placing it on his head shouldn’t be the one whom we have foretold will seize the reins of monarchy from you.”

Some of them were advising to behead him; others advised to burn him. Jethro [Moses’ future father-in-law] was sitting among the advisors. He argued that the child had no intelligence [and no omen should be associated with his harmless child’s-play with the crown].

“Test him,” he said. “Bring in front of him a plate of gold and glowing coals. If he reaches for the gold, that is a sign that he has intelligence, and we will execute him. If, however, he reaches for the [bright and glowing] coals, then he is without intelligence, and is not deserving if death.”

They brought [the plate] in front of [Moses], and he immediately reached for the gold. The angel Gabriel came and pushed his hand, and he grabbed the coal. [As is the nature of children,] he [instinctively] shoved his hand – together with the coal – into his mouth, and his tongue was burnt.

From this Moses became “heavy of mouth and heavy of tongue.”

 

[laska]

Abraham's Three Truths of Astronomy-
Meridian Magazine :: Science and Religion :: Abraham's Three Truths of Astronomy

 

[laska]

Astrology- study of planets and human behavior: the study of the positions of the Moon, Sun, and other planets in the belief that their motions affect human beings -(Encarta ® World English Dictionary)

Astrology is a pseudoscience. It is not imo part of Abraham’s astronomy or what is meant by the scriptural references to signs.

 

[laska]

Just wanted to let everyone know since I started this active thread that I am leaving Debate Politics for a time, things have gotten crazy and I really have to focus my time, and DP is just too addictive and time consuming for me. Hate to leave as I had great plans for this thread. Anyway, best wishes to all-Laska.

 

[Monk-Eye]

Tidal Changes

"Tidal Changes"

Just wanted to let everyone know since I started this active thread that I am leaving Debate Politics for a time, things have gotten crazy and I really have to focus my time, and DP is just too addictive and time consuming for me. Hate to leave as I had great plans for this thread. Anyway, best wishes to all-Laska.

Hopefully you will find time to return.
The desire to participate is unique.
Best wishes and good luck.

The moon is the eye of the sun's unconscious mind.

 

[laska]

Not sure Tecoyah still visits DP but I had mentioned in an earlier thread about Joseph Smith understanding the concept of relativity back in the 1830’s. He wanted me to start a thread on this, and so I started this one and just linked The Book of Abraham. Below is facsimile number 2 with Joseph’s explanations (there were three facsimiles with the Egyptian papyri that Joseph translated the Book of Abraham from.) Figure 1 has to do with relativity.

A FACSIMILE FROM
THE BOOK OF ABRAHAM
No. 2

EXPLANATION​

Fig. 1. Kolob, signifying the first creation, nearest to the celestial, or the residence of God. First in government, the last pertaining to the measurement of time. The measurement according to celestial time, which celestial time signifies one day to a cubit. One day in Kolob is equal to a thousand years according to the measurement of this earth, which is called by the Egyptians Jah-oh-eh.
Fig. 2. Stands next to Kolob, called by the Egyptians Oliblish, which is the next grand governing creation near to the celestial or the place where God resides; holding the key of power also, pertaining to other planets; as revealed from God to Abraham, as he offered sacrifice upon an altar, which he had built unto the Lord.
Fig. 3. Is made to represent God, sitting upon his throne, clothed with power and authority; with a crown of eternal light upon his head; representing also the grand Key-words of the Holy Priesthood, as revealed to Adam in the Garden of Eden, as also to Seth, Noah, Melchizedek, Abraham, and all to whom the Priesthood was revealed.
Fig. 4. Answers to the Hebrew word Raukeeyang, signifying expanse, or the firmament of the heavens; also a numerical figure, in Egyptian signifying one thousand; answering to the measuring of the time of Oliblish, which is equal with Kolob in its revolution and in its measuring of time.
Fig. 5. Is called in Egyptian Enish-go-on-dosh; this is one of the governing planets also, and is said by the Egyptians to be the Sun, and to borrow its light from Kolob through the medium of Kae-e-vanrash, which is the grand Key, or, in other words, the governing power, which governs fifteen other fixed planets or stars, as also Floeese or the Moon, the Earth and the Sun in their annual revolutions. This planet receives its power through the medium of Kli-flos-is-es, or Hah-ko-kau-beam, the stars represented by numbers 22 and 23, receiving light from the revolutions of Kolob.
Fig. 6. Represents this earth in its four quarters.
Fig. 7. Represents God sitting upon his throne, revealing through the heavens the grand Key-words of the Priesthood; as, also, the sign of the Holy Ghost unto Abraham, in the form of a dove.
Fig. 8. Contains writings that cannot be revealed unto the world; but is to be had in the Holy Temple of God.
Fig. 9. Ought not to be revealed at the present time.
Fig. 10. Also.
Fig. 11. Also. If the world can find out these numbers, so let it be. Amen.
Figures 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, and 21 will be given in the own due time of the Lord.
The above translation is given as far as we have any right to give at the present time.

 

[Tashah]

I read the chapters in your link, it says that Jehova talked to Abraham. It's not Jehova. Nobody knows if it's Jehova, Jahuva or Jehuva. It's a translation from Hebrew, and whenever this word is mentioned in the Tanach - there is no punctuation under the letters (all the other words in the Tanach have punctuation under the letters), all that is written are 4 letters that if you want to translate them to English you will get Y/(J - if you translate I to J),H,V,H, the main understanding is that it's acronym of Yihiye, Hove Ve Haya, which means: He will be, he is present and he was.

YHVH is also known as the Tetragrammation. When reading the Torah, one never touches these letters. A pointer is used to not sully the name of God.

Another translation of YHVH could be: "I am whatever I choose to be"