Abortion debate still the same as always

[Atreus21]

So then you hold the same true for life giving organs then like Kidneys. I mean if your kidneys can give life to someone, you should be forced to give one of them up right? I mean life and all if you aren't a hypocrite. If you deliberately keep a kidney a life is threatened.

I don't understand what it has to do with the post you quoted, but:

We're not obliged to risk our lives to prevent all deaths. We're obliged not to deliberately kill other human beings. Not giving your kidney to someone dying of natural causes might be morally defensible. Reaching and and killing an innocent person is not.

 

[Atreus21]

Not true, pregnancy is a risk to the mother. She can die from pregnancy so you are deliberately putting the mother at risk.

Not all risks justify deadly force to mitigate. My mother, being immuno-compromised, would not have been justified in killing someone infected with COVID if they were in close proximity to her.

 

[noonereal]

Hard work every day after school and on weekends from the age of 12 until after graduation when he went into partnership with his brothers in South East Michigan.

And continued work 5 days a week plus middle of the night jobs or weekends when needed.
for many years.

Many small business owners did not have 9 to 5 Jobs.

They have to work at management and maintaining the company and clients 24/7.

So it was a case of who he new, his brothers.
And he worked 5 days a week?
And you think this is a big deal?

The hardest working job i ever had was the poorest paid and exempt from overtime and minimum wage.

The highest paying job I ever had which put in in the top 2% was the easiest, by far.

Here is a fact,
The top factor to being comfortable in America is being born into comfort.
The 2nd greatest factor is luck. Being in the right place at the right time.

This hard work crap is to keep the masses hopefull. Its bogus.
Plus, I know lots of lazy slobs who belive they are hard working folks who "earned" it.

Dolts.

 

[choiceone]

Not all risks justify deadly force to mitigate. My mother, being immuno-compromised, would not have been justified in killing someone infected with COVID if they were in close proximity to her.

Agreed. But unwanted pregnancy is not just about health issues. Consent to sexual intimacy is not unlimited or unconditional. One consents to one act of sexual intimacy: one person can put one body part or something else in one part of one's body for a limited amount of time (four hours of PIV sex is unhealthy). One can consent only if contraception is used, which is a clear statement of non-consent to pregnancy. Then, there is no consent to an embryo's being implanted in one's uterus, let alone for a 9 month period and issuing in childbirth.

If the embryo were a person, it would have no right to be inside of a woman's uterus without consent. As it is legally non compos mentis, it would have the same legal status as a legally insane man with a penis in your vagina, which you discovered on waking up. In NY, at least, f you couldn't get the man's penis out of your vagina without killing him, you'd still have the right to do that, even if he thought what he was doing was okay because he was legally insane. A third party would have the right to help you even if he/she had to kill the guy. The fact that he couldn't be prosecuted and convicted for rape would be irrelevant.

There are people who have equated an embryo to a legally insane rapist (see McDonough, for example). The point is that this isn't about risk. It's about a violation of consent.

 

[minnie616]

So it was a case of who he new, his brothers.
And he worked 5 days a week?
And you think this is a big deal?

The hardest working job i ever had was the poorest paid and exempt from overtime and minimum wage.

The highest paying job I ever had which put in in the top 2% was the easiest, by far.

Here is a fact,
The top factor to being comfortable in America is being born into comfort.
The 2nd greatest factor is luck. Being in the right place at the right time.

This hard work crap is to keep the masses hopefull. Its bogus.
Plus, I know lots of lazy slobs who belive they are hard working folks who "earned" it.

Dolts.

Believe as you want but small businesses and their owners are often referred to as the backbone of our country.

Small Business as a Basis of Economics​

https://realtybiznews.com/small-business-as-a-basis-of-economics/98754172/#:~:text=Depending based on economics, small,new solutions for existing ideas.

I apologize to the Original Poster for taking this thread off topic.

 

[AGENT J]

Constructing the abortion debate on valuing the life of one over the other, with pro-choice being the mother and pro-life the unborn baby, is an entirely false construct most of the time.

1.) that wasnt done
2.) what the OP stated is factually true hence your inability to anybody else inability to prove otherwise
those groups YOU mention dont even agree among themselves, there are prolifers here that say other pro-lifers are not pro-lifers etc etc so NO its not "with pro-choice being the mother and pro-life the unborn baby" as you false claim nor did the OP claim that either . . . .why do you post so many failed and retarded lies LOL

the rest of your moronic "feelings" change no facts and are irrelevant since the OP still stands

 

[noonereal]

Believe as you want but small businesses and their owners are often referred to as the backbone of our country.

Small Business as a Basis of Economics​

https://realtybiznews.com/small-business-as-a-basis-of-economics/98754172/#:~:text=Depending based on economics, small,new solutions for existing ideas.

I apologize to the Original Poster for taking this thread off topic.

I gave nothing against small businesses. I own one myself. I am simply pointing out what it takes to get ahead in life and hard work is not nearly as high on the list as is sold to us.

 

[bluesmoke]

A step forward and a half-step back.

Right. There is nothing new. What is shown over many yrs is that is how progress is made. After that half step back, we later take a full step forward and net an additional half step. We eventually become a more liberal society. Those who wish to be backwards, though, do not give up. The South lost the Civil War, but they haven't given up. Look at Texas. They are proposing legislation to secede from the Union, again.

 

[AGENT J]

Right. There is nothing new. What is shown over many yrs is that is how progress is made. After that half step back, we later take a full step forward and net an additional half step. We eventually become a more liberal society. Those who wish to be backwards, though, do not give up. The South lost the Civil War, but they haven't given up. Look at Texas. They are proposing legislation to secede from the Union, again.

Lots of nutters, bigots and anti-rights/freedom people have trouble giving up fantasy and oppression . . . they are broken inside.

 

[Scrabaholic]

I don't understand what it has to do with the post you quoted, but:

We're not obliged to risk our lives to prevent all deaths. We're obliged not to deliberately kill other human beings. Not giving your kidney to someone dying of natural causes might be morally defensible. Reaching and and killing an innocent person is not.

A zef is not a human being/person. Fact

 

[choiceone]

Right. There is nothing new. What is shown over many yrs is that is how progress is made. After that half step back, we later take a full step forward and net an additional half step. We eventually become a more liberal society. Those who wish to be backwards, though, do not give up. The South lost the Civil War, but they haven't given up. Look at Texas. They are proposing legislation to secede from the Union, again.

Yes, and many of the same states believe that pregnant women should be slaves of the state and be forced to produce more people for the state as they once were forced to produce more slaves for the slave owners.

In fact, the new proposals in places like Missouri recall Missouri's efforts to make free states return slaves to Missouri owners, which issued in the Fugitive Slave Law/Act.

Now, they want to try to sue abortion clinics in states where abortion is legal if women from Missouri have abortions there. They even want to prevent pregnant women from traveling out of Missouri to a state where abortion is legal and having an abortion there.

These are such easy parallels that it is as if these states are literally repeating their stupid history.

 

[minnie616]

So it was a case of who he new, his brothers.
And he worked 5 days a week?

He was on call 7 days a week. 24 hours daytime or middle of night if needed.
That’s what happens when you own a business and are needed in middle of night.

And you think this is a big deal?

No. I think small business require a lot of personal commitment and time especially while building the business.

The hardest working job i ever had was the poorest paid and exempt from overtime and minimum wage.

The highest paying job I ever had which put in in the top 2% was the easiest, by far.

Here is a fact,
The top factor to being comfortable in America is being born into comfort.
The 2nd greatest factor is luck. Being in the right place at the right time.

This hard work crap is to keep the masses hopefull. Its bogus.
Plus, I know lots of lazy slobs who belive they are hard working folks who "earned" it.

Dolts.

Glad you born into comfort and you were lucky and you were in the right place at the right time.
It is a lot easier that way.

Congrats on your luck.

 

[noonereal]

He was on call 7 days a week. 24 hours daytime or middle of night if needed.
That’s what happens when you own a business and are needed in middle of night.




No. I think small business require a lot of personal commitment and time especially while building the business.

Glad you born into comfort and you were lucky and you were in the right place at the right time.
It is a lot easier that way.

Congrats on your luck.

You clearly did not understand my post. I worked sub minimum wage jobs starting out. What you are is determined to self praise.

I aM decidedly not impressed. Seriously.

 

[noonereal]

Right. There is nothing new. What is shown over many yrs is that is how progress is made. After that half step back, we later take a full step forward and net an additional half step. We eventually become a more liberal society. Those who wish to be backwards, though, do not give up. The South lost the Civil War, but they haven't given up. Look at Texas. They are proposing legislation to secede from the Union, again.

This time, I support them. Them and all red states. Enough. Break the country up. I dont want to live like a deplorable.

 

[bluesmoke]

This time, I support them. Them and all red states. Enough. Break the country up. I dont want to live like a deplorable.

Then you are advocating war by the red states seceding from the Union. Regardless of if wishing to rid yourself of the red states.

 

[minnie616]

Then you are advocating war by the red states seceding from the Union. Regardless of if wishing to rid yourself of the red states.

And as the red states get deeper in debt because of all the welfare poverty in their state , they will expect the workers/taxpayers in the wealthier states to fund their poor states.

Mississippi and West Virginia for example are among the highest who are dependent on Federal dollars.


Look at the link I am posting :

The States That Are Most Reliant on Federal Aid

MoneyGeek’s analysis identified the states most reliant on federal funding and found an intriguing correlation between dependency and political leaning.

www.moneygeek.com

 

[bluesmoke]

And as the red states get deeper in debt because of all the welfare poverty in their state , they will expect the workers/taxpayers in the wealthier states to fund their poor states.

Mississippi and West Virginia for example are among the highest who are dependent on Federal dollars.


Look at the link I am posting :

The States That Are Most Reliant on Federal Aid

MoneyGeek’s analysis identified the states most reliant on federal funding and found an intriguing correlation between dependency and political leaning.

www.moneygeek.com

I do believe Fed$ should be distributed based on need. The red states need more, so they get more. That's fine with me.

 

[bluesmoke]

Yes, and many of the same states believe that pregnant women should be slaves of the state and be forced to produce more people for the state as they once were forced to produce more slaves for the slave owners.

In fact, the new proposals in places like Missouri recall Missouri's efforts to make free states return slaves to Missouri owners, which issued in the Fugitive Slave Law/Act.

Now, they want to try to sue abortion clinics in states where abortion is legal if women from Missouri have abortions there. They even want to prevent pregnant women from traveling out of Missouri to a state where abortion is legal and having an abortion there.

These are such easy parallels that it is as if these states are literally repeating their stupid history.

Rep/cons should be aware of their own bias that banning abortion will produce a higher % babies the Rep/con believe, in their own bias, has tendency to rely on govt assistance and thus a "drain" on the economy and govt resource.