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Abortion And The BIBLE

tosca1

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The following are the grounds that you'd find in an old thread, titled Abortion On Christian Ground.

Post #2 – Biblical references to the fetus being human

Post #3 – Old Testament, God's view of life before birth
Post #4 – Ground #2
Post #6 – Ground #3
Post #7 – Ground #4
Post #8 – Ground #5

Post #9 – On being neutral and silent




Lately, the misconception that abortion isn't in the Bible is being used again as an argument.
The term “abortion,” may not be found anywhere in the Bible, but that doesn't mean it isn't there.
Abortion is the deliberate taking of life, therefore it is murder.
The evil act is compounded by the fact that abortion is the murder of an innocent and the most vulnerable of all men.


Here is the verse that defines the unborn as an innocent:


Romans 9

10 Not only that, but Rebekah’s children were conceived at the same time by our father Isaac.
11 Yet,
before the twins were born or had done anything good or bad—in order that God’s purpose in election might stand:



...and, here is a verse that condemns abortion:


Proverbs 6

16 There are six things the Lord hates,
seven that are detestable to him:

17 haughty eyes,
a lying tongue,
hands that shed innocent blood,





Not only that, it is also being argued that God thinks so low of the unborn that He compared him to a slug! :)



The Fetus Has A Soul

Some argue that the unborn has no soul. They want to say that because without a soul, it means the unborn is not a human being. And if the fetus isn't a human being, then it wouldn't be murder.

Human life is sacred. It has dignity. WHY? Because God has implanted his image within every one of us! The image of God refers to
that part of humanity that is IMMATERIAL, (i.e. SOUL).

The human soul is that part of the human that isn't physical.


https://www.gotquestions.org/human-soul.html


And God had given it long before we were born.
God told Jeremiah, “Before I formed you in the womb, I knew you. Before you were born, I set you apart.” Jer 1:5


And, Psalm 139:13 declares, "For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother’s womb."


How many verses from various prophets from various timelines describe the care and personal touch rendered by God on the fetus: “Formed thee in the womb.” Jeremiah, Job, Isaiah, and Psalmists.
 
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The Fetus Is A Human Being


The Bible says the fetus is a human being. Science says human life begins at conception.
Logic says the same thing! After all, what else would be the offspring of human beings – no matter what stage of development the offspring is?


Job 3

3 After this, Job opened his mouth and cursed the day of his birth.
2 He said:
3 “May the day of my birth perish,

and the night that said, ‘A boy is conceived!’



The Bible also refers to the fetus as a baby............. as children!

Luke 1

41 And when Elizabeth heard the greeting of Mary, the baby leaped in her womb. And Elizabeth was filled with the Holy Spirit,

Luke 1
44 For behold, when the sound of your greeting came to my ears, the
baby in my womb leaped for joy.

Genesis 25

22 The children struggled together within her, and she said, “If it is thus, why is this happening to me?” So she went to inquire of the Lord.


Not only that!
The Bible refers to the unborn as ................... a PEOPLE! A NATION!




Genesis 25
21 Now Isaac pleaded with the LORD for his wife, because she was barren; and the LORD granted his plea, and Rebekah his wife conceived.
22 But the children struggled together within her; and she said, “If all is well, why am I like this?” So she went to inquire of the LORD.
23 And the LORD said to her:
Two nations are in your womb,
Two peoples shall be separated from your body;
One people shall be stronger than the other,
And the older shall serve the younger.”




And on top of all that, the fetus is also referred to as a reward from God.



Psalm 127
3 Behold, children are a gift of the Lord,
The fruit of the womb is a reward.




So, how anyone can even think that the fetus has no more value than a slug, is beyond me! :)
 
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The Fetus Has A Soul
The bible doesn't say that anywhere. Quite the contrary, the bible says our spirit enters the body with the first breath, and leaves with the last breath.
Not only that, it refers to it at least 30 TIMES !!
Have you even read the book?
 
...and, here is a verse that condemns abortion:


Proverbs 6

16 There are six things the Lord hates,
seven that are detestable to him:

17 haughty eyes,
a lying tongue,
hands that shed innocent blood,

Cows are innocent and have blood. Does that mean the bible condemns eating beef?

Come to think of it, according to the bible, and unborn child is not innocent -- it hasn't been baptized yet and is therefore guilty of original sin.

Not that I actually care what the bible says.
 
The bible doesn't say that anywhere. Quite the contrary, the bible says our spirit enters the body with the first breath, and leaves with the last breath.
Not only that, it refers to it at least 30 TIMES !!
Have you even read the book?

I'm talking about SOUL. You're talking about SPIRIT.
The spirit and the soul are not exactly the same.



1 Thesalonians 5
23 Now may the God of peace himself sanctify you completely, and may your whole spirit and soul and body be kept blameless at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ.


Hwebrews 4

12 For the word of God is alive and active. Sharper than any double-edged sword, it penetrates even to dividing soul and spirit, joints and marrow; it judges the thoughts and attitudes of the heart.
 
How anyone can believe anything in the bible is beyond most of the people on the planet.
According to the Bible, Egypt is a place that exists. You just said that you can't understand how anyone would believe Egypt exists because Egypt is of the things in the bible. I formally invite you to take your flat-earth moon-landing-hoax nonsense elsewhere :)
 
Cows are innocent and have blood. Does that mean the bible condemns eating beef?

:rolleyes:

We're talking about murder - which definition is applied to MAN!



Come to think of it, according to the bible, and unborn child is not innocent -- it hasn't been baptized yet and is therefore guilty of original sin.
:rolleyes:

....explains the one who don't even understand the difference between a cow and a person! Hahahahaha




Not that I actually care what the bible says.

It's obvious.

You don't seem to care about what the dictionary says too.
 

• A pregnant woman who is injured and aborts the fetus warrants financial compensation only (to her husband), suggesting that the fetus is property, not a person (Exodus 21:22-25).

• The gruesome priestly purity test to which a wife accused of adultery must submit will cause her to abort the fetus if she is guilty, indicating that the fetus does not possess a right to life (Numbers 5:11-31).

• God enumerated his punishments for disobedience, including "cursed shall be the fruit of your womb" and "you will eat the fruit of your womb," directly contradicting sanctity-of-life claims (Deuteronomy 28:18,53).

• Elisha's prophecy for soon-to-be King Hazael said he would attack the Israelites, burn their cities, crush the heads of their babies and rip open their pregnant women (2 Kings 8:12).

• King Menahem of Israel destroyed Tiphsah (also called Tappuah) and the surrounding towns, killing all residents and ripping open pregnant women with the sword (2 Kings 15:16).

• Isaiah prophesied doom for Babylon, including the murder of unborn children: "They will have no pity on the fruit of the womb" (Isaiah 13:18).

• For worshiping idols, God declared that not one of his people would live, not a man, woman, or child (not even babies in arms), again confusing assertions about the sanctity of life (Jeremiah 44:7-8).

• God will punish the Israelites by destroying their unborn children, who will die at birth, or perish in the womb, or never even be conceived (Hosea 9:10-16).

• For rebelling against God, Samaria's people will be killed, their babies will be dashed to death against the ground, and their pregnant women will be ripped open with a sword (Hosea 13:16).

• Jesus did not express any special concern for unborn children during the anticipated end times: "Woe to pregnant women and those who are nursing" (Matthew 24:19).

 
:rolleyes:

We're talking about murder - which definition is applied to MAN!

No, we're talking about abortion and your argument for why you think it should be considered murder. But once again, here you are being circular. Why am I not surprised?

That reference in the bible to shedding blood of innocents doesn't say anything about it applying just to man.
 
No, we're talking about abortion and your argument for why you think it should be considered murder. But once again, here you are being circular. Why am I not surprised?

That reference in the bible to shedding blood of innocents doesn't say anything about it applying just to man.
Wrong...

"Every moving animal that is alive may serve as food for you. Just as I gave you the green vegetation, I give them all to you. Only flesh with its life—its blood—you must not eat." Genesis 9:3,4
 
Wrong...

"Every moving animal that is alive may serve as food for you. Just as I gave you the green vegetation, I give them all to you. Only flesh with its life—its blood—you must not eat." Genesis 9:3,4

Weird. So many contradictions. And that even seems to support cannibalism. Humans are animals, after all.
 
Weird. So many contradictions. And that even seems to support cannibalism. Humans are animals, after all.
Wrong again..after the flood of Noah’s day God authorized humans to administer capital punishment for murder...

"Anyone shedding man’s blood, by man will his own blood be shed, for in God’s image He made man." Genesis 9:6
 
• A pregnant woman who is injured and aborts the fetus warrants financial compensation only (to her husband), suggesting that the fetus is property, not a person (Exodus 21:22-25).

No, that's not what it means. Let's read that passage again:


Exodus
22 “If people are fighting and hit a pregnant woman and she gives birth prematurely but there is no serious injury,
the offender must be fined whatever the woman’s husband demands and the court allows.

23 But if there is serious injury, you are to take life for life,

24 eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot, 25 burn for burn, wound for wound, bruise for bruise.



The key phrase is, pregnant woman and she gives birth PREMATURELY.

If this is all about the value of the woman only - there wouldn't be any need to mention and specify her PREGNANCY.

The woman isn't the only one affected by premature birthing. The child is put at risk too, perhaps more so.
That law applies to both mother and child.
 
I'm talking about SOUL. You're talking about SPIRIT.
The spirit and the soul are not exactly the same.
That was merely my choice of words. You're splitting hairs.
The references to "the breath of life" don't distinguish. The bible's definition of "life" begins with the first breath, and ends with the last !!
Your book says so - so go argue with it!
 
• A pregnant woman who is injured and aborts the fetus warrants financial compensation only (to her husband), suggesting that the fetus is property, not a person (Exodus 21:22-25).

• The gruesome priestly purity test to which a wife accused of adultery must submit will cause her to abort the fetus if she is guilty, indicating that the fetus does not possess a right to life (Numbers 5:11-31).

• God enumerated his punishments for disobedience, including "cursed shall be the fruit of your womb" and "you will eat the fruit of your womb," directly contradicting sanctity-of-life claims (Deuteronomy 28:18,53).

• Elisha's prophecy for soon-to-be King Hazael said he would attack the Israelites, burn their cities, crush the heads of their babies and rip open their pregnant women (2 Kings 8:12).

• King Menahem of Israel destroyed Tiphsah (also called Tappuah) and the surrounding towns, killing all residents and ripping open pregnant women with the sword (2 Kings 15:16).

• Isaiah prophesied doom for Babylon, including the murder of unborn children: "They will have no pity on the fruit of the womb" (Isaiah 13:18).

• For worshiping idols, God declared that not one of his people would live, not a man, woman, or child (not even babies in arms), again confusing assertions about the sanctity of life (Jeremiah 44:7-8).

• God will punish the Israelites by destroying their unborn children, who will die at birth, or perish in the womb, or never even be conceived (Hosea 9:10-16).

• For rebelling against God, Samaria's people will be killed, their babies will be dashed to death against the ground, and their pregnant women will be ripped open with a sword (Hosea 13:16).

• Jesus did not express any special concern for unborn children during the anticipated end times: "Woe to pregnant women and those who are nursing" (Matthew 24:19).

Not to mention the fact that the hands-down greatest abortionist of all time is apparently god himself - because countless perfectly natural miscarriages have happened daily, and throughout millennia, all of which are no doubt considered "acts of god". Clearly, god doesn't give a shit about fetuses - only his misguided would-be cult followers consider them important.
 
No, we're talking about abortion and your argument for why you think it should be considered murder. But once again, here you are being circular. Why am I not surprised?

That reference in the bible to shedding blood of innocents doesn't say anything about it applying just to man.


IT IS STILL...........................MURDER! The Fetus is a human being!
You've got to connect the dots. You can't exclude what's relevant and related to the issue - that's irrational.

Hands that shed innocent blood, is applicable to the murder of a fetus! ABORTION!
The fetus has the innocence of children - even more so since the fetus has never done anything - neither good or bad!

The evil of murder is compounded more so since the person being murdered is an innocent, and the most vulnerable of human beings!
This is among those which Christians are supposed to protect!
 
IT IS STILL...........................MURDER!
No - it isn't.
No matter how loud you shout it with bold oversized type, it still isn't.
The next time you scream it in 26pt bold red, it still won't be.
Or the time after that . . . or the time after that . . . or the time after that. Get it?






How about now? Get it yet?
 
• The gruesome priestly purity test to which a wife accused of adultery must submit will cause her to abort the fetus if she is guilty, indicating that the fetus does not possess a right to life (Numbers 5:11-31).

That a TEST FOR ADULTERY!
No one said anything about pregnancy - how is that related to abortion?


Numbers 5


19 Then the priest shall make her take an oath, saying, ‘If no man has lain with you, and if you have not turned aside to uncleanness while you were under your husband's authority, be free from this water of bitterness that brings the curse.
20 But if you have gone astray, though you are under your husband's authority, and if you have defiled yourself, and some man other than your husband has lain with you,
21 then’ (let the priest make the woman take the oath of the curse, and say to the woman) ‘the Lord make you a curse and an oath among your people,
when the Lord makes your thigh fall away and your body swell.
22 May this water that brings the curse pass into your bowels and make your womb swell and your thigh fall away.’
And the woman shall say, ‘Amen, Amen.’


23 “Then the priest shall write these curses in a book and wash them off into the water of bitterness.
24 And he shall make the woman drink the water of bitterness that brings the curse, and the water that brings the curse shall enter into her
and cause bitter pain.
25 And the priest shall take the grain offering of jealousy out of the woman's hand and shall wave the grain offering before the Lord
and bring it to the altar.
26 And the priest shall take a handful of the grain offering, as its memorial portion, and burn it on the altar, and afterward shall make
the woman drink the water.
27 And when he has made her drink the water, then, if she has defiled herself and has broken faith with her husband, the water that brings
the curse shall enter into her and cause bitter pain, and her womb shall swell, and her thigh shall fall away, and the woman shall become
a curse among her people.

28 But if the woman has not defiled herself and is clean, then she shall be free and shall conceive children.
 
That was merely my choice of words. You're splitting hairs.
The references to "the breath of life" don't distinguish. The bible's definition of "life" begins with the first breath, and ends with the last !!
Your book says so - so go argue with it!
Wrong...life is in the blood...the unborn have blood flowing thru their veins...

"For the life of the flesh is in the blood, and I myself have given it on the altar for you to make atonement for yourselves, because it is the blood that makes atonement by means of the life in it." Leviticus 17:11
 
• God enumerated his punishments for disobedience, including "cursed shall be the fruit of your womb" and "you will eat the fruit of your womb," directly contradicting sanctity-of-life claims (Deuteronomy 28:18,53).

There is the key phrase. Punishment for disobedience.

The OT has lots of God's punishments that saw people perish. Like the rest of examples you gave.



• Elisha's prophecy for soon-to-be King Hazael said he would attack the Israelites, burn their cities, crush the heads of their babies and rip open their pregnant women (2 Kings 8:12).

• King Menahem of Israel destroyed Tiphsah (also called Tappuah) and the surrounding towns, killing all residents and ripping open pregnant women with the sword (2 Kings 15:16).

• Isaiah prophesied doom for Babylon, including the murder of unborn children: "They will have no pity on the fruit of the womb" (Isaiah 13:18).

• For worshiping idols, God declared that not one of his people would live, not a man, woman, or child (not even babies in arms), again confusing assertions about the sanctity of life (Jeremiah 44:7-8).

• God will punish the Israelites by destroying their unborn children, who will die at birth, or perish in the womb, or never even be conceived (Hosea 9:10-16).

• For rebelling against God, Samaria's people will be killed, their babies will be dashed to death against the ground, and their pregnant women will be ripped open with a sword (Hosea 13:16).




God giveth life - He can take it away. That's the prerogative of being God.
We are not God.


• Jesus did not express any special concern for unborn children during the anticipated end times: "Woe to pregnant women and those who are nursing" (Matthew 24:19).

He doesn't have to.
He already did express special concern for the unborn - by specifically mentioning PREGNANT women!
What do pregnant women carry?
What do "nursing women" and pregnant women have in common? BABIES!
 
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Wrong...life is in the blood...the unborn have blood flowing thru their veins...

"For the life of the flesh is in the blood, and I myself have given it on the altar for you to make atonement for yourselves, because it is the blood that makes atonement by means of the life in it." Leviticus 17:11
Wrong - you're quote is describing where life resides - not where it begins and ends. There are over thirty references in the bible citing "the breath of life being breathed into", or "the breath of life leaving". Feel free to play at will with those, and countless other contradictions.

Here's a suggestion. Perhaps you might find some deeper inspirational insights into your god if you make a blood sacrifice. He seems to like that.
But ... don't hold your breath!

(lol - I slay me!)
 
That was merely my choice of words. You're splitting hairs.
The references to "the breath of life" don't distinguish. The bible's definition of "life" begins with the first breath, and ends with the last !!
Your book says so - so go argue with it!
:rolleyes:


Even if you call it, "it"......so what!
Especially nowadays.........It, can apply to someone whose gender we don't know!
Like someone transitioning between genders - you saying they're inhuman?
They're not alive? :)



Wrong! Hahaha - I know you don't care for the Bible - but, you don't want to listen to science and logic? :LOL:

Go ahead, ask any pregnant mothers if she feels her baby alive in her womb.
The unborn is alive inside the womb - therefore, life begins before the child's first breath!
That's a no-brainer!
 
Wrong - you're quote is describing where life resides - not where it begins and ends. There are over thirty references in the bible citing "the breath of life being breathed into", or "the breath of life leaving". Feel free to play at will with those, and countless other contradictions.

Here's a suggestion. Perhaps you might find some deeper inspirational insights into your god if you make a blood sacrifice. He seems to like that.
But ... don't hold your breath!

(lol - I slay me!)


That's what abortion is. The modern-day child sacrifice to the evil god Baal - only these days, we call it SELF.
 
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