A good border wall would devastate --------------

[lwf]

They have a vested interest in letting as many illegals cross as possible. What's a few criminals here and there?

What benefit do democrats gain from illegal immigration?

 

[HenryChinaski]

What benefit do democrats gain from illegal immigration?

Don’t you know? Millions and millions of voters. :shock:

 

[SonOfDaedalus]

They have a vested interest in letting as many illegals cross as possible. What's a few criminals here and there?

The easiest way to to reduce illegal immigration is to remove the incentive that brings them here--jobs. Throw those who employ illegal immigrants in jail and problem solved.

But Republicans don't want to solve the problem either. What makes them worse than Democrats is that they also use illegal immigrants as scapegoats to get their base excited.

1. Guest worker permits
2. Throw employers in prison

Problem solved.

 

[Skeptic Bob]

A good border wall would devastate drug and the sex trafficking business. Makes you wonder why democrats are so against it. Do they have a vested interest in these crimes?

Over 95% of illegal drugs come in by sea. And even if they did want to get drugs over the wall they would just shoot it over the wall. But again, that isn’t how drugs get into our country.

 

[lwf]

Over 95% of illegal drugs come in by sea. And even if they did want to get drugs over the wall they would just shoot it over the wall. But again, that isn’t how drugs get into our country.

It isn't how most illegal immigrants get into our country either.

 

[Tanngrisnir]

A good border wall would devastate drug and the sex trafficking business. Makes you wonder why democrats are so against it. Do they have a vested interest in these crimes?

No, it wouldn't.

Why are you trying to talk about things you don't understand?

 

[Luckyone]

A good border wall would devastate drug and the sex trafficking business. Makes you wonder why democrats are so against it. Do they have a vested interest in these crimes?

You are dreaming

 

[Bullseye]

Really? How much reduction? Worth $5 billion?

This puts that number in context

How about applying $1 billion to finding and punishing employers that hire the illegal laborers?

I've seen nothing that justifies spending that $ in terms of effectiveness.

We already do punish employers. The problem with relying on that is that the illegals are already in the US.

 

[Bullseye]

You are dreaming

Well, just saying "pretty please" doesn't seem to be working, so what's your solution?

 

[RaleBulgarian]

There must be some logical reason that democrats are against the wall. Any suggestions.

If it has to be explained you wouldn’t understand. Too much Trump between your ears.

 

[Lursa]

This puts that number in context

We already do punish employers. The problem with relying on that is that the illegals are already in the US.

That link doesnt answer my question. It doesnt compare the cost of the wall to actual savings in $$ or crime for illegals in the US. (Effectiveness, which was my question) As a matter of fact, it showed many many other places where that money could be better spent.

And we do not punish employers enough. Not hardly. Imagine how many inspections and how much enforcement could be done with just $1 billion.

And if there were fewer jobs, the illegals would leave. Example: during the economic crisis of 2008-2009, the number of illegals in the US dropped significantly and fewer were coming here, because they couldnt find work.

Soooo, no, you're not correct.

 

[ttwtt78640]

That link doesnt answer my question. It doesnt compare the cost of the wall to actual savings in $$ or crime for illegals in the US. (Effectiveness, which was my question) As a matter of fact, it showed many many other places where that money could be better spent.

And we do not punish employers enough. Not hardly. Imagine how many inspections and how much enforcement could be done with just $1 billion.

And if there were fewer jobs, the illegals would leave. Example: during the economic crisis of 2008-2009, the number of illegals in the US dropped significantly and fewer were coming here, because they couldnt find work.

Soooo, no, you're not correct.

You want tangible results - congress wants imagery and the continued flow of campaign cash.

 

[Bullseye]

That link doesnt answer my question. It doesnt compare the cost of the wall to actual savings in $$ or crime for illegals in the US. (Effectiveness, which was my question) As a matter of fact, it showed many many other places where that money could be better spent.

Yeah, we need all those ineffective, duplicative job programs.

And we do not punish employers enough. Not hardly. Imagine how many inspections and how much enforcement could be done with just $1 billion.

And, again, that means we have unemployed illegals already in the country. Why not stop them from getting in?

And if there were fewer jobs, the illegals would leave. Example: during the economic crisis of 2008-2009, the number of illegals in the US dropped significantly and fewer were coming here, because they couldnt find work.

Slight difference between a slumping economy drying up jobs and economy as normal.

Soooo, no, you're not correct.

Nope, you're spinning to avoid acknowledging the utility of a wall along with other anti-illegal immigration measures.

 

[Lursa]

Yeah, we need all those ineffective, duplicative job programs.

And, again, that means we have unemployed illegals already in the country. Why not stop them from getting in?

Slight difference between a slumping economy drying up jobs and economy as normal.
Nope, you're spinning to avoid acknowledging the utility of a wall along with other anti-illegal immigration measures.

No...you didnt come close to proving your claim.

And now you are just moving the goal posts and qualifying everything.

Example:

Your thinking is predictably limited, if you cant even see this: if the employers were unable to hire illegals, then there are fewer jobs and thus, less reason for illegals to come here and reason for them to leave as they did during the economic downturn. The reason is the same: many fewer jobs. :doh

 

[Cephus]

It is a waste of tax payer dollars.

And the $50 billion+ (going with the lowest figures I've seen) spent on illegal aliens EVERY SINGLE YEAR isn't?

 

[Bullseye]

No...you didnt come close to proving your claim.

Wrong, I've clearly laid out the utility and effectiveness of walls in preventing illegal entry. Your primary problem is because it's Trump proposing it.

I moved nothing.

Example:

Your thinking is predictably limited, if you cant even see this: if the employers were unable to hire illegals, then there are fewer jobs and thus, less reason for illegals to come here and reason for them to leave as they did during the economic downturn. The reason is the same: many fewer jobs. :doh

And you accuse ME of limited
reasoning? Let's put all our effort into one basket and hope we can catch enough employers to force illegals to go back. How long do you think that would take? Why not cut down on the inflow AND accelerator the outflow?

 

[SonOfDaedalus]

And the $50 billion+ (going with the lowest figures I've seen) spent on illegal aliens EVERY SINGLE YEAR isn't?

To paraphrase Milton Friedman maybe it's not a zero-sum game.

They come here to fill a labor need in the market which results in increased productivity. When they spend they contribute to the economy.

 

[Cephus]

To paraphrase Milton Friedman maybe it's not a zero-sum game.

They come here to fill a labor need in the market which results in increased productivity. When they spend they contribute to the economy.

If they were here to take jobs, we wouldn't be spending more than $50 billion a year on them. They are coming here for the benefits. I'd rather spend the $30 billion once than $50 billion a year forever.

 

[Lursa]

Wrong, I've clearly laid out the utility and effectiveness of walls in preventing illegal entry. Your primary problem is because it's Trump proposing it.
I moved nothing.


And you accuse ME of limited
reasoning? Let's put all our effort into one basket and hope we can catch enough employers to force illegals to go back. How long do you think that would take? Why not cut down on the inflow AND accelerator the outflow?

No you did zero cost benefit analysis, nor provided any. Dont lie.

And again you demonstrate mental limitations: who ever said going after employers as "the only method" was a plan? Poor, limited assumption on your part. Were you assuming we'd discontinue ALL other methods to identify and stop illegals when the wall was built? :doh

 

[holbritter]

There are, in fact, thousands of ladders already stored on the Mexican side of the border for the walls and fencing that already exist there.

And you know that how? Do you have a link or source for that 'fact'?

 

[holbritter]

What benefit do democrats gain from illegal immigration?

The amount of funding a state gets and the how they are represented is based on population. The census includes illegals (hence the uproar over having the question on the census if you're a legal citizen).

 

[holbritter]

Really? How much reduction? Worth $5 billion?

How about applying $1 billion to finding and punishing employers that hire the illegal laborers?

I've seen nothing that justifies spending that $ in terms of effectiveness.

We waste so much money on useless things. Maybe we can use some of this for the wall. At least the wall will have some results.

How the Government Saved $136 Billion in 5 Years By Cutting Waste | The Fiscal Times

 

[Tigerace117]

And thousands of illegals are just going to jump into the ocean and swim across?

There's this interesting invention people made a little while ago called a "boat".

You can use it to cross the ocean.

Claiming to be in San Diego you should have known that buddy.

 

[Bullseye]

There's this interesting invention people made a little while ago called a "boat".

You can use it to cross the ocean.

Claiming to be in San Diego you should have known that buddy.

I know about illegal aliens using boats - I live in San Diego. They get caught by Coast Guard at sea or LE when they land. Problem is boats have limited capacity - trying to move groups of 50-100 or more as is typical land tactical, requires a lot of boats.

 

[Lursa]

We waste so much money on useless things. Maybe we can use some of this for the wall. At least the wall will have some results.

How the Government Saved $136 Billion in 5 Years By Cutting Waste | The Fiscal Times

Agreed. And Americans are thus very gunshy when it comes to just handing over our tax dollars. So many people just jump on this simplistic solution...little more than a slogan...for a wall. But just how effective would it be? Worth $5 billion? Or would that $$$ be better spent on other methods, like focusing REAL $$ and enforcement on the employers? (for example)