5 dead, 16 hospitalized in mass shooting at Highland Park Fourth of July parade, shooter being sought

[Minerva]

The Vegas shooter was stopped by good guys with guns. He took his own life before they could, but if they hadn't interrupted his plan earlier than he had anticipated (by leaving a door open that triggered an alarm), he would have been free to kill dozens more. Columbine shooters kept shooting until it was clear they would have to engage police directly and they took their own lives.

So the good guy with a gun didn't stop the shooting, it just made the shooter plan so he could kill the maximum number of victims until his clock got punched.

 

[Lycanthrope]

IMO there are distinctions between the mentally ill and the dysfunctional males that commit these killings. There is overlap, but they are not the same thing. However also IMO, *we* are creating, somehow, the dysfunctional ones...our society, our culture.

OK, so you've brought this up again and I am curious as to your thoughts.

Does your definition of "dysfunctional male" extend beyond those men committing mass murder with firearms?
You say "somehow" as though you might not have definitive ideas and that's okay, but what factors do you think are involved in creating these males?
What is dysfunctional about our society/culture that it generates dysfunctional individuals? Can it be remedied?

 

[Lursa]

Las Vegas just got lost in the ever changing news cycle. There is something there that we aren’t being told. The news from then on has been like trying to drink from a firehose.

Hm. It is odd but I hadnt considered they were hiding anything.

 

[donhughesmusic]

The Vegas shooter was stopped by good guys with guns. He took his own life before they could, but if they hadn't interrupted his plan earlier than he had anticipated (by leaving a door open that triggered an alarm), he would have been free to kill dozens more. Columbine shooters kept shooting until it was clear they would have to engage police directly and they took their own lives.

So the shooters stopped themselves. They were not stopped by good guys with guns. They stopped themselves. The good guys were close, but they did not stop the shooters. The shooters stopped themselves.

 

[Lycanthrope]

The Vegas shooter was stopped by good guys with guns. He took his own life before they could, but if they hadn't interrupted his plan earlier than he had anticipated (by leaving a door open that triggered an alarm), he would have been free to kill dozens more. Columbine shooters kept shooting until it was clear they would have to engage police directly and they took their own lives.

"In 2017 the Vegas shooter shot 60 people to death and wounded over 400 more."

"Whew - thank God there were good guys with guns around or that could have been a LOT worse! Next..."

 

[noonereal]

So, you're breaking the law. Guess laws don't work if you don't want to follow them, right?

I am not driving to Canada or Mexico to get legal pot.

Yes a few guns would come in but with one nation, one set of laws that restricted the nutters, we could make tremendous changes.

 

[ASHES]

So the good guy with a gun didn't stop the shooting, it just made the shooter plan so he could kill the maximum number of victims until his clock got punched.

"Until they get stopped by a good guy with a gun" is the same thing. And it's how they usually end.

 

[Bodi]

Now 6 dead 12 in serious condition. At a 4th of July parade no less! How does this stop!!!

It won't.

I will actually get worse.

It will take extreme measures to make a dent and that means the government do some serious crackdown shit.

 

[Maidenrules29]

The gun zealots thank these 5 (plus 16) and their families for giving their lives

That is so disingenuous and I want to vomit every time I hear people say that. Legal gun owners wish that NO ONE would ever die by gunfire. The fact is, that because of the history of this country and the 2A, the guns are out there, in circulation, and there's nothing we can do about it. What we can do is try like hell to not raise criminals, and keep the guns out of the hands of criminals.

 

[Utility Man]

Doctor from the hospital (on the TV) says 25 of the 26 people admitted there had gunshot wounds.

Thank goodness for modern medicine.

 

[Lursa]

OK, so you've brought this up again and I am curious as to your thoughts.

?? The FBI, the AMA (esp. psych), and other agencies have profiles on males like this. We studied them in training in HR. And they've developed them further since then.

Here's a current article by a psychiatric professional:

https://www.cnn.com/2022/06/18/opinions/mass-murders-pathway-to-violence-bergen-meloy/index.html

Does your definition of "dysfunctional male" extend beyond those men committing mass murder with firearms?

Hell yeah. Violence is high all across the US, esp. domestic abuse, road rage, white nationalism, etc. and males are accountable for 90% of it per FBI stats. I've posed them before, dont have them handy now.

You say "somehow" as though you might not have definitive ideas and that's okay, but what factors do you think are involved in creating these males?
What is dysfunctional about our society/culture that it generates dysfunctional individuals? Can it be remedied?

I dont feel like writing a novel but things like entitlement, bullying, both parents working, parents that dont provide enough attention (IMO TV & phones are the babysitters), structure, and discipline, vilifying gay and LGBT kids/adults and creating unnecessary fear, insecurity, hate, confusion, <fill in the blank> and mostly 'division' and the highly ignorant polarization of society that is often too stupid to accept facts and science and believes that 'their beliefs' drive reality and not the other way around.

And of course it can be remedied. But again, not writing a novel.

“There is a cult of ignorance in the United States, and there has always been. The strain of anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.”​

― Issac Asimov​

 

[noonereal]

Now 6 dead 12 in serious condition. At a 4th of July parade no less! How does this stop!!!

We have a serious nutter problem in the USA that is used by evil politicians to make themselves rich
As such, the slaughter will not stop.

 

[SkyFox76]

Just heard they are running the serial number on the weapon. Maybe that will give them a lead, unless it's stolen.

As for his description, not sure how they confuse the shirt as being white or blue. It's also possible he's shaved his head by now and headed to do more damage. Hoping not, but it's been quite a few hours and they've got nothing.

 

[SCrider]

The only thing that stops a bad guy with a gun is .............. what then?

Doing every damn thing possible to keep that gun out of his hands in the first place.

 

[trouble13]

It's not splitting hairs. It is north of Chicago and a very upscale town......this is not about Chicago's inner-city gun violence. BTW the shooter is a young white male.

That goes without saying. The reaction by Progressives makes the shooter's race and gender obvious.

 

[Lursa]

The gun zealots thank these 5 (plus 16) and their families for giving their lives so they can continue without sacrifice. A rather small price to pay to maintain unfettered gun rights, don't you think? It seems the status quo in the proliferation of guns is far more important than 5 lives (not to mention the lives of all of those that were at this event, but will now live in terror, some with sleepless nights and riddled with anxiety the rest of their lives).

The clearest evidence that your opinion is not accurate is the fact that every time one of these tragedies occurs, it endangers our rights. They absolutely go against the best interests of those supporting the 2A.

 

[Manc Skipper]

That goes without saying. The reaction by Progressives makes the shooter's race and gender obvious.

 

[Josie]

Doing every damn thing possible to keep that gun out of his hands in the first place.

Sounds good to me.

 

[Lursa]

It's certainly one aspect of a complex problem. What are your thoughts on the hows and whys?

Care to answer my question first? Are you open to the idea that 'guns' are not the real problem but a only a symptom?

Let's see your opinions on this.

 

[Bodi]

The gun zealots thank these 5 (plus 16) and their families for giving their lives so they can continue without sacrifice.

That is so disingenuous and I want to vomit every time I hear people say that.

The gun zealots thank these 5 (plus 16) and their families for giving their lives so they can continue without sacrifice.

 

[Josie]

Just heard they are running the serial number on the weapon. Maybe that will give them a lead, unless it's stolen.

As for his description, not sure how they confuse the shirt as being white or blue. It's also possible he's shaved his head by now and headed to do more damage. Hoping not, but it's been quite a few hours and they've got nothing.

Maybe a light blue?

 

[j brown's body]

That is so disingenuous and I want to vomit every time I hear people say that. Legal gun owners wish that NO ONE would ever die by gunfire. The fact is, that because of the history of this country and the 2A, the guns are out there, in circulation, and there's nothing we can do about it. What we can do is try like hell to not raise criminals, and keep the guns out of the hands of criminals.

The marketing of guns by manufacturers and advocates probably doesn't help. That includes not just exploiting male insecurities but presenting them as a valid source of protection, which is mostly a myth, or a legitimate tool for problem solving (one thinks of all those ads with gun weilding Republi+can candidates).

The problem is everywhere: mass shootings, inner city "justice", suicides, spouse and other assaults, accidental injuries and deaths.

A true public health crisis.

 

[Utility Man]

That small town has been forever changed.

Sadly that "change" is like a disease slowly spreading across America.

FWIW, it is also raining now (on the evidence and belongings left behind etc).

Swat team and news crews are set up about a mile from the scene. Looks like a residential area.

 

[j brown's body]

That goes without saying. The reaction by Progressives makes the shooter's race and gender obvious.

Don't kid yourself, nobody cares about blacks killing each other unless its to rag on Democratic city governments.

 

[Bodi]

We have a serious nutter problem in the USA that is used by evil politicians to make themselves rich
As such, the slaughter will not stop.

That really is it... there are Gun Salivators out there caressing their guns refusing to give an inch while politicians and businessmen make shitloads of money not really giving a shit if people die as a result because they are far removed from the actual violence.