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4- Charged for Attempt to Tear Down Andrew Jackson Statue

Perotista

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There are no moral winners in the past...Democrat or Republican.

Perhaps I should have said what was the norm and what was accepted. Moral standards do change over time.
 
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There are no moral winners in the past...Democrat or Republican.
The arrival of all those foreigners from all over the world -bringing their languages, religions, and cultures with them - really brought down the tone of the country, So unlike what happened on other continents.
 

ClaraD

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The arrival of all those foreigners from all over the world -bringing their languages, religions, and cultures with them - really brought down the tone of the country, So unlike what happened on other continents.

No, those foreigners from all over the world are what has made this country. They are who built the country, Chinese, Irish, Latinos, Africans and countless others. The Latinos, though weren't necessarily foreigners, they were already here...we just absorbed parts of their country and made it part of the US.
 

ClaraD

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Perhaps I should have said what was the norm and what was accepted. Moral standards do change over time.

Correct, standards to change over time...however, our hind sight should be 20/20 and we should not forget the errors of the past, so that they are not repeated.

btw, I had to read your screen name about 4 times before it stuck in my head...in Spanish periodista is reporter or media person and your moniker is very close to that...just thought you would find that interesting.
 
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coyotedelmar

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I agree they should be charged, and I'd fine with Jackson's monument being removed. There is a way to go about that though, not just tearing something down because you don't like it. prison time would be way too much though, but I'm a believer that prisons should be for rehabilitation and not just punishment.
 

Crossfire

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I agree they should be charged, and I'd fine with Jackson's monument being removed. There is a way to go about that though, not just tearing something down because you don't like it. prison time would be way too much though, but I'm a believer that prisons should be for rehabilitation and not just punishment.

Prisons are supposed to be punishment, rehabilitation centers are for rehabilitation. Perhaps if prisons were less accommodating, people would feel more urgency to avoid them. However, for these vandals, maybe having them help erect a new statue would deter them from destroying them unlawfully in the first place.
 

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...A statue made of stone (which is idolatry if you are Christian btw)...

How about instead of misrepresenting the Bible, you just leave Christianity to the Christians?
 

ClaraD

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How about instead of misrepresenting the Bible, you just leave Christianity to the Christians?

I am a real Christian, not one of those fake, Sunday only Christians....so, I am not misrepresenting the Bible at all.

Ye shall make you no idols nor graven image, neither rear you up a standing image, neither shall ye set up any image of stone in your land, to bow down unto it: for I am the Lord your God. Ye shall keep my sabbaths, and reverence my sanctuary.

— Leviticus 26:1–2, King James Bible

and the NIV Exodus 20:4

You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below. 5 You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, 6 but showing love to a thousand generations of those who love me and keep my commandments.


I don't think God was stuttering when he handed that law down.
 
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I am a real Christian, not one of those fake, Sunday only Christians....so, I am not misrepresenting the Bible at all.

Ye shall make you no idols nor graven image, neither rear you up a standing image, neither shall ye set up any image of stone in your land, to bow down unto it: for I am the Lord your God. Ye shall keep my sabbaths, and reverence my sanctuary.

— Leviticus 26:1–2, King James Bible

and the NIV Exodus 20:4

You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below. 5 You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, 6 but showing love to a thousand generations of those who love me and keep my commandments.I don't think God was stuttering when he handed that law down.
Leviticus, huh? He's the go to OT guy whenever anyone wants to make a point against Christianity. You're no Christian or you'd be aware of that.
 

ClaraD

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Leviticus, huh? He's the go to OT guy whenever anyone wants to make a point against Christianity. You're no Christian or you'd be aware of that.

I am quoting the 10 Commandments, the basis for Christian beliefs and laws. So, if you were an actual Christian you would know that. btw, After I have told you I am Christian, attacking me on that is considered a personal attack and a violation of the rules here. I would suggest you consider another modus operandi. I have been a Christian my entire life and know the bible better than any of these fake Christians that follow Trump as their god.
 

Crossfire

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I am a real Christian, not one of those fake, Sunday only Christians....so, I am not misrepresenting the Bible at all.

Ye shall make you no idols nor graven image, neither rear you up a standing image, neither shall ye set up any image of stone in your land, to bow down unto it: for I am the Lord your God. Ye shall keep my sabbaths, and reverence my sanctuary.

— Leviticus 26:1–2, King James Bible

and the NIV Exodus 20:4

You shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below. 5 You shall not bow down to them or worship them; for I, the Lord your God, am a jealous God, punishing the children for the sin of the parents to the third and fourth generation of those who hate me, 6 but showing love to a thousand generations of those who love me and keep my commandments.


I don't think God was stuttering when he handed that law down.

Yeah, it is talking about worshiping them, not just having a statue. When your ideology starts dictating how you understand scripture, then you should not be "preaching" to other Christians what the Bible says. Your smug attitude explains why many people do not like "real" Christians.
 

Crossfire

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I am quoting the 10 Commandments, the basis for Christian beliefs and laws. So, if you were an actual Christian you would know that. btw, After I have told you I am Christian, attacking me on that is considered a personal attack and a violation of the rules here. I would suggest you consider another modus operandi. I have been a Christian my entire life and know the bible better than any of these fake Christians that follow Trump as their god.

So, after berating people for their choice in president, you are going to go all Karen on him? Wow.
 

ClaraD

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Yeah, it is talking about worshiping them, not just having a statue. When your ideology starts dictating how you understand scripture, then you should not be "preaching" to other Christians what the Bible says. Your smug attitude explains why many people do not like "real" Christians.

It says, you shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heave above or on the heart beneath or waters below. IT has an addition of you shall not bow down to them...but the first part is do not make them.
 

ClaraD

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So, after berating people for their choice in president, you are going to go all Karen on him? Wow.

telling someone to follow the rules is not being a Karen...however, someone calling the police on a black person building a patio in their own yard, is. However, I am not white, nor do I live in the white part of America

Karen is a pejorative slang term for an obnoxious, angry, entitled, and often racist middle-aged white woman who uses her privilege to get her way or police other people's behaviors.

As featured in memes, Karen is generally stereotyped as having a blonde bob haircut, asking to speak to retail and restaurant managers to voice complaints or make demands, and being an anti-vaxx , Generation X soccer mom.

In 2020, Karen spread as a label used to call out white women who were captured in viral videos engaging in what are widely seen as racist acts.


So, if you are going to use derogatory terms...make sure you actually understand what they mean.
 

Perotista

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Correct, standards to change over time...however, our hind sight should be 20/20 and we should not forget the errors of the past, so that they are not repeated.

btw, I had to read your screen name about 4 times before it stuck in my head...in Spanish periodista is reporter or media person and your moniker is very close to that...just thought you would find that interesting.

I agree, one needs to learn from history in order not to repeat its same mistakes. We have a horrible time learning from history though.

Now that is interesting. Periodista, well I'll be. I like it. I don't speak Spanish, but I do Thai and Lao from my time in Southeast Asia. Actually, I was a big Ross Perot backer in 1992 and 1996, so my name was a play on Perot. I first got to know of Ross back in December of 1969 when I was stationed in Vientiane Laos when he arrived with a 707 filled with Christmas presents for our POW's held in Hanoi. But that is another story for another day.
 

ClaraD

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So, after berating people for their choice in president, you are going to go all Karen on him? Wow.

Um, this thread is about the removal of a statue of a dead man, who was essentially Hitler to Native American Indians. There is nothing in here about choices of president or berating those choices. Get on topic, or move along.
 

ClaraD

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I agree, one needs to learn from history in order not to repeat its same mistakes. We have a horrible time learning from history though.

Now that is interesting. Periodista, well I'll be. I like it. I don't speak Spanish, but I do Thai and Lao from my time in Southeast Asia. Actually, I was a big Ross Perot backer in 1992 and 1996, so my name was a play on Perot. I first got to know of Ross back in December of 1969 when I was stationed in Vientiane Laos when he arrived with a 707 filled with Christmas presents for our POW's held in Hanoi. But that is another story for another day.

Yes, indeed. I also supported Perot back in the day after frustration at the choices given to us during that election. I would be interested in hearing those stories..my late father married a woman from Thailand.
 

Crossfire

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It says, you shall not make for yourself an image in the form of anything in heave above or on the heart beneath or waters below. IT has an addition of you shall not bow down to them...but the first part is do not make them.

So, you really believe that anything made in the shape of anything is idolatry? That is what you are going to go with? Am I to assume you are in agreement with all other Old Testament law?
 

ClaraD

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So, you really believe that anything made in the shape of anything is idolatry? That is what you are going to go with? Am I to assume you are in agreement with all other Old Testament law?

i believe statues are idolatry as a Christian and as the laws of the Bible mandate that they are. Is the statue not made of stone? Is it not a graven image? It is all of those things and was made as something to revere..it is idolatry. Nope, Jesus came and changed much of that...I am not Jewish... he, however, did not alter the 10 commandments. Do you think that we aren't beholden to the 10 Commandments?
 

Crossfire

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telling someone to follow the rules is not being a Karen...however, someone calling the police on a black person building a patio in their own yard, is. However, I am not white, nor do I live in the white part of America

Karen is a pejorative slang term for an obnoxious, angry, entitled, and often racist middle-aged white woman who uses her privilege to get her way or police other people's behaviors.

As featured in memes, Karen is generally stereotyped as having a blonde bob haircut, asking to speak to retail and restaurant managers to voice complaints or make demands, and being an anti-vaxx , Generation X soccer mom.

In 2020, Karen spread as a label used to call out white women who were captured in viral videos engaging in what are widely seen as racist acts.


So, if you are going to use derogatory terms...make sure you actually understand what they mean.

Fine, you are not a strict, meme definition of Karen. Although, if you had a little more equitable outrage at rule adherence, it might come across as less douchey.
 

ClaraD

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Fine, you are not a strict, meme definition of Karen. Although, if you had a little more equitable outrage at rule adherence, it might come across as less douchey.

Um, I follow the rules here, I expect others to do so as well. I am not applying standards to you, that I do not apply to myself. You can go shout on the street all day if you choose to do so...that is a free speech arena...this arena is constrained by rules and standards.
 

Crossfire

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Um, this thread is about the removal of a statue of a dead man, who was essentially Hitler to Native American Indians. There is nothing in here about choices of president or berating those choices. Get on topic, or move along.

Yes, hall monitor, I know what the topic of the thread is. Can you provide us a list of who all were essentially Hitler, other than Hitler, who was actually Hitler, so we know which statues need removed via vigilantism? Thanks.
 

ClaraD

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Yes, hall monitor, I know what the topic of the thread is. Can you provide us a list of who all were essentially Hitler, other than Hitler, who was actually Hitler, so we know which statues need removed via vigilantism? Thanks.

Andrew Jackson was the person who instituted the acts that led to the Trail of Tears...are you denying that? Since he marched Native American Indians to Concentration camps and relocated them by force, stealing their land and giving it to whites...that makes him Hitler. Are you really trying to deny that occurred?

btw, if you don't like the rules here, you are always free to leave and create your own board.
 

Perotista

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Yes, indeed. I also supported Perot back in the day after frustration at the choices given to us during that election. I would be interested in hearing those stories..my late father married a woman from Thailand.

I did too and after 53 years, still happily married. Ross wasn't successful in his attempt to deliver the Christmas Presents. He choose Vientiane because it had both a North Vietnamese Embassy and an American one. He took the Christmas Presents over to the North Vietnamese Embassy loaded in the back of five or six Lao Army deuce and half's. But the North Vietnamese Ambassador refused to meet with him. I have always remembered that.

I was stationed in Thailand from May of 1967 to Aug 1969, the Laos Aug 1969 thru May 1971, Vietnam May 1971 until March 1973 when the Paris Peace Pact sent us army guys packing. But it was back to Thailand from March 1973 until July 1976. Quite an Experience.
 

Crossfire

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Um, I follow the rules here, I expect others to do so as well. I am not applying standards to you, that I do not apply to myself. You can go shout on the street all day if you choose to do so...that is a free speech arena...this arena is constrained by rules and standards.

You can expect whatever you like. You can also expect to get a nice "Stay in your lane, bossy" response when you exceed your authority. Now, so I do not get reported for being off-topic: Andrew Jackson statue.
 
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