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3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Today

Re: 3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Tod

Actually that is far from the truth of the matter. We refuse to impose trade restrictions on them beacuse we (meaning mostly those that supply campaign cash) like cheap (highly profitable) stuff. You will never see protests over this with demorats in charge, this will become a major issue only if (when?) republicants are in charge.

Just because we can do something does not mean we have a duty to do something.
 
Re: 3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Tod

Just because we can do something does not mean we have a duty to do something.

True, as long as we don't mind paying folks not to work here. ;)
 
Re: 3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Tod

If you lived in a third world country as a child and had a choice of looking for scraps of food in a dump or working in a sweatshop which enabled you to buy a meal, which would you take? The professor of economics in the clip who actually studied several countries didn't say that all sweatshops paid more than the average wage. He did say some do. I still maintain that your argument is ethnocentric. If all sweatshops around the world closed, how many lives would be hurt. How many people would be forced to subsistence farming, gathering firewood for sale or eating from dumpsters or dumps?

You are literally spitting out the same line that I have already stated in my bolded text. Why is this so complicated for you people? Suffering is bad. Human suffering is really bad. If possible, human suffering should be reduced, lessened as much as possible. And you think a bunch of sweat shops is the best that can be done for these people?
 
Re: 3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Tod

Really? SO that give you the ability to justify allowing for millions of people to live their entire lives working on assembly lines 6 days a week (or more) 80 some hours a week, with little food, no freedom to unionize, or go on strike, nothing. Just like most "libertarians" you won't even address the human side of it, you just go straight to the snarky "economic" argument.

And what happens when these companies run out of 3rd world **** holes to run to? Your argument only works with the current system in place, with a seemingly never ending supply of countries willing to beat down their citizens and their workers when those workers demand rights. In the US, in a matter of a few decades, we made an extremely impressive amount of progress. If 1st world countries put their brains and economic power together, most certainly they could find a way to, at the very least, improve conditions in these countries. Passing laws that ban the import of goods made in sweatshop like conditions, for starters, could do a lot in forcing these countries to increase their work standards. Even the SMALLEST of wage demands can end in police beatings and the like.

And yes, companies like Apple, Wal-Mart, Vtech, they are making billions. "Greedy" can be more of a subjective term, but the way people like John Stossel use the word, MOST CERTAINLY they are "greedy".

Why would we want to prevent sweat shops? Everybody benefits from them. You seem to not understand that these workers in China would simply either be unemployed, or would be working the field or gathering bottles to sell. Most sweatshops pay more than the local average income. Nobody is forcing anybody to do anything. They take these jobs because they're good paying jobs where they live.

You want to kill the edge they have and make sure they're unemployed. Answer me this, why would we hire them if they weren't cheaper?

You are literally spitting out the same line that I have already stated in my bolded text. Why is this so complicated for you people? Suffering is bad. Human suffering is really bad. If possible, human suffering should be reduced, lessened as much as possible. And you think a bunch of sweat shops is the best that can be done for these people?

Human suffering IS bad. However, you want these people to suffer MORE. If being unemployed wasn't worse, they wouldn't be working there.

I, of course, agree with you. One thing we can do that may or may not have an immediate impact is to exercise our power as consumers. I try to buy american made or at least in stores where I can track who produces their goods. If I can't do that I shop at stores that have a reputation for treating their employees well. etc.

Question: I wonder about the impact allowing this to continue has on jobs here. As long as these corps can get cheaper labor elsewhere, they will ship jobs out of the US. If the standards are raised for workers in other countries that might keep more jobs here. Is that valid point?

It's a very valid point, more ****ty jobs will be moved to America, making the products more expensive, and the foreign workers unemployed. They lose their jobs, we get more expensive products, and we probably still end up hiring local immigrants to work the job anyway. How many Americans do you know want to work long hours in a sweaty factory for little pay?

Everybody loses in that scenario.
 
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Re: 3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Tod

You are literally spitting out the same line that I have already stated in my bolded text. Why is this so complicated for you people? Suffering is bad. Human suffering is really bad. If possible, human suffering should be reduced, lessened as much as possible. And you think a bunch of sweat shops is the best that can be done for these people?

It's not complicated to understand. It's difficult for you to accept. Ethnocentrism isn't a desirable trait. It's elitist which allows us to feel we are superior to people in the rest of the world, not societies, but individual people. You've also shown empathy which desirable but your ethnocentrism makes you believe that we have the ability or authority to force your will on them. My suggestion to you is let your personal actions make choices which help the economies of the third world. I buy American as often as possible but I don't make myself crazy if I see a shirt I like which is made in Bangladesh. I understand that maybe I'm helping a kid avoid sleeping in a cardboard box or fight with a sea gull over a scrap of bread at the dump.
 
Re: 3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Tod

It is the responsibility of these countries' governments to put building codes in place, effective minimum wage laws, safety standards, etc. It is not the responsibility of the United States of America.

It's not that simple.

Most of these poor countries are under IMF Structural Adjustment contracts, which means that private entities get to have a very formidable say in how labor laws are formed and governed; which means the very codes and ethics you are talking about can easily fly out the window to protect the bottom line of OUR companies.

When nations are under contractual obligation to pay back IMF loans with their resources and cheap labor, adjustments to labor rights are next to impossible.

You can then turn around and say, "Well, their leaders chose to accept IMF loans, so how is that our problem?" That is technically true, but how often do leaders make decisions that are in the best interests of everyone, and not ones that will line their own pockets and creature comforts?

If a super power arrived tomorrow and said it would give the U.S. government a consolidated loan and nice pay raises for everyone in government if the government in turn let them control worker rights, average minimum wage, and resource development, do you think our government wouldn't be tempted to accept?

Our corporations that are exploiting international monetary policy are just as guilty of these incidents occurring as the governments who let those corporations in, if not more so. Yet we get to have our cake and eat it too by exploiting them with our high-risk loans and then turn around and blame THEM when we ignore human rights. We are supposed to be the "developed" powers that have worked through this crap in OUR countries already, but instead we are exporting these old problems elsewhere for our own greedy benefits. You don't find that the slightest bit unethical?
 
Re: 3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Tod

It's not that simple.

Most of these poor countries are under IMF Structural Adjustment contracts, which means that private entities get to have a very formidable say in how labor laws are formed and governed; which means the very codes and ethics you are talking about can easily fly out the window to protect the bottom line of OUR companies.

When nations are under contractual obligation to pay back IMF loans with their resources and cheap labor, adjustments to labor rights are next to impossible.

You can then turn around and say, "Well, their leaders chose to accept IMF loans, so how is that our problem?" That is technically true, but how often do leaders make decisions that are in the best interests of everyone, and not ones that will line their own pockets and creature comforts?

If a super power arrived tomorrow and said it would give the U.S. government a consolidated loan and nice pay raises for everyone in government if the government in turn let them control worker rights, average minimum wage, and resource development, do you think our government wouldn't be tempted to accept?

Our corporations that are exploiting international monetary policy are just as guilty of these incidents occurring as the governments who let those corporations in, if not more so. Yet we get to have our cake and eat it too by exploiting them with our high-risk loans and then turn around and blame THEM when we ignore human rights. We are supposed to be the "developed" powers that have worked through this crap in OUR countries already, but instead we are exporting these old problems elsewhere for our own greedy benefits. You don't find that the slightest bit unethical?

I'm saying that it's not a problem we can solve.

Look, I think it'd be great if Nike made sure its overseas suppliers paid, what? Half our minimum wage? If they opened their own factories in these countries and built them with state-of-the-art safety and building codes in place. Just how long do you think Nike would be in business? You're not going to buy their thrice-priced shoes. And neither is anyone else.

People's beliefs are that our companies should go into these countries and rewrite their laws. It's up to these countries to rewrite their OWN laws. It's up to their people to have their own Haymarket Squares. We can't suddenly export our values, our labor standards, our building codes into Third World countries. Talk about de-stabilizing a country in a heartbeat.

When American businesses go into other countries and start utilizing their labor force, they are a Godsend to the people. There are thousands and thousands of people waiting in line for jobs at these factories. Give these people time to effect their own changes.
 
Re: 3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Tod

It's not complicated to understand. It's difficult for you to accept. Ethnocentrism isn't a desirable trait. It's elitist which allows us to feel we are superior to people in the rest of the world, not societies, but individual people. You've also shown empathy which desirable but your ethnocentrism makes you believe that we have the ability or authority to force your will on them. My suggestion to you is let your personal actions make choices which help the economies of the third world. I buy American as often as possible but I don't make myself crazy if I see a shirt I like which is made in Bangladesh. I understand that maybe I'm helping a kid avoid sleeping in a cardboard box or fight with a sea gull over a scrap of bread at the dump.

Ok. People in many of these countries have tried to change things. They are beaten down by police in places like Bangladesh when they ask for a few cents worth of a pay increase. THEY WANT IT. I will admit, that I probably have certain ideas of how things should be for them that are skewed by where I grew up and where I live, but for very MODEST reforms, reforms that many of THOSE workers want, I think your ethnocentrism counter argument only goes so far.
 
Re: 3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Tod

You want to kill the edge they have and make sure they're unemployed. Answer me this, why would we hire them if they weren't cheaper?

Human suffering IS bad. However, you want these people to suffer MORE. If being unemployed wasn't worse, they wouldn't be working there.

It's a very valid point, more ****ty jobs will be moved to America, making the products more expensive, and the foreign workers unemployed. They lose their jobs, we get more expensive products, and we probably still end up hiring local immigrants to work the job anyway. How many Americans do you know want to work long hours in a sweaty factory for little pay?

Massive environmental damage. Massively shortened lifespans from overwork. And the life spans they do have are severely lower in life quality than they could be. These are not unfixable problems. I read your comments, and as far as I can tell (and feel free to correct me), that this is the best we can do, this is the best things can get, for them and for us; OR (maybe) that they might figure out, in these countries, how to get themselves better work conditions, but there is NOTHING we can, or should, do to help them in even the most modest of reforms.

I AGREE that they would be worse off without a job, but (again) it seems as if you think that since a very dangerous and life damaging sweat shop job is better than starving on the street, that it should be left at that...? Every argument on your post here is based off of what I already addressed (maybe not to your satisfaction) in bold text in the OP. BUT, if there was a way (whatever way that may be, a free market approach, or whatever else) for these people to achieve a better standard of living than what they have now, shouldn't that way be pursued? Or do you think there is no active steps that can be taken to quicken this process?

I'm honestly trying to understand more of where you are coming from with this.
 
Re: 3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Tod

I'm saying that it's not a problem we can solve.

Look, I think it'd be great if Nike made sure its overseas suppliers paid, what? Half our minimum wage? If they opened their own factories in these countries and built them with state-of-the-art safety and building codes in place. Just how long do you think Nike would be in business? You're not going to buy their thrice-priced shoes. And neither is anyone else.

That's why we need something to change that will affect ALL companies, across the board. It can't be done on a single business by business standard, or else those businesses will be out of the game, crushed by the others that still take advantage of these people.
 
Re: 3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Tod

I saw it. Why would you expect anyone to accept a specious argument?

A sprained ankle is better than a broken leg, what's your point? It's still exploitation. Working long hours in dangerous conditions and little pay just so 1st world companies can maximise profits.
Just because other jobs in the country are also sh**ty, doesn't excuse blatant exploitation.
 
Re: 3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Tod

Why would we want to prevent sweat shops? Everybody benefits from them. You seem to not understand that these workers in China would simply either be unemployed, or would be working the field or gathering bottles to sell. Most sweatshops pay more than the local average income. Nobody is forcing anybody to do anything. They take these jobs because they're good paying jobs where they live.

You want to kill the edge they have and make sure they're unemployed. Answer me this, why would we hire them if they weren't cheaper?

False. The US companies could give the workers a decent payrise and better health and safety, and it would still be a lot cheaper to hire those workers there than workers in America.
The countries would still have an edge in wage competitiveness.
 
Re: 3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Tod

Ok. People in many of these countries have tried to change things. They are beaten down by police in places like Bangladesh when they ask for a few cents worth of a pay increase. THEY WANT IT. I will admit, that I probably have certain ideas of how things should be for them that are skewed by where I grew up and where I live, but for very MODEST reforms, reforms that many of THOSE workers want, I think your ethnocentrism counter argument only goes so far.

I have no issue with wishing for an end to child labor or substandard living conditions here or elsewhere. I just believe that it's counter productive to punish Nike for using child labor and impossible to force our will, standards or morality on other governments. If you travel the world you'll see that while everyone lives differently, we are basically the same as people. We love our kids and hope they have better lives than we do. Doesn't matter where you go. It's just that in some countries it's no big deal if you squat on the side of the road and take a dump. Here, not so much. Ethnocentrism says that's nasty but in some places you gotta go when you gotta go.
 
Re: 3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Tod

Unfortunately, there's little motivation to do anything about it. Our government benefits from our people paying low prices, our people benefit from low prices, their governments benefit from getting pay offs (think our wealth gap is big? theirs is HUGE), and they also benefit from their people having jobs (crappy though they are). The losers are, of course, those people. The workers in those countries will have to demand better working conditions etc. Probably the only time I'll openly support the idea of a union is when it comes to real positive change in worker safety and standard of living at the workplace. Labor may be cheap, but there's no excuse for it being unsafe or demeaning. Those people are the only ones that can realistically effect change. It won't be easy...people will get hurt and die from that struggle (reference America's stand for labor rights in the late 1800s early 1900s), but that is the only way any real, lasting change will occur despite your consumer conscience and good intentions.

I think the most important first step would be safety. That is an issue that could garner some public support.
 
Re: 3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Tod

I AGREE that they would be worse off without a job, but (again) it seems as if you think that since a very dangerous and life damaging sweat shop job is better than starving on the street, that it should be left at that.

Who claimed it should be left at that? I think you're confused.
Yes, those cultures, those people, those countries, those governments, should indeed take the opportunities we're giving them to participate in the global marketplace, and continually improve upon them. Perhaps with our guidance, of course.

Who in your opinion is claiming things should NOT improve? I think you're just battling a strawman. Maybe it's just with companies that work with the government, but of the fortunate 500's I work with, they are very heavy handed on labor, ethics, and especially foreign ethics/labor with all of their internal folks as well as everyone who does business with them. So much so that even if it's clear you are not involved at all overseas, you still get to listen to the strict requirements and have to sign off on "we have no one there or do not currently do business with oversease labor, etc.". That may come at the request of government (I would assume, but it may not!), it's largely corporations who tow that line though. Are you saying you don't think they are doing a good job on the whole? Or are you cherry picking the bad actors?
 
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Re: 3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Tod

Well, if its gots to be, better them than me...
 
Re: 3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Tod

Who claimed it should be left at that? I think you're confused.
Yes, those cultures, those people, those countries, those governments, should indeed take the opportunities we're giving them to participate in the global marketplace, and continually improve upon them. Perhaps with our guidance, of course.

Who in your opinion is claiming things should NOT improve? I think you're just battling a strawman. Maybe it's just with companies that work with the government, but of the fortunate 500's I work with, they are very heavy handed on labor, ethics, and especially foreign ethics/labor with all of their internal folks as well as everyone who does business with them. So much so that even if it's clear you are not involved at all overseas, you still get to listen to the strict requirements and have to sign off on "we have no one there or do not currently do business with oversease labor, etc.". That may come at the request of government (I would assume, but it may not!), it's largely corporations who tow that line though. Are you saying you don't think they are doing a good job on the whole? Or are you cherry picking the bad actors?

Going quickly to the point of whether I'm saying the problem is systemic or only occurring in specific instances; when that factory collapsed in Bangladesh, most of the larger American companies refused to sign on to a plan to reform the system, instead deciding to rely on their own inspections (which have been shown to be VERY ineffective in the past http://www.nytimes.com/2013/09/02/business/global/superficial-visits-and-trickery-undermine-foreign-factory-inspections.html?pagewanted=all. They then put forth their own plan, which is significantly less effective than the one offered up by labor reform groups.

Most U.S. clothing chains did not sign pact on Bangladesh factory reforms - Washington Post

New Bangladesh Safety Reform Plan by Wal-Mart, Gap Draws Ire from Labor Groups | Fashionista
 
Re: 3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Tod

I have no issue with wishing for an end to child labor or substandard living conditions here or elsewhere. I just believe that it's counter productive to punish Nike for using child labor and impossible to force our will, standards or morality on other governments. If you travel the world you'll see that while everyone lives differently, we are basically the same as people. We love our kids and hope they have better lives than we do. Doesn't matter where you go. It's just that in some countries it's no big deal if you squat on the side of the road and take a dump. Here, not so much. Ethnocentrism says that's nasty but in some places you gotta go when you gotta go.

It's NOT ethnocentrism. You are REALLY misusing that word. Simply because a government is repressive and corrupt due to big business, doesn't mean the values of the people follow suit. Billion dollar multi-national corporations DO have influence, and most of these big companies are from 1st world nations. Our private sector and public sectors could be used to influence those governments, through politics and economics.
 
Re: 3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Tod

It's NOT ethnocentrism. You are REALLY misusing that word. Simply because a government is repressive and corrupt due to big business, doesn't mean the values of the people follow suit. Billion dollar multi-national corporations DO have influence, and most of these big companies are from 1st world nations. Our private sector and public sectors could be used to influence those governments, through politics and economics.

I'm not misusing the word in the least and you are being ethnocentric.

From WikiL Ethnocentrism is judging another culture solely by the values and standards of one's own culture.[

That's exactly what we are talking about here. Some people look down on cultures that allow child labor or substandard wages. In some cultures it's customary for a father to take the virginity of his daughter. Here it's incest and strictly taboo. We shouldn't judge other cultures based on the way we live because every culture is different. Your attitude is elitist. It's truly what they mean when they talk about the ugly American. We like to meddle in the internal affairs of other governments to try to make them meet some imaginary standard that we create. You remind me of an old saying. You don't know someone until you walk a mile in their shoes but then you'll be a mile away and have their shoes.
 
Re: 3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Tod

I'm not misusing the word in the least and you are being ethnocentric.

From WikiL Ethnocentrism is judging another culture solely by the values and standards of one's own culture.[

That's exactly what we are talking about here. Some people look down on cultures that allow child labor or substandard wages. In some cultures it's customary for a father to take the virginity of his daughter. Here it's incest and strictly taboo. We shouldn't judge other cultures based on the way we live because every culture is different. Your attitude is elitist. It's truly what they mean when they talk about the ugly American. We like to meddle in the internal affairs of other governments to try to make them meet some imaginary standard that we create. You remind me of an old saying. You don't know someone until you walk a mile in their shoes but then you'll be a mile away and have their shoes.

So you are claiming that a society's culture is DEFINED BY THE ACTIONS OF THE PARTICULAR GOVERNMENT IN POWER AT THAT POINT IN TIME? Sure the two can intermix, but, and here are the two most important points that you are either unable to read, or purposefully ignoring;

1. I'M NOT DEFINING THE REFORMS THAT SHOULD BE IMPLEMENTED BY THE STANDARDS SET IN COUNTRIES LIKE THE UNITED STATES. I'm advocating very, VERY, basic rights to be allowed for that could eventually lead to such standards.

2. I'M NOT ADVOCATING FOR SOMETHING THAT WOULD'T BE ADVOCATED FOR BY THE LOCAL POPULACE OF MANY OF THESE NATIONS. We've seen protests take place by workers in countries such as Bangladesh, and the people are beaten down by the government. Are you REALLY going not draw a line of distinction between a corrupt governments actions, and the actual culture and ideals of the masses of people?

You are not addressing my points. You simply keep saying "You are being Ethnocentric" and then proceed to, again and again, define what that means in a way that is IN NO WAY applicable to what I am saying.
 
Re: 3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Tod

So you are claiming that a society's culture is DEFINED BY THE ACTIONS OF THE PARTICULAR GOVERNMENT IN POWER AT THAT POINT IN TIME? Sure the two can intermix, but, and here are the two most important points that you are either unable to read, or purposefully ignoring;

1. I'M NOT DEFINING THE REFORMS THAT SHOULD BE IMPLEMENTED BY THE STANDARDS SET IN COUNTRIES LIKE THE UNITED STATES. I'm advocating very, VERY, basic rights to be allowed for that could eventually lead to such standards.

2. I'M NOT ADVOCATING FOR SOMETHING THAT WOULD'T BE ADVOCATED FOR BY THE LOCAL POPULACE OF MANY OF THESE NATIONS. We've seen protests take place by workers in countries such as Bangladesh, and the people are beaten down by the government. Are you REALLY going not draw a line of distinction between a corrupt governments actions, and the actual culture and ideals of the masses of people?

You are not addressing my points. You simply keep saying "You are being Ethnocentric" and then proceed to, again and again, define what that means in a way that is IN NO WAY applicable to what I am saying.

I'm claiming nothing of the kind. Every culture has it's own folkways and morays but the working environment in which workers toil is dictated by the economic development in that society. If children are reduced to subsistence living, homelessness and poverty, a sweat shop is a welcome respite. There are lots of issues that create those conditions. Certainly government is responsible for much of the economic development, system of currency, trade and economic system. Certainly the values a society has with respect to trade impact the financial futures of people living in each country.

Your own ethnocentrism has everything to do with your wish to place your advocacy for certain values, labor standards and practices on other cultures. You have a right to advocate fair treatment for workers in Bangladesh but even fairness in that case is subjective and that subjectivity is based on the values that you learned and carry as an American. If you were a Bangladeshi, you would probably advocate standards which are different than the one you espouse. The difference in your standards and those of a Bangladeshi is your ethnocentrism if you were to put that in some standard of measurement. You would like to see fairness but to many all they want to see is a bowl of rice.

That doesn't stop you from wishing that the workers of the world rise to the level that you hope for them. Good luck with that. Utopia is a wonderful place. it rains Budweiser and rueben sandwiches grow on bushes.
 
Re: 3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Tod

the Universal Declaration of Human Rights
PREAMBLE

Whereas recognition of the inherent dignity and of the equal and inalienable rights of all members of the human family is the foundation of freedom, justice and peace in the world,

Whereas disregard and contempt for human rights have resulted in barbarous acts which have outraged the conscience of mankind, and the advent of a world in which human beings shall enjoy freedom of speech and belief and freedom from fear and want has been proclaimed as the highest aspiration of the common people,

Whereas it is essential, if man is not to be compelled to have recourse, as a last resort, to rebellion against tyranny and oppression, that human rights should be protected by the rule of law,

Whereas it is essential to promote the development of friendly relations between nations,

Whereas the peoples of the United Nations have in the Charter reaffirmed their faith in fundamental human rights, in the dignity and worth of the human person and in the equal rights of men and women and have determined to promote social progress and better standards of life in larger freedom,

Whereas Member States have pledged themselves to achieve, in co-operation with the United Nations, the promotion of universal respect for and observance of human rights and fundamental freedoms,

Whereas a common understanding of these rights and freedoms is of the greatest importance for the full realization of this pledge,

Now, Therefore THE GENERAL ASSEMBLY proclaims THIS UNIVERSAL DECLARATION OF HUMAN RIGHTS as a common standard of achievement for all peoples and all nations, to the end that every individual and every organ of society, keeping this Declaration constantly in mind, shall strive by teaching and education to promote respect for these rights and freedoms and by progressive measures, national and international, to secure their universal and effective recognition and observance, both among the peoples of Member States themselves and among the peoples of territories under their jurisdiction.



Article 1.

* All human beings are born free and equal in dignity and rights.They are endowed with reason and conscience and should act towards one another in a spirit of brotherhood.

Article 2.

* Everyone is entitled to all the rights and freedoms set forth in this Declaration, without distinction of any kind, such as race, colour, sex, language, religion, political or other opinion, national or social origin, property, birth or other status. Furthermore, no distinction shall be made on the basis of the political, jurisdictional or international status of the country or territory to which a person belongs, whether it be independent, trust, non-self-governing or under any other limitation of sovereignty.

Article 3.

* Everyone has the right to life, liberty and security of person.

Article 4.

* No one shall be held in slavery or servitude; slavery and the slave trade shall be prohibited in all their forms.

Article 5.

* No one shall be subjected to torture or to cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment or punishment.

Article 6.

* Everyone has the right to recognition everywhere as a person before the law.

Article 7.

* All are equal before the law and are entitled without any discrimination to equal protection of the law. All are entitled to equal protection against any discrimination in violation of this Declaration and against any incitement to such discrimination.

Article 8.

* Everyone has the right to an effective remedy by the competent national tribunals for acts violating the fundamental rights granted him by the constitution or by law.

Article 9.

* No one shall be subjected to arbitrary arrest, detention or exile.

Article 10.

* Everyone is entitled in full equality to a fair and public hearing by an independent and impartial tribunal, in the determination of his rights and obligations and of any criminal charge against him.

Article 11.

* (1) Everyone charged with a penal offence has the right to be presumed innocent until proved guilty according to law in a public trial at which he has had all the guarantees necessary for his defence.
* (2) No one shall be held guilty of any penal offence on account of any act or omission which did not constitute a penal offence, under national or international law, at the time when it was committed. Nor shall a heavier penalty be imposed than the one that was applicable at the time the penal offence was committed.

Article 12.

* No one shall be subjected to arbitrary interference with his privacy, family, home or correspondence, nor to attacks upon his honour and reputation. Everyone has the right to the protection of the law against such interference or attacks.

Article 13.

* (1) Everyone has the right to freedom of movement and residence within the borders of each state.
* (2) Everyone has the right to leave any country, including his own, and to return to his country.

Article 14.

* (1) Everyone has the right to seek and to enjoy in other countries asylum from persecution.
* (2) This right may not be invoked in the case of prosecutions genuinely arising from non-political crimes or from acts contrary to the purposes and principles of the United Nations.

Article 15.

* (1) Everyone has the right to a nationality.
* (2) No one shall be arbitrarily deprived of his nationality nor denied the right to change his nationality.

Article 16.

* (1) Men and women of full age, without any limitation due to race, nationality or religion, have the right to marry and to found a family. They are entitled to equal rights as to marriage, during marriage and at its dissolution.
* (2) Marriage shall be entered into only with the free and full consent of the intending spouses.
* (3) The family is the natural and fundamental group unit of society and is entitled to protection by society and the State.

Article 17.

* (1) Everyone has the right to own property alone as well as in association with others.
* (2) No one shall be arbitrarily deprived of his property.

Article 18.

* Everyone has the right to freedom of thought, conscience and religion; this right includes freedom to change his religion or belief, and freedom, either alone or in community with others and in public or private, to manifest his religion or belief in teaching, practice, worship and observance.

Article 19.

* Everyone has the right to freedom of opinion and expression; this right includes freedom to hold opinions without interference and to seek, receive and impart information and ideas through any media and regardless of frontiers.

Article 20.

* (1) Everyone has the right to freedom of peaceful assembly and association.
* (2) No one may be compelled to belong to an association.

Article 21.

* (1) Everyone has the right to take part in the government of his country, directly or through freely chosen representatives.
* (2) Everyone has the right of equal access to public service in his country.
* (3) The will of the people shall be the basis of the authority of government; this will shall be expressed in periodic and genuine elections which shall be by universal and equal suffrage and shall be held by secret vote or by equivalent free voting procedures.

Article 22.

* Everyone, as a member of society, has the right to social security and is entitled to realization, through national effort and international co-operation and in accordance with the organization and resources of each State, of the economic, social and cultural rights indispensable for his dignity and the free development of his personality.

Article 23.

* (1) Everyone has the right to work, to free choice of employment, to just and favourable conditions of work and to protection against unemployment.
* (2) Everyone, without any discrimination, has the right to equal pay for equal work.
* (3) Everyone who works has the right to just and favourable remuneration ensuring for himself and his family an existence worthy of human dignity, and supplemented, if necessary, by other means of social protection.
* (4) Everyone has the right to form and to join trade unions for the protection of his interests.


Article 24.

* Everyone has the right to rest and leisure, including reasonable limitation of working hours and periodic holidays with pay.

Article 25.

* (1) Everyone has the right to a standard of living adequate for the health and well-being of himself and of his family, including food, clothing, housing and medical care and necessary social services, and the right to security in the event of unemployment, sickness, disability, widowhood, old age or other lack of livelihood in circumstances beyond his control.
* (2) Motherhood and childhood are entitled to special care and assistance. All children, whether born in or out of wedlock, shall enjoy the same social protection.

Article 26.

* (1) Everyone has the right to education. Education shall be free, at least in the elementary and fundamental stages. Elementary education shall be compulsory. Technical and professional education shall be made generally available and higher education shall be equally accessible to all on the basis of merit.
* (2) Education shall be directed to the full development of the human personality and to the strengthening of respect for human rights and fundamental freedoms. It shall promote understanding, tolerance and friendship among all nations, racial or religious groups, and shall further the activities of the United Nations for the maintenance of peace.
* (3) Parents have a prior right to choose the kind of education that shall be given to their children.

Article 27.

* (1) Everyone has the right freely to participate in the cultural life of the community, to enjoy the arts and to share in scientific advancement and its benefits.
* (2) Everyone has the right to the protection of the moral and material interests resulting from any scientific, literary or artistic production of which he is the author.

Article 28.

* Everyone is entitled to a social and international order in which the rights and freedoms set forth in this Declaration can be fully realized.

Article 29.

* (1) Everyone has duties to the community in which alone the free and full development of his personality is possible.
* (2) In the exercise of his rights and freedoms, everyone shall be subject only to such limitations as are determined by law solely for the purpose of securing due recognition and respect for the rights and freedoms of others and of meeting the just requirements of morality, public order and the general welfare in a democratic society.
* (3) These rights and freedoms may in no case be exercised contrary to the purposes and principles of the United Nations.

Article 30.

* Nothing in this Declaration may be interpreted as implying for any State, group or person any right to engage in any activity or to perform any act aimed at the destruction of any of the rights and freedoms set forth herein.
The Universal Declaration of Human Rights

article 23 was emphasized because it discloses the universal rights these employees now possess
now it is up to the employees to assert their established rights
 
Re: 3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Tod

I'm claiming nothing of the kind. Every culture has it's own folkways and morays but the working environment in which workers toil is dictated by the economic development in that society. If children are reduced to subsistence living, homelessness and poverty, a sweat shop is a welcome respite. There are lots of issues that create those conditions. Certainly government is responsible for much of the economic development, system of currency, trade and economic system. Certainly the values a society has with respect to trade impact the financial futures of people living in each country.

Your own ethnocentrism has everything to do with your wish to place your advocacy for certain values, labor standards and practices on other cultures. You have a right to advocate fair treatment for workers in Bangladesh but even fairness in that case is subjective and that subjectivity is based on the values that you learned and carry as an American. If you were a Bangladeshi, you would probably advocate standards which are different than the one you espouse. The difference in your standards and those of a Bangladeshi is your ethnocentrism if you were to put that in some standard of measurement. You would like to see fairness but to many all they want to see is a bowl of rice.

That doesn't stop you from wishing that the workers of the world rise to the level that you hope for them. Good luck with that. Utopia is a wonderful place. it rains Budweiser and rueben sandwiches grow on bushes.

How many different ways can I put this so that you will understand?

IT IS THEY who want wage increases, THEY who want to form unions. If I WAS a Bangladeshi worker, I would be advocating VERY similar ideas to the ones I am actually putting forth, such as wage increases, the right to effectively form labor unions (even with the newest set of "reforms" forming a labor union is still far more restricted than it needs to be) better safety standards, better compensation for the those killed in factory accidents.

AND, even if I was being ethnocentric, that doesn't make me wrong, in and of itself. If a culture decided they want to have laws to repress, say, a religious minority with violence, I would be 100 percent correct in lambasting such laws. And it wouldn't be wrong at all for other countries to assert whatever influence they had against such laws diplomatically.

If you are claiming something analogous to the Prime Directive (from Star Trek), you'd already be wrong, in that WE HAVE ALREADY interfered with their culture and their society. THOSE ARE OUR (first world nations) companies in those countries. We've already stuck our hand in their affairs. But that is an ok thing to do apparently, but to go ANY further and make that involvement in their countries slightly less horrible, OH NO, we don't DARE to do that.

The concept here is so amazingly simple. With great power, comes great responsibility. We have GREAT power and influence, especially compared to weaker countries. There are a number of steps that could be take to lessen the suffering of other human beings. Throw around "ethnocentrism" all you want, that change any of what I've said.
 
Re: 3rd World Labor - Labor Rights Abuses - The Most Important Human Rights Issue Tod

I think that both sides raise some important points. On one hand, low-wage manufacturing seems to be the quickest way out of poverty, and putting labor regulations in too quickly just drives employers to the next poorest region with harder to enforce standards. Even if a global system of standards could be developed and somehow effectively enforced, what's to stop manufacturers from just investing more in robotics and high-tech manufacturing? These jobs do provide an important step to raising a country out of poverty.

That being said, the conditions in these areas are often terrible, and the best thing for workers is for their countries to grow past this phase as quickly as possible. There also needs to be more employers competing for these workers' labor. Why can these factories offer such low wages? Because the alternatives suck. Why do they suck in relation to these factory jobs? It's often very difficult for locals without political connections and huge amounts of capital to start a new business. If you go to an urban slum working class neighborhood in the developing world you would be astonished by the entrepreneurship of the poor. There are businesses for almost everything from public restrooms, to protection, to telephones. These people have tremendous potential, but so often they cannot expand their business in a legitimate way unless they know someone in the bureaucracy. These multinationals on the other hand have plenty of money to pay all of the taxes, fees, and bribes that come with setting up shop in a less friendly business environment. Investors still react to regulations and other government actions, but they are usually much better equipped to go through the maze of red tape. Their economies of scales are also better at dealing with bad infrastructure. Many times local governments will even dispossess people of their land in order to build a factory, giving people even less choice.

I don't think that sweatshops are in of themselves bad things, but they can be a symptom of a larger problem.
 
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