35 countries where the U.S. has supported fascists, drug lords and terrorists

[dimensionallava]

Why were we involved? For the same reason the Soviet Union was involved in Latin America: because we were involved in a global war of ideologies and respective power. And, lol, no we didn't kill "50,000 people" when we attacked Kabul in 2001. Or at any other point. And the 30,000 were killed in the span of two years in one or two central prisons under Amin and Taraki.

This is clearly a subject you don't know that much about.

The amount of people arrested under amin and taraki combined was between 18,000 and 45,000. The amount of people executed under the PDPA 14 year rule was between 10,000 and 27,000 as I said flimsy numbers

Hekmatyer killed 50,000 people and turned kabul into a ghost town by hailng down thousands of american made rockets indiscriminately during the 92 war which was funded by the CIA

but instead of playing the "thats side killed more people than the other side" game. Lets talk about why the USA was invloved at all, and whether it was the right thing too do, and if so should they have increased their support. Since alot of this is still classified, most of our numbers and facts are wrong anyway :lol:

 

[Oozlefinch]

I had to check to find he was still alive. I hadn't seen him anywhere in the media as of late, but hadn't heard of his passing either.

I hold Kissinger in the very highest regards.

One thing about Kissinger is that he has long been an excellent statesman and advisor. He advised Presidents from Kennedy to Bush Jr., and looked more to the interests of his adoptive nation and the world at large then any particular government or politics. And interestingly enough for somebody of his reputation, he almost never gives interviews or goes on talk shows. Since he left office in 1976 he has paintained one of the lowest profiles of anybody ever to hold a Cabinet level position.

And as far as I am aware, the only President in the last 50+ years who has not petitioned him for advice is the current one. However, odds are that if elected Hillary Clonton would probably have him as a member of her "Kitchen Cabinet". When she herself was Secretary of State, she frequently reached out to him for advice.

He is one of the few that I could honestly say it would be impossible to say what his actual "party affiliation" was. He served Presidents of both parties with good advice, and it was ultimately up to them if they wanted to take it or not.

 

[Oozlefinch]

Hekmatyer killed 50,000 people and turned kabul into a ghost town by hailng down thousands of american made rockets indiscriminately during the 92 war which was funded by the CIA

Wow, really?

And exactly which "American made rockets" were these, exactly? Because other then one very specific system, the US has not used "rocket artillery" in decades.

However, that was and still is a common weapon made and exported by the Soviets, and now Russia.

So please, some more information about this? Exactly what "American made rockets" were used in 1992?

Sorry, like pretty much all of your posts, this is lacking in almost any kind of reality. It is simply propaganda and personal opinion with absolutely nothing to back it.

 

[dimensionallava]

Wow, really?

And exactly which "American made rockets" were these, exactly? Because other then one very specific system, the US has not used "rocket artillery" in decades.

However, that was and still is a common weapon made and exported by the Soviets, and now Russia.

So please, some more information about this? Exactly what "American made rockets" were used in 1992?

Sorry, like pretty much all of your posts, this is lacking in almost any kind of reality. It is simply propaganda and personal opinion with absolutely nothing to back it.

everything i said is pretty much public record, this is what you see when you look up hekmatyar on wiki

When the Soviet war in Afghanistan began in 1979, the CIA began funding his rapidly growing Hezb-e Islami mujahideen organization through the ISI. Following the stepping down of Afghan President Najibullah in 1992, Hekmatyar and other warlords began a civil war in Afghanistan, which led to the deaths of around 50,000 civilians in Kabul alone

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gulbuddin_Hekmatyar

heres a few more sources, its pretty much all been declassified at this point, sorry couldn't find the exact make and model of the rockets used back then, although, ill be honest im not sure why that was the most important thing to you

AT FIRST, IT WAS A JUST A morbid whistling overhead, the sound of an antipersonnel rocket in the dying moments of flight. Then it exploded in a shattering burst of smoke and dust.

A group of children had been playing a noisy game of tag near their mud-walled homes. Now, as the smoke cleared on this bright December afternoon, there was only moaning. Near the crater dug by the rocket lay two children, a boy of 17 and his 6-year-old sister, shattered by shards of twisted steel. Around them nearly a dozen other children were strewn about, many of them grievously wounded.

Throughout 1989, rocket attacks by United States-backed rebels had been pounding Government-held cities and towns; in major cities like Kabul and Kandahar I had seen these rockets kill as many as 40 people in a single blast. But this was Khost, a Government outpost in a remote, south-eastern corner of the country (map, page 28), a place so small and so long besieged that its services barely function at all. It took 20 minutes for any help to appear. By then, another youngster, a 4-year-old girl, had died. By dusk, three more children were dead.

As a crowd gathered around the children, I was identified as an American reporter. There were murmurs as the word passed; the United States provides the rebels with $700 million in support each year - by far their largest single source - and the rockets are widely regarded as an American responsibility. One old man stepped forward. ''Get away!'' he shouted. ''Why do you do this to us? Tell us why!''

The cry was familiar to the handful of American reporters who remained in Afghanistan after the last Soviet troops withdrew on Feb. 15, 1989. In the courtyards of 1,000-year-old mosques, in the sinuous back streets of ancient cities, in smoky restaurants where men in turbans chewed mutton kebabs, ordinary Afghans regularly approached and asked - sometimes in puzzlement, more often in anger - how the United States could allow the rebels to fire American-supplied weapons into neighborhoods and bazaars, killing and wounding the ordinary people on whose behalf they claim to be fighting.

During 1989, according to estimates made by Western relief agencies, rebel rocket attacks killed at least 1,000 people in Kabul, the capital, and perhaps several times that many across the country. But through it all, American officials insisted that the United States would continue to arm and finance the rebels, while supporting their refusal to negotiate with the Soviet-backed regime in Kabul. By the fall, the officials had begun to speak almost casually of the need for another ''season'' or two of fighting before the rebels could force the capitulation of the Kabul Government.

AFGHANS - Now They Blame America - NYTimes.com
Ghost Wars: How Reagan Armed the Mujahadeen in Afghanistan | Democracy Now!
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Cyclone
How the U.S. ended up giving weapons to the Taliban | Washington Examiner

 

[Chomsky]

One thing about Kissinger is that he has long been an excellent statesman and advisor. He advised Presidents from Kennedy to Bush Jr., and looked more to the interests of his adoptive nation and the world at large then any particular government or politics. And interestingly enough for somebody of his reputation, he almost never gives interviews or goes on talk shows. Since he left office in 1976 he has paintained one of the lowest profiles of anybody ever to hold a Cabinet level position.

And as far as I am aware, the only President in the last 50+ years who has not petitioned him for advice is the current one. However, odds are that if elected Hillary Clonton would probably have him as a member of her "Kitchen Cabinet". When she herself was Secretary of State, she frequently reached out to him for advice.

He is one of the few that I could honestly say it would be impossible to say what his actual "party affiliation" was. He served Presidents of both parties with good advice, and it was ultimately up to them if they wanted to take it or not.

Perhaps rather than serve a party, he prefers to serve America?

That would seem to be in his character, from what I've gleaned from his interviews over the years.

He used to turn up on The Charlie Rose Show, often enough. He paired very well with Charlie Rose. And I saw him for a solid 1/2 hour, one-on-one with a very good local PBS interviewer.

 

[Oozlefinch]

everything i said is pretty much public record, this is what you see when you look up hekmatyar on wiki

And was the US the only country that gave aid?

I notice however that you are dodging the question. Instead of trying to skip around it and simply throw around crap, simply tell us the rockets that the US made that they were using.

It really is not that hard of a question to answer.

 

[dimensionallava]

And was the US the only country that gave aid?

I notice however that you are dodging the question. Instead of trying to skip around it and simply throw around crap, simply tell us the rockets that the US made that they were using.

It really is not that hard of a question to answer.

as i said i cant find the exact name of the rockets, can you? i'm not sure why its important

Also I think its pretty safe too assume that the CIA wasn't giving the taliban money to buy weapons from the soviets, in order too fight the soviets.....

 

[Oozlefinch]

Perhaps rather than serve a party, he prefers to serve America?

And that has always been my impression of him as well.

Interestingly enough, his actual politics and people he hangs out with tend to be on the Left side of the isle. But he is most closely associated with those on the Right.

Myself, I could not give a fig for politics. And I may not always agree or dissagree with Dr. Kissinger, but I always respect his position.

 

[Cyrylek]

"The U.S. is backing Ukraine’s extreme right-wing Svoboda party and violent neo-Nazis whose armed uprising paved the way for a Western-backed coup"

See, here's the problem, right away. I am no fan of Svoboda by any means - they are proud inheritors of the IRA-like Ukrainian nationalist movement that targeted ethnic Poles, and I happen to be a Pole. But Svoboda gained, like, under 5% of the vote in elections that followed the "Western-backed coup" (Translation: Uprising against the Kremlin's puppet regime that also happened to be one of the most corrupt even by the standards of the region), and lost most of its seats in the Rada (parliament).

Needless to say, there is not a single instance of any US official - or private, as far as I know - entity "backing" Svoboda in any way. Even if we Americans were all super-evil and super-cynical, why "back" a group that has zero influence?

I'm sure an intelligent argument can be made against American involvement in many places, but starting with crude Putinist propaganda tricks is a dubious tactic.

 

[Oozlefinch]

as i said i cant find the exact name of the rockets, can you? i'm not sure why its important

Also I think its pretty safe too assume that the CIA wasn't giving the taliban money to buy weapons from the soviets, in order too fight the soviets.....

OK, so now we have "American rockets", that did not come from America. And you can not provide any information of where they came from (although here is a hint, the only artillery rockets in use since the 1960's have been the Soviet Katyusha).

But the point I am making here is that you have made a claim, and are still doing anything you can to avoid answering it.

But here, let me give you a hand here. The rocket most likely used was a more modern version of the Katyusha, the BM-27. It was first produced in the Soviet Union in 1975, and first fielded in the Soviet-Afghan War. It could fire 16 220mm rockets, and was extensively used in the Afghan War. It was mounted on a ZIL 8x8 truck chassis, and there were dozens of them left in Afghanistan after the Soviets withdrew.

Oh, and here is a picture of a Soviet BM-17 in use during the Soviet-Afghan War.

Getting the point yet? Not only could you not provide anything to back your claims that the rockets were "American", you could not even identify them in any way. You could not even bother to provide any kind of reference at all to to source of the rockets. Yet I was able to identify the rockets used, and their source.

Are you even aware that most of the weapons and munitions used in the Soviet-Afghan war by the Mujahadeen were actually captured Soviet weapons? The support from the US was actually rather limited, but it was enough to tip the ballance and keep their movement alive. But they relied upon captured weapons during, and for years after the war. Did you not even notice that the weapons that both the Northern Alliance and the Taliban used were all of SOviet manufacture?

Now please come back when you want to discuss this rationally, based upon facts and not fantasies and propaganda.

And really, you are not sure why it is important?

It all has to do with creadibility. You make a claim, so you are the one that has to validate that claim. Otherwise, it is worth nothing.

Maybe you live in a world where unfounded claims are important, but I live in a world where facts and proof matter much more. And notice, where you claim it is unimportant and meaningless, and dodged the question, I actually provided the rockets used, and more information.

So once again, how did the US provide the weapons? That is your claim after all, and at that time the Soviet Union was the only nation that made and exported them. And yet, you say they could not have come from the USSR. So where did they come from? You made the claim, please back it up.

 

[Chomsky]

And that has always been my impression of him as well.

Interestingly enough, his actual politics and people he hangs out with tend to be on the Left side of the isle. But he is most closely associated with those on the Right.

Myself, I could not give a fig for politics. And I may not always agree or dissagree with Dr. Kissinger, but I always respect his position.

I feel the same way about those among us that I believe are good thinkers.

I n asso longer am a member of either party, but do draw a lot more from the left than right. But that matters not. When someone whom I respect comes on, I stop and listen. Charles Krauthammer is one such guy. I might only agree with maybe 20% of his politics, but I go out of my way to listen to what he says. Whenever I can. His personal politics and his association with Fox mean little, compared to the content of his ideas.

Actually, Krauthammer has similarity to Dr. Kissinger, with his gravelly monotonic delivery and pragmatic stoicism!

 

[dimensionallava]

OK, so now we have "American rockets", that did not come from America. And you can not provide any information of where they came from (although here is a hint, the only artillery rockets in use since the 1960's have been the Soviet Katyusha).

But the point I am making here is that you have made a claim, and are still doing anything you can to avoid answering it.

But here, let me give you a hand here. The rocket most likely used was a more modern version of the Katyusha, the BM-27. It was first produced in the Soviet Union in 1975, and first fielded in the Soviet-Afghan War. It could fire 16 220mm rockets, and was extensively used in the Afghan War. It was mounted on a ZIL 8x8 truck chassis, and there were dozens of them left in Afghanistan after the Soviets withdrew.

Oh, and here is a picture of a Soviet BM-17 in use during the Soviet-Afghan War.

Getting the point yet? Not only could you not provide anything to back your claims that the rockets were "American", you could not even identify them in any way. You could not even bother to provide any kind of reference at all to to source of the rockets. Yet I was able to identify the rockets used, and their source.

Are you even aware that most of the weapons and munitions used in the Soviet-Afghan war by the Mujahadeen were actually captured Soviet weapons? The support from the US was actually rather limited, but it was enough to tip the ballance and keep their movement alive. But they relied upon captured weapons during, and for years after the war. Did you not even notice that the weapons that both the Northern Alliance and the Taliban used were all of SOviet manufacture?

Now please come back when you want to discuss this rationally, based upon facts and not fantasies and propaganda.

yeah thats fine, I'm sure they stole some of their weapons, again i dont know why its important, america supplied thousands of stinger missles, isreal supplied alot of soviet made weapons that they had seized, your making a big deal out of one really obscure fact... they supplied the taliban with billions of dollars and a wide variety of weapons, many of them second hand weapons from other countries they had destabilized, but some of them like stinger missiles were manufactured in the USA.

Meaning the rockets brand name, is nothing but a bit of trivia.... if you would like to discuss how the cia would sell weapons of the regimes they toppled or buy them from black market arms dealers is one thing, but saying the cia wasn't involved at all because technically the bombs used to murder tens of thousands of civilians in the 1992 afgfhan civil war, that the CIA paid for, weren't actually manufactured in america is just childish

 

[Oozlefinch]

I feel the same way about those among us that I believe are good thinkers.

I n asso longer am a member of either party, but do draw a lot more from the left than right. But that matters not. When someone whom I respect comes on, I stop and listen. Charles Krauthammer is one such guy. I might only agree with maybe 20% of his politics, but I go out of my way to listen to what he says. Whenever I can. His personal politics and his association with Fox mean little, compared to the content of his ideas.

Actually, Krauthammer has similarity to Dr. Kissinger, with his gravelly monotonic delivery and pragmatic stoicism!

I feel much the same way about Juan Williams. I do not often agree with him, but I almost always listen to him. Although I admit I listen much more when he is talking from thought, and not raw emotion.

yeah thats fine, I'm sure they stole some of their weapons, again i dont know why its important, america supplied thousands of stinger missles, isreal supplied alot of soviet made weapons that they had seized, your making a big deal out of one really obscure fact... they supplied the taliban with billions of dollars and a wide variety of weapons, many of them second hand weapons from other countries they had destabilized, but some of them like stinger missiles were manufactured in the USA.

Meaning the rockets brand name, is nothing but a bit of trivia.... if you would like to discuss how the cia would sell weapons of the regimes they toppled or buy them from black market arms dealers is one thing, but saying the cia wasn't involved at all because technically the bombs used to murder tens of thousands of civilians in the 1992 afgfhan civil war, that the CIA paid for, weren't actually manufactured in america is just childish

And once again, you are simply making things up. The total number of STINGER missiles provided to the Afghans was only around 1,000. Not "thousands". And these were purely ground to air, so they were not the rockets used to bombard Kabul.

And the total was around $3.2 billion. But it was not all weapons, most of it was actually in economic aid. Food, medical supplies, training, funding refugee camps, and a great many other things.

And no, this is not "trivia" unless you think that the truth is trivia. I for one do not. If you notice, the title of this very forum is "DebatePolitics", not "FantasyPolitics". In a debate, you had better come up with facts and be able to back them up, not simply make things up and throw them around like so much coprolite, expecting people to believe anything you say.

I for one never said the CIA was not involved. However, facts and the like are important if you are going to be taken seriously by anybody who does not simply applaud anything you say simply because you agree with them.

Now, are you able to discuss things rationally with facts to back up your claims, or is this your norm? Simply making things up as you go and hoping that every simply believes you without any kind of fact checking?

 

[Fearandloathing]

It would take way too long to go through this and provide either the proper refutation or the right context but readers should look at the very first one and notice that the DRA is merely described as Afghanistan's "socialist government" instead of the brutal regime which came to power after a Soviet coup and invasion.

You really don't get it do you? Your best argument is about a ****ing label?

Don't give me the time crap, if there was anything seriously wrong in there we wouldn't be playing word games

 

[Fearandloathing]

I had to check to find he was still alive. I hadn't seen him anywhere in the media as of late, but hadn't heard of his passing either.

I hold Kissinger in the very highest regards.

I think his low, monotonic, unemotional gravelly voice works to his advantage, in that it forces listeners to be quiet and remain at attention if they're to understand what he says.

Another guy that has a similar oratory delivery to Kissinger's is Noam Chomsky. Monotonic, quiet, boring in delivery, a real chore to listen to. But when you read his books his ideas are lively, energetic, and thought provoking; and you wonder how it can possibly be the same guy.

Actually, Charles Krauthammer and David Gergen are similar too. All individuals who's thoughts I greatly respect, and all that have me turn-up the volume and command my undivided attention whenever they're speaking.

He always reminded me of Peter Sellers' "Dr. Strangelove."

 

[Oozlefinch]

He always reminded me of Peter Sellers' "Dr. Strangelove."

Only because one was German, the other Austrian.

The inspiration of Dr. Strangelove was actually Wernher Von Braun. The former SS officer who later advised Presidents.

 

[dimensionallava]

I feel much the same way about Juan Williams. I do not often agree with him, but I almost always listen to him. Although I admit I listen much more when he is talking from thought, and not raw emotion.



And once again, you are simply making things up. The total number of STINGER missiles provided to the Afghans was only around 1,000. Not "thousands". And these were purely ground to air, so they were not the rockets used to bombard Kabul.

And the total was around $3.2 billion. But it was not all weapons, most of it was actually in economic aid. Food, medical supplies, training, funding refugee camps, and a great many other things.

And no, this is not "trivia" unless you think that the truth is trivia. I for one do not. If you notice, the title of this very forum is "DebatePolitics", not "FantasyPolitics". In a debate, you had better come up with facts and be able to back them up, not simply make things up and throw them around like so much coprolite, expecting people to believe anything you say.

I for one never said the CIA was not involved. However, facts and the like are important if you are going to be taken seriously by anybody who does not simply applaud anything you say simply because you agree with them.

Now, are you able to discuss things rationally with facts to back up your claims, or is this your norm? Simply making things up as you go and hoping that every simply believes you without any kind of fact checking?

then your first post shouldve been something along the lines of "hey interesting fact! the bombs that hit the ground were actually second hand soviet made missiles, they only used the american weapons to shoot helicopters out of the sky......"

but since it wasn't im assuming this is some anti-communist rant, feel free to continue without me

 

[Sherman123]

You really don't get it do you? Your best argument is about a ****ing label?

Don't give me the time crap, if there was anything seriously wrong in there we wouldn't be playing word games

I suggest you go back and re-read the several posts that were made on this subject and calm down.

 

[Chomsky]

He always reminded me of Peter Sellers' "Dr. Strangelove."

:lamo

 

[Oozlefinch]

but since it wasn't im assuming this is some anti-communist rant, feel free to continue without me

Where did I imply that in any way, shape, or form?

Look, I could not really give a damn about politics. However, I do care about truth and accuracy. And when somebody does so little research and simply makes things up, they are demanding to be fact-checked.

If you do not like being fact-checked, then make posts with facts, not simply making things up.

All you have been doing is spinning and spinning and spinning. And the last time I checked, this was the History thread. And history demands things like facts, not political rantings where you fight those who show you are wrong with blasts and propaganda, then simply saying you are being picked on.

I could not care if somebody is a communist, an atheist, a luddite, or an anarcho-fascist. But if you think anybody who does not accept anything you say is anti-communist, then so be it.

But you were the one that made so many claims, it is up to you to validate them. Simply going "hey, you should have corrected me" does not cut it. I even did try that, and you simply said I was wrong and insisted over and over you were right, then that you were wrong was inconsequential.

Myself, I found the entire OP rather silly and sophomoric. Less history then a political rant.

Kind of like the part about Argentina. Interesting that you fail to mention that the coup came about because the military was fed up of following Presidential Orders from Isabel Peron to round up, neutralize, arrest, and eliminate any opposition to her government. Including Conservatives, Liberals, Socialists, Union Leaders, Judges, Police, Journalists, and the Clergy. Your source gives such a blatant one sided presentation, that fails to mention why the coup was conducted in the first place.

And yes, most of the population was relieved and applauded the coup in 1976. The last time the military had stepped in was when the Illia government collapsed under a collapsing economy, unrest from labor unions, and trying to use the military as his personal enforcement arm. They held power until 1973 when they stepped down once it was agreed that a new Constitution would be drafted (which would include among other things term limits for the President and Vice President.

Trust me, you can not talk about the Dirty War, without discussing why it came about in the first place.

 

[dimensionallava]

Where did I imply that in any way, shape, or form?

youve repeatedly called me a liar and accused me of spreading communist propaganda, for getting a meaningless fact wrong, that was not only irrelevant to the op, but wasn't even all that relevant to the the actual post you responded too

Look, I could not really give a damn about politics. However, I do care about truth and accuracy. And when somebody does so little research and simply makes things up, they are demanding to be fact-checked.

If you do not like being fact-checked, then make posts with facts, not simply making things up.

All you have been doing is spinning and spinning and spinning. And the last time I checked, this was the History thread. And history demands things like facts, not political rantings where you fight those who show you are wrong with blasts and propaganda, then simply saying you are being picked on.

I dont mind being fact checked in fact i encourage it, what I dont like is when someone uses a meaningless fact irrelevant to the topic, to dismiss everything i said. What your doing is exactly what a grammar nazi does, by focusing on one miniscule error, then repeating the fact that I made the error as if it means something. Youll notice another poster made a mistake earlier in the thread, I managed too correct him without accusing him of being a propagandist. In case you didn't notice I made this thread about 35 countries over the past 70 years, about events that were largely classified....not the afghan civil war specifically

I could not care if somebody is a communist, an atheist, a luddite, or an anarcho-fascist. But if you think anybody who does not accept anything you say is anti-communist, then so be it.

no not anyone just you....

But you were the one that made so many claims, it is up to you to validate them. Simply going "hey, you should have corrected me" does not cut it. I even did try that, and you simply said I was wrong and insisted over and over you were right, then that you were wrong was inconsequential.

Myself, I found the entire OP rather silly and sophomoric. Less history then a political rant.

Kind of like the part about Argentina. Interesting that you fail to mention that the coup came about because the military was fed up of following Presidential Orders from Isabel Peron to round up, neutralize, arrest, and eliminate any opposition to her government. Including Conservatives, Liberals, Socialists, Union Leaders, Judges, Police, Journalists, and the Clergy. Your source gives such a blatant one sided presentation, that fails to mention why the coup was conducted in the first place.

I didn't write the article in the op, i didn't fail to mention anything... they are 1 paragraph summaries, but if you want to give an anti communists opinion about argentina as well thats fine....youve done such a great job apologizing for the usa in afghanistan :doh

And yes, most of the population was relieved and applauded the coup in 1976. The last time the military had stepped in was when the Illia government collapsed under a collapsing economy, unrest from labor unions, and trying to use the military as his personal enforcement arm. They held power until 1973 when they stepped down once it was agreed that a new Constitution would be drafted (which would include among other things term limits for the President and Vice President.

Trust me, you can not talk about the Dirty War, without discussing why it came about in the first place.

thats true you can't.... so lets discuss the european colonization of argentina since thats why it came about in the first place

 

[Oozlefinch]

thats true you can't.... so lets discuss the european colonization of argentina since thats why it came about in the first place

I see. So there would have been no coup, if the Spaniosh had never traveled to Argentina hundreds of years prior in the first place.

Goodbye.

 

[Fearandloathing]

I suggest you go back and re-read the several posts that were made on this subject and calm down.

I suggest you mind you own ****ing business. We here to debate not make personal comments

 

[Sherman123]

I suggest you mind you own ****ing business. We here to debate not make personal comments

Then address my points instead of being so snide.

 

[JANFU]

yeah thats fine, I'm sure they stole some of their weapons, again i dont know why its important, america supplied thousands of stinger missles, isreal supplied alot of soviet made weapons that they had seized, your making a big deal out of one really obscure fact... they supplied the taliban with billions of dollars and a wide variety of weapons, many of them second hand weapons from other countries they had destabilized, but some of them like stinger missiles were manufactured in the USA.

Meaning the rockets brand name, is nothing but a bit of trivia.... if you would like to discuss how the cia would sell weapons of the regimes they toppled or buy them from black market arms dealers is one thing, but saying the cia wasn't involved at all because technically the bombs used to murder tens of thousands of civilians in the 1992 afgfhan civil war, that the CIA paid for, weren't actually manufactured in america is just childish

The Taliban were a minor faction during the Soviet occupation of Afghanistan. They came to power later in the 90's due to support from Pakistan and the Saudis.

The Taliban

The Taliban were born in the fires of the struggle against the Soviet invasion in the 1980s. A village clergyman in Kandahar, Mullah Mohammad Omar emerged as a leader in 1994, he had lost an eye fighting the Soviet forces in the 1980s and was a charismatic and authoritarian leader. The Taliban and their supporters were disillusioned with the feuding Mujahideen warlords who after driving out the Soviet invaders had then fallen into conflicts among each other. The Taliban promised to bring peace and enforce Sharia (Islamic law). They proved popular, many Afghanis were fed up of constant fighting and the Taliban started to stamp out corruption and reduce banditry so that trade started to begin again.

The word Taliban is the plural form of the Arabic word Talib or student. Despite its usage in English the term Taliban is not a singular noun, the name originates from the fact that so many of the membership were students of religious seminaries in Pakistan and Afghanistan. They are a Sunni Muslim group. There is some evidence that the US thought the Taliban would bring security to Afghanistan and that would allow US firms to build gas pipelines across the country, some in the US mistakenly believed the Taliban would bring back Afghanistan’s old monarchy.

They expanded quickly from their stronghold in the South West, in 1995 they captured Herat province which borders Iran, within a year they had captured the Afghani capital of Kabul over throwing the regime of President Burhanuddin Rabbani. In 1998 within four years of their emergence they controlled 90% of Afghanistan. Pakistan’s involvement in the Taliban’s rise to power is a source of some debate.