250+ Disturbing facts surrounding 9/11

[creativedreams]

Many disturbing facts surrounding 9/11

Here is a small part of it....the links to verify every statement can be found at this site which has the full list of disturbing facts...

P.S. I will provide even more disturbing facts with backup that are not even mentioned here...

Killtown's:* 250+ 9/11 'Smoking Guns' Found in the Mainstream Media - Connecting the dots.

250+ 9/11 'Smoking Guns' Found in the Mainstream Media

PLANNED BEFORE



1962 - US military drafted 'Operation Northwoods', a plan to commit terror acts in US cities, kill innocent people, hijack airplanes, and plant evidence as a way to trick the public into thinking Cuba committed an unprovoked attack against the US in order to support a war against Cuba. (ABC, Natl Security Archives)

March '00 - Filming begins for The Lone Gunmen's 'Pilot' episode that depicts a US plot to crash an electronically hijacked Boeing 727 into WTC and blame foreign terrorists to provoke war and increase military's budget (KC Star), March '01 - 'Pilot' episode airs on FOX TV, 6 months before attacks (TV Guide), Co-producers were relieved to hear 9/11 plot pre-dated their show. (io9.com)



PRIOR KNOWLEDGE / PREPARATION

1999 - NORAD starts conducting exercises in which airplanes are hijacked and crashed into targets which include the WTC and Pentagon (USA Today), April '01 - NORAD requested a war games event of having a terrorist group hijack a commercial airline and fly it into the Pentagon. (Boston Globe)

2000 - CNN has employed active duty military psyops personnel. (WorldNetDaily)

[..snip..]

 

[creativedreams]

Many disturbing facts surrounding 9/11

Here is a small part of it....the links to verify every statement can be found at this site which has the full list of disturbing facts...

P.S. I will provide even more disturbing facts with backup that are not even mentioned here...

Killtown's:* 250+ 9/11 'Smoking Guns' Found in the Mainstream Media - Connecting the dots.

250+ 9/11 'Smoking Guns' Found in the Mainstream Media

PLANNED BEFORE



1962 - US military drafted 'Operation Northwoods', a plan to commit terror acts in US cities, kill innocent people, hijack airplanes, and plant evidence as a way to trick the public into thinking Cuba committed an unprovoked attack against the US in order to support a war against Cuba. (ABC, Natl Security Archives)

March '00 - Filming begins for The Lone Gunmen's 'Pilot' episode that depicts a US plot to crash an electronically hijacked Boeing 727 into WTC and blame foreign terrorists to provoke war and increase military's budget (KC Star), March '01 - 'Pilot' episode airs on FOX TV, 6 months before attacks (TV Guide), Co-producers were relieved to hear 9/11 plot pre-dated their show. (io9.com)



PRIOR KNOWLEDGE / PREPARATION

1999 - NORAD starts conducting exercises in which airplanes are hijacked and crashed into targets which include the WTC and Pentagon (USA Today), April '01 - NORAD requested a war games event of having a terrorist group hijack a commercial airline and fly it into the Pentagon. (Boston Globe)

2000 - CNN has employed active duty military psyops personnel. (WorldNetDaily)

[..snip..]

Shall we discuss this?

 

[Demon of Light]

WTC Ground Zero workers claim they helped FBI find 3 of the 4 black boxes from planes that struck WTC, contradicting official accounts that none were found. (Philadelphia Daily News)

This one bugs me the most. The notion that they could find the passport of one of the hijackers, but no one could find even one of the black boxes stretches credulity to the breaking point.

 

[Wiseone]

I like how in one example the fact that a nearby Army Post was having an exercise to train for possible terrorist attacks is evidence 9/11 was a conspiracy, then in another example the fact that a different nearby base is having NO training that day for a terrorist attack is also evidence.

 

[505]

Shall we discuss this?

Instead of copy/paste spamming, how about offering up your own thoughts on it for once? You know... put together a coherent and complete timeline of what YOU think happened on 9/11. Then we can discuss it. When you spam 15 videos or plagiarize an entire piece of someone else's work, without a single contribution whatsoever, nobody wants to debate with you.

So... no "stupid sheeple and your MSM/gov nutswinging" comments. No "I'm just asking questions". No copy/pasting of any sort. Can you do it?

 

[creativedreams]

This one bugs me the most. The notion that they could find the passport of one of the hijackers, but no one could find even one of the black boxes stretches credulity to the breaking point.

Exactly....basically nothing was found bigger than a fingernail to identify anyone...but somehow they find a complete passport on the street that magically flew out of a pocket and a wallet that just happens to point to a suspect on the plane.....

 

[Wiseone]

Exactly....basically nothing was found bigger than a fingernail to identify anyone...but somehow they find a complete passport on the street that magically flew out of a pocket and a wallet that just happens to point to a suspect on the plane.....

I don't know if thats the case but even if thats true its certainly not outside the realm of possibility. I mean there were papers from those office buildings that flew as far away as New Jersey, that seems weird but it certainly happened.

So just because something is unlikely, or seems unlikely, is no proof of anything.

 

[creativedreams]

I don't know if thats the case but even if thats true its certainly not outside the realm of possibility. I mean there were papers from those office buildings that flew as far away as New Jersey, that seems weird but it certainly happened.

So just because something is unlikely, or seems unlikely, is no proof of anything.

I see where you are coming from...do you see where I am coming from?

 

[usda select]

Shall we discuss this?

No. Seeing something that isn't there isn't insight. You have no insight. You have no evidence. You have nothing even close to either.

 

[usda select]

Instead of copy/paste spamming, how about offering up your own thoughts on it for once? You know... put together a coherent and complete timeline of what YOU think happened on 9/11. Then we can discuss it. [/quote]

You won't see that from a truther because it cuts off the ability to change the story. Apologies for the bluntness but part of being a man is stating what you think and backing it up. Creativedreams is not a man.

 

[Demon of Light]

I don't know if thats the case but even if thats true its certainly not outside the realm of possibility. I mean there were papers from those office buildings that flew as far away as New Jersey, that seems weird but it certainly happened.

So just because something is unlikely, or seems unlikely, is no proof of anything.

I am not going to say it is impossible for a passport to survive. However, to believe that they were able to find this passport, but were somehow incapable of finding even one of the black boxes from either plane really pushes it. They found all the black boxes from the planes that hit the Pentagon and the one that crashed in Pennsylvania. Supposedly all but one was too damaged, but the point is they found all four. Yet with the WTC they could not find a single one, but did manage to find a passport. That is much more than simply unlikely.

 

[usda select]

I am not going to say it is impossible for a passport to survive. However, to believe that they were able to find this passport, but were somehow incapable of finding even one of the black boxes from either plane really pushes it. They found all the black boxes from the planes that hit the Pentagon and the one that crashed in Pennsylvania. Supposedly all but one was too damaged, but the point is they found all four. Yet with the WTC they could not find a single one, but did manage to find a passport. That is much more than simply unlikely.

It actually would be much much more difficult to find the black boxes at the WTC than in either PA or VA.

The crashes occurred high up in the air--700 feet plus. If the boxes were thrown clear by the initial explosions of the aircraft, you have a 720 degree field of trajectory versus one of 360 degrees in PA and VA.

The wreckage of the buildings themselves--two of the worlds largest man made structures would do much more impact damage to something in it's midst than the relatively small Pentagon or the crash in PA that involved no structure at all.

The crash in VA was at a government building where there was a very small public citizen footprint. The crash in PA was in the middle of nowhere. Literally tens of thousands of people contaminated the possible evidence fields in NYC. I'm not saying that it happened, I'm saying it was a possibility that it could have happened where in VA and PA, there is much less likelihood. Remember we're comparing the crash sites.

There is a water component in NYC that didin't exist in any of the other crash sites.

 

[Demon of Light]

It actually would be much much more difficult to find the black boxes at the WTC than in either PA or VA.

The crashes occurred high up in the air--700 feet plus. If the boxes were thrown clear by the initial explosions of the aircraft, you have a 720 degree field of trajectory versus one of 360 degrees in PA and VA.

The wreckage of the buildings themselves--two of the worlds largest man made structures would do much more impact damage to something in it's midst than the relatively small Pentagon or the crash in PA that involved no structure at all.

The crash in VA was at a government building where there was a very small public citizen footprint. The crash in PA was in the middle of nowhere. Literally tens of thousands of people contaminated the possible evidence fields in NYC. I'm not saying that it happened, I'm saying it was a possibility that it could have happened where in VA and PA, there is much less likelihood. Remember we're comparing the crash sites.

There is a water component in NYC that didin't exist in any of the other crash sites.

It sounds real convincing if we just ignore that a much smaller and less durable passport supposedly survived and was found, while supposedly not even one of the four black boxes were found. It is extremely unlikely that the black boxes were destroyed and so one has to argue that not one was found. The black box is not something people would miss while clearing the wreckage and so you would have to argue that every last one was simply somewhere they could not find. Arguing that it is possible is like saying it is possible that you will be killed by a meteorite tearing through your head five minutes from now. I mean, sure it could conceivably happen but the chances are far higher that it will never happen.

Guys like you love Occam's Razor, but in this case it really fails you.

 

[505]

It sounds real convincing if we just ignore that a much smaller and less durable passport supposedly survived and was found, while supposedly not even one of the four black boxes were found. It is extremely unlikely that the black boxes were destroyed and so one has to argue that not one was found. The black box is not something people would miss while clearing the wreckage and so you would have to argue that every last one was simply somewhere they could not find. Arguing that it is possible is like saying it is possible that you will be killed by a meteorite tearing through your head five minutes from now. I mean, sure it could conceivably happen but the chances are far higher that it will never happen.

Guys like you love Occam's Razor, but in this case it really fails you.

It's just so hard to say for sure though. You guys want hush-a-boom to bring down the towers since you don't believe that buildings can fall like that. Then you have something like that passport and "it's impossible". I've always wondered how you guys would spin it if things were flipped on this one and it turned out that the passport casted some sort of doubt on the "official story"... I bet you would be all over it and would have no problem.

The fact of the matter is that things like 500+mph plane crashes at almost a thousand feet cause crazy ****. Plain and simple.

 

[usda select]

It sounds real convincing if we just ignore that a much smaller and less durable passport supposedly survived and was found, while supposedly not even one of the four black boxes were found. It is extremely unlikely that the black boxes were destroyed and so one has to argue that not one was found. The black box is not something people would miss while clearing the wreckage and so you would have to argue that every last one was simply somewhere they could not find. Arguing that it is possible is like saying it is possible that you will be killed by a meteorite tearing through your head five minutes from now. I mean, sure it could conceivably happen but the chances are far higher that it will never happen.

Guys like you love Occam's Razor, but in this case it really fails you.

No. Guys like me examine a case for what it is. Guys like you suspect there is something askew and point out very minor and even trivial matters and place them in the echo chamber to make them sound earth shaking. For example, on AA11, we know Atta was in the cockpit. Why? Air traffic controllers heard him say "We have some planes". So we know Atta was in the cockpit on Flight 11. Unless there was some sort of hypnotism involved, it is safe to assume that a fellow terrorist was at the controls of UAL 175 as well. We have videos of each plane hitting each building. So the CVR and FDRs are of little significance in this matter to start with.

To continue on, the plank that "we always find them" is very shallow to start with. Yeah, you almost always find them for a good reason. The pilots are usually doing whatever they can to preserve the aircraft and the lives on the aircraft. You guys can't seem to figure out that the priorities of the terrorists piloting the planes was the exact opposite on 9/11. So the crash sites are not going to look like other crash sites and, thusly, the wreckage will be different.

Whats more, the uniqueness of the involvement of two of the world's largest buildings is added into the equation. Crashes you are comparing it to does not include that to be sure.

 

[Wiseone]

I am not going to say it is impossible for a passport to survive. However, to believe that they were able to find this passport, but were somehow incapable of finding even one of the black boxes from either plane really pushes it. They found all the black boxes from the planes that hit the Pentagon and the one that crashed in Pennsylvania. Supposedly all but one was too damaged, but the point is they found all four. Yet with the WTC they could not find a single one, but did manage to find a passport. That is much more than simply unlikely.

Like I said, just because something seems unlikely to you doesn't mean anything as far as evidence and proof are concerned.

 

[Demon of Light]

No. Guys like me examine a case for what it is. Guys like you suspect there is something askew and point out very minor and even trivial matters and place them in the echo chamber to make them sound earth shaking.

Supposedly not being able to find even one of the black boxes is far from a minor or trivial matter. These things are designed to survive pretty much everything and designed to stick out like a sore thumb.

To continue on, the plank that "we always find them" is very shallow to start with. Yeah, you almost always find them for a good reason. The pilots are usually doing whatever they can to preserve the aircraft and the lives on the aircraft. You guys can't seem to figure out that the priorities of the terrorists piloting the planes was the exact opposite on 9/11. So the crash sites are not going to look like other crash sites and, thusly, the wreckage will be different.

Yet we still found all of the black boxes for the one that flew dead-on into the ground and the other that flew right into a highly reinforced outer wall and broke through several inner walls after that.

Like I said, just because something seems unlikely to you doesn't mean anything as far as evidence and proof are concerned.

It is not just unlikely. Like I said, the chances of this are so low that it can generally be dismissed as a possibility.

 

[Wiseone]

It is not just unlikely. Like I said, the chances of this are so low that it can generally be dismissed as a possibility.

Thats just your opinion, and its based on nothing other than speculation and assumpton.

 

[usda select]

Supposedly not being able to find even one of the black boxes is far from a minor or trivial matter. These things are designed to survive pretty much everything and designed to stick out like a sore thumb.

Well, I meant trivial insofar as the facts of the matter being the planes were hijacked. I mean does it really matter what the rpm's of engine 2 were when it hit the towers?

Yet we still found all of the black boxes for the one that flew dead-on into the ground and the other that flew right into a highly reinforced outer wall and broke through several inner walls after that.

Yeah, I'm guessing the 150,000,000 pounds of buildings in WTC did something to the boxes. Still of little consequence.

 

[Demon of Light]

Thats just your opinion, and its based on nothing other than speculation and assumpton.

It is not speculation or assumption, but simple history and the fact we have two other crashes on the same day where all of the black boxes were found. Here we are expected to believe that a small passport managed to make it out and found, but the devices designed to survive at temperatures of over 1,000 degrees Celsius and over 3,000 pounds of pressure per square inch were either destroyed or someone missed these bright orange boxes while sifting through the rubble.

Well, I meant trivial insofar as the facts of the matter being the planes were hijacked. I mean does it really matter what the rpm's of engine 2 were when it hit the towers?

It certainly does matter because it could tell us who was in the plane, what route they took, and plenty more.

Yeah, I'm guessing the 150,000,000 pounds of buildings in WTC did something to the boxes. Still of little consequence.

You really do not know what you are talking about do you? These are designed to take thousands of pounds of pressure per square inch.

 

[Whovian]

You really do not know what you are talking about do you? These are designed to take thousands of pounds of pressure per square inch.

Apparently, neither do you.

How black box is made - manufacture, used, components, product, industry, machine, Components, The Manufacturing Process, Quality Control, The Future

After manufacture, the units are exposed to a series of grueling and somewhat bizarre torture test conditions. Black boxes are shot from cannons, stabbed by thin steel rods, attached to 500 lb (227 kg) weights and dropped from 10 ft (3 m) above the ground, crushed in a vice at 5,000 lb (2,270 kg) of pressure, cooked with a blow torch for an hour at 2,012°F (1,100°C), and submerged under the equivalent of 20,000 ft (6,000 m) of seawater for one month.

Thousands of pounds yes, but per square inch is technically incorrect.

This...

is the flight data recorder from Egypt Air 900, which crashed into tha Atlantic.
Lots of wreckage from that crash, ans the box was pretty badly beaten up.

If you think an explosion like this...

Would leave an intact flight recorder like the one pictured above, you are sadly mistaken.

 

[Demon of Light]

Apparently, neither do you.

How black box is made - manufacture, used, components, product, industry, machine, Components, The Manufacturing Process, Quality Control, The Future

Thousands of pounds yes, but per square inch is technically incorrect.

It is not technically incorrect at all, you are just using a less reliable source is all:

Static crush - For five minutes, researchers apply 5,000 pounds per square-inch (psi) of crush force to each of the unit's six major axis points.

Source: HowStuffWorks

Also, not every part of the box is designed according to such stringent requirements, just the parts that contain the data. Showing a picture of the whole thing is misleading.

This...

is the flight data recorder from Egypt Air 900, which crashed into tha Atlantic.
Lots of wreckage from that crash, ans the box was pretty badly beaten up.

Do you seriously mean EgyptAir 990, an aircraft that came down under more clearly conspicuous circumstances?

If you think an explosion like this...

Would leave an intact flight recorder like the one pictured above, you are sadly mistaken.

I am not mistaken at all. That explosion is just the jet fuel igniting, something they are designed to withstand. Look through the source I gave.

 

[I_Gaze_At_The_Blue]

It sounds real convincing if we just ignore that a much smaller and less durable passport supposedly survived and was found, while supposedly not even one of the four black boxes were found.

How so, paper and card objects survive quite well in events like this ... something to do with being light enough to get BLOWN out the way !!!

Millions of bits of paper ... files, passports, drivers licenses, appointment cards, reports, personal letters, medical cards, etc, etc, etc all survived ... what is the big deal then ???

 

[I_Gaze_At_The_Blue]

It is extremely unlikely that the black boxes were destroyed and so one has to argue that not one was found.

How so ???

Are these things totally indestructable, compeletely impervious to damage then ???

"A common misconception states that the black boxes are "indestructible." No manmade device is indestructible, and no material has ever been developed that cannot be destroyed under severe enough conditions. The black boxes are instead designed to be highly survivable in a crash. In many of the worst aviation accidents, the only devices to survive in working order are the Crash Survivable Memory Units (CSMUs) in the black boxes. The remainder of the recorders, including the external case and other internal components, are often heavily damaged."

"However, no recording device is perfect. Black boxes are sometimes never found or too badly damaged to recover some or all of the data from a crash"

Aerospaceweb.org | Ask Us - Airliner Black Boxes

http://www.nytimes.com/2005/08/17/i...l=1&adxnnlx=1289905217-c1tst2A44RARvqpiAz2X3g

Badly damaged black boxes sent to American manufacturers | Scoop News

IEEE Spectrum: Beyond the Black Box

NTSB - CVR & FDR

Black Boxes

 

[I_Gaze_At_The_Blue]

I am not mistaken at all. That explosion is just the jet fuel igniting, something they are designed to withstand. Look through the source I gave.

But they are not designed to be in a substained fire for a long time ... even although there was this enormous fireball in which maybe 20% of the fuel burnt off in ... there was still the majority of fuel dumped into the building, igniting all the contents instantly on those floors.

Don't forget also that in other, more typical crashes the pilots will try to dump or eject fuel beforehand to lessen damage and increase, however slightly, survivability.

On 9/11 the hijackers kept that fuel ... it made an immense difference.