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170 page How to Molest Children manual...

CriticalThought

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The world is becoming a very scary place to be a kid.

170-Page Child Molestation Instruction Manual Surfaces - News Story - WFTV Orlando

ORANGE COUNTY, Fla. -- Orange County sheriff deputies say a 170-page manual is circulating around Central Florida. It shows people, step-by-step, how to molest children. It also includes where to find potential victims.

“I've never seen anything like it. It was pretty amazing when I first saw it just because how detailed it was,” said Detective Philip Graves with the Orange County Sheriff’s Office.
This definitely challenges the limits of free speech.
 

TacticalEvilDan

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Don't get me wrong, as a father I'm revolted by the idea of something like this, but . . .

. . . it is just me, or does this make about as much sense as a manual on how to do a successful drive-by?
 

Hoplite

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As abhorrent as I find the idea of using it....people have free speech. This falls into the same kind of category as the Anarchist's Cookbook.
 

soccerboy22

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Some one now needs to write a 170 page manual in how to defend your kids from molesters. There should also be a chapter on how to use the right amount of force.
 

TacticalEvilDan

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You don't need a book.

You need a single page -- the one-page release form for your local karate dojo.

I've attended classes with kids of a variety of ages, and those little ****s were evil! :lol:
 

Barbbtx

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Wouldn't this be as illegal to have as child porn?
 

mac

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Wouldn't this be as illegal to have as child porn?
I think only if it has explicit photos of children. The "author" will probably get away with it under Freedom of Speech.
 

soccerboy22

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For the sake of those that pick this up there better be something on how not to get caught. Otherwise prison is going to SUCK for them.
 

jallman

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For the sake of those that pick this up there better be something on how not to get caught. Otherwise prison is going to SUCK for them.
Actually, I think the way that works is they suck for the whole prison.
 

TacticalEvilDan

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It seems to me it should fall under some kind of incitement law.
It would seem to me, at least in the legal sense, that there is a significant difference between teaching someone how and saying do it now.


ETA: Sorta like that MIT Lockpicking Guide that circulated for years.

God, I think I still have a copy of that...
 
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MaggieD

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Wouldn't this be as illegal to have as child porn?
I'll bet you've hit on something. Why wouldn't it fall under that definition? Not much of a stretch....especially if there are any photos at all...porn kind or not...exploitation...?

Edit: Ooops. Article says sheriff says it's not a crime to possess it. That's just wrong. The law should be changed.
 
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Hoplite

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Wouldn't this be as illegal to have as child porn?
No, it's a manual detailing how to do something, unless it has actual explicit photos, it's no different in the eyes of the law than a manual on how to fix a toilet.

I'll bet you've hit on something. Why wouldn't it fall under that definition? Not much of a stretch....especially if there are any photos at all...porn kind or not...exploitation...?
Because it's not (that I know of) advocating that people go out and do this. That makes a difference.
 

TacticalEvilDan

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That's just wrong. The law should be changed.
I disagree.

I think there should be all sorts of books out there teaching us how to do all sorts of **** that we're not supposed to do, and that it should be up to us as human beings with forebrains to either not do them or to use the knowledge of evil to do good.

Dot.
 

CriticalThought

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Edit: Ooops. Article says sheriff says it's not a crime to possess it. That's just wrong. The law should be changed.
It would require a Federal Constitutional Amendment.

The Supreme Court has ruled time and time again that the written word is always protected free speech. The only exceptions are libel and threats.

The reasoning is, if you don't like something, then you don't have to read it. Publishers also don't have to print it, and book sellers don't have to sell it.

The only reason people would care now is because the internet has made it so potentially dangerous publications can be accessed by whoever wants them. "How to make a bomb", "How to kill yourself", "How to conduct a school schooting", etc. are all topics that have emerged, but they are all still considered protected free speech.

Obscentiy laws in some states may apply in this case. However, it isn't very likely for the reason that nobody is being forced to read it.
 
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jallman

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It would seem to me, at least in the legal sense, that there is a significant difference between teaching someone how and saying do it now.


ETA: Sorta like that MIT Lockpicking Guide that circulated for years.

God, I think I still have a copy of that...
Then let it be an aiding and abetting charge when the manual is shown to have been used in the commission of the very crime it passively advocates. :shrug:
 

TacticalEvilDan

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Then let it be an aiding and abetting charge when the manual is shown to have been used in the commission of the very crime it passively advocates. :shrug:
Nah.

All those books floating around out there teaching you how to secure (or, for that matter, to use) your computer? Lots of useful information for hacking someone else's.

All those books floating around out there teaching you how to hack someone else's computer? Lots of useful information for securing yours.

The only people we should be prosecuting are the people who actually do the bad thing. They're the ones who decided how to use the information.
 

jallman

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Nah.

All those books floating around out there teaching you how to secure (or, for that matter, to use) your computer? Lots of useful information for hacking someone else's.

All those books floating around out there teaching you how to hack someone else's computer? Lots of useful information for securing yours.

The only people we should be prosecuting are the people who actually do the bad thing. They're the ones who decided how to use the information.
There's a big difference between a manual teaching you how to use your computer and one teaching you how to hack. Intent is evident in the presentation of the material.
 

TacticalEvilDan

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I understand that the line in the sand for you is intent, jallman. What I'm saying is I don't give a hoot what the intent is -- just as someone could use it to do something horrible, someone else (a parent, a law enforcement department) could use it to prevent something horrible, and conversely someone could use a book teaching you how to protect against such things to do something horrible.

Provided that the literature in question doesn't go into specifics about a particular person (Little Suzie Q at 133 West Main Street, for example), of course. Sort of like how a general discussion about taking down the CiC being one thing, and the discussion of a specific plot to do so being entirely illegal.
 

TacticalEvilDan

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Yeah.

Except here. Because of the First Amendment.

I'm just trying to say that while I get where you're coming from on this, manuals can be used both ways no matter what the intent of the author was. That's why, barring specificity, it should be about the intent of the reader.
 
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